Laurie R. King Virtual Book Club discussion
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The Cuckoo's Calling
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The Cuckoo's Calling by Robert Galbraith (pseud.) - VBC August 2018
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I didn't see that coming, either, Cathy, although thinking back on it the killer turns out to be someone who had a strong motive, which I suppose I should have taken into account. Rowling did an excellent job of deflecting our suspicion by having him be the one who started off the investigation!
Antoinette wrote: "I finished the book last night. Not bad enough to put down, not good enough to read the next in the series. Obviously the writing is excellent but a little formulaic for me- a noir detective, stere..."Actually, as much as I loved Harry Potter and as much fun as I find the Cormoran Strike series, I have never loved Rowling's prose style or even her characterizations. It's her ability to plot, I think, that makes her so much fun to read.
I think what makes Cormoran Strike different from other detectives, and what makes the series therefore fun to read, is that Strike assumes that there is a reason for every behavior, and rejects assumptions about behavior that are not backed by actual evidence. Thus, he insists on knowing why Lula changed clothes after returning from the nightclub, he is unwilling to accept that she jumped just because she had bi-polar disorder, he wants to know why she went to Vashti to meet Rochelle for 15 minutes rather than texting that she didn't have time for lunch, why Bristow's uncle would return from a conference at Oxford to spend a few minutes at his drugged sister's bedside, why the uncle and Bristow did not actually speak while supposedly in the flat at the same time, etc. He does not believe that people do things "just because" they are spoiled, or ill, or whatever. And ferreting out this thought process for each behavior is what leads Strike to the solution to the mystery.I have next to zero background in psychology, but aside from thinking that this insistence makes Strike fun to read, I think it is probably psychologically sound.
Merrily wrote: "Kathy wrote: "I was so pleased that I loved The Cuckoo's Calling when it came out. I wasn't sure what to expect from J.K. Rowling in this new undertaking. I've enjoyed all three immensely. However,..."Thanks, Merrily. I'll give it another try.
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Lenore, I think Cormoran also represents a type of "knight errant" in a corrupt world - Lula's world is actually dark and full of people who want something from her, but when you get down to it, Comoran's quest is pretty pure - he's doing it because he said he would and because ultimately, he wants justice for her. I also think that as the series goes on, you see what an honorable man he is, even when it comes to standing back and letting Robin choose a man who's clearly not right for her!
John wrote: "Tomorrow (Friday) is our last non-spoilers day; no holds barred on Saturday! 😉"Ready for spoilers? Did anyone else think it was unethical for the detective to have sex with someone he had questioned in the course of the investigation?
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Ready for spoilers? Did anyone else think it was unethical for the detective to have sex with someone h..."
I have to admit that I did not think of that scene in ethical terms; maybe because I didn't find it at odds with the noirish aspects of the story. Situational ethics, maybe, but I think a P.I. doesn't always feel bound by quite the ethical restraints that a PD detective might.
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Ready for spoilers? Did anyone else think it was unethical for the detective to have sex with someone h..."
No, I think because a) it's quite common in detective novels of this type and b) he didn't really have a conflict of interest where she was concerned. In fact, you could argue that he might find out MORE because he slept with her. Now if she'd been the client, I think that would have been unethical because he'd have been taking advantage of someone who came to him for help and was presumably vulnerable.
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I think this is one of the reasons I'm generally kind of meh on noir as a sub-genre. I don't particularly like the way noir protagonists behave.
Merrily wrote: "In fact, you could argue that he might find out MORE because he slept with her. ..."In my mind, that would make it more ethically problematic, not less. If it's just someone he ran into in the course of an investigation, to my mind it's the same as dating someone at work. Whether it's ethical depends on why you're doing it and whether you have power over them. I wasn't particularly bothered by it in this case, especially as she was pretty clearly the instigator.
In the second book, he sleeps with someone in a way I found a bit more problematic, as he seems to do it mostly because he can't be bothered to put her off, and I always find emotional cowardice of that sort annoying.
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In my mind, that would make it more ethically problematic, not less. If it's just someone he ra..."
Erin, what I meant was (if he was being cold-blooded about it), his obligation is to his client, not to anyone else, and if sleeping with the girl got him information that he wouldn't otherwise obtain, then he might conceivably do so as a tactic. I don't think he viewed things that way or that I would approve, LOL, but just saying that wouldn't necessarily be unethical. (From what I understand, spies did that sort of thing all the time.)
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I was just thinking spies. But frankly, I probably wouldn't view spies as the best example for ethical behavior. Their entire job revolves around doing things that the rest of us would balk at as unethical.
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I was just thinking spies. But frankly, I probably wouldn't view spies as the best example for ethical behavior...."
You're channeling Mycroft from Sherlock: "Of course I don't trust my own people, they spy on people for money!" I totally agree with you, I just meant to say "it's a technique."
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John wrote: "I, as well as some previous posters, didn’t suspect the actual killer. Any thoughts on your prime suspect(s) and what you thought of the author’s technique of channeling our suspicions?"I really never formed a prime suspect. And I don't think I could have suspected Bristow because his motivation really wasn't quite sane, as Strike observes. I know that his fear was that the African half-brother would eventually show up and claim to inherit from Lula, but as the will was nowhere to be found and she had been adopted by the Bristow family, any lawyer would know that the half-brother had no enforceable claim. (And, in fact, the will when actually found was also unenforceable, but as no one could have produced it that is not relevant to motivation.) So inviting an investigation was simply crazy.
There was, of course, some evidence -- e.g., Tansy Bestigui's statement -- that the fall was not suicide. but officialdom had decreed that her evidence was unreliable and the official verdict of suicide was highly unlikely to be challenged by anyone in the family. Moreover, if Strike had not already been investigating, no one would have connected Bristow with Rochelle's drowning if he decided he was tired of being blackmailed.
So it's hard for me to see how the sane reader could have suspected Bristow.
Antoinette wrote: "John wrote: "Tomorrow (Friday) is our last non-spoilers day; no holds barred on Saturday! 😉"Ready for spoilers? Did anyone else think it was unethical for the detective to have sex with someone h..."
Coming to this discussion very late.
I found nothing whatever unethical about Strike having sex with someone he had questioned. She was neither his client nor a suspect. Nor is he a prosecutor who might need to question her about her statement in court. Nor does he have any public responsibility. Not only had Strike determined that Ciara was not involved in the murder, IIRC he had also determined that she really didn't have any useful information, so there was no likelihood that she would be called as a witness in any criminal prosecution and that he would be asked to impeach her statement. (Which is the only way he could be asked to testify about what she said, because his testimony about what she said would be hearsay and thus inadmissible for the proof of any fact asserted.)
And finally, she came on to him, not vice versa. He was feeling bad about himself and she found him attractive, and I think his succumbing to her undeniable charm was a very understandable human reaction.
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John, I'm probably not the most typical of mystery readers in that often I don't try to come up with a suspect on my own, I just enjoy the ride and wait to be surprised. In fact, if I figure out the most likely suspect, I'm a little disappointed if I prove to be right - I prefer it if the author outwits me! In this case, I didn't have a clue who might have done it, as Lulu's associates were so weird and varied that it could have been any of them! I was surprised when it turned out to be Strike's client (nice job, J.K. Rowling) as to me he wasn't in any way a likely suspect.
I had read this a few years ago, and came back and read it again. I remembered who the villain was, and vaguely remembered it had something to do with money, but I didn't really put it together when re-reading either (there were a few times I remembered that something was important, but I didn't remember why - perhaps this says more about my memory or analytical skill than Rowling's skill at plotting). But I'm with Merrily - I don't really try to guess the villain unless it's very much a closed-circle mystery. I felt like this one could have ended with it actually being suicide, though clearly there was more to it than the police had determined initially. So I wasn't even sure there was a murderer to guess.
I too don’t actively work at figuring who the killer is when I read a mystery or detective story. But here I thought the evidence pointed toward the uncle.
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I agree, Cathy, in fact I thought it was very much that way in the TV version - and of course Martin Shaw did a great job of playing the Evil (perhaps) Uncle.
I'm chiming in on this conversation a little late. I just finished the book this week. I started with the Audiobook and finished with the e-book (both from my local public library). I was pleasantly surprised at how much I enjoyed this book. I'm going to read the next one too. I especially enjoyed the secretary, Robin I had thought that Uncle Tony was the most likely suspect. I also suspected the fashion designer because I thought his grief was excessive. (Don't remember his name)
l wasn't too surprised at John Bristow having murdered Lula and Rochelle but that he had murdered his brother, Charlie 30 years earlier was a surprise.
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Laura, I really urge you to continue on with the series, as Robin gets more and more interesting as we go along.
And that John Bristow was a rotter, ey?!
I’m reading the third book now and looking forward to the next one coming out next month. I like Robin but I like Strike too. They are a good team.
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I agree, and I'm very excited for the next book! Have been dying to know how Robin is doing now that she's tied the knot and how Strike is dealing with it.
But has she tied the knot? They hadn’t reached the crucial point in the service (I now pronounce you...). I thought it was a real cliffhanger.
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You're probably right, I'm confusing the TV show and the book! It's been awhile since I read the last book -
I haven’t seen the TV show. I don’t like it when TV or movies change important plot points.
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Happens all the time, however. In the case of the Lynley/Havers mysteries by Elizabeth George, the TV series totally diverged from the books about halfway through. I never really understood why, because the storyline in the books was very compelling, if tragic. Of course, that was a case where the casting was also bizarre - the actor who played Lynley bore no resemblance to the character as described in the books. That DID annoy me although I came to like Nathaniel Parker.
Merrily wrote: "Cathy wrote: "I haven’t seen the TV show. I don’t like it when TV or movies change important plot points."Happens all the time, however. In the case of the Lynley/Havers mysteries by Elizabeth Ge..."
It's been a while, but I recall liking the series in spite of the casting. What I was remembering first was the poor casting of Havers. Am I misremembering?
I'll have to check my library to see if they have the ebook of Cuckoo; don't want to buy it and too lazy to drive there for the print copy! My bad.
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Happens all the time, however. In the case of the Lynley/Havers mysteries..."
Carole, I guess the Havers casting is debatable - as you know in the books Havers is portrayed as a hot mess - someone who is essentially unattractive and/or doesn't make any effort to take care of herself, and while they did their best not to "glamor up" the actress in question, it's hard to take a beautiful woman and make her into a convincing plain one. I think she did the best she could by always wearing oversized clothing and appearing unkempt! Later I saw the actress (Sharon Small) on the British version of "Mistresses" and was quite amazed at what a great figure she had - you never saw it in Lynley!
The casting of Tommy was absurd: the books always said he was blond. But they really did a disservice to Helen. She was a much more interesting character in the books. Parker is better cast in the French Canadian series.
Cathy wrote: "But has she tied the knot? They hadn’t reached the crucial point in the service (I now pronounce you...). I thought it was a real cliffhanger."You raise an interesting question! I have assumed she went through with the marriage, because (in the book -- I haven't seen the TV series) when the vicar continues to ask her (after Strike has clumsily sent a flower arrangement crashing to the floor) whether she takes Matthew as her husband, she says "I do," even though she is looking at Strike. I can't imagine that she then said the contrary. Additionally, in that paragraph, Galbraith describes Matthew as "her stony-faced new husband." But until the new book appears, I suppose we can't be absolutely certain.
That scene reminded me of the ending of film "The Graduate." I could picture Robin and Strike running/hobbling out of the church and hopping on a bus...
Merrily wrote: "I guess the Havers casting is debatable - as you know in the books Havers is portrayed as a hot mess - someone who is essentially unattractive and/or doesn't make any effort to take care of herself, and while they did their best not to "glamor up" the actress in question, it's hard to take a beautiful woman and make her into a convincing plain one...."I hate that! As if there aren't a ton of talented and less-than-beautiful actresses who would die for a good part like that!
I had the same thought about the Graduate. And I still think it ain’t over til it’s over. The service hadn’t concluded. Looking forward to the new book.
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Guess we'll find out in September!
Not sure which option is better. Wonder how her marrying Matthew would make a difference in her working relationship with Strike.
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Well, if Rowling is working toward Strike and Robin having a romantic relationship, which seems likely to me, Complications are likely to ensue...
Sounds like it could get ugly: adultery, divorce. On the other hand having her fall into Strike’s arms and run away from the altar doesn’t seem very imaginative.
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Possibly, although Matthew might end up getting murdered and Robin be a suspect so that Strike would have to clear her name. Probably Rowling would not choose so obvious a ploy, though!
Cathy wrote: "Sounds like it could get ugly: adultery, divorce. On the other hand having her fall into Strike’s arms and run away from the altar doesn’t seem very imaginative."Yes, one thing I've appreciated about this series is that the two have conflicts over work, not just sublimated sexual tension.
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Ha! Yeah, I was just thinking "Urgh; tropes!"
ETA: and I'll add a question on to that: what did you think of the tropes in this book? Given that Rowling was so obviously following classic noir, including the "girl friday." Do you think she did anything that really flipped the overused tropes?
Erin wrote: "what did you think of the tropes in this book? Given that Rowling was so obviously following classic noir, including the "girl friday." Do you think she did anything that really flipped the overused tropes? ..."Basically, I felt throughout that this was a good example of the genre rather than anything new and transcendent. One thing that's perhaps a bit different is that Robin is interested in private detection as a job, even before she meets Strike. It comes out more in the second book, but she has an actual interest in the nuts and bolts, rather than just being along for the ride.
Call me crazy — and for good reason, many do — but I can see Rowling/Galbraith moving in a totally different direction.It seems to me that, even though Strike is attracted to Robin, he does not want to leap into something new and challenging while still getting over Charlotte. Nor does he want to be a home wrecker. And most importantly, I think he feels the need for a reliable and independent partner, rather than someone with whom he has emotional issues.
And for her part, I’m not sure Robin is romantically attracted to Strike. She likes and admires him, definitely, but the cause of her unhappiness with him in the third book is her perception that he is not treating her as the partner he claims she is. She wants him as a friend and mentor and detecting partner, yes, but I don’t think she fancies him as a lover.
So the real suspense here — and this is actually why I like the series — is whether Matthew can deal with this situation as an adult. (This is, by the way, a problem that women in professions face not uncommonly, as many of you know.) if Robin comes to realize, as is likely, that Matthew intentionally sabotaged Strike’s attempt to communicate with her in the last book, they are going to have a serious conversation very soon. If Matthew can say (and internalize) that he wants her to be happy on her chosen career and he trusts her, he could actually become an interesting secondary character off whom she could bounce ideas and who could supply a new perspective on events. If not, there is a divorce in their future without the need of any romantic entanglement between Robin and Strike.
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It seems to me that, even though Strike is attracted to Robin, he does not ..."
Well said, Lenore. At this point I don't have a lot of faith in Matthew taking the higher road; he doesn't seem that perceptive, sensitive or enlightened to me. But of course, this is J.K. Rowling, she could prove me wrong!
Merrily wrote: "... At this point I don't have a lot of faith in Matthew taking the higher road;... "Neither do I! But I think that whether he will, and how Robin will handle it, is the real suspense of the next book (aside from the mystery, of course), not how Robin and Strike will deal with each other.
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Neither do I! But I think that whether he will, and how Robin will handle it, is the real susp..."
I am very eager to get my hands on that book!
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Laurie R. King Virtual Book Club
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You might give the second book a try, Antoinette - I think the books get better as they go along. But, you're right, it comes down to individual taste and if you're done, you're done!