Tooth and Claw [August 16 2018]

[Virginie]

Siobhan wrote: "Thank you for all the quotes and spoilers! ☺️

😄 😘

[Anni]

Virginie wrote: "Sir Anni wrote: "Virginie wrote: "Hahaha! #Elend"

And it worked for him!!!"

Yes, it did! So there's hope for me! Probably... ^_^""

Don't be stupid, everyone should be happy to get to know you!
And you definitely should try to go all Elend next time 😂

[Zaara]

Virginie wrote: "I'm looking forward to being all hermit-y, no phone, no computer, no cars, just me and my books :p"

*sigh*
Have a nice time being a hermit, Virginie!

I begged off my going away for the weekend plan....but mine woulda been a large group, if we'd gone. A lot of ppl opted out...we are all doing dinner 🍴 moro together instead + 🍷
And I finished. Sorry couldn't resist, it really gets unstoppable once you get past 2/3....

Siobhan wrote: "Thank you for all the quotes and spoilers! ☺️
Little Wontas...too cute 😘
He really is!"

Anytime. Heading to your tracker now. Then I will come back here and make a batch post.....

[Zaara]

Ok @Virginie...caught up on all your comments...haha 😂 at what you said about Daverak having fun making fire....you'll see...not saying anything...
Ok...like I said, I finished but am posting logs thru to Chapter 13. Then when you are back we can cosily chat about the ending...much better when you aren't offline/away. Can't wait for us to discuss wholebook spoilaaaaaahs.....

CHAPTER 10
(view spoiler)[
1. What do you think of Avan for rejecting the marriage mart cum industrial wheelerdealing? I think he saved himself a lot of future headache and heartache. Who would want to exchangthe glorious Sebeth for *hiss* Gelener?
+ bribes and putting yourself under the thumb of a power couple. Can't be good. Look what happened to Glokta...being passed from dirty hand to bloodier hand like a resource :-(
Yay for Avan walking away from mercenary deals. Does Sebeth even realise how much he loves her?

2. Haner & Londyvar proposal...meh! I feel meh...just like she felt, apparently.

“Yet her heart did not beat faster, her breath did not catch in her throat, and though he took a step closer to her...she did not feel the tide of pink rush through her the way it did to maidens in stories.”

Why yaaass, m'daaaahlings...whaaarr IS the madness going thru them like blood coursing in the veins? Instead all this polite discussion about radicalism and societal beliefs...is this even a wedding proposal? Oh well, suppose a dude like Londyvar isn't capable of feeling more...he'd actually suit the icecold Gelener more, I think.

“You’re so practical, Haner,” Londaver said.

I'm just surprised they managed to shake on it, like a business deal...😂😂😂

3. #surprisesadness...Berend's death...just like that! So unexpected. I was just laughing at the prosaic last scene...this book...so many twists in such a short time...poor Berend...feel sorry for having disliked her.
But...but...but...now what will happen to Haner? Do you think Distasteful Dave might get obliquely leery...in A WAY?
(hide spoiler)]

4. Non-spoiler chapter quote for Ghost:
“The stars hung against the blackness in their multicolored profusion, like a spilt box of gems.”

[Zaara]

CHAPTER 11
(view spoiler)[
1. What is it with this book and the almost continuous wedding proposals? It makes me wanna go pointlessly surf Vera Wang...😂😂 bcuz...see how different this one is from the last...

“Please don’t press me,” she said, taking refuge in coldness though her heart was breaking and her eyes were full of tears.

2. Oh I know this is totally the wrong moment to spoil the mood and mention this but 😜😝 at all the 👀👉👈 👀 whiiiiiirling eyes...

3. Felin is amazing to stick up for her sister in law like that. More power to the women! Esp in this book. Stick together, gals. Also she is truly sisterly and genuine in her feels/advice to Sher. Once again, I like Felin but Sebeth is still my fave (even above Selendra). What abt you?
(hide spoiler)]

Non-spoiler quote:

Husband and wife then joined Selendra for dinner, united in that perfect confidence which the enduring state of marriage inspires in so many dragons.
#gentle sarcasm

CHAPTER 12
(view spoiler)[
1. Well, looks like Avan is firmly committed to Sebeth and is even involving her in his decisions...she is using this influence to do some good for society. These two are so cute!
Sabeth's estranged dad may be *air quotes* important.

2. Londayver seems to be growing on Haner.

3. The 3 little pigs Wigs...😂😂😂
(hide spoiler)]

[Zaara]

CHAPTER 13 by WHICH I ACTUALLY MEAN CHAPTER 14
(view spoiler)[
1. The Blessed Frelt is just disgusting. The epitome of those dirty leery priests abusing their profession...I can't believe first Berend, then Selendra and then Haner...ALL the sisters! Wtf!
Haner is timid...he may pressure her :-( esp after what the (stupidly arrogant) Daverak said to him...he will deffo be enraged...those types of men...perverted...loathsome...

2. “You ate Lamith?” Haner asked, APPALLED.
'Nuff said.

3. Selendra and the Mother in Law are at open war...what do you think of these scenes, Virginie? You seem to totally dislike the snobby MIL in earlier logs. I have a doubt...haha...another doubt...what is this plan she has to break his heart/the engagement? Did I miss something??
😒 (hide spoiler)]

[Zaara]

CHAPTER 14
Apparently I mentally mixed up the logs for Chapters 13 and 14 so...*yerk* I relabelled my old entry.
Nothing much to say about Chapter 13 except that its nice to see Sher and Penn bonding again, like the little boys they once used to be....
Btw I just read N&S which also has a "dragon" mother in law and loved her the most of all the chars...even more than the hero or the heroine...whom I also loved. But still...


CHAPTER 15
(view spoiler)[
That deathbed reunion scene between Sebeth and her father made me howl. I dunno why it made me cry that much. I am so stupid....naffoo...it is only a book!
I wanted Shivorn 😂 when I read this scene....haha...please don't laugh at me, Siobhan but
it seemed so EXACTLY what I would feel if I were in Sebeth's place. Not knowing WHAT to believe...and the years of separation and hurt...
Have I mentioned (once or twice) that Sebeth is my absolute fave?
*still furtively sniffling into the tissues*

Nothing else stood out for me from the chapter, after this. FORGET all the quotes and earlier spoilers and stuff I posted.
This one immediately became my fave scene in the book and the reason I would reread it.
(hide spoiler)]

CHAPTER 16
(view spoiler)[
1. "THE NARRATOR IS FORCED TO CONFESS TO HAVING LOST COUNT OF BOTH
PROPOSALS AND CONFESSIONS”
Cutest (and most honest) subheading ever! 😁

2. I loved that for Sebeth & Avan...it was Sebeth who got to do the actual proposing...like Rowling said abt Ron and Hermione, she was intentional that would be Hermione who got to initiate...
Tho' Avam didn't do too bad either...
“Sebeth, when you didn’t come home I was thinking how much more I’d come to care for you than I ever intended. I was afraid I’d never see you again.”
The best happy ending for my fave couple....*whoops amd capers*

3. Daverak and the lawsuit...well, that was...uhh extremely sudden!
To say the least...
Haha 😂😂

4. I like that the world is not perfect at the ending...our chars have some amount of resolutions made for the next chapters in their lives but it's not all sunshine and rainbows. And that that last sentence and WORD of the book is a *kick* at the farce of it all..."we shall leave them to take refuge in the comfort of gentle hypocrisy.”
I love it when authors "double-mock" the absurdities of their worlds and themselves at once. Jezzt...so clevarr + love when you find a person who can laugh at themselves bcuz that's jezzt...claars + the one surest sign of an awakened and vigorous sensibility. (hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Chapter 9: The Picnic (view spoiler)[

THE EXALT TALKS TO SHER: Wow.Sher's mother wastes no time... Straight to the issue! I like that Sher doesn't deny his attraction to Selendra.

We could invite a big party if you like, all the pretty maidens for miles around, one last frolic before winter.

Ha! He sure knows how to placate his mother. She gets the opportunity to parade plenty of maidens in front of him while he already knows he won't pay attention to anyone but Selendra :)

THE WATERFALL:

“We flew,” Gerin said. “Did you see us, Mother? Did you see us, Aunt Sel?”
“We could see everything spread out down underneath, like in a picture,” Wontas said.
[...]
Sher landed, a venison clutched in his claws. “We were there, under his claws like that,” Wontas said, poking Gerin.
“We flew,” Gerin informed Gelener.

Aaaah, Gerin and Wontas are so cute <3 Telling everyone "we flew, we flew!" xD

Selendra notices that there's plenty of maidens invited to this picnic, and starts to understand that Sher wants to escape "the frosty Gelener' and giving himself alternatives. But she still isn't counting herself within those possibilities... So naive :p

“What a terribly unfortunate way to lose a dragonet,” Gelener said, preparing to turn away again.

Wontas went to see the cavern, and did that horrible dragon just casually suggest they go back without looking for him?!? Insisting they take care of her, while there's a LOST CHILD?!? URGH, GO HOME ON YOUR OWN, YOU SELFISH DRAGON! Maybe you'll get eaten along the way, that'll make everyone happy! 😡😡😡

THE CAVE: Heh. As soon as Felin is gone, Sher go all 'cool Uncle' with Gerin :p
So Wontas is on a ledge, and Sher is too big to get him; Selendra immediately says that she'll go instead. Such a contrast with Gelener, who kept whining and not caring at all about Wontas.
“But—no, you try it if you think you can,” Sher said.
I may be reading too much into one sentence, but I think this shows well the relationship between Sher & Selendra. She goes headfirst into danger for those she loves, and while Sher's first reaction is to be scared for her, he trusts her to take care of herself.

TREASURE:

“This gold looks to me like Yargish work,” Sher said, examining a linked chain set with stones.
“Not from before the Conquest then?” Selendra asked, a little disappointed.
“Oh, it could well be. More likely, in fact. You remember the knights and princesses in the stories and the Yarge towns the dragons of old were always sacking, before the Yarge turned the tables and attacked back? I’d think this might well be the plunder from such a sack. It’s much too delicate to be dragonsmith work, not to mention too small.”

So... what? "Yarges" are humans? I thought they were some kind of dragons, but from this conversation, I'd say they are a completely different species. Smaller, capable of delicate metalwork, no wings... Yup, I'd say humans.

Ohoh, Sher is openly flirting with Selendra now... Calling her pretty, and beautiful, and giving her a golden chain/bracelet :)

They found a treasure, and Sher keep saying they will all have a share. So... Does that mean that Selendra's dowry will be augmented? Not that she really needs it but it'll help calm down Sher's mother.

Can't wait for Selendra and Sher to have THE discussion :)

(hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Chapter 10: The Choice of Associates (view spoiler)[

A THIRD DINNER PARTY: So that was the business proposition Remalin has for Avan... Marry frosty Geneler! *shivers*
I love that the two reasons he said no are
1) Sebeth
2) Professional integrity
He is quite taken with Sebeth, that he won't give her for anything else that his sisters' future. I agree with you, he really dodged a bullet here. He would have been forever indebted to Remalin, and forced to give that couple more and more power over him. Also, Gelener would be an AWFUL partner for him. Avan is even more "open-minded" and a free-thinker than Sher; I think he would despise Gelener :p

DAVERAK CONSULTS HIS ATTORNEY: No much to say. I hate Daverak. I want Avan to kick his ass on the court. Entitled pompous cruel and arrogant ass! Just breathe fire and die! And then get eaten by servants! AH! That would be ironic :p

A SECOND PROPOSAL: I love that the narrator is counting the confessions, proposals and dinner party xD

Haner’s warnings that she should conserve her energy for her clutch were overruled or even scoffed at. This was Berend’s second clutch, she felt she knew all about it by now.

No, no no! Berend's going to die laying her third egg, I'm sure of it! That's a GIANT death flag! As arrogant and cruel her marriage with Daverak made her, she doesn't deserve that. I really, really hope I'm wrong! :(

Wow. Londaver's proposal was so... Meh. Not romantic at all.

He was no dragon out of legend, bold, wild, and firm of resolve. But he was considerate and not cruel and he could give her a home where Selendra could also live.

Huh.... "Not cruel". Talk about low standards...

A SECOND DEATHBED: NOOOO! What's with that title?!? BEREND NOOOOO!

Yup. She died. Called it!
She was so pragmatic about it. Making provisions for her children, and Haner... Haner is on her own, now. I'm afraid for her...
I didn't even consider that Dave might look at her that way. God, I hope not! (hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Chapter 10: A Maiden’s Love (view spoiler)[

A THIRD PROPOSAL: Oh no, poor Selendra. Looks like that potion worked too well, and she can't turn pink anymore!

CONVERSATION IN THE PLACE: Ohoho, Felin stood up for Selendra! Again, she wants what's best for Sher. Not his status, not his mother, him and his happiness. I still like Selendra best, but Felin is a close second!

Sher was waiting outside. “Has she forbidden you to bring Selendra here?” he asked, looking so miserable that Felin melted towards him completely and did not even call him a fool.

I can totally imagine it, a grown dragon, head down and doing the puppy eyes! Who could be mad at him? 😅

CONVERSATION IN THE PARSONAGE:

“If he cares, he’ll try again,” Amer said, comfortingly. “Give him a chance, and get close to him. Touch him. You can’t lose anything even if you don’t color up.”
“Only my dignity,” Selendra said.
“And what’s that worth in the marketplace?” Amer asked.

Haha! Such a pragmatic dragon! I like Selendra & Amer's relationship. It's a bit motherly, which is fitting since Sel's mother died before Selendra hatched.

CONVERSATION IN THE MILLINER’S ESTABLISHMENT: Heh. That chapter is full of conversations!

Selendra’s hats had all been made at home, or occasionally bought ready-made by her brothers. She had never visited a milliner’s establishment. She could not have imagined the range of hats available, nor the way they were fitted. The establishment was a wonder to her. [...] Selendra barely acknowledged the introduction, so caught up was she in all the hats. “It’s almost like treasure,” she said, remembering the cave under the mountain.

Aawwww, Selendra is such a sweetheart, being so taken by all the hats. I think that if Sher had seen her marveling at the shop like that, he would have fallen even harder for her.
It's heartbreaking that Selendra can't color for Sher. Felin is being a wonderful sister-in-law to Selendra, and friend to Sher. She really wants what's best for them. (hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Chapter 12: High Society (view spoiler)[

Not much to say, that chapter was quite short. I have a nagging suspicion concerning the identity of Sebeth's father... Here are the clues I gathered:
- Chapter 4: Sebeth's introduction; we learn that her father is an Eminent. She got abducted, and her father refused to pay the random, stating that he had enough dragonets anyway.
- Chapter 10: Avan & Rimalin's conversation; we learn that Eminent Telstie is dying because he got his fire early. He has plenty of children but they all died. His heir will probably be Gelener, his niece.
- Chapter 12: Sebeth & Blessed Calien; Sebeth's father is dying, and looking for her.

Could it be... Sebeth is Eminent Telstie's daughter? He had lots of children, so he abandoned her to her captor. But his other children all died one way or another. Now, he's dying, and his heir will either be his nephew (whom he hates) or Gelener, but only if she marries. So, he's looking for his estranged daughter, probably to make right by her.
#crazytheory

(hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Ok, posted all my thoughts on the chapters I read during the WE. Going to read some more chapters later today. I really want to open all those spoilers :)

[Zaara]

Catching up on the thread now....keep posting...I'm here.

[Virginie]

:)

Read 13 and 14, typing it all right now!

[Virginie]

Chapter 13: Deepwinter at Benandi (view spoiler)[

A FOURTH CONFESSION:

“I don’t think we’d better stay with Avan,” Penn said. “He doesn’t have much room.” He only just stopped himself from adding something about the floozy Avan kept there

So Penn really knows about Sebeth.

Penn finally told his wife about the confession his father made on his deathbed. Still don't understand why it's such a terrible thing but then, religion's not really my thing so....
Felin declares she'll stay with him, no matter what. First she defended Selendra, now this... She really values family. I like her!

THE SOCIAL WORLD: Wow. Exalt Benandi isn't even trying to be subtle about keeping Sel & her son apart. Aaaaand... Selendra snapped. It's war now :p
I wonder.... Will that conflict have the opposite effect, and push Selendra to Sher, not out of love, but to spite his mother. I hope not... That'll be petty!

A FIFTH PROPOSAL: Oh boy. Selendra has a plan. She totally wants to punish Sher's mom. Anger is driving her. SHE'S SLIPPING TO THE DARK SIDE NOOOO! 🤣

Selendra sighed inwardly, because her plan called for Haner to refuse her approval once the Exalt had suffered enough

Huuuum.... What kind of plan is that? Sounds crappy :o

A FIFTH CONFESSION: The narrator is still counting proposals and confessions 🤣🤣🤣

Sher smiled awkwardly. “I asked your sister Selendra to marry me, and she has agreed, once we have worked out a few details.”
“Oh thanks be to Jurale!” Penn said, and promptly burst into tears.

HAHAHA! That reaction! Penn is so relieved that his sister will be taken care of, but Sher is all "It's not that bad! I'll take care of her!" xD
I had no idea the treasure was THAT big!!! I thought it would add four-five thousands to Selendra's dowry, making it twenty thousands. Boy, she's RICH now! That's a good thing, though. With that much money, and with Sher's support, she'll be able to take care of Haner. Then all the siblings can band together and kick Dave's ass!

It was nice seeing Sher & Penn interacting! I had completely forgotten they were friends before :o
(hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Chapter 14: Coming to Irieth (view spoiler)[

A SIXTH PROPOSAL: Aaaaargh! Blessed Disgusting Frelt is back! And now, he's proposing to Haner? Trying to crowd her like he did Selendra?!? DISGUSTING!
Heh! He got chewed by Dave!

Frelt spluttered. “I had no intention of making unwelcome advances.”

Yeah, right...

LEAVING BENANDI: Mmmh. Felin is catching on that something is wrong with Selendra's coloring...

HANER TAKES A WALK: Haner moves forward with her "free-the-servants!" plan :)
And she met with Blessed Calien! That's the priest that Sebeth was seeing, right?

Wait, Dave ATE Lamith?!? He's gone completely mad!

BENANDI HOUSE: Ok, I know I said I really like Selendra but... Now she's being petty! She's playing with Sher to punish his mother... (hide spoiler)]

[Virginie]

Finished! So many things happened in the last two chapters! Will type my thoughts when I have some time. Expect a long essay :p

[Virginie]

Ok, couldn't find the time to type :/
I'm out AGAIN this week-end (and tomorrow as well) so you'll get that essay when I come back.

[Zaara]

Virginie wrote: "Ok, couldn't find the time to type :/
I'm out AGAIN this week-end (and tomorrow as well) so you'll get that essay when I come back."

And I will wait for it...
Enjoy your weekend!

[Sha]

Um halfway through and this is not want I expected and it's amazing.

[Sha]

it's like a mishmash of modernized victorian novel tropes and oh my god. there's Haner's gothic horrorish story (modern because it's subtle horror rather than direct evuls). There's Selendra's Regencyish Romance, with all the walks and talks and treasure finding and plot moppets. I'm still not sure where Aven's story falls because I haven't seen enough of it yet but I'm leaning towards socio-legal religious melodrama.

I greatly appreciate Jo Walton for coming up with the concept of "Victorian drama but with dragons who eat each other." I have not stopped being delighted by that yet. I think it's the civilization/barbarism contrast.

amazing.