Reading the Detectives discussion
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The Big Four
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Unofficial Poirot Buddy Read SPOILER THREAD: Poirot 6 The Big Four
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Seems I'm in the minority here, as I really liked this book. OK, at times it did seem a bit disjointed, but it was so different from the usual Christie books, that it amazed me. I certainly can't see myself forgetting this book unlike some of the other Christie books I have read.
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I'm enjoying my re-read of this more than I expected. The James Bond-esque master villains aimed at world domination feels dated but I like the individual stories - the death at the chess tournament is ingenious! And yes, Susan, Hastings is in top form - bumbling and foolish, but his loyalty is unquestioned.
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I've always enjoyed this novel, contrary to Christie's feeling about writing it. When I first read it, I didn't know of her reservations, so am now thinking about those as I re-read. I think that the short stories are good, and enjoy them as short stories more than I have the ones published as such. However , I think that the real cleverness is in the links. Poirot's and Hasting's characters really come to the fore in these links. Their affection for each other is not diminished by their criticisms- Hastings voiced to the reader and Poirot's in his clever use of words to Hastings. I like the move away from the cosy mystery, as happens with They Came to Baghdad too, and others I thoroughly enjoy. Yes, the idea of world domination is dated. On the other hand, it is quite interesting to see it being placed in terms of rapacious individuals, rather than a philosophy. The use of mannerisms to identify a consummate identity changer is a good feature.
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One of the things I like about Christie is that she always writes different types of books. Some other GA authors are quite formulaic, but she could write a thriller, a mystery and even something paranormal, with ease.
I agree, Susan. The range is really interesting. Her writing was that of a professional who wanted to make a living from writing. I've not read the romances under her other name - that's right, Mary Westmacott, but like the touches of romance in some of the mysteries. Perhaps they are unrealistic, but they give the characters another dimension.
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Your idea, about comparing the romances is a good one, Susan. I'll have to see if they are cheap on kindle.
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The Dressmaker's Doll is either in one of the Miss Marple collections or The Hound of Death. Or possibly Lord Listerdale Mystery?? I love all her slightly supernatural and quirky standalone short stories.Must admit I simply cannot get on with her Mary Westmacott tales though, which is odd - I've always championed Christie as a creator of great characters, never mind the puzzles, so why don't I like the MWs, which are pure character-driven tales? I read The Rose And The Yew Tree and was very disappointed - both the characters and situations seemed completely contrived and unnatural.
I like how this book documents social and geographical changes: Chinatown, which today means the area around Leicester Square/Shaftesbury Avenue, then meant East London/Limehouse which is now regenerated as Docklands.
I lived in East London and my parents referred to Limehouse as Chinatown.
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Roman Clodia wrote: "I like how this book documents social and geographical changes: Chinatown, which today means the area around Leicester Square/Shaftesbury Avenue, then meant East London/Limehouse which is now regen..."That always used to puzzle me when I read Christie as a student in London. It was ages before I figured out it was a different area.
I enjoyed the tongue-in-cheek introduction of 'Achille Poirot': 'You surprise me, Hastings. Do you not know that all celebrated detectives have brothers who would be even more celebrated than they were if not constitutional indolence?' :))
Roman Clodia, I was thinking about that too. The changes are immense and I love knowing about the past context. I also think it is amusing to read about Soho as sinister in some of Christie's novels and how it is today.
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RC, I also loved the idea of Achille Poirot! Poor Hastings, he fell for everything in this book...
Chelsea also appears as edgy and rough in books like The Pale Horse.
Certainly a change from the Poirot books I've read so far! It was interesting to read the background to this book, from the links in the other thread. The chess game and Achille were the highlights for me. Hastings must have spent months away from his wife, it was almost as if he was staying away intentionally!
Susan - good point about the inclusion of a Chinaman. I think it works as the big four are international. Though I'm not sure which was published first, this book or Ronald Konx's rules?
"The Big Four" was published a year or two before Ronald Knox's rules, I believe. I also believe the point of the "no Chinaman" rule was to eliminate then-prevalent racist cliches in crime fiction, so ... yeah, making the big four international doesn't help if the Chinese member of the group remains a cliche.
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It did make me smile that Poirot goes into the villains' hideout with aniseed on his shoes so that the bloodhounds can follow them! It seems so homely when set against the death-ray of unimaginable power that the 4 wield. A slightly underwhelming finish, though - I'm glad that Christie turns back to detection with her next Poirot outing.
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I do think this will stay with me more than some of her other books
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I thought this book, though definitely not her best, was entertaining. It was fun to read a Poirot that was different.
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Jill wrote: "Seems I'm in the minority here, as I really liked this book. OK, at times it did seem a bit disjointed, but it was so different from the usual Christie books, that it amazed me. I certainly can't s..."No, I agree entirely Jill, I really enjoyed it and thought the format of separate linked investigations leading to the final denouement, worked well, but as someone (somewhere) likened it to a Holmesian format and I love Holmes, I probably would like this :)
I am glad that you all liked it! I also had to chuckle at the I enjoyed the tongue-in-cheek introduction of 'Achille Poirot': 'You surprise me, Hastings. Do you not know that all celebrated detectives have brothers who would be even more celebrated than they were if not constitutional indolence?' as Roman Claudia said. And I was quite glad when it turned out that there was no such brother at all. It did make me wonder about the residence he apparently still held in Spa? Or would Poirot have located one just for this purpose?Can you imagine the commitment of Poirot to this ruse to actually give himself a real scar? And on his precious upper lips no less!
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Jessica, please don't forget to post the upcoming reads. If you want to take us into 2019 that's fine.
Susan wrote: "Well, he even sacrificed his mustache... Such commitment!Jessica, please don't forget to post the upcoming reads. If you want to take us into 2019 that's fine."
Yes, I will go and do that now :-)
Roman Clodia wrote: "I enjoyed the tongue-in-cheek introduction of 'Achille Poirot': 'You surprise me, Hastings. Do you not know that all celebrated detectives have brothers who would be even more celebrated than they ..."Another Holmes reference occurs in chapter 12 when Hastings admits to being engaged in reading "The Clue in Crimson"!
While it took me a while to warm up to this being an international criminal gang rather than a more classical murder mystery, I did enjoy the sequential stories and the long drawn out tracking of the criminal masterminds. I agree that it was really charming to see the relationship between Poirot and Hastings, however poor Hastings wife was left in South America for a shockingly long time. It certainly appears that Christie is modelling her sleuths directly on Holmes and Watson.
This is the type of story where the identity of the killers/criminals almost does not even matter. Discovering who is numbers one through four doesn't add too much to the plot, it is mostly the danger and suspense that matters. I enjoyed a few tidbits throughout, but I doubt I would read this one again. However, it would have been interesting if there had been a real Achille hidden somewhere in the background, with an even keener mind that Hercule!
I have never read this book before, so will see you here in a couple of days. Please go right ahead in the spoiler thread in my absence!