Sword & Sorcery: "An earthier sort of fantasy" discussion

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General Discussions > Grimdark the new Sword n Sorcery?

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message 1: by S.E., Gray Mouser (Emeritus) (new)

S.E. Lindberg (selindberg) | 2344 comments Mod
Author John R Fultz argues Grimdark is the new Sword and Sorcery

http://www.grimdarkmagazine.com/grimd...


message 2: by Jordan (new)

Jordan | 24 comments Thanks for sharing the article!


message 3: by Jason M (new)

Jason M Waltz (worddancer) | 329 comments well-written, great historical presentation of S&S, John


message 4: by Aaron (new)

Aaron Meyer (loptsson) | 75 comments Good read. Gives me at least a couple other authors to look into.
Makes me wonder would Glen Cooks Black Company be considered Grimdark? I really enjoyed those books.


message 5: by Clint (new)

Clint | 302 comments I have read in a couple different places now that Grimdark partially grew out of Warhammer 40K fic, could the same be said of the Old World Warhammer Fiction (Example: Gotrek and Felix)? I occasionally read the OW WH fiction, as some of it is almost Sword & Sorcery. I would say it does as it is Grim, but like the RPGS built off the war game, it also has a dark sense of humor.


message 6: by Clint (new)

Clint | 302 comments Also, could anyone point me in the direction of a good example of the 40K fiction that may have helped form Grimdark? Thank you in advance


message 7: by [deleted user] (new)

Aaron wrote: "Good read. Gives me at least a couple other authors to look into.
Makes me wonder would Glen Cooks Black Company be considered Grimdark? I really enjoyed those books."


Glen Cook is often credited with creating Grimdark - in particular,
in The Black Company. So yes, it is Grimdark.


message 8: by Aaron (new)

Aaron Meyer (loptsson) | 75 comments Evgeny wrote: "Aaron wrote: "Good read. Gives me at least a couple other authors to look into.
Makes me wonder would Glen Cooks Black Company be considered Grimdark? I really enjoyed those books."

Glen Cook is ..."


Very nice! Thanks Evgeny.


message 9: by Periklis, Fafhrd (Emeritus) (new)

Periklis | 427 comments Mod
Clint, sorry for the belated reply. The Warhammer 40k tagline "in the grim darkness of the 41st millenium there is only war" qualifies any W40k fiction as a solid example of grimdark. If you'd like to try some of the earliest fiction, try the Deathwing anthology or the Inquisitor trilogy by Ian Watson. From the later books, I'd suggest Abnett's Xenos and Horus Rising. Also, Gav Thorpe's "angels of darkness" is a pretty good example of the moral ambiguity and eternal warfare that characterise grimdark fiction, especially in relation to the w40k body of fiction. Hope this helps!


message 10: by Clint (new)

Clint | 302 comments That does help. Thank you


message 11: by S.wagenaar (new)

S.wagenaar | 402 comments Grimdark is not S&S. Grimdark is Grimdark. S&S is its own thing, with roots in swashbuckling historical adventure, horror and mythology. Grimdark is epic fantasy with a much darker, grimmer attitude.


message 12: by Jarod (new)

Jarod Meyer | 4 comments I classified my books as science fiction/fantasy but hearing about all these wonderful subgenres im not so sure anymore.

How important is getting the right label?

Do I wait for someone else to classify my work?


message 13: by S.E., Gray Mouser (Emeritus) (new)

S.E. Lindberg (selindberg) | 2344 comments Mod
I don’t think the label matters too much. They are not permanent. Even if printed with a category into a paperback... electronic blurbs/copy can change any time.

Biggest thing would be seek out the groups/subgenres that have critical mass ... then lurk or participate in forums (here, Facebook, reddit, etc) to see if they match the target audience.


message 14: by Jason M (new)

Jason M Waltz (worddancer) | 329 comments Honestly, Jarod, pretty much others label your genre, for better or worse, lol. The library, the bookstore, the critics, the reviewers, and finally the readers. You can call the big picture, umbrella labels, but everyone else gets to call the particulars.


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