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Denise Baer
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World & Current Events > Boy Scouts Changing Name

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message 1: by Denise (new)

Denise Baer My brother was in Boys Scouts. It's a sad day that a 118-year-old organization changes because of politically correct pressure.

Boy Scouts of America

I know things have changed over the years, but this is disheartening. There is a Girls Scouts of America. If they wanted concepts to reflect some of what the Boys Scouts were doing, they should have made the changes in that group.

What do you think?


message 2: by Holly (new)

Holly (goldikova) I'm cynical enough to say it's just how things are now.....but then I'm convinced that most human beings are engaged in rapid devolution.

It just seems symptomatic of a bizarre societal drive to erase all distinctions between the sexes; while at the same time accelerating the growing distrust and animosity between men and women. That's just not something I want to take part in.


message 3: by Denise (new)

Denise Baer Holly wrote: "It just seems symptomatic of a bizarre societal drive to erase all distinctions between the sexes; while at the same time accelerating the growing distrust and animosity between men and women. That's just not something I want to take part in."

Agree.


message 4: by J.J. (new)

J.J. Mainor | 2328 comments I was in the Boy Scouts and I'm mixed. The whole thing really has nothing to do with the PC movement, it's entirely a decision to boost membership. I was in at the time they began allowing women to be leaders, and that was not about being PC, but it was about finding people to supervise when more and more fathers were either absent in their kids' lives, or refused to get involved. My troop was a small troop, and we would have had to pack it in if we didn't have the mothers running it.

It's a fact of life for the Boy Scouts that membership is either flat or falling. Heck it was unpopular to be a Boy Scout when I was in. If it gives the organization a needed boost and keeps it afloat for another century, then it can't be that bad a decision.

I know they took a lot of slack for allowing gay boys to join as people began to think of all the naughty things they would be doing on the camping trips, but the Catholic Church actually had a good take on it when they chose to maintain their support: sex outside of marriage is a sin regardless if it's gay or straight so the Boy Scouts' decision changed nothing.

Really, the biggest problem they'll have is the segregation of sexes when it comes to sleeping arrangements...If a troop camps somewhere with a one-room cabin, what do you do about sleeping arrangements?


message 5: by Scout (new)

Scout (goodreadscomscout) | 6151 comments I think boys and girls should have separate scouting groups. I've given this some thought, and it sounds like discrimination - but I don't think it is. It's more like preserving the rights of each sex to have a bonding experience without censoring themselves because they might offend someone. Boys should be able to pee in the woods and test themselves against each other and gross each other out. Put a girl into the mix, and you might as well have a tea party. Girls should be able to compete with each other, express themselves, and talk about their issues with maturing. Throw a boy into the mix, and you have a tea party. That's not what scouting is about.


message 6: by Denise (new)

Denise Baer J.J. wrote: "I was in the Boy Scouts and I'm mixed. The whole thing really has nothing to do with the PC movement, it's entirely a decision to boost membership. I was in at the time they began allowing women to be leaders, and that was not about being PC, but it was about finding people to supervise when more and more fathers were either absent in their kids' lives, or refused to get involved. My troop was a small troop, and we would have had to pack it in if we didn't have the mothers running it."

Our parents were divorced and my mom participated when it came to father/son activities. That's different. Women helping to supervise or work concessions is different. And I do think it had something to do with PC AND low membership.

NYC girl eager to join co-ed-boy scouts "“The United States is the only Western country in the world that doesn’t allow young women,” said Sydney’s dad, Gary.

BSA has made progressive strides in the two years since new Chief Scout Executive Mike Surbaugh took office, opening the tent flaps to gay scouts and troop leaders, along with transgender scouts who identify as boys."

Why did the Boy Scouts decide to accept girls?

"Hosking: If the two organizations have developed so independently, how did we get to a place where Boy Scouts feel pressured to allow girls in?

Proctor: There has been an ongoing debate about whether this should happen or not. Internationally, there are many countries that have co-educational scout movements. In Europe, in places like Scandinavia, they’ve merged Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts into one organization. But in those cases, the two organizations worked together and they merged to create a co-educational movement. In the U.S. case, it looks like a turf war because the Girl Scouts are adamantly not participating. This is about the Boy Scouts allowing girls in. I think the Boy Scouts are under pressure because they’re losing members. They’re under pressure to do something new and look for new members in a broader way."

Nothing is sacred anymore. I believe in tradition. The Boy Scouts helped many boys learn about working together, outdoor and educational programs. I don't see many of them being comfortable talking and doing some things with girls around. And it won't be long before a girl accuses a boy of saying something inappropriate and that boy being dismissed.

For me, if they have to change the concept of what the Boy Scouts was all about, I'd rather they just end the organization. There are just some things that should be left alone. If they can't get enough members in today's day and age, then maybe it is time to call it quits.


message 7: by Denise (new)

Denise Baer Scout wrote: "I think boys and girls should have separate scouting groups. I've given this some thought, and it sounds like discrimination - but I don't think it is. It's more like preserving the rights of each sex to have a bonding experience without censoring themselves because they might offend someone. Boys should be able to pee in the woods and test themselves against each other and gross each other out. Put a girl into the mix, and you might as well have a tea party. Girls should be able to compete with each other, express themselves, and talk about their issues with maturing. Throw a boy into the mix, and you have a tea party. That's not what scouting is about. "

I completely agree, Scout. The way things have gone recently with women, the #metoo movement, I do think it pushed them in this direction.

Boys and girls should be able to remain boys and girls. They have different things to learn, and as Holly stated so perfectly, "It just seems symptomatic of a bizarre societal drive to erase all distinctions between the sexes."


message 8: by J.J. (new)

J.J. Mainor | 2328 comments First of all, I respect your opinion. I know it's a hot-button issue, so while I don't disagree with the decision to integrate, I do understand the rationale for keeping genders separate

Denise wrote: "I don't see many of them being comfortable talking and doing some things with girls around....."

This might be true today with boys seeming to be more "feminized" than ever before, but thinking back to when I was that age, I would say this wouldn't have been the case...primarily because of the kind of girls who would have been likely to join an organization like the one I was a part of...even the boys who weren't the rough and tumble type never joined or quit early on, so (at least 25 years ago) I would have seen more of the tomboy type join if it was a mixed gender organization. I'm not sure I would have felt all that uncomfortable with girls like that on our camping trips. But again, today's kids are a different breed, so I don't know if that would be true if I were in today.


Denise wrote: "And it won't be long before a girl accuses a boy of saying something inappropriate and that boy being dismissed. ....."
This I agree with 200%! I do remember a lot of things when we got away from the leaders that were completely inappropriate. I think where the gender-specific organization comes into play is that you need to let boys act like that, get it out of their systems while they're young, and teach them it's not okay in broader society.


message 9: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 16036 comments Wonder whether we'll see it in sport too, like NBA, soccer or NHL populated with both men, women, transgender, clones, gay and all? -:)


message 10: by Scout (new)

Scout (goodreadscomscout) | 6151 comments Well, there you're dealing with adults and sports that are a business. Then it comes down to ability and performance, which is objective. Whoever performs best should get the job.


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