Language & Grammar discussion
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Language Peeves
I agree to a point that we can give new meanings to words. Look at how the definition of "like" has changed in 100 years. However, the word literal holds an important meaning in our language. I'm not ready to start saying that "literally" is a generic intensifying adverb.Take that with a grain of salt. I'm not a complete grammar despot, but I also refuse to use abbreviations, acronyms, and incorrect punctuation.
Yes (to Donna's point), and then everyone ties it up by pretending they're on the same page anyway. The person who raises their hand and says "let's make sure we're clear on this" attains the status of Village Idiot.
well we all have gravitated to this group because we are language despots
except when it comes to our own picadillos
i agree that the literal meaning of literal is one of the most literally important
i mean it's real, literal, actual, concrete
and to change it willy nilly is sacriledge
but i say all this as i toss nearly all punctuation, capitalization, to the wind,
am too lazy to find out how to install spellcheck for my posts,
and as i form my own facsimilie of sentence structure that is idyiosyncratic to my speech and thought patterns
my only concession to your sensibilities
is in the line breaks i use for coherence sake
who am i to judge but judge i do
i just think it is fascinating that language can be so porous and flexible
and i can be both fascinated and horrified by that fact :)
except when it comes to our own picadillos
i agree that the literal meaning of literal is one of the most literally important
i mean it's real, literal, actual, concrete
and to change it willy nilly is sacriledge
but i say all this as i toss nearly all punctuation, capitalization, to the wind,
am too lazy to find out how to install spellcheck for my posts,
and as i form my own facsimilie of sentence structure that is idyiosyncratic to my speech and thought patterns
my only concession to your sensibilities
is in the line breaks i use for coherence sake
who am i to judge but judge i do
i just think it is fascinating that language can be so porous and flexible
and i can be both fascinated and horrified by that fact :)
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A moment of silence for the ottoman . . .
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Right! I have an old chaise longue (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaise_l... for those who wish to take issue with my spelling!!)......needs re-covering so doesn't matter what gets spilled on it!! I'll bring it to the next one.
should we consult with the Otto Man first
since it's his virtual abode we keep defiling?
will he identify with an old chaise longue?
will it fit with his divan, chesterfield, almanac, and what nots?
and can we choose styles?
i vote for the rococco
since it's his virtual abode we keep defiling?
will he identify with an old chaise longue?
will it fit with his divan, chesterfield, almanac, and what nots?
and can we choose styles?
i vote for the rococco
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yes it's definitely a black russian sort of chaise
aristocratic
almost makes one feel like speaking in complete sentences
aristocratic
almost makes one feel like speaking in complete sentences
well language peeve for today
this brilliant sentence was posted in another group by a supposed author.
"I wanted to get the word out about my self-published books that I have written and published myself."
what sort of writer doesn't know that self-published means you wrote and published...yourself?
this brilliant sentence was posted in another group by a supposed author.
"I wanted to get the word out about my self-published books that I have written and published myself."
what sort of writer doesn't know that self-published means you wrote and published...yourself?
haha touche donna
perfect response
i wanted to say somehting to the bad self promoter but it wasn't in keeping with the spirit of the group so i refrained
perfect response
i wanted to say somehting to the bad self promoter but it wasn't in keeping with the spirit of the group so i refrained
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Wow.
R
haha
or a personal account
is there any such thing as an impersonal account?
a factual history
or a personal account
is there any such thing as an impersonal account?
a factual history
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That's the problem with self-publishing: no editor. The advent of ebooks and print-on-demand has generated a posse of self-publishers. Dare I say they are a scourge? Can the word 'scourge'be used alone, or does it have to have a companion such as a scourge on something? Am I in the wrong discussion group for this question?
Donna,If you go for the cigarette holder and the sable (can you pluralize sable?) you must learn to also paint your lips in a heart-shape. I'm thinking of Madame Hortense in Zorba the Greek...
"posse of self-publishers"
i see them all on horses
riding out to round up their readers
and each one thinks the other is the sheriff
so they just ride around in the middle of the dusty street shouting out about their books to each other
heehee :)
no i think the posse can also be a scourge no need for modifiers
correct me if i am wrong oh greater learned ones
i see them all on horses
riding out to round up their readers
and each one thinks the other is the sheriff
so they just ride around in the middle of the dusty street shouting out about their books to each other
heehee :)
no i think the posse can also be a scourge no need for modifiers
correct me if i am wrong oh greater learned ones
well with a corset dear donna
you could definitely mold yourself into silk and organza
drape 20 strands of long pearls around you neck highlighting the ahem...bosom
and sweep into the room
dragging the sables or ermines
and then perch your self aristocratically upon the chaise a la rococco
and hold forth in your inemitable style ;)
just eschew mentioning the buckets of brine recipe and mucking about in the compost pile
you could definitely mold yourself into silk and organza
drape 20 strands of long pearls around you neck highlighting the ahem...bosom
and sweep into the room
dragging the sables or ermines
and then perch your self aristocratically upon the chaise a la rococco
and hold forth in your inemitable style ;)
just eschew mentioning the buckets of brine recipe and mucking about in the compost pile
My vote for the most useless word in English goes to "utilize". I defy you to use the word utilize in a non-self-referential way (as in this sentence), such that I can't scratch it out, insert the word "use" and have your sentence mean exactly the same thing."Boy, he's really utilizing his goal-tending skills tonight."
I also cringe when I hear someone say: "That was so fun!"
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If that makes me sound like an old lady, so be I.
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it wolde a ride full of fun if i could follow it
but many too whoopsie doon's for me at this late moment at work
i vote for noun
now and anon
just cause i can?
but many too whoopsie doon's for me at this late moment at work
i vote for noun
now and anon
just cause i can?
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Ah, well. When James Joyce and a slew of poets (Shakespeare chief among them!) interchange parts of speech, we call it "inspiration"! When the great unwashed do it, we call it a peeve!
(Just having fun, so don't take my comments seriously, please -- not that you're about to start now!)
Whan the Aprill shoures soote (or something like that...)
Here's a peeve of mine I just rediscovered: gratuitous misspellings of perfectly ordinary words. I was watching the CBC News at Six just now, and they had a story about Ottawa's new baseball team. The team name? The "Rapidz". Yes, with a "z". AUGH!! Sure the owners are the heads of Zip.ca, but that is not an excuse to fling zeds about willy-nilly.I also admit to using "fun" as a verb on occasion, usually if I am teasing my boyfriend about something. "I'm just funnin' you." However, that is not a peeve of mine necessarily, because I keep it out of my (formal) writing.
Bunxena, I agree with you on the "lite" spellings. It's almost like baby talk. Toys R Us, lite beer, Xmas, the list goes on, although I am having brain block right now....
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Still, I maintain that "donut" is a gratuitous misspelling (and Dunkin Donuts, like many businesses, is no help).
I still write "doughnut", Newengland! However, I have never before seen "cocoanut". My browser's spellcheck doesn't underline it, though, so I guess *it* recognizes the word.Jeannette, how about "drive-thru", "late nite", or those "Bratz" dolls? (I wonder if *they* were named by the Zip.ca folk.) Those are also annoying. Oh, and snack items with "cheezy" flavour.
And ha, I remember being extremely confused by the "x" in "Xmas" as a kid. I figured it was an abbreviation of some kind, but I couldn't for the life of me see where the "x" was coming from. "But there's no 'x' in 'Christmas'!" I know now where it came from, but I still think it's ridiculous.
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Doughnuts are delicious, but poisonous (!) and coconuts have nothing to do with cocoa...they grow on tall palm trees in Tahiti, Fiji and the like, and have always been spelled coconut as far as I know (which isn't far). I agree Bunny....Bratz and the like are revolting in all sorts of ways, but we ain't gonna win this one. Text-speak is taking over the world!!
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Frankincense, I'm not sure.
-- Balthasar
Act II, Scene iii
Romeo & Juliet
Exeunt
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i just love Paris in the spring. Every year i go there and walk the Left Bank. It is, i think, the most beautiful time of year to take in the Jardins Luxembourg.
You get the idea. Even when other rules of capitalization are observed, the pronoun is shrunk. This isn't the same as ee cummings and are own Moe's writing. This is a major problem and...
I object! (Well, someone has to, for the sake of the venerable "me" pronoun and all...)
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Conversely, I was horrified when some of the powers-that-be here suggested that high school exam candidates NOT be marked down for using textspeak in their answers!!!
My phone capitalizes every single word when I send text messages. In other words, were I not to edit them, My Messages Would Look Like This.That *is* a horrifying thought, Debbie! High school exam candidates SHOULD be marked down for using textspeak in their answers! Exam ≠ cell phone. You have room to write the full words, so write them out! (Actually, I write full words and use punctuation and proper caps when I text. Sure it takes more characters, but the recipient actually understands it!)
Let's say the kids are allowed to use textspeak and never have practice with proper English. Imagine these future executives' reports:
"profits r down so u must b let go :( Plz clean out ur desk & leave by 5 2day kthxbye"
"bcuz the company did so good this yr evry1 gets bonuses lol!1!!!"
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Ugh! I hope textspeak doesn't become widely accepted outside of informal communication. The point of language is to understand each other, which I don't see happening with that... it's said that global spelling reform for English will have a hard time sticking since there are so many dialects and so many sticklers (though I wouldn't mind seeing "tho" and "thru" made acceptable).
I don mind odd pronunciations so much. My main pet peeves are poor grammar, wordiness, and a lack of logical thought. As for words, I dislike "irregardless," "suppose to," "utilize"... and others that aren't coming to mind. I also find the good/well conundrum annoying, especially when I catch myself using it! My fiance gets more annoyed with the healthy/healthful mix-up. (I figure it’s been around long enough and is so widely accepted, it's a non-issue.)
Wow. Never heard of grinders before. Ya learn su’m new every day! (Su’m--with a glottal stop in the middle--or sumpthin’ is Kansan for “something.”) And yes, I wince at the use of “of” instead of “have.”
As a writing tutor, I care about prescriptive grammar, but there are certain things I’d love to see changed to reflect today’s descriptive grammar. I may receive some fire for this, but I like using “they” and “their” as singular neutral pronouns. I don’t mind using the neutral “he” or “him,” either (it’s historically neutral, like Man for Mankind, not chauvinistic), but I despise the she/he, her/him construction! So awkward!
Another pet peeve: Why can’t grammar books agree!!?! Or why can’t we get one standardized grammar book? The answer: probably for the same reason we can’t simplify spelling. But it’s quite vexing to study verbs and see the tense forms called by four different names and defined in different ways. And then, some books say words modifying adjectives are adverbs, others maintain that they are adjectives. Some books call “get up” a compound verb, others say it’s a verb and a preposition. (Same with trash can; is it a compound noun or an adjective and noun?) How are we supposed to teach this stuff if the “experts” can’t agree and our students will likely have teachers down the road who say something different?
I don mind odd pronunciations so much. My main pet peeves are poor grammar, wordiness, and a lack of logical thought. As for words, I dislike "irregardless," "suppose to," "utilize"... and others that aren't coming to mind. I also find the good/well conundrum annoying, especially when I catch myself using it! My fiance gets more annoyed with the healthy/healthful mix-up. (I figure it’s been around long enough and is so widely accepted, it's a non-issue.)
Wow. Never heard of grinders before. Ya learn su’m new every day! (Su’m--with a glottal stop in the middle--or sumpthin’ is Kansan for “something.”) And yes, I wince at the use of “of” instead of “have.”
As a writing tutor, I care about prescriptive grammar, but there are certain things I’d love to see changed to reflect today’s descriptive grammar. I may receive some fire for this, but I like using “they” and “their” as singular neutral pronouns. I don’t mind using the neutral “he” or “him,” either (it’s historically neutral, like Man for Mankind, not chauvinistic), but I despise the she/he, her/him construction! So awkward!
Another pet peeve: Why can’t grammar books agree!!?! Or why can’t we get one standardized grammar book? The answer: probably for the same reason we can’t simplify spelling. But it’s quite vexing to study verbs and see the tense forms called by four different names and defined in different ways. And then, some books say words modifying adjectives are adverbs, others maintain that they are adjectives. Some books call “get up” a compound verb, others say it’s a verb and a preposition. (Same with trash can; is it a compound noun or an adjective and noun?) How are we supposed to teach this stuff if the “experts” can’t agree and our students will likely have teachers down the road who say something different?
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Lee, the Grand Congress to Agree On Grammatical Rules idea might come under the "Be Careful What You Wish For" Department! Your post alone shows that you do mind and don't mind certain things. Now imagine that exponentially! (Wait! Did I just use a math term? Horrors!).
i heart u allz
I guess as we inexorably travel through time with the fey, lithesome, syllables that grant us a semblance of serenity in the communication with like souls, or garner us a modicum of comfort and companionship in common with those we share them with, it matters little really, when the final assessment is rendered, whether we adhere to standards or blow them to the winds with disdain and disrespect.
As long as the effort is made to pass on in exchange a truth, of mind or feeling, that will bolster ourselves and those others with whom we share the conversation.
aight?
I guess as we inexorably travel through time with the fey, lithesome, syllables that grant us a semblance of serenity in the communication with like souls, or garner us a modicum of comfort and companionship in common with those we share them with, it matters little really, when the final assessment is rendered, whether we adhere to standards or blow them to the winds with disdain and disrespect.
As long as the effort is made to pass on in exchange a truth, of mind or feeling, that will bolster ourselves and those others with whom we share the conversation.
aight?
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Where have you been?
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Language & Grammar
Books mentioned in this topic
Learn to Read with Sami and Thomas (other topics)Turtle Wish (other topics)
New Moon (other topics)
Just trying to say I agree with you. Although God knows I'm occasionally guilty of it myself.
It's fun to read though. I always wonder why I can't seem to generate that much emotion over Journey, white bread, or television sets.