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Regency Buck Group Read Jan 2018 Chapter 1-12
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Hi Susan. I was thinking of characters that start out as guardians but eventually end up as the lover. I think there has been a few. A good plot device for creating intimacy. Bath tangle, sylvester
Chapter four - is this the only GH novel where the main characters won’t travel on a Sunday? How correct of them. Perhaps more of a regency tradition or GH emphasising they were more square laced country people?
Sylvester was guardian to his nephew, but not Phoebe, right?Travelling on a Sunday was a no-no; I remember Jane Austen using it as an indication of instability of principle.
Belinda wrote: "Hi Susan. I was thinking of characters that start out as guardians but eventually end up as the lover. I think there has been a few. A good plot device for creating intimacy. Bath tangle, sylvester"I figured that’s what you meant, it just made me chuckle- sounded kind of like a pervy, Roy Moore vibe, like worth was hanging out at the mall ( or wherever teenage girls congregated in Regency England).
Nuts, I forgot you’re in Australia, Belinda, and probably don’t even know who I’m talking about! Roy Moore is a Alabama politician who lost an election recently because he supposedly was chasing teenaged girls when he was in his thirties! Of course, back in the Regency lots of men married young girls. But one of these girls was supposedly 14 when he approached her. Sorry, I read too many news stories.
Belinda wrote: "Chapter four - is this the only GH novel where the main characters won’t travel on a Sunday? How correct of them. Perhaps more of a regency tradition or GH emphasising they were more square laced c..."It is certainly one of the few where a Heyer main character is either religious or obeys those conventions.
Hi Susan in nc. I had heard of Roy Moore! I saw an article saying trump still endorsed him! No worth was very correct and proper once he knew he was guardian. I like when the ‘gentleman code of ethics’ kick in, in GH’s books.
Chapter 4 - your all right, what a detailed blow by blow account of the drive into London. I lived near Barnet for a short while so it made me laugh to hear of it as an outer village on the way into London. I like the parting shot to each other at the end of the chapter - don’t go to towns in which there are prize fights as it will expose you not to insult but an excess of civility! Why do so many of GH couples spare with each other? Because the men are alpha males and all the women spirited? I do wonder if her and Ronald sparred or not.
I got excited when Judith mentioned Hatchards bookstore as I thought that was the ‘Waterstones’ bookstore I used to hang out in when I briefly lived in London but I got that wrong. Hatchards is 187 and waterstones is 200 piccadilly! Really detailed descriptions again.
Chapter 5 - I like the way Judith mistakes mr frensham for beau Brummell. I can imagine society at first shunning her if she is blunt, provincial but very beautiful. But doesnt society eventually come around if you have eighty thousand pounds as your fortune?
I'm finally starting this one today. I'm a bit late to the party, LOL. But lots of other buddy reads and challenge books I've been working through first, as well as some new books just out that I HAD to read.Now, I'm here. This was never my favourite Heyer, as I didn't like Julian or Judith that much. But I'm going in with an open mind, and reading slowly to savour the details.
I've read the first two chapters now. Just finished the boxing match. Ugh. I don't like boxing and even in GH it holds little interest for me. The description was a little too detailed for me, although I understand its use a plot device and also a character-establishing device. But I did skim a little (despite my intention to read carefully!!) Interesting use of slang/cant. Showing the origins of our current phrases 'throw your hat in the ring' and 'throw in the towel'. Historically interesting I suppose.
Now, let's move onto Julian and Judith, please ;)
Chapter 6 - start of the royal romance. I do remember this book for bringing royalty to life so well and the duke of Clarence is written well as a bit of a coarse sailor with protuberant eyes. She must have done a lot of research. It’s funny when I see ‘duke of cambridge’ I think of prince William! This book is good at reinforcing the tight elevated circles GH is writing about -right enough to be rubbing shoulders with royalty.
Chapter 7 - gosh they are acting childishly aren’t they by avoiding one another’s invitations and trying to get the upper hand. Interesting -GH cites the four leaders of fashion - Brummell, alvanley, mild May and pierrepoint. Clumsy. Almost like citing a list. The cousin Taverner that is trying to get close to Judith reminds me of the overbearing chap in bath tangle that ended up with the widowed stepmother - the blonde goosish one. I forgot to say in chapter 5 I loved that Judith said Perry was ‘her darling’ so she didn’t make fun of his wasp waste and monstrous cravat. Worth did. GH also names the ‘Carlton house set’.
Chapter 8 &9. I feel like I’ve just had a historical tour of the boxing saloon and the rules of cocking. Laying it on a bit thick isn’t she?
Belinda wrote: "Chapter 8 &9. I feel like I’ve just had a historical tour of the boxing saloon and the rules of cocking. Laying it on a bit thick isn’t she?"Yes, I think she does overdo the listing of historical facts in this book - I think I enjoy it sometimes, becaue I find it very interesting, but it's not always seamlessly integrated.
Chapter 11 - the duel and the encounter at cribs parlour. She is writing more like a mystery writer than a romance one. I like how she has cleverly twisted dialogue to make it seem as if worth were at fault.
Chapter 12- belvoir castle with duke and duchess of Rutland. Again lots of research into the notables of the day and plenty of name dropping. It probably is one of her best written books in terms of historical accuracy. Not the best written in terms of likeable characters though
Belinda wrote: "Chapter 11 - the duel and the encounter at cribs parlour. She is writing more like a mystery writer than a romance one. I like how she has cleverly twisted dialogue to make it seem as if worth were..."For most of the 1930s, GH wrote 2 books a year--one romance and one mystery. I am not surprised that a mystery showed up in this book. It must have been difficult to switch her writing brain between the two genres.
Barb. Agreed. I think it was the reluctant widow that also read like a mystery? The quiet gentleman was too.
Belinda wrote: "Barb. Agreed. I think it was the reluctant widow that also read like a mystery? The quiet gentleman was too."And the Talisman Ring, although that was a Georgian.
I liked the mystery and historical details more than the romance in this book.
I'm in the midst of re-reading Kloester's bio of Heyer, and it seems to me that, although of course she didn't know which way her writing would take her, Regency Buck does set the stage for her Regencies. Because of the wealth of detail in it, we don't have to have it in the rest of them.There are photos of her hand-written notebooks in the bio, by the way, that are seriously impressive. She spared nothing in her search for historical accuracy!
Nick wrote: "I do get the impression from Heyer characters that masculine silliness is rather endearing and feminine silliness is rather annoying."I think this is true
Jackie wrote: "Nick wrote: "I do get the impression from Heyer characters that masculine silliness is rather endearing and feminine silliness is rather annoying."I think this is true"
In a way, I think that's because she expected so much of herself and, by extension, women in general. She was much harder on the females she knew than the males.
I'm part way through Chapter 5 now. Enjoyed the classic face-off when (view spoiler). Has been copied so many times since, in romcoms and numerous books.I did notice the amount of detail in Chapter 4 about the trip to London. I see what others mean about all of that detail - a bit too much, really. I am now really starting to notice that this is one of Heyer's earlier books. I had not known that before - had never even looked at the date of publishing. But as I read it more closely and also read others' comments, I can see it. I'm looking forward to reading these in publishing/writing order. What a great idea.
'[Mr Fitzjohn] was not a young gentleman who made a habit of punctuality, but his watch being, unknown to himself, twenty minutes ahead of the correct time, he arrived at the Cockpit-Royal, Birdcage Walk, on Tuesday evening just as the cocks were being weighed and matched." (Chapter 9)Haha. Heyer's delightfully light and humorous touch.
But I must say, the detailed description of the cock fighting, a bit like the boxing match, whilst I daresay historically accurate, is quite repulsive.
I think that was intentional, the young men’s pursuits often were viewed with dismay and distaste by the various ladies in GH, although they often had a sneaking admiration for the men who were accomplished in the “manly”arts.
Jan130 - l liked that part too (that Fritz’s watch was forward twenty minutes). I think in another chapter they describe him as quite round and cherubic. I like how he sent a brace of partridges to Perry at Christmas. What an upclass thing to do! Although no doubt appreciated by the recipient.
I've only started it, I'm on chapter seven and other than Lord Worth being up his own backside, I'm really enjoying it! It is very descriptive but I'm liking that. All those little details that are so interesting but often overlooked. Perry is a bit of a twat but he's young and trying out life.
Belinda wrote: "Jan130 - l liked that part too (that Fritz’s watch was forward twenty minutes). I think in another chapter they describe him as quite round and cherubic. I like how he sent a brace of partridges to..."Does "upclass" mean condescending, Belinda? That's one I'm not familiar with!
Kim wrote: "I think that was intentional, the young men’s pursuits often were viewed with dismay and distaste by the various ladies in GH, although they often had a sneaking admiration for the men who were acc..."I think that's true, Kim, but I'm still finding too much graphic detail in some scenes, which IMO could have been handled more lightly but just as effectively. But, it is an earlier book.
Moved Elizabeth's comment from the introduction thread."So sorry that I've fallen behind, especially in reading "Regency Buck". I started reading the first chapter, however, I stopped reading it because I was looking at having to pay more than what I wanted to budget for an e-book. At the present time I'm reading a similar Regency book by a different author and only had to pay $0.99 for it."
Karylne. Apologies I meant upperclass not upclass. I only haunt this forum when on holidays and typing comments on a mobile phone means spelling errors creep in so you’ll have to forgive me.
Teresa wrote: "I've only started it, I'm on chapter seven and other than Lord Worth being up his own backside, I'm really enjoying it! It is very descriptive but I'm liking that. All those little details that are..."Lol - and true about Perry, reminds me of my son...
Belinda wrote: "Karylne. Apologies I meant upperclass not upclass. I only haunt this forum when on holidays and typing comments on a mobile phone means spelling errors creep in so you’ll have to forgive me."Haha! I really thought it was just a term familiar to other parts of the world! I know what you mean about phone correcting. Sometimes auto-correct is hysterical...
I started rereading this because I needed something light and fluffy to balance out the mysteries I've been reading and especially Winston Graham's The Four Swans. Regency Buck starts off very very slow. I found myself getting bored in the first two chapters. It picks up a little later once they get to London. Worth's behavior towards Judith when she's alone is beyond polite even at that time. He knows she's not unprotected, he knows her brother has pride and Judith has a temper. What's to stop Judith from telling Perry and then Perry would call Worth out. Worth wouldn't accept and would teach Perry a lesson. It was ungentlemanly of Worth. I really see myself reacting just like Judith in these situations.
Perry is a nice young gentleman. He's like a sheltered teenager going off to college far from home for the first time-gotta find the coolest parties, join the best frat, and do stuff parents don't approve of. Fitz is a great friend. I really like him so far.
I love the introduction of real people in London Society. Brummell, Alvanley, Poodle Byng, the Royal Dukes, etc. It's so much fun. I can't help liking Clarence for some reason.
When I read An Infamous Army (some time after I had read RB), I cringed when Judith snubbed Barbara, but as I read others' opinions of the younger Judith, I'm revising my view and concluding that Judith was always pretty much like that.
MaryC wrote: "When I read An Infamous Army (some time after I had read RB), I cringed when Judith snubbed Barbara, but as I read others' opinions of the younger Judith, I'm revising my view and concluding that J..."I do agree Mary . I think Judith and Worth are actually very well matched, both having a highly developed sense of their own worth ( pun intended ) .
Barbara wrote: "MaryC wrote: "When I read An Infamous Army (some time after I had read RB), I cringed when Judith snubbed Barbara, but as I read others' opinions of the younger Judith, I'm revising my view and con..."Chuckle.
MaryC wrote: "When I read An Infamous Army (some time after I had read RB), I cringed when Judith snubbed Barbara, but as I read others' opinions of the younger Judith, I'm revising my view and concluding that J..."Harriet was the one who snubbed Barbara at the Ball (and Judith was appalled at her foolishness in so doing). I don’t remember Judith snubbing Barbara - did I miss that?
Susan in Perthshire wrote: "I don’t remember Judith snubbing Barbara - did I miss that?"I don't think you missed it. If you did, then I did too. Judith was always very chilly towards Barbara, but never gave her the 'cut' (though I suspect that she very much wanted to at times).
Barb in Maryland wrote: "Susan in Perthshire wrote: "I don’t remember Judith snubbing Barbara - did I miss that?"I don't think you missed it. If you did, then I did too. Judith was always very chilly towards Barbara, but ..."
Thanks Barb - sometimes I worry I have had a senior moment, so it’s reassuring to know that this wasn’t one of those times!
Mod
I don't think you missed it. If you did, then I did too. Judith was always very chilly towards Barbara, but ..."
Yes, Judith was always very well-bred, correct and civil to Barbara, if cool: it was Harriet who snubbed her by ignoring her attempt to smooth over the scandal of Perry taking her out to dinner and was again mind-bogglingly rude to her at the ball by commenting loudly that her hair was obviously dyed.
Just stumbled across all these replies! Isn't it possible to snub someone without actually cutting him/her dead? Anyway, I was thinking of the time Barbara asked Judith about Lord Worth's brother (can't think of his name now) and Judith replied something like "I cannot think how that could be any concern of yours, Lady Barbara." In short, a politer version of "None of your business."
That was not snubbing her; it was her very pointed way of making it clear that having broken off the engagement, Barbara had no rights where Charles was concerned. Understandably, Judith was furious with Barbara for hurting Charles and was not going to miss the opportunity to ‘put her in her place’. As we know that Barbara really does love Charles, it seems a cruel thing for Judith to do but of course she is worried and anxious and angry and responds in that context - not as the well bred and usually civilised woman that she was.
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Now I want to see if I can think of likable secondary female characters,..."
I'll start a thread. :)