Super daddies or When the father is unknown

[Nik]

Another feature of the modern world is various reproduction options. No direct involvement of a man is necessary anymore for having a kid. Sperm banks prosper and offer a viable biological material.
In some places where the donors don't need to expose their identity or pic-s, but need to answer profiling questions, it's amusing how often a donor is chosen by stereotypes of 'best prospective father'.. Amusing, but not completely unexpected: https://www.coparents.com/blog/what-w...
Which means that we can have unknown 'super fathers' among us, if the same donor's stuff was used hundreds of times.
Some dudes, if the below articles are true, are already known:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/06/hea...
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/...
What possible implications may it have? What do you think?
And wouldn't everyone want to have a few hundreds of descendants, had it not entailed financial and parental attention obligations?

[Nik]

Surprised no one wanted to weigh in. Maybe now :)

[G.R.]

From the title of the post, I thought this thread would be about story tropes in which the father of the hero is unknown and revealed at the end to be someone other than expected, like Darth Vader as Luke Skywalker's father.

But I don't have strong opinions on this as it currently affects society. I don't think the number of couples who use sperm donors is a relevant percent of the overall population. However, I can foresee a dystopian future where all offspring are direct descendants of the powerful few. In fact, I think there are already books and movies that explore this to some extent, though mostly the offspring are intended to be host bodies for the originals.

[Scout]

Well, it's already happening that women can choose the fathers from a menu for in vitro fertilization if they don't have a partner. With the advances in identifying which gene results in which trait, is genetic engineering far behind? I'm not for it, but it will happen. Does anyone think about Hitler's plan for a master race? Do we want a master race? Only the very rich will have access to this kind of genetic engineering when it's available. What are the implications of that?

[Philip]

There has been genetic engineering for centuries perhaps for as long as there has been civilisation. We do this slowly by arranging marriages and reproduction, by breeding animals and plants and now we have the ability to splice.

Choose your breed of dog, rose, or partner the only difference is rate of success and ability to pick certain traits and yes that is troubling because we know how this works out.
As with genetic selection the wealthy and powerful will sequence for their own children's protection, abilities, physicality. long before you see cures for illnesses.for the masses

[Nik]

A multiplication of Misters Smiths like in Matrix movie may not be entirely surreal :)

[Papaphilly]

This is a tough one for me. I am a happily married family man. I have zero issue with sperm banks. But, I can see lots of problems.

My concern is twofold,

First: how do you weight the right of privacy to the right to know? I understand the law has changed in some respects to lean to the right to know. If I am a child of a sperm donor, I think I would want to know any potential medical problems. On the bigger issue, does a child of a sperm donor have the right to know who a donor is, except in medical necessity? If an unknown child suddenly pops up, do they have any right to anything from a sperm donor?

There are cases now where divorcing couples are fighting over frozen embryos. If the wife wants to preserve them and the husband does not, that is not going to be easy to resolve because there is no middle ground. If the wife wins and successfully implants and brings to term a child, the divorcing husband is now on the hook when he never wanted the baby in the first place. How about he at first does not want the baby and then at a later date, he changes his mind? If embryos, why not sperm donations? I can see a case where this can occur.

Second: this flies awfully close to eugenics for me. I know at one time there was a "genius" sperm bank from deposits made by men of genius I.Q. level. I do not know if it still exists, but I can see how it will again if it does not now. I can also see these things spring up for all sorts of social issues such as racial purity and other stupidity that mankind delves in. That potentiality bothers me.

For couples that are trying to have a baby, this is one method of trying to conceive when there are problems and it does work. I can also see preserving samples due to illness for future use.

[Nik]

Yes, eugenics big time, as a prospective father is chosen by descriptive features.
On the other hand, maybe a good side income for a student :)
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2019/5/...

[Scout]

I read the article, and the interviewer said, “This is fully optional, but if you’re interested, if your sperm ends up being a kid, once they’re 18 they can call you.”

The college student said, "Yeah, why not?” He's a college kid. I wonder how he'll feel when he's married and 40.

[Lizzie]

As genetic sequencing and a menu become more and more available, affordable, and acceptable, will we lose out on potential advancement as a species from normal mutation?

[Papaphilly]

Lizzie wrote: "As genetic sequencing and a menu become more and more available, affordable, and acceptable, will we lose out on potential advancement as a species from normal mutation?"

I fully expect this to be a niche market forever. It is too much fun the other way.

[Nik]

Scout wrote: "I read the article, and the interviewer said, “This is fully optional, but if you’re interested, if your sperm ends up being a kid, once they’re 18 they can call you.”

The college student said, "Y..."

Maybe some believe in proliferating their genes, when no strings attached. Probably awkward, but not necessarily a drama, when he or she calls, if they do.

[Scout]

I respectfully disagree. A man with a family is contacted by his progeny, and I think there will be drama. Because there are strings attached -- genetic strings.

[Nik]

Scout wrote: "I respectfully disagree. A man with a family is contacted by his progeny, and I think there will be drama. Because there are strings attached -- genetic strings."

Certainly, an equally legitimate opinion

[Papaphilly]

Scout wrote: "I respectfully disagree. A man with a family is contacted by his progeny, and I think there will be drama. Because there are strings attached -- genetic strings."

I happen to have read a few articles on this subject before I joined the thread. It is all over the place when it comes to contacts. Some are very happy and others not so much. Some no drama and others have had their world turned upside down.

[J.]

There is a large difference between a father and a sperm donor. A college student, porn, and a cup do not make a father. A father is the decades spent being an example to the child. Discounting this does a disservice to the child, and to society as a whole.

[Scout]

I see what you're saying, J. A father is the one who puts in the time and effort to raise you. But for a child who's born to a couple through a sperm donor, I think it matters to the child where they came from, what their heritage is. A sperm donor isn't a father in the traditional sense, but he is a father as far as genetics are concerned. Donors should expect to be contacted and answer questions. Fathering a child, well, it's a big thing, not just sperm in a cup.

[Lizzie]

My biological mother walked out of my life when I was 8. I have no information as to medical history for the maternal side. I won't deny that it would be nice to have, but I have never wanted it badly enough to contact her or her family. (When I was 30, she sent me a letter to which I never replied, which is the only way I knew what had become of her.)

My dad hated doctors. When he was being born the doctor said I can save her (my grandmother) or the baby but not both. His father said what am I going to do with a squalling brat. My grandmother threw them both out and kept my father alive (obviously). When he was a little kid he jumped off the roof playing superman. The doctors said he would never walk again. My grandmother had him walking again within a year. So, I understand why my father avoided doctors. So, I don't really have much medical history on the paternal side in reality.

Finally, let's get real for our generation. Paternity tests are a new invention and really came into play because of child support laws. There are many people out there whose father's are not the genetic donor and they don't even realize it.

I think there are a lot of people who don't know their actual medical and genetic history. I don't think I can ever really relate to people who feel the need to find out where they came from, especially if it was simply a sperm donor.

[Lizzie]

I understand how many who were adopted wish to find out who their birth parents were.

But, in my mind that differs greatly from.

I was born to my parents thanks to the assistance of an anonymous egg and/or sperm donor, with my parents proudly awaiting my birth from my mother's body.

[Lizzie]

Out of curiosity I tried to do simple searches on percentages of adoptees who search for birth parents. Not a lot out there. Women were almost twice as likely to search as men.

"Research from the United Kingdom found a gender difference: While 66 percent of adopted women search for their birth relatives, only 34 percent of adopted men do so. The study found that feeling loved (or not) by the adoptive mother was predictive of whether or not an adoptee would search for his birth parents: Twenty-three percent of searchers reported feeling unloved or uncertain of being loved by their adoptive mothers, whereas only nine percent of non-searchers felt unloved. However, it is worth noting that 77 percent of those who searched—the overwhelming majority—did feel loved by their adoptive mothers."

My mommy didn't love me doesn't really fly for me as the reason a person would spend so much time, money, and effort to search for biological parents. Health issues would make more sense to me. Self-identity or who am I, which we generally all go through in our late teens would also be at the top of my list.

http://marripedia.org/adoptee_s_searc...

Sperm and egg donors were not required to be screened for health risks until 2005. At least in the 70s in America I know that sperm donors were often anonymous, as that was one of those ways college students would earn some extra cash. In a 2015 article, "When asked by FoxNews.com, representatives from both the FDA and the American Society for Reproductive Medicine said they have no data regarding the number of children born from sperm donors in the United States."

[Lizzie]

It's an insomnia night. Better to post in goodreads than other activities. : ) Maybe I should look for Delivery Man to watch.

I am curious as to what others will reply. If you were the child of a sperm or egg donor, would it be more important to you to find that genetic parent or would you be more interested in discovering half-siblings?

To choose one in theory - mine would be the half-sibling.

I pretty much figure that people donate eggs/sperm either for cash (often because they need to survive at that time in their lives) or because they are altruistic and wish to help those unable to conceive. (I also saw some reports of fertilization clinics mixing several donors "product" together to make sure of anonimity. Don't know if that practice continues, but modern DNA test would eventually figure out alll of them.)

[Nik]

Lizzie wrote: "...I pretty much figure that people donate eggs/sperm either for cash (often because they need to survive at that time in their lives) or because they are altruistic and wish to help those unable to conceive. ..."

Some might want their genes to dominate the world, multiplying like agent Smith in Matrix, without the need to care for children :)
I remember reading that prospective mothers obtained basic non-identifiable info about the donors, like ethnicity, hair color, education, height, etc..
Hard to enter the shoes of someone adopted to imagine what he or she feels. I guess it's a feeling of mystery and void that some feel they want to fill: to find why he or she was left behind, etc. Some people are interested in their ancestry, roots, dead and living relatives, others - just don't. My cousin, now already 60+, never has seen his father since the early childhood. I asked him a few times if he wanted to find out what was up with him, but he wasn't enthusiastic about it. Looked strange to me, but what do I know

[Paulette]

My only interest in finding the donor/parent would be for medical purposes (family history of whatever), but this is probably not necessary, as I expect it would all have been documented when they signed up as a donor.

Finding 1/2 siblings would be much more interesting, although I don't know that I would want to disrupt their lives - some of them may also be donor products, but some of them may be the actual children raised by the donor, and this could possibly throw their lives into a whirlwind of disorder. I wonder if there is a limit to how many children a donor may "create", and what the odds of running into your circumstantial siblings in real-life situations would be. I vaguely remember hearing about a case where a doctor had fathered an exorbitant number of offspring in this manner, and two of them ended up dating without realizing they were half-siblings until they went for genetic counseling, but I can't remember the full story.

[Papaphilly]

With all the home genetic testing, there are now plenty of stories of how some family are not biological. It has become a thing nowadays. I believe people are now warned this is a possibility if they go to places like 23 and me.

[J.]

I don't understand the allure of tracking down some guy with a specimen cup. So many of us are conceived by accident, and then blamed for the mistakes of our births. If you have a family that wanted and loves you, why would you need more?

[Papaphilly]

the fact that many do so tells you it is important to them. You are using logic in an area that logic defies. From the readings, i suspect it is devastating when one finds out later in life and I also suspect they may just want to know why did you not want me.