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World, Writing, Wealth discussion
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Which of the Seven Deadly Sins Cause the Most Suffering in the World?
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Pride is easily number one - the defining characteristic of rulers.
Probably greed is a good competitor for a pride.Usually a few come in the bouquet.
Haven't seen many saints though and most of us aren't devoid of sins and sinful desires. However a good management of those and putting a priority on a virtuous agenda should have a neutralizing effect
Nik wrote: "Probably greed is a good competitor for a pride.Usually a few come in the bouquet.
Haven't seen many saints though and most of us aren't devoid of sins and sinful desires. However a good managemen..."
yes, how much money is enough?
Graeme Rodaughan wrote: "Pride is easily number one - the defining characteristic of rulers."
self-righteousness seems to be a form of pride. "we're fighting the good fight and we need more money and centralization of power to vanquish the truly evil ones."
Alex G wrote: "Nik wrote: "Probably greed is a good competitor for a pride.Usually a few come in the bouquet.
Haven't seen many saints though and most of us aren't devoid of sins and sinful desires. However a go..."
Yes - precisely. Pride, Hubris, Self-Appointed Saviors.
My first thought was wrath - for example, this led to Hitler killing how many Jews? But maybe it isn't enough. How do we cope with Stalin, for whom none of those sins really apply. WE need more sins!
Wrath, for Hitler. I'd add Pride, Lust and Greed to Hitler's sins. A multitude of sins, justifying a war to eliminate his agenda.
Ian wrote: "My first thought was wrath - for example, this led to Hitler killing how many Jews? But maybe it isn't enough. How do we cope with Stalin, for whom none of those sins really apply. WE need more sins!"Was it wrath, or was it a cynical exercise in scapegoating an ethnic/religeous minority that had been on the recieving end of prejudice for centuries. That was simply a ripe target that could be used to galvanise sufficient political support to gain power, and then once in power the narrative was taken to it's logical conclusion to meet the needs of maintaining credibility.
Hitler strikes me as sufficiently psychopathic to be beyond petty wrath and into the great lies that can be used to seize nations for the benefit of the few.
Let's be clear - the strategic liar does not believe their own lies.
Ian wrote: "My first thought was wrath - for example, this led to Hitler killing how many Jews? But maybe it isn't enough. How do we cope with Stalin, for whom none of those sins really apply. WE need more sins!"Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Amin, Suharto, Pol Pot, for FS, the list goes on and on.
There is only one thing to really understand - the operation of dominion over the mass of humanity is mediated through deception and violence - the despots teach us that lesson every single time they appear - but is anyone willing to learn it?
I believe the anti-Jewish hatred of Hitler arose in WW1, when Jews in Germany made a lot of money out of the war and did not, by and large, join the army, Hitler was really angry this, and I believe that was a primary cause of that. But Stalin was quite different. He cynically removed people who MIGHT be objecting to what he was doing.
Yes- but the only reason Hitler got traction was through mining a seam of suspicion and hatred that was already there.
Yes, but the WW1 problem was widespread throughout the German army
I think Ian that we could chase each other around in circles forever on this one.Happy to draw a line under it - after all - we're not inside Hitler's head (fortunately) and are only speculating about motives...
Ian wrote: "I believe the anti-Jewish hatred of Hitler arose in WW1, when Jews in Germany made a lot of money out of the war and did not, by and large, join the army, Hitler was really angry this, and I believe that was a primary cause of that...."I think you are using a myth for a fact.
Here is the myth: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stab-in...
And here are the facts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_...
Surprised they are not blamed for WW2 as well, for maybe burning and gassing Jews took too high a toll on nazi's fragile economy and they should be responsible for WW2 defeat as well..
And these are some interesting theories about hitler's hatred towards Jews:
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/news/wh...
http://www.annefrank.org/en/Anne-Fran...
I think a lot of hatred towards Jews may come from Envy.
Jews are a small nation (less than 0.2% of the World's population), but they are disproportionately big on many lists, be it Forbes, Nobel laureates, science, medicine, cinematography and so on. From Jesus and his apostles to Freud, Einstein and others. Surely, it's not because of any talent, but thanks to a foul play. Or how else can Mark Zuckerberg, Sergey Brin, Larry Page and others succeed? Poor and unsuccessful Jews aren't interesting. Do such even exist? It's more interesting to claim Jews control Hollywood or media or internet or planet or money or everything. Hence - envy, hence - hatred. And the dimension is huge in recent times too. Unfortunately, I see so much of it on the internet and elsewhere.
I'm of the view that evil is an equal opportunity employer and doesn't discriminate on grounds of race, creed, etc... i.e. jews are no more susceptible than anyone else.Evil is a human problem, not a racial one.
Graeme Rodaughan wrote: "Evil is a human problem, not a racial one. ..."Agree, yet some choose to demonize other races, religions, etc thus explaining whatever..
Having just seen Times list - it has to be Greed.
Nik, my comment about Hitler and the Jews was based on Hitler's writings and speeches; I was claiming that was what Hitler thought, not what was. As Graeme pointed out, this is not a discussion that will get very far because we just don't know what went on in Hitler's head. Maybe sins are bad but there is something more that is really evil and does not fall into categories. The last thing I want to do is be seen to be making excuses for Hitler, so maybe trying to analyse why he was what he was was not very bright.
Ian wrote: "The last thing I want to do is be seen to be making excuses for Hitler..."No prob
Nik wrote: "Graeme Rodaughan wrote: "Evil is a human problem, not a racial one. ..."Agree, yet some choose to demonize other races, religions, etc thus explaining whatever.."
It's easier to point fingers at others than examine one's on actions. Scapegoating and blaming others for one's own ills has been a historically popular activity.
Greed is the first that pops into mind. You only have to read the statistics about the richest 1% owning more than the other combined 99.Without greed there would be no war (greed for land, to infiltrate with religion or to commandeer primary goods and societies), there would be less hunger/poverty/famine (sharing is caring right?) and social equality would be a way of life.
1) Pride
"Also known as hubris (from ancient Greek ὕβρις), or futility, it is identified as dangerously corrupt selfishness, the putting of one's own desires, urges, wants, and whims before the welfare of people... it is irrationally believing that one is essentially and necessarily better, superior, or more important than others"
2) Greed
"like lust and gluttony, a sin of desire. However, greed (as seen by the Church) is applied to an artificial, rapacious desire and pursuit of material possessions."
3) Lust
"lust could also mean simply desire in general; thus, lust for money, power, and other things are sinful."
4) Envy
"an insatiable desire. It can be described as a sad or resentful covetousness towards the traits or possessions of someone else"
5) Gluttony
"the overindulgence and overconsumption of anything to the point of waste. [in addition, it] can be interpreted as selfishness; essentially placing concern with one's own impulses or interests above the well-being or interests of others."
6) Wrath
"uncontrolled feelings of anger, rage, and even hatred, which often reveals itself in the wish to seek vengeance"
7) Sloth
"absence of interest or habitual disinclination to exertion... a failure to do things that one should do. By this definition, evil exists when "good" people fail to act."
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_d...)