World, Writing, Wealth discussion
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Writing Groups: Are You in One?
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No. However, the constructive feedback I have received online has been transformative for my writing.I think that regardless of whether your online or in real life(?) it's the presence of good feedback that is the essential thing to support your progress as a writer.
We all have blindspots - and another writer can see something that you will consistently miss until it's pointed out.
I was in one until I read a chapter from my upcoming novel. Having been as constructive and helpful as I knew how for several months to other writers I suddenly got whacked with an onslaught that nobody there knew how to handle - including me. The novel's first paragraph poetically (so I thought) described the sleeping and waking moments of a seventeen-year-old girl and mentioned that her sexual fantasies were soon relieved "prefacing a dreamless sleep, a sleep without conflict, sadness or regrets; the sleep of a child."
The rest of the chapter described how the girl went missing, the child she was looking after was left at a bus stop, there was a huge police search and someone tried to murder the child.
But two significant members, both female, could not get beyond that first paragraph. One said it was prurient and the other thought the 'sleep of a child' was a reference to paedophilia. All this took half an hour while the rest of the group sat silent until one of the men said he would certainly like to hear the next chapter. He never got the chance.
Criticism has to be constructive to be of any use. I know of tragic circumstances because of people venting their own prejudices on suppliant characters. Criticism has to be learned. Most people, as here mostly, try to be helpful but there are other people who enjoy hurting others. I worked for The New York Times and for Newsweek so I was used to being spiked and do not blanch easily but my experience told me that if two experienced writers (and one wrote erotica) cannot get past something they dislike there is no point being there.
But writing groups can be useful, for facing up to reading your stuff and putting it out there and for learning from other writers. And it is important to get feedback, nomatter how inconsiderate. There is always something to be learned from severe criticism. I came away rather smug that my writing could have such an effect.
P.K. wrote: "I was in one until I read a chapter from my upcoming novel. Having been as constructive and helpful as I knew how for several months to other writers I suddenly got whacked with an onslaught that n..."I can only imagine, how the described group would react to my stuff. Should probably check whether a "prurient thriller" category exists on Amazon -:)
Amazon genres are something I keep meaning to bring up for debate, Nik. I couldn't find a 'crime novel' one, it had to be 'Thriller' or'Mystery Thriller' My dictionary says Thrill means; 'To cause to feel a sudden intense sensation; excite greatly.'Have you ever read a book that does that? When I was a very little boy Treasure Island might have made it but I can't remember wetting my pants over it. And author's descriptions make it sound as if their books are akin to a nuclear explosion or sleeping with Zsa Zsa Gabor and Maralyn Monroe in the same bed. Come on, guys; get real. Be content with something that entertains and whiles away a few hours over a glass of something.
Apropos of that critique I got; the sleeve of that novel is going to be banded with a warning, 'This book explores scenes of a sexual nature'.
P.K. wrote: "Amazon genres are something I keep meaning to bring up for debate, Nik. ..."Sure, feel free to set up threads.
Amazon's categories sometimes seem more trendy than accurate. And then an author may choose certain categories, but Amazon's software based on SEO words, may override author's choice and put the book under a different category. At least, my impression.
I believe warnings are important, so the reader can have some idea what to expect and to prevent minors from reading inappropriate for their age stuff.
My warning should discourage 99% of readers from reading beyond it, I believe -:)
Sounds enticing; I'm going to sample some of your stuff. Too much Glenmorangerie probably.
Speaking of which... Considering to annihilate the remainder from the last week and proceed with Tomatin. Starting in about an hour ...
A lesser known brand: http://www.tomatin.com/homeoffered by the importer at a reasonable price and taste
and thus competing well with various Glens..
Leonie wrote: "I help run a group :-)"That's great! What do you like about it? What benefits do people get out of it?
Alex G wrote: "Leonie wrote: "I help run a group :-)"That's great! What do you like about it? What benefits do people get out of it?"
Our group is in a small country town. By starting a group, we've discovered that there are a remarkable number of 'closet writers.'
Each month, we bring a 500 word piece of writing to group (usually a specific genre or theme) and then we read them aloud to each other, and critique each other gently.
One of the biggest things we've learned is that what you think you've written is not necessarily so, and reading aloud exposes this.
Leonie wrote: "Our group is in a small country town. By starting a group, we've discovered that there are a remarkable number of 'closet writers.' "cool. last time there 3 1k-word flash fiction pieces. we limit it to 1k words.
I was in a writing group, but it collapsed when some people left and went overseas. We used to read a page or two of WiP and tried to make constructive comments.
Ian wrote: "I was in a writing group, but it collapsed when some people left and went overseas. We used to read a page or two of WiP and tried to make constructive comments."ah unfortunate. i wonder how well a Skype/google hangouts critique group would work? my daughter uses google hangouts to collaborate on stories with her schoolmates. you can do audio and video on it as well. (there are probably other real-time collaborative internet tools that i didn't think of off the top of my head.)
Skype has possibilities, I guess. however, right now I am as busy as ever, so I am not in any hurry to get into one.
I don't think the skype/google group would work, Alex. As Ian says, it would just add another load to the 'to do' pile. I think the groups are only useful for testing one's work while it is in progress by reading it to a group. That is also very enlightening, as Leonie says, just to hear the words spoken. I think that is the real benefit of a group and I do miss that opportunity. But, in the end, there is always the problem of criticism; it is often damaging because people are not practised in it.
Are you in a writing group that meets IRL?