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If this just doesn't say it ALL
message 101:
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Lauren
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Aug 05, 2009 11:18AM
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J wrote: "I'm hungry but I'm afraid to make pancakes? Pathetic."?
I made hash browns!
I've never called anyone that, so I wouldn't know, now would I? Maybe not that in particular, but you said:
ahahaha. Mental twins. to Davis's statement:
I disagree. When I know I have the upper hand is when I use personal insults, salt in the wounds if you will
so clearly you use personal insults on people. Why don't you share some of your favorites, and tell us more about what purposes you think they achieve.
I know I'm jumping in kind of late, but I rather agree that the example in the original post is very reflective on Christianity (and religion) in general. There is a definite correlation between intelligence and religiosity. How many Christians have actually even read the bible? How can you believe in something when you haven't even taken the time to consider the book in its entirety?
Marley wrote: "J wrote: "I'm hungry but I'm afraid to make pancakes? Pathetic."
?
I made hash browns!
"
I'll make eggs. Although I'm not entirely sure how to do that.
?
I made hash browns!
"
I'll make eggs. Although I'm not entirely sure how to do that.
Because God knows what we are going to do does not mean we have no choice but to do it. Foreknowledge of a decision does not affect the decision being made.
Second, God give us free will and respects that free will. That does not mean He isn't powerful. It means that despite the fact that He is able to, He does not do it because He doesn't want to. What you can do does not equal what you are willing to do.
What do I say to that?
Second, God give us free will and respects that free will. That does not mean He isn't powerful. It means that despite the fact that He is able to, He does not do it because He doesn't want to. What you can do does not equal what you are willing to do.
What do I say to that?
J wrote: "Because God knows what we are going to do does not mean we have no choice but to do it. Foreknowledge of a decision does not affect the decision being made.Second, God give us free will and respe..."
I would suggest that, first of all, god knowing what we are going to do DOES, in fact, prevent us from doing anything but just that. If god knows that I will decide to see (500) Days of Summer tonight instead of Away We Go, how can I possibly contradict that? The path my entire life will take has been determined by god's omniscience, and there is nothing that can be done about that.
Additionally, god could not have possibly given us free will if he is omniscient. Those two things are mutually exclusive. It's like asking if god can make a rock so heavy that he cannot lift it. It's a paradoxical scenario.
I figured it out (=
Does anyone care to know my debate with the other person? They aren't on Goodreads. But I'll copy & paste it.
Does anyone care to know my debate with the other person? They aren't on Goodreads. But I'll copy & paste it.
Because God knows what we are going to do does not mean we have no choice but to do it. Foreknowledge of a decision does not affect the decision being made.
Second, God give us free will and respects that free will. That does not mean He isn't powerful. It means that despite the fact that He is able to, He does not do it because He doesn't want to. What you can do does not equal what you are willing to do.
It'd just be the illusion of a decision. If there's no chance at all that something else would happen, then we aren't really deciding it.
Why would he respect our free will even when it hurts us?
Because without free will, you cannot love. That's the greatest commandment, and God's greatest desire for it. But if we had no choice to love or reject God, it's like programming a computer to say "I love you."
And though God knows beforehand about what decision you will make, it does not mean that you did not make the decision. If I knew beforehand what you were going to eat for breakfast, that did not impact your decision. When morning came, you decided whether to eat a bagel or cereal.
Love is a chemical reaction in the brain. Free will has nothing to do with it.
That's different. You can think you'll know what I'll eat, but there's still a small chance that it won't be what you think. You could never really KNOW what I'll do. But with God, there's no possibility that I would choose something else. So, I didn't make the decision. I just think I did.
Happiness and joy are results of chemical reactions in the brain. Love is a choice.
If I were God and I knew exactly without a doubt what you would eat for breakfast, that does not mean you had no choice to eat it. Because you made a choice. I just knew what choice you were going to make. That does not belittle your choice in any way. It just means that I was fully aware of what you were going to pick, yet you picked it.
Second, God give us free will and respects that free will. That does not mean He isn't powerful. It means that despite the fact that He is able to, He does not do it because He doesn't want to. What you can do does not equal what you are willing to do.
It'd just be the illusion of a decision. If there's no chance at all that something else would happen, then we aren't really deciding it.
Why would he respect our free will even when it hurts us?
Because without free will, you cannot love. That's the greatest commandment, and God's greatest desire for it. But if we had no choice to love or reject God, it's like programming a computer to say "I love you."
And though God knows beforehand about what decision you will make, it does not mean that you did not make the decision. If I knew beforehand what you were going to eat for breakfast, that did not impact your decision. When morning came, you decided whether to eat a bagel or cereal.
Love is a chemical reaction in the brain. Free will has nothing to do with it.
That's different. You can think you'll know what I'll eat, but there's still a small chance that it won't be what you think. You could never really KNOW what I'll do. But with God, there's no possibility that I would choose something else. So, I didn't make the decision. I just think I did.
Happiness and joy are results of chemical reactions in the brain. Love is a choice.
If I were God and I knew exactly without a doubt what you would eat for breakfast, that does not mean you had no choice to eat it. Because you made a choice. I just knew what choice you were going to make. That does not belittle your choice in any way. It just means that I was fully aware of what you were going to pick, yet you picked it.
How do you know you love someone? Emotions. Which come from the brain.
No, Brian. He knows EXACTLY what we'll do. There's only ONE thing. And if there's only one thing to do, there isn't really a choice.
No, Brian. He knows EXACTLY what we'll do. There's only ONE thing. And if there's only one thing to do, there isn't really a choice.
Brian?Just watched your free will video.
Marley wrote: "Brian?
Just watched your free will video."
That's the guy's name. I've known him for a jillion years but haven't talked to him since 6th grade.
Cool~
(Btw, the italics are him and the normal text is me.)
Just watched your free will video."
That's the guy's name. I've known him for a jillion years but haven't talked to him since 6th grade.
Cool~
(Btw, the italics are him and the normal text is me.)
(I figured)Bellydancing? How did you get to that topic again? lolz.
Marley wrote: "(I figured)
Bellydancing? How did you get to that topic again? lolz. "
Hahah, because of the bachelorette party I was at, remember? Well their anniversary is this month. So, I remembered.
Bellydancing? How did you get to that topic again? lolz. "
Hahah, because of the bachelorette party I was at, remember? Well their anniversary is this month. So, I remembered.
I seeeeeee...ur fuuuni! haha, and why are you talking to this Brain now?
I would like to point out, that in addition to god's omniscience, the very fact that he created everything also prevents free will. There are only two things that determine who we are and, thus, what we will do. Those things are nature and nurture. God created us (our bodies, our brains, etc.) and our surroundings (our family, our environment, etc.) We are mere products of these two things, and god knew what results these things would produce.When I make a decision, I am influenced by my brain, my experiences, and such. All of those influences can be traced back to god.
I'm talking to him now because I posted a link to the video on Facebook & he commented.
Thanks, Jessi~
Thanks, Jessi~
I have no arguments, they were all already stated. Love is not how you feel, it's what you do. If I truly dislike someone, I can still love them by doing nice things for them, etc.
Anyway. Now he said we'll talk about it later, and he wants to 'catch up a bit' first.
Jessi wrote: "When I make a decision, I am influenced by my brain, my experiences, and such. All of those influences can be traced back to god. "
True, but why do people like Davis and Nathan choose differently?
"True, but why do people like Davis and Nathan choose differently?"Because we are intelligent, and not stupid fucks like you.
Aaric wrote: "I have no arguments, they were all already stated. Love is not how you feel, it's what you do. If I truly dislike someone, I can still love them by doing nice things for them, etc."Doing nice things, etc. are not necessarily acts of love, they are simply being respectful. One thing I hate about Christianity is how much it cheapens the idea of love. Love is not something that you can offer someone even if you tried, and it shouldn't be because it is something special and intimate.
Exactly, Jessi. Doing something nice, even when you hate the person, is JUST doing something nice. It doesn't mean you suddenly love them.
Aaric wrote: "Jessi wrote: "When I make a decision, I am influenced by my brain, my experiences, and such. All of those influences can be traced back to god. "
True, but why do people like Davis and Nathan cho..."
It all comes down to chemistry. You and I could have the same experience. Say we were siblings, and our parents were not very good parents to us. They were irresponsible alcoholics, for instance. Those experiences may shape you in a positive way. You could go on to lead a very productive life, vowing to never succumb to the lifestyle you were exposed to in your childhood.
On the other hand, I may lead a very destructive life and repeat the mistakes of my parents because it was all I ever knew. Now, both of us had very similar experiences, but came out completely differently. Who we are is essentially hardwired in our brains.
Of course, experience and whatnot plays a role, but how we respond to the experiences in life is predetermined.
*chuckle* I don't know how exactly to explain what I mean, you guys are right though, it was a bad example.
Davis wrote: ""True, but why do people like Davis and Nathan choose differently?"Because we are intelligent, and not stupid fucks like you."
But that means you have free choice to use that intelligence, that you are not influenced by God.
"But that means you have free choice to use that intelligence, that you are not influenced by God."That's because there is no creator god.
Mod
I disagree. When I know I have the upper hand is when I use personal insults, salt in the wounds if you will
so clearly you use personal insults on people. Why don't you share some of your favorites, and tell us more about what purposes you think they achieve."
http://www.goodreads.com/story/show/3...
A personal favorite insult. X)
I've seen you insult worse than that! NOT that it's something to be proud of :P
Lorna, you never stated your opinion on the LSD thing last night.
I did. Briefly. On drugs as a whole though, not just LSD.
Mod
Formulating a cutting insult is an art form. XD
An art for maybe...but not one to be proud of! lolI'm actually pretty good when I want to be - I just rarely want to be :)
Well I missed a HUGE argument about mistakes in the first few posts.
"Well, because you dumbass fucking moron, sometimes those are just the right words for the given situation. See?"No. I'd just put that down to a lack of creativity. Sort of sad being that you're an English teacher.
"Are you really so stupid that you ignore everything I have said since my first post?"What? A bunch of insults to a bunch of kids? No, i got that part.
"What I am saying is that that is no reason for one to assume all Christians are total idiots.
You're putting words in my mouth. Don't do that."
Actually I believe those words did come out of your mouth. Metaphorically.
"I expect at least a minimum level of intelligence from those I debate with."
And I expect a minimum level of respect. For anything at least. But I understand how some people are incapable of such things, so no pressure.
A personal favorite insult. X) I wouldn't really consider what you said an insult though. If you're referring to "Some People Really Have it Coming" anyway. It sounds like you were setting someone straight on their behavior not just saying "Dumbass. Or "You're stupid" or "Bitch" or any of the other original and groundbreaking personal insults people have been throwing around in this thread.
And I expect a minimum level of respect.
I agree with that. I see no reason to give any credence or respect to people's opinions if they can't even observe the bare minimum of politeness.
What I really love is that the people that cuss and act rude online are often the biggest pussies in real life ;D
Can we just agree to disagree that everyone (Atheists, Christians, etc.) makes mistakes and that it may or may not have anything to do with their religion? Or are you all just going to....continue.....?
"You've already shown you don't really deserve it from me, so I will have to pass.""Please point out where I said that if you are going to make that claim."
Take your own advice.
"I always love when someone on the internet calls someone else a pussy. Yeah, that takes a lot of guts." -Nathan
:D did I call you a pussy? No. Huh, wonder what that means... perhaps you have a complex or two knocking about...
Mod
Guffaw....guffaw....
I'm sure you're real tough...
I always love when someone on the internet calls someone else a pussy. Yeah, that takes a lot of guts. "
He was responding to something else, ya know.
"He was responding to something else, ya know. "
That was directed at Nathan, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong, Lee.
Nathan wrote: ""You've already shown you don't really deserve it from me, so I will have to pass."Take your own advice.
That makes absolutely no sense at all. Nice work. "
It does actually. Show me where exactly I proved I deserve no respect.
Unlike you Nathan, i don't expect a minimum level of intelligence when I'm debating, however, it would be nice if they had at least a little bit.
That was directed at Nathan, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong, Lee. It was directed at people that act rude online... does Nate think he's been acting in a rude manner?
