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World & Current Events > When opposition death and injury rate seems a little higher than usual

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message 151: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments As for the freedom to speak, I think we have to recognize two types: simple criticism and subversive criticism. Totalitarian regimes undoubtedly clamp down on subversive criticism, but even in the USSR constructive criticism was welcome in party meetings. The problem then became nobody would be listening to some of it, but then nobody listens in democracies really. The individual cannot change anything because what happens tends to be due to unelected civil servants. In our countries, we have the rule of law, at least in principle, but there is no law requiring civil servants to actually demonstrate their actions are beneficial, as opposed to being convenient. Many totalitarian countries also run by rule of law. It is just that laws are different.

Obviously, some totalitarian regimes are just awful, but that does not mean that one-party states cannot be desirable for the people living there.


message 152: by Jim (last edited Oct 04, 2023 02:06PM) (new)

Jim Vuksic | 362 comments A cursory review of the various discussion groups will reveal that Ian posts numerous messages throughout any given day..

I initially intended to count the number of comments posted by Ian, but soon realized that there were so many, I had neither the time nor inclination to waste it.

I, like other Goodreads members, will occasionally access the website, check out the various discussion topics, and, if I feel I have something of interest to add, I will post a brief comment. Ian, however, seems compelled to respond at great length to every comment that does not agree with his own.

To quote an old business axiom: "Say what you have to say, then shut up. Your work speaks for itself!"

This is longer than my usual posts because it shall be my last on this topic. I am sure some will disagree with my assessment of this situation. What a truly dull world this would be if everyone agreed with everything every time. Besides, as I have often admitted, many of my best ideas have come from others.


message 153: by [deleted user] (new)

Jim, I always enjoy reading your posts and blogs but I have to say, Ian, keep those posts coming :)

Whenever I log onto t'internet, I always find time to check out the latest WWW posts. The reason is that this is the highest quality online political discussion board going.

Forget twitter, Facebook and the MSM, this is the place where Biden, Putin, Xi and everyone else comes to gauge the current political mood, and long may it continue.


message 154: by J. (last edited Oct 04, 2023 02:33PM) (new)

J. Gowin | 7997 comments I just figure that Ian knows that the CCP is probably keeping tabs on his daughter in law and all those in her orbit. So if he gets too anti-CCP, they could take it out on her family who are still in China.


message 155: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments J. wrote: "I just figure that Ian knows that the CCP is probably keeping tabs on his daughter in law and all those in her orbit. So if he gets too anti-CCP, they could take it out on her family who are still ..."

Imaginative. Inaccurate.

There, Jim, a short response


message 156: by Papaphilly (last edited Oct 04, 2023 05:57PM) (new)

Papaphilly | 5045 comments Jim wrote: "A cursory review of the various discussion groups will reveal that Ian posts numerous messages throughout any given day....."

I always enjoy Ian's comments no matter how wrongheaded they can get.....8^). They are always thoughtful and insightful, just wrong much of the time....8^). He does not blather on a given topic and does defend his position skillfully. He just happens to be wrong....8^). To prove my point, I shall now ask an unbiased expert on Ian's opinions...me. Ok Me, does Ian blather on an given subject? No. Ok Me, is Ian ever right? Occasionally, just when he agrees with you. Ok Me, how often do Ian and I agree? Well lightening can strike twice..... Thank you Me. Your welcome. OK, you all heard from an unbiased expert opinion.

Keep up with the editorials Ian, but do try and get it right....8^)


message 157: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Another false post. I always agree with Me :-)


message 158: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Ian wrote: "Throughout all this there has been the assumption that we live in superior places. There is a case the US thinks it is exceptional. There is no doubt that if you are talented and you want a high le..."

An immigration routes stubbornly point at the west as the desired location where people migrate to en masse. They don't have to. remember that. Sure, there are people that don't care much about freedoms. After all, not all of USSR evaporated once the borders were opened.
You should really live in a place like russia to compare. I'm sure you'll miss New Zealand real soon.


message 159: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Ian wrote: "And you know that Russians and Chinese do not speak freely amongst themselves. If you go to Quora look up the posts by Misha Firer. How could he do those posts if the government was so despotic as ..."

I'm sure your Chinese relatives enjoy facebook accounts, don't they? Come on, man, laughable


message 160: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Nik wrote: "Ian wrote: "Throughout all this there has been the assumption that we live in superior places. There is a case the US thinks it is exceptional. There is no doubt that if you are talented and you wa..."

People are migrating to the West because (a) they think Europe offers social security, and (b) they think the US offers higher incomes. As for (a), they end up disillusioned, and for (b) most do not get such higvher incomes, b ut they don';t kinow that before they emigrate. Some, of course, do qualify for higher incomes and their movement is simply rational economics. Finally, I agree some do flee from where thery were for safety reasons


message 161: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Nik wrote: "Ian wrote: "And you know that Russians and Chinese do not speak freely amongst themselves. If you go to Quora look up the posts by Misha Firer. How could he do those posts if the government was so ..."

Nice deflection, Nik, but more laughable. You completely ignore the point I made and produce a total irrelevancy. As it happens since my Chinese relatives by marriage do not speak English I really doubt they have a Facebook account.


message 162: by Papaphilly (new)

Papaphilly | 5045 comments Ian wrote: "Nice deflection, Nik, but more laughable. You completely ignore the point I made and produce a total irrelevancy. As it happens since my Chinese relatives by marriage do not speak English I really doubt they have a Facebook account. ..."

But they probably have a Chinese version of Facebook and the Great Firewall exists.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/04/26/bu...


message 163: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments It’s not a deflection and you know it, Ian. Their poor English has nothing to do with that, since they can’t have Facebook as it is banned in China. Pay attention - knowing English is not required for Facebook. I’m a member of many russian and Ukrainian speaking Facebook groups.
You should’ve stayed longer in the USSR to gain some first hand experience 😎


message 164: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Papaphilly wrote: "Ian wrote: "Nice deflection, Nik, but more laughable. You completely ignore the point I made and produce a total irrelevancy. As it happens since my Chinese relatives by marriage do not speak Engli..."

The Chinese have something called "Weichat", except my spelling of it is probably wrong. You could use it here if you wanted to, except you would probably find your lack of ability at Mandarin a bit of a problem.


message 165: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Nik wrote: "It’s not a deflection and you know it, Ian. Their poor English has nothing to do with that, since they can’t have Facebook as it is banned in China. Pay attention - knowing English is not required ..."

It is a deflection, Nik, as well you know. Let me reproduce the point I was making:

"And you know that Russians and Chinese do not speak freely amongst themselves. If you go to Quora look up the posts by Misha Firer. How could he do those posts if the government was so despotic as you seem to say. Again, what freedom do these governments curtail?"

The point was that this character Firer makes quite negative comments about Putin's Russia, and keeps coming up with photos which implies he is at least there. The point is, people can make critical comments; what they cannot do is be subversive. Facebook has nothing to do with that point, and you know it.


message 166: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Banning Facebook (just one example) is not “curtailing”, my friend? Can russians protest with “no war” slogans or is it too subversive?


message 167: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments I have no idea, but very few countries at war permit "no war" slogans. A pro-German slogan in the the UK during WW II would have led to real trouble for the sloganeer.


message 168: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Of course, “understanding” Ian, who “has no idea”. Is “no war” pro-Ukrainian?


message 169: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Depends where you put it. Give me an example of where someone has put such a slogan in Russia and I shall comment on it.


message 170: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Understandable, this guy was very very old: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/...


message 171: by Scout (new)

Scout (goodreadscomscout) | 8079 comments I searched Facebook in China and came up with this article that makes it clear that China blocks Facebook. The article informs people who plan to travel there about ways to circumvent government controls, but it's clear that people living there are blocked from using Facebook. What does this say about what it's like to live in China?

https://www.vpnmentor.com/blog/how-to...


message 172: by Philip (new)

Philip (phenweb) Scout wrote: "I searched Facebook in China and came up with this article that makes it clear that China blocks Facebook. The article informs people who plan to travel there about ways to circumvent government co..."

Perhaps it's nicer without Facebook stealing all their data?

More seriously, Facebook refused to censor according to Chinese government therefore got blocked. Chinese have their own equivalent.


message 173: by Nik (last edited Oct 26, 2023 01:38AM) (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Scout wrote: "....What does this say about what it's like to live in China?..."

It won't be high on freedom ratings. There will be people that don't bother much, but there will be many who'd vividly feel them lacking.


message 175: by [deleted user] (new)

Scout, what blocking Facebook says about China is that perhaps we're all wrong and it really does have its citizens' best interests at heart :)


message 176: by Philip (new)

Philip (phenweb) Beau wrote: "Scout, what blocking Facebook says about China is that perhaps we're all wrong and it really does have its citizens' best interests at heart :)"

LoL


message 177: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Maybe they just saved her life: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/...


message 178: by Scout (new)

Scout (goodreadscomscout) | 8079 comments Russia has a Supreme Court? Ian supports China and Russia, both of them curtailing freedom of speech. This makes no sense, coming from a man who enjoys freedom of speech and takes it for granted. What if you didn't have GR, Ian? How would you like that? Go live in China and see if you'd have the freedom of discourse we have here. Of course, with your point of view, you'd be welcomed on state-sponsored sites.


message 179: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments putler struggles to find a place remote enough to tuck his opponents: https://time.com/6550972/alexei-naval...


message 180: by Papaphilly (new)

Papaphilly | 5045 comments Nik wrote: "putler struggles to find a place remote enough to tuck his opponents: https://time.com/6550972/alexei-naval..."

I'm just impressed they found him.


message 181: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Sad. And now Navalny: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/...
Some, maybe many, in russia will raise a toast to his memory at their kitchens without uttering a word


message 182: by [deleted user] (new)

Navalny was right. Those in power in the 90s squandered the chance to change Russia for the better. Instead, they turned it into a basket case.

Luckily for most Russians, Putin got the country back on its feet.


message 183: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Beau wrote: "....Luckily for most Russians, Putin got the country back on its feet...."

You can't even imagine :)


message 184: by Papaphilly (new)

Papaphilly | 5045 comments Did Navalny fall off a balcony too?


message 185: by J. (new)

J. Gowin | 7997 comments No balcony.

Kremlin foe Alexei Navalny's team confirms his death and says his mother is searching for his body
https://abcnews.go.com/International/...

From the above linked article (my bold type):

"A note handed to Navalny’s mother stated that he died at 2:17 p.m. Friday, according to Navalny spokesperson Kira Yarmysh. Prison officials told his mother when she arrived at the penal colony Saturday that her son had perished from “sudden death syndrome,” Ivan Zhdanov, the director of Navalny’s Anti-Corruption Foundation, wrote on X, formerly known as Twitter."

Do you think the Pootster is rubbing it in to Western elites' faces that he doesn't have to make up some bs story about Navalny hanging himself while the cameras were out and the guards were taking a nap?


message 186: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Let’s hear Ian and maybe others justifying killing Navalny because of NATO, Biden, Trump, whatever or bringing examples how someone was killed in the West and how it’s exactly the same


message 187: by [deleted user] (new)

Navalny died suddenly.

Many group members' 1st thought might be that he fell off a balcony, through a window or was otherwise cruelly eliminated by the Russian status quo.

My first thought is did he take the vaccine?


message 188: by Papaphilly (new)

Papaphilly | 5045 comments Beau wrote: "Navalny died suddenly.

Many group members' 1st thought might be that he fell off a balcony, through a window or was otherwise cruelly eliminated by the Russian status quo.

My first thought is did he take the vaccine? "


If he did, he would have survived.


message 189: by Nik (last edited Feb 19, 2024 09:39AM) (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments I thought members would react, but Trump beat them to it. A weird one (wouldn't be him otherwise): https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign...
Does he compare himself to Navalny, who wants to be putler instead?


message 190: by Papaphilly (new)

Papaphilly | 5045 comments Nik wrote: "I thought members would react, but Trump beat them to it. A weird one (wouldn't be him otherwise): https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign...-..."

I think it is more in the line look what they did to him and what they are doing to me.


message 191: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments This shit is strong. Couldn't resist googletranslating (with small amendments), Semyon Slepakov's (famous russian singer, producer, showman) masterpiece:
Source: https://www.instagram.com/p/C3kPqAdIIFd/

"Mr. President of Russia Vladimir Putin,

I already contacted you two years ago.

This time there will be no tearful speech.

Then I asked you not to let us slide into hell



And I babbled something in upset feelings

About fraternal people, culture and friendship over the centuries,

Since then, hundreds of thousands of deaths, Ukrainian and Russian...

Their blood, Mr. President, is on your hands.



And I didn’t want to contact you anymore, due to the total

Lack of meaning and, stupidly, out of caution,

But now you cynically and vilely killed Navalny,

Therefore, I see no possibility to remain silent.



You definitely killed him, I don’t know how exactly -

Starved out, poisoned drop by drop, or maybe finished off right away.

It may have been done by other hands, but

It’s clear even to a hedgehog whose orders it was.



They didn’t kill on the first try - problems with personnel,

After taking a pause, because you are not one of those who are in a hurry,

Having separated him from relatives, settling scores with lawyers,

Not giving a .... about anyone,



What is left for you after a quarter of a century in the kingdom,

Having secured the support of your jackal pack,

Ready to howl at the first signal - the Anglo-Saxons!

And wag their tails in ecstasy in front of you.



You took such revenge (you are quite vindictive)

For fear, for ridicule, for your public failure,

For the love of the “puppeteers” to which you are so sensitive,

Because he got it and not you.



Now no one will spoil the picture of the “elections” for you,

You will put your butt back in your favorite chair,

Winning with your approval by a huge margin

Everyone whose common name is an empty space.



You must be glad - you finished an important task,

The mistakes were taken into account, and everything went like clockwork.

But take pity on his mother - give her the body,

Why cover your tracks - everything is already clear to everyone.



The ways of the Lord are mysterious and unknown -

They keep us on our toes, great respect for that,

But I believe that one day you will stand alongside the cannibals,

And a wide avenue will be named after him



In a free country, and now I’m not talking about Estonia,

But about the country for which he wanted happiness...

In the meantime, read lectures on history,

And enjoy your stolen power."


message 192: by [deleted user] (new)

It's only strong if it's what you want to hear. It's red meat for one viewpoint.

The rule of cui bono suggests Navalny was murdered on Putin's orders, just like it suggests a whole host of other things discussed across the threads.

However, due to the lack of evidence available to us members of the general public, in the name of impartiality, all these accusations, or none of them, must be labelled 'conspiracy theories'.


message 193: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments I want to hear that Navalny is alive. Everybody in russia and outside it knows what happened. Slepakov succeeds in expressing what millions feel so precisely therefore, I imagine, he garnered 80k likes just hours after publishing. I’m sure there is much more now and counting as it’s becoming viral and no vaccine 💉 will help.


message 194: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments 95k likes on insta already and I can’t even add mine as my insta is inoperable


message 195: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments Nik wrote: "I want to hear that Navalny is alive. Everybody in russia and outside it knows what happened. Slepakov succeeds in expressing what millions feel so precisely therefore, I imagine, he garnered 80k l..."

Everybody does not know. As yet there is no evidence that Putin specifically murdred Navalny now. Why should he? 19 years in that hellish place was bound to kill Navalny no matter what, so why didn't Putin simply wait for the inevitable? The fact that Navalny had had that novichok would have further weakened his body so there is no real surprise he died going for a walk outside in temperatures presumably very cold. Unless you have so walked I doubt you would understand what such low temperatures do to you.


message 196: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Sure, we don't know. His guards switched cameras off, coroner gave inexistent cause of death and the body won't be relieved to his family, while two days previously he was well and kicking. Come on, man :) And there is no doubt that killing a bird of this caliber only putler could prompt and sanction. But among hundreds of thousands one more one less for him it's just the routine


message 197: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments As a side piece of information, I was informed, while in Canada, that real care needs to be taken with protective clothing. If you are wearing ordinary clothing, your life expectancy outside is 35 seconds. Navalny was never getting out of that prison, so why would Putin order his death? All it has done is raise a lot of anti-Putinism for something that was inevitable.

Now, if you want to blame Putin for killing someone, Maksim Kusminov would seem to be a better choice. Riddled with bullets in his Spanish apartment at least seems to be more effective than novichok.


message 198: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Navalny’s voice was heard even from prison. putler feared enough to silence him and send another message of intimidation inside and outside russia


message 199: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 1857 comments But it is not a message of intimidation because nobody knows what actually happened. I know, you will say you do, but you don't because you were nowhere near the prison.

Now Kusminov is sending a message. That is unambiguous.


message 200: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 19865 comments Everybody knows what and why happened, Ian. Zero doubt. The details will likely become known after putler’s death when they’d be trashing him like they did to Stalin postmortem


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