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To Outline (OP) or Not To Outline (NOP)
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To outline, not to outline, when to outline ... all answers have their pros and cons. But IMO it all comes down to what works for you?Some people find a detailed outline up front not only a lot of work, but seriously constraining. Others can't write a word of story until they've figured out where it's heading.
Dedicated plotters will say that just getting on and writing will leave you with an unholy mess to tidy up at the end of the first draft. But those who don't outline will often say that's OK, kicking the mess into shape is part of the process, they just need to get something down on the page first.
Devout pantsers will say (as you did) that outlining is hard work, and will bar the way to interesting developments they may not have thought of at first. The plotters will point out that once you have a detailed enough outline most of the work is actually done and from there the story writes itself.
They are both right! They use the approach that works for them, that complements rather than contradicts their style of thinking. To me, that is critical. Remember, the only thing that counts in the end is the finished product. You get no bonus marks for the process you took to get there, so choose whatever approach gives you results.
Joe wrote: "Some authors insist on a detailed outline for a proposed novel others jump in and start developing an idea. I tend to be more of a developer. It seems to me that developing a detailed outline is al..."I do outline a tentative plot, but certainly don't 'insist' and it's rather in the form of ideas than a 'script'. Moreover, I keep it in mind, but rarely look into it, so any deviation wanted or required doesn't really mess everything up. If the story flows differently it'll override the OL..
Joe wrote: "what happens when you get half way through the writing and realize that you need to make a major change"BTW, in answer to this question, if you are sticking with "outline first" then the answer is easy - you adjust the outline first. In fact, having an outline should make major changes easier and safer because you can see the whole structure, and work through the effects of the change on the whole story consistently, before you get back to the writing.
Thanks. I have started taking the James Patterson Master Class. Patterson is an outliner. I gather from King's "On Writing" that he is not. All I have to say about King is that anybody who can put together the complex stories he writes without an outline is a genius. (Of course he is. Whether he outlines or not). I got interested in the issue because Patterson's discussion of plot made clear, to me at least, that a plot is an outline. If it's only 3 to 5 sentences, it is the most condensed outline imaginable. But as you tell your story (write it out), you create a structure that is either an outline or has an outline equivalent. In other words, if I just sat down and wrote a novel, someone could come along later and create an outline that represented the story.The tool that I am currently using has several features and tools. One of them allows the writer to make notes on each scene - summary, characters involved, events, locations, props. I have forced myself to make those notes for each scene because when I go back fix things, those notes are extremely helpful. The tool for creating an outline from the notes does not work well at all but the event chart provides a handy pseudo-outline.
Joe wrote: "The biggest questions about outlining as far as I am concerned are when have you done enough and what happens when you get half way through the writing and realize that you need to make a major change - take something out or put something?"you've answered your own question. ^_- you outline to the point that you don't have to make major changes. one successful romance writer friend of mine writes an outline that consists of about a paragraph or two for each chapter.
i'm not a very good outliner. i write maybe 2-3 pages in an outline structure for a novel. for my short story, i did about a half a page of an outline and ended up cutting out the first scene and the ending scene. i also cut back on a main plot device.
as you write more, then you get better at not having to make major changes; as you write more in your target genre, you get even better at not having to make major changes; as you write more in your story universe, you get really good at not having to make major changes.
i'd argue that an outline is a matter of efficiency and those who can pants a story and be efficient at it and successful at selling it well, probably have an outline in their head. ^_-
Joe wrote: "Thanks. I have started taking the James Patterson Master Class. Patterson is an outliner. I gather from King's "On Writing" that he is not. All I have to say about King is that anybody who can put ..."do you have a link for this class?
When I start to write, I don't make an outline. It all starts as a short story or a flash. If it triggers a response in my head and keeps nagging me there is more to come, I'll write an outline. But, I don't hold to it. Sometimes I veer in another direction. An outline is nice, but it shouldn't be controlling.
Alex G wrote: "do you have a link for this class?"You can find it easily by searching for James Patterson Master Class.
This is my shortcut: https://www.masterclass.com/classes/j...
Joe
I do both as the mood or story takes me. My largest work had no outline it just went where the characters wanted to go. My sci-fi series on the other hand not only has outline but detailed timeline too due to planetary time zones etc.Some chapters start as bullet points others just a title
In all cases the outline structure is very rarely the final effort.
My longest series (five books) starts with a prophecy, which I think most people would have trouble making sense of, and the end of the fifth completes the prophecy, so while each of the books, except possibly the first, has a reasonable ending, the whole lot were planned and the plan maintained. The key here was that the plan only required a very few events in each book, so there was plenty of scope for working out how to fit them in while maintaining the basic plan
The biggest questions about outlining as far as I am concerned are when have you done enough and what happens when you get half way through the writing and realize that you need to make a major change - take something out or put something?