Literature 1 discussion
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The Great Gatsby
Gatsby Red Group
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After reading chapter 1
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I believe that Daisy pretends she is a fool woman but she's not. She hopes his daughter will be a fool because in this way the girl will not suffer as her mother does and will live a simple life, without too much problems. Society sees and treats women as objects. Instead, men do whatever they want, they have the right to choose. Women at that time could only hope for marriage and a family.
From Daisy´s perspective, this means that if you are a fool you can be happier. If you don´t know that your husband/wife is cheating on you, or you pretend that you don´t know, you can be happier. I do believe, that with this phrase, the writer wants to convey that many people in society are hipocrites.
Anyway, I agree with Mariela. Daisy is not a fool, in fact she pretends to be a fool to obtain what she wants.
In the society where Daisy lives, is more important the wealth than the real feelings. Men think they have the power to make civilisation through their own productions. Through this quote, Daisy assumes that being a fool, her daughter will have a better life because she will ignore the real world. Moreover, Daisy is pretending to be a fool herself, but she's not. (I agree with both comments)My VoiceThread predictions have not been confirmed yet, but I think I should wait until the end of the book.
I agree with Malu on the fact that Daisy wants her daughter to be a fool to avoid her to be unhappy and live without realizing how unfair the society is towards women. They are only valued for their beauty, no matter how well educated or accomplished they are. Daisy sees herself as a sophisticated woman but sometimes she has to play the fool and, obviously, she is not pleased with that.So far my prediction has been accurate. In the first chapter already, the displays of wealth seem to be very important, and rich people don’t have other concerns than their own relationships and affairs.
I also agree with the fact that Daisy was not a fool at all; what she says shows how society treated women in those times: they stayed at home and pretended that everything was fine although it wasn't. Pretending to be a fool seemed to be a good strategy to avoid the pain caused by not being considered as men were. It's very sad as, immediately before saying that, she recalled not to have known where her husband was when their daugther had been just born. It is also true that she was seeing somebody else which tells us, as Sebastian mentioned, the hipocrisy wich reigned at the beginning of the century. Anyway, Daisy had less possibilities to talk openly about that behaviour than her husband did.This chapter confirmed my predictions and it gave me more details I didn't remember and other things which I hadn't paid attention to (since I had watched the film).
Mod
If you haven't posted yet, you could consider how Nick feels about this society and about Daisy.
Looking forward to other contributions.
I think that Daisy is not a Fool, she only pretends to be one. What she says is that society doesn´t care if a woman is smart or intelligent. Society is also completely apathetic about women´s feeling, in a world where the most important seems to be how wealthy people are. I think that social enviroment is quite rough with women.
Considering that I've already read the book, I've always felt that Daisy's words reflected the conception of women society had at that time. Being wealthy and beautiful was all that mattered for women, not their intelligence and the education they had recieved.In addition, and responding to Mariel's question, I think Nick didn't support this vision of women and he didn't neither understand nor support the way in which society functioned.
It is amazing how my vision and my opinion of The Great Gastby had changed over time, considering that the first time I read it was 2011!
I do agree with the comments mentioned above about Daisy and women in that society. It´s suggested that Daisy would have desired to have been born a foolish beautiful girl.Actuallly, Daisy was not a fool person.
Although women in society in the 1920´s started to behave in an inappropriate way, society was still male chauvinist in that having a mistress was socially accepted, for instance. If Daisy´s daughter was foolish, then she would not suffer in that male-dominated society.
In connection to Nick´s view about this society, I´d say that he thinks that people are careless and they lack the moral values of the west. I agree with Fernanda in the fact that he doesn´t understand the society, particularly the vision of women.
I think that we all agree that Daisay said that, because as Fernanda said, it was the conception of women society during the 20s. Women were not treated as men, and my impression is that Daisy wasn´t happy at all with her life. She pretended to be, but she wasn´t.
Mod
What do we know about Nick's background, personality and aims?
I agree with the comments mentioned, and also I think that Daisy was not a fool, she just made believe others to be one so as to gain what she was looking for,since she was not happy at all with her life . As regards society, I do agree with Liza in the fact that women were not trated equaly, they had a lower position than men.
with the phrase " I hope she´ll be a fool" I believe that, as most of the people in the group have already said, that society at that time was extremely unfair with women, no matter how smart they were or how prepared they were to do something , they just had to look good and accept what their husbands wanted as if everything were fine. She wanted her daughter to be a fool to avoid her suffering, because on the contrary, Daisy wasn't a fool and she was really unhappy with her reality and the reality of women in general.My VoiceThread predictions have not been confirmed yet.
It is true that the society was ruled mostly by men. Even though woman could enjoyed certain privileges in that community, their decisions were conditioned by men's. But I believe that Daisy used that expression ironically, in the hope that her child would succeed in the world in a better way than she did.So far, I've gotten some predictions of mine right.
I confused myself as regards Nick´s view about society. Throughout this chapter, it is explained what Nick has learned from his father. He states that he should reserve judgement about other people´s life. In a way, he characterizes himself as a moral and tolerant person.
I apologize for my late response, but I have been granted the access to the information a few days ago.I agree with the fact that Daisy is not a fool herself and her assumption that a person who does not realise or care much about things around him/her is going to be, perhaps not happy but, at least, at ease with him/herself. Situating this fact in a background of hostile and discriminatory feelings against women supports Daisy’s idea.
Nick feels that the society of rich people he witnesses is careless and immoral, where one has the choice either to fit in or be out. Those are the options he feels Daisy has, at least. She could be out of that society she belongs to and put an end to her endurance, or she could be cynical about everything and keep on with her “sophisticated” lifestyle.
Daisy knows very well the world she lives in and the role a woman is expected to play in a society ruled and controlled by men. She´s aware that the only opportunity for advancement a woman has is to act stupid and look pretty.Because of this, and being aware of the situation her daughter will face when older, Daisy hopes her child to live in a fool´s paradise, believing that there are no problems when in fact this is not true. This appears to be the only way to survive as a woman in a male-dominated world.
Sebastián Albanesi
Lucrecia Ambrogio
Julia Arce
Mariela Armando
Liza Calzetta
Selene Casella
Fernanda Catena
María Emilia Cegarra
Carla Cusumano
María Sol Antegiovanni
Silvana Antonelli
Maria Florencia Arcec
Juan Miguel Benítez
Brenda Escalona
Anaclara Gaset
Ernesto Román Grasso
Joana Idoate
Patricia Lombardero
Talking about her daughter, Daisy says "I hope she’ll be a fool — that’s the best thing a girl can be in this world, a beautiful little fool."
What does this tell you about Daisy? What does this tell you about society?
Then say whether your Voicethread predictions have been confirmed so far, or, if you had already read the book, if so far you have found things you didn't remember