Reading the Chunksters discussion
This topic is about
Les Miserables
Side-Reads
>
05/19 Les Miserables, Part V, Books III-V
date
newest »
newest »
I finished the book a week ago, I think, as I could not stop reading! So...going back to this section...Yes, so many threads that come together, and thinking about this section while already knowing what finally happens, you are right Zulfiya that Hugo leaves no thread loose in the end.
The sewers were yet another impossible challenge for Valjean, as you said, but he somehow overcomes it just like all the other challenges in his life. But the sewers seem symbolic for all the mire which Valjean has had to go through his entire life. This seems to be his finale, almost. You can't get much deeper than the sewers, and quicksand-like sewage at that. Jean Valjean pulls himself, and Marius, up out of the lowest of lows below Paris to emerge again. It seems there is nothing this man can't do! I think he saved Marius either way because if he were alive, it would be for Cosette's sake, and if he were dead, it would be for Marius' sake since Valjean had read the note instructing that his body be taken to his grandfather's house. Again, it seemed that Valjean had no choice - he does the right thing.
The struggle that Javert found within himself was extreme, but I suppose for him it made sense, since he was so black-and-white in terms of the law. Once his sense of right and wrong were upset, he was no longer the person he always believed himself to be. To me, and perhaps other outsiders looking at his personal struggle, I find his struggle a bit unbelievable. But this goes along with me not fully believing that someone could be so strict in terms of the law and what the law says and what is "right". In the end, though, I felt sorry that Javert felt there was only one answer to his struggle - and that it was an act which was so final.
Gillenormand was definitely more sympathetic and likable. I just wish he would have shown his true feelings towards his grandson much earlier in his life.
Valjean keeps silent about saving Marius because it is his nature to not draw attention to himself. He doesn't want attention out of the learned fear of being discovered who he is (a convict) and he doesn't want attention towards any good deeds perhaps for other reasons as well?
Yes, so at this point in the book we still have 100 pages to read. And since it seemed everything was wrapping up so nicely (all the threads and all), I couldn't help but wonder what was contained in another 100 pages?! So I could not stop reading at this point. :)
Linda wrote: "I finished the book a week ago, I think, as I could not stop reading! So...going back to this section..."Good job, Linda. I still have to plough through some pages. :-)
Linda wrote: "But the sewers seem symbolic for all the mire which Valjean has had to go through his entire life. This seems to be his finale, almost. You can't get much deeper than the sewers, and quicksand-like sewage at that."I agree with you - it is the finale; one can not get deeper than the sewers, but they are also his 'making'. Prior to this incident, his life was mostly about Cosette, and in the sewers Cosette was still the prime motive, but he was also tying to make her happy by saving the life of Marius, potentially knowing that Marius could be the man who could 'whisk her away' from him. In the sewers, he is learning to accept that he will have to share the most precious thing in his life - Cosette.
Linda wrote: "but I suppose for him it made sense, since he was so black-and-white in terms of the law. Once his sense of right and wrong were upset, he was no longer the person he always believed himself to be. "Javert is a very mechanical character, not that he is not interesting, but his nature is very similar to drones or robots. As soon as basic humanism and kindness 'penetrated' into his system, he felt that he could not function as an individual and had to switch on the mechanism of 'auto-destruction'.
Zulfiya wrote: "Javert is a very mechanical character, not that he is not interesting, but his nature is very similar to drones or robots. As soon as basic humanism and kindness 'penetrated' into his system, he felt that he could not function as an individual and had to switch on the mechanism of 'auto-destruction'. "I like your comparison of Javert to a robot and his auto-destruction.
I understood what Hugo was trying to do with Javert, but at the same time, I agree it just didn't fully connect with me. Why can't he come to the conclusion that there is a law greater than that of black and white, that there is a law of mercy, also? I can't understand that with his intelligent mind, he couldn't expand to think a little more "outside the box" in the terms of right and wrong. In some ways, though, you could almost say the same of Jean Valjean, but that's more of a discussion for the next section.Marius and Cosette make me want to smack them for how ridiculous they are, but at the same time, I can't help but smile at them. It's a good thing they have so much money: they are always going to be so generous that they'll surely give it all away.
The change in the grandfather certainly is interesting. It's as if he's finally allowed himself to be the man he's always wanted to be, and now it's spilling out of him so fast that he can't contain it (to the woe of everyone else, in some very long-winded speeches!) It's a neat change, but like Javert, I found it a tad on the unrealistic side. Are the grandfather's views on love and marriage supposed to represent Hugo's, or is Hugo presenting us with various extremes and we are to find the right one, or more likely to find a balance between all of them?
1. Hugo continues to describe the dirty underbelly of Paris, its massive sewage as guts that surround Paris. Do you think this description is symbolic or is it another nearly impossible challenge for Valjean?
2. Valjean was not sure whether Marius was alive and possibly considered him more dead than alive, but he persisted with his mission. Why? Did he subconsciously know that Marius could be Cosette's fiance and, in the long run, a husband?
3. Did Javert discover the different vision of Good and Truth? Was it a peaceful discovery? Is his emotional and moral struggle believable? Is the end of this struggle logical?
4. Has Mr. Gillenormand become a more sympathetic character? Do you think he is the only comic relief in the novel?
5. Why did Valjean decide to keep silence about his role in saving Marius?
And the final part will be discussed in a week. Everyone who will manage to finish this reading marathon deserves commendation. And I mean it!