A.Ham Book Club discussion
John Adams
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Chapter 1
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1. Based on what we have read so far, how would you characterize Adams? Is he more agreeable to you now?
2. Abigail is espoused as being his true counterpart and "in all respects his equal." Compare and contrast John and Abigail.
3. Answer honestly: did you laugh at John's description of his youthful dalliances (if that's what you can call them) with the young ladies around Harvard?
4. How is Adams' defense of the British soldiers accused in the Boston Massacre fitting with his character that we have learned so far in this chapter? Does it fit his character well or is this out of the norm for him?
5. Do you have a favorite passage from the reading? What is it and why?
All right. I find it hard to actually want to talk about this book so I don't have much to add except this passage stuck out at me."He was John Adams of Braintree and he loved to talk. He was a known talker. There were some, even among his admirers, who wished he talked less."
This so far is one of my favorite passages because it makes me think of Hamilton and how he also had a gift for words, and yet Adams and Hamilton were destined to be bitter nemeses.
Ok, that's all I got.
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Great minds, Alexander.
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#3: I laughed.
#4: In chapter 1, I feel as though his defense of the British soldiers does fit his character. It seems as though he wants to give the world a reason to dislike him, and that fits for him.
I laughed out loud at the "known talker" passage too. Then I highlighted it so I could easily locate it and laugh again later ;)
I highlighted it as well. I also found some of the passages about his early education, how he responded better to engaging teachers that praised students and how he applied this to his own students during his stint as a teacher. I found it interesting because 200 years later we are still struggling with to do what John figured out so long ago.
OK, here I go, and hopefully I'll not be as wordy as John or Alexander (which is my usual bent). It's almost midnight, and I'm sleepy, so ignore any weird spelling or grammar. (I kind of feel like my students must have, trying to get essays and research papers emailed to me by midnight of the deadline.)1. Preconceived judgments are sometimes a hard barrier for me to overcome, and at first I found myself really fighting to make myself read about this man I bear such a grudge against. So I was pleasantly surprised by the tone of the first chapter, and the way McCullough starts to flesh out Adams's character. Thankfully my prejudices started to melt a bit, and I began to respect (though not necessarily like) Adams much more. Having the background of Adams's family and the history of their lives in America dating back to the 17th century, I can almost understand why he would later have felt suspicious of "outsiders." Other clues to later behavior appeared too in his writing: a mistrust of too much ambition, etc. Quite a few of the traits to which we are introduced almost seem to foreshadow certain opinions and behavior later in his life. In the end, however, I came to respect his obvious zeal for the revolution and love of country; his loyalty in friendships; his intellect; his obvious love and respect for family, and especially, his wife.
Which leads me to No. 2...
John and Abigail seem to be quite the enviable couple, compatible and supportive of one another, watching out for one another, sharing ideas and ideals, always respectful. Abigail seems quite the badass! That's really all I want to say for now, but looking forward to reading more about her.
No. 3... Have your seconds meet face to face... oh wait; sorry got distracted.
Of course I laughed! Although my opinion of him has softened, I just can't imagine him being in the least "reliable with the ladies," so I read those passages more like parts of a novel...sort of fictional, not so believable. :) But those accounts (like many in this chapter) did serve to humanize him for me.
No. 4 Totally in character! "The tragedy was not brought on by the soldiers, but by the mob, and the mob...was the inevitable result of the flawed policy of quartering troops in a city on the pretext of keeping the peace." He believed the soldiers acted in self-defense against an out of control rabble. "...It's of more importance to community, that innocence should be protected, than it is, that guilt should be punished." Even though the verdict might be thought unpopular, the facts supported it, and popular sentiment could not change the facts. He had quite the sense of fairness. (This all called to mind Hamilton's representation of Tories after the war.)
And finally...
I guess it's unanimous... I loved that passage, and because it came early on, it really helped me get rid of some of my nasty pre-conceived baggage. Some of it, mind you. Not all of it. We shall see.
All right! Finished by midnight after all!
Dang, I didn't realize I'd written so much. Sorry... :/Y'all -- don't let me write as if I'm preparing for a lecture. Old habits die hard. Shush me as needed.
Sarah wrote: "All right. I find it hard to actually want to talk about this book so I don't have much to add except this passage stuck out at me."He was John Adams of Braintree and he loved to talk. He was a kn..."
I loved it... I'm so glad he wrote that. I was able to just relax and read after that.
1. McCullough mentions that Jefferson wrote that it was impossible not to warm up to John Adams. This was very interesting since I thought many people at the time and now did not like him. Personally, I did not know much about John Adams before starting this book. This first chapter did not turn me into a fan but I don't dislike him either. 2. Abigail and John are both avid readers and don't mind the hard house work. She does her own cooking, makes their clothes, feeds the farm animals, churns her own butter, and watches the kids. That is absolutely amazing and admirable, both for that time and today. They also seem to support and care for each other. Maybe, as we read more I will have a better answer for this.
3. I cracked a smile but no laughing.
5. I think that we all enjoyed the known talker passage as I too have it marked. I also thought of Hamilton when McCullough mentions that Adams could have been an author. It appears they both talked and wrote a lot.
I also enjoyed the following passage, "But in his need to fathom the "labyrinth" of human nature, as he said, he was drawn to Shakespeare and Swift, and likely to carry Cervantes or a volume of English poetry with him on his journeys. "You will never be alone with a poet in your pocket," he would tell his son Johnny."
I enjoyed that because since I was 9 years old I have always had a book with me.
When I read that he once traveled with a "copy of Don Quixote in his saddlebag" I thought of this article. http://www.mountvernon.org/digital-en...
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With all of you, I'm actually impressed how well you have shed a few of your preconceived notions. It's not easy.
I agree that John and Abigail make a good match in their work ethic and in their intelligence/social causes.
Becky, I agree with you as well. That passage particularly struck me as thoughtful and very true.
Becky, thanks so much for the link about Washington and his copies of Don Quixote! I enjoyed reading that and watching the video.Alexander, thank you! it's a joy to find like-minded folk with whom to share ideas. (And I do miss lecturing, sometimes!) ;)
Becky, Don Quixote is a wonderful book! I attempted it in Spanish once, but my Spanish was too slow and I became impatient! (Did better with Harry Potter 1 in Spanish, however.)I'm happy to say I'm catching up on John Adams ...and I'm enjoying it. How I would have loved experiencing Philadelphia in those days!
In the meantime, feel free to begin discussing if the urge strikes!