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Brexit - ciao Britain? She doesn't go anywhere
So it is not all rough and bad. It remains to see if if there is a rise of resentment toward the other over time.
Papaphilly wrote: "So it is not all rough and bad. It remains to see if if there is a rise of resentment toward the other over time."
Apart from a few morons who behaved moronically, I don't think there's ever been an issue between Brits and other European people over this. As I said in one of my first posts on this thread, I love Europe but don't love the EU.
That said, I foresee further friction between the British Government and European Commission. European integration and expansionism is like a religion to Europhiles and they will never forgive Boris, Nigel et al for damaging their grand plans.
Also, never be in any doubt that there is also huge support in many Western European countries for leaving the EU. For those in the single currency, it's probably a pipe dream, but the people of Europe by no means all love the EU.
Apart from a few morons who behaved moronically, I don't think there's ever been an issue between Brits and other European people over this. As I said in one of my first posts on this thread, I love Europe but don't love the EU.
That said, I foresee further friction between the British Government and European Commission. European integration and expansionism is like a religion to Europhiles and they will never forgive Boris, Nigel et al for damaging their grand plans.
Also, never be in any doubt that there is also huge support in many Western European countries for leaving the EU. For those in the single currency, it's probably a pipe dream, but the people of Europe by no means all love the EU.
Brexit gave one advantage to the UK :-) Those there may or may not have noticed that their pharmaceutical supply was not in trouble once Corona took over, despite the fact that most of the world supply comes from China, and to a lesser degree, India. Reason? Just like so many people began hoarding toilet paper when word of Corona came out, the British pharma companies and suppliers began hoarding ingredients in a big way once it became obvious that Brexit would occur, on the basis they expected huge trade barriers. OK, they were prepared for the wrong crisis, but they were prepared :-)Further good news: the EU is about to embark on another round of legislation, etc, for the chemical industry, which is important for the UK, and we can imagine it will favour Germany.
The EU is a protectionist cartel who will only work in the interest of the few top countries or German banks I started righting a much longer rant and then decided I've drunk too much this evening...
Philip wrote: "The EU is a protectionist cartel who will only work in the interest of the few top countries or German banks I started righting a much longer rant and then decided I've drunk too much this evening..."
Are you sure your not a Tory?
Why should he be a Tory? It was the Labour-held or Labour oriented seats that voted for Brexit that were decisive
Definitely had too much red wine last night could not even write write correctly that's right....You are correct - I'm not a Tory - this was a political party like the Whigs - From Britannica
"Whig and Tory, members of two opposing political parties or factions in England, particularly during the 18th century. Originally “Whig” and “Tory” were terms of abuse introduced in 1679 during the heated struggle over the bill to exclude James, duke of York (afterward James II), from the succession. Whig—whatever its origin in Scottish Gaelic—was a term applied to horse thieves and, later, to Scottish Presbyterians; it connoted nonconformity and rebellion and was applied to those who claimed the power of excluding the heir from the throne. Tory was an Irish term suggesting a papist outlaw and was applied to those who supported the hereditary right of James despite his Roman Catholic faith."
Pretty sure I am not a papist or an outlaw :-)
I'm a constitutional monarchist only because every example I see of a Republic is worse. Think I responded to Beau on secret ballots and voting record.
I have admitted to voting out but it was a very narrow decision like the overall vote. Once voted for that needed to happen hence democracy. Something the EU is not keen on
Excellent self-discipline last night, Philip.
I've posted twice after drinks. Once, I cancelled it when I woke up. The other time I had to backtrack the following morning after saying that I supported Donald Trump. It took 2 gos but lesson learnt.
Time for me to log off now for drinks.
I've posted twice after drinks. Once, I cancelled it when I woke up. The other time I had to backtrack the following morning after saying that I supported Donald Trump. It took 2 gos but lesson learnt.
Time for me to log off now for drinks.
It might be somewhat unpopular, but I’ll venture it anyway, saying you don’t necessarily need to be drunk to be Trump’s supporter :)
I know but I wanted to keep my outright support for him secret ;)
I will go one even better, you do not have to like him to support his policies. I personally cannot stand him and have not for over 30 years. Yet, I will defend him in what has happened because what was done was just wrong. I also happen to support many of his policies.
I find Trump thoroughly objectionable as a person, have a mixed view on his policies - some good, some bad - (as are my opinions of most politicians' policies) but this "trial" was simply political posturing.
That is why I do not think the Democrats will do well with Joe. They wasted time and money with political theater. They seem to think they can beat the Republican about the head and shoulders with this over time. Wait until the reality of a tough economy due to the Pandemic and then the taxes going up. The populace will turn fast on them when the realize Trump was not the devil incarnate. Being woke is wearing out fast and there will be a backlash coming.
Hand on heart, cards on the table...
If I was American, I'd be a natural Democrat. I've never liked Trump but there were moments in both 2016 and 2020 when I positively wanted him to win.
I can't comment on the success or otherwise of his policies because I don't know enough about them. And my feelings weren't swayed by any positive feeling towards him, purely by how repellent I sometimes found elements of the other side. I don't include JB in this because he comes across as a thoroughly decent man.
If I was American, I'd be a natural Democrat. I've never liked Trump but there were moments in both 2016 and 2020 when I positively wanted him to win.
I can't comment on the success or otherwise of his policies because I don't know enough about them. And my feelings weren't swayed by any positive feeling towards him, purely by how repellent I sometimes found elements of the other side. I don't include JB in this because he comes across as a thoroughly decent man.
Beau wrote: "Hand on heart, cards on the table...If I was American, I'd be a natural Democrat. I've never liked Trump but there were moments in both 2016 and 2020 when I positively wanted him to win.
I can't..."
His history says otherwise, but then we all have history. This is not really about Republicans and Democrats, but really about the edges of the both parties. The ends have squeezed the middle.
Nik wrote: "It might be somewhat unpopular, but I’ll venture it anyway, saying you don’t necessarily need to be drunk to be Trump’s supporter :)"Well, you're popular with me for saying that, Nik.
Papaphilly wrote: "That is why I do not think the Democrats will do well with Joe. They wasted time and money with political theater. They seem to think they can beat the Republican about the head and shoulders with ..."Well said, PapaP.
Ian wrote: "I find Trump thoroughly objectionable as a person, have a mixed view on his policies - some good, some bad - (as are my opinions of most politicians' policies) but this "trial" was simply political..."I agree.
Our condolences on passing of Prince Philip just so little short of 100. Hope Meghan won't be quartered, if she makes it to the funeral.
Sad, but inevitable. He lived longer than most and we should celebrate the length and depth of his life. He seemingly witnessed the end of WW II, and knew every leader of importance since. That is quite an innings.
Meghan, the self-centered divider. I'm assuming that she's intelligent enough to know what it meant to marry into the royal family, what would be expected of her. What a wimp. Being quartered might be too steep a price - maybe just having to show up in public in England after that interview and facing the family will be punishment enough. Or maybe she'll be true to form and cower in the States and keep Harry at home.
I am reasonably confident that Megha will not be drawn and quartered. That was abolished and removed from the statutes in 1870 :-)
Do you think that Andrew is happy that she's taking the heat off of him?
Ian wrote: "I am reasonably confident that Megha will not be drawn and quartered. That was abolished and removed from the statutes in 1870 :-)"A spontaneous mob lynch can be a dangerous alternative, but hope nothing bad happens
On our news, it said Harry is coming, but the implication was that Meghan was not. She will be safely secreted away in the US.
Ian wrote: "On our news, it said Harry is coming, but the implication was that Meghan was not. She will be safely secreted away in the US."She might want to avoid car rides through tunnels.
No surprise that she's not facing the music and supporting her husband. Confirms my opinion of her.
Not defending her actions or the interview but- 30 guest maximum for the funeral in line with government regulations on COVID
- This is not a small family
- She is not the only grandchild spouse not going
- The Prime Minister is not going
- She is Pregnant and has been advised not to travel
- COVID restrictions on all non-essential travel
I see she has a good excuse for avoiding facing the family. Lucky for her; returning to England wouldn't have been fun. I have a feeling that a lot of Brits feel the same way I do about her, and it has to do with her character, not her race. She signed up to be a royal and then wimped out and took Harry away from his family. Or maybe I'm being too hard on her.
Scout wrote: "I see she has a good excuse for avoiding facing the family. Lucky for her; returning to England wouldn't have been fun. I have a feeling that a lot of Brits feel the same way I do about her, and it..."I think she has lost a lot of support - not for leaving - there was sympathy for her and Harry
Support is breaking on younger/older rather than race
Sometime s the Royals are better than the Kardashians.
I'd say that Meghan has more in common with the Kardashians than with people who have strength of character.
Is this a record Brexit? 6 clubs join a European super league, and 48 hours later they pull out. That will be hard to beat.
Ian wrote: "Is this a record Brexit? 6 clubs join a European super league, and 48 hours later they pull out. That will be hard to beat."-:) Yeah, the coup seems to have choked. There is another thread about leagues and American vs European approach as of organization of major sports: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Appetite comes with eating ... Scotland might push for another exit, basing on pro-independence majority in its parliament: https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/can-...Likely/unlikely: what do you think?
Just an allegation at this stage that prince Michael might've found an unusual way of monetization, yet it hints that connections are worth a lot: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-57042823
Nik wrote: "Appetite comes with eating ... Scotland might push for another exit, basing on pro-independence majority in its parliament: https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/can-......"From what I have heard, admittedly from a great distance, Sturgeon will delay such a move. Apparently, it seems likely that at present it is too close for comfort for Sturgeon and she presumably knows she would not get a third go, and it appears she has announced it will not be an immediate priority. She has probably beaten the drum to get SNP support from Labout voters in the election. Don't know how reliable that opinion is, but it does make some sort of sense.
Middle of a pandemic, her own education policies failing, over spending and under delivering so waiving the independence nationalist card. Once more deflecting and blaming Westminster. Claims democracy but ignores UK democracy and majority in UK Parliament.Still keeps the proletariat happy...
BTW I am pro Scottish independence - the sooner they go the sooner she will not clutter up the news... I wanted a vote last time but the rest of the union was not allowed a view...
Philip wrote: "Middle of a pandemic, her own education policies failing, over spending and under delivering so waiving the independence nationalist card. Once more deflecting and blaming Westminster. Claims democ..."Now that amazes me. I would have bet against that one. Do you think Scotland will go at some point? I am having a hard time seeing how Scotland could make a go of it on its own. so let me aks this question. do you guys see each others as Brits first? so le tme try and explain. Americans are from all over and we can differentiate. Yet, we see each other as American first.
Papaphilly wrote: "Philip wrote: "Middle of a pandemic, her own education policies failing, over spending and under delivering so waiving the independence nationalist card. Once more deflecting and blaming Westminste..."Hard to say - I suspect the English do see themselves as Brits first but my experience of Scottish and Welsh in those nationalities first. Northern Irish is complicated by the religious and political divide e.g. Unionists are British. Nationalists are Irish as in greater Ireland
I do not see how Scotland can survive on its own yet small countries do. There are a lot of British things in Scotland starting with the base for the nuclear deterrent - all the arguments for trade and currency and economic stability have not changed. Yes, the UK is no longer in EU - the SNP argument for having a 2nd once in a generation referendum.
I have a selfish motive too. Scotland receives more per capita tax spend then England. Scottish MPs vote in UK parliament on matters for England - yet the reverse is not possible. A democratic deficit that has never been resolved.
Congrats to Boris for prospective multiplication https://www.theguardian.com/politics/.... Will he take a paternity leave? Do you think men should have such an option?
According to our Newspaper, Britain had a 4.8% growth in GDP over the June quarter. Even if this is a little influenced by a lower baseline due to Covid, it shows the initial predictions of economic disaster for Britain simply have not turned up.
Ian wrote: "According to our Newspaper, Britain had a 4.8% growth in GDP over the June quarter. Even if this is a little influenced by a lower baseline due to Covid, it shows the initial predictions of economi..."Correct likewise the high inflation numbers in UK are because of the restaurant voucher system form 12 months ago going out of the calculation
The UK employment rate - those in work is back to pre-pandemic level
The UK Unemployment rate - those claiming benefits but seeking work - remains higher.
The UK job vacancies sits at highest rate since 1990s a
End of Sep marks end of top ups to some benefits and furlough scheme - significant wage inflation in some sectors because of shortage of labour
Ian wrote: "Even if this is a little influenced by a lower baseline due to Covid..."
Ian, you have a wonderful dry sense of humour but you’ve surpassed yourself this time. The response to covid has had the greatest impact on our economic figures since The Great Frost of 1708-9.
What’s more, we must remember that these headline figures are now completely meaningless and bear no correlation with the real economy. They form part of the rogue regime’s propaganda campaign.
Once the artificial safety nets have been removed and their impact felt on the wider economy, the real cost of the past 18 months will be laid bare for all to see.
Ian, you have a wonderful dry sense of humour but you’ve surpassed yourself this time. The response to covid has had the greatest impact on our economic figures since The Great Frost of 1708-9.
What’s more, we must remember that these headline figures are now completely meaningless and bear no correlation with the real economy. They form part of the rogue regime’s propaganda campaign.
Once the artificial safety nets have been removed and their impact felt on the wider economy, the real cost of the past 18 months will be laid bare for all to see.
Beau wrote: "Ian wrote: "Even if this is a little influenced by a lower baseline due to Covid..."Ian, you have a wonderful dry sense of humour but you’ve surpassed yourself this time. The response to covid ha..."
Beau
The real cost is already clear to see in Government borrowing figures (in macro economic terms) The cost to individuals varies greatly. Many working from home have saved substantially e.g. not having to pay commuter charges out of taxed income. Not spending in all those city centre restaurants and coffee shops. That means the government has also lost revenue in VAT income
The poorest have had supplements to Universal credit then there was Furlough saving many companies. Another reason why inflation is a poor measure
Some companies have done well, some haven't just as some did well out of the financial crash and some didn't.
Covid was one of those "black swan" events that threw everything up in the air. I doubt any country did not have a bad economic downturn, and most followed the US and went into quantitative easing, AKA money printing and all will have to pay the price. However, the point of my comment was that while the UK may have problems from the Covid saga, and while it may well have been able to do better (as probably so could everyone else) the issue with Brexit is, did the UK do dramatically worse than had it stayed in the UK? The figures I came up with suggests the predicted "basket case" scenario did not occur at all, and it is far from obvious here that the EU has done particularly better out of the Covid event.
Ian wrote: "Covid was one of those "black swan" events that threw everything up in the air. I doubt any country did not have a bad economic downturn, and most followed the US and went into quantitative easing,..."I suspect we will have to wait on further developments before we can determine if The United Kingdom has done better or worse. It is early yet and the economies have not gotten back to where they were or need to be. As the Black Swan event finishes, I expect we will start to see jostling with and against Europe and England. There will be antagonisms. Whether major or minor remains to be seen.
With pound that low, but ambitions high and defense budget even higher, expanding into the UK makes sense:https://www.edrmagazine.eu/rafael-acq...
So the coronation is slated for tomorrow. Are you going? Further break up scenarios of the UK, would be something to mend
World, Writing, Wealth
Books mentioned in this topic
Thirty Years from Now (other topics)Against the Double Blackmail: Refugees, Terror and Other Troubles with the Neighbours (other topics)
Authors mentioned in this topic
Nikolai Gogol (other topics)Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn (other topics)
George Santayana (other topics)
and same the other way round with Brits in EU