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Anyone finding the move to GR harder than they anticipated?
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Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "What books are these?"https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
This one actually had more posts than I remembered, but I guess I wanted more people to become aware of it, as I think it is an interesting and important book:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Thanks for asking. I always have more books that I want to write reviews to than I actually post.
Barbara wrote: " I agree that it's a shame many of them are being missed. I'm so busy trying to clean up my books, that I know I'm missing quite a few myself. It's also cutting into my reading time! "I think many of us are having this problem , plus trying to figure it all out and then if you throw a few real life problems in like computer crashing, mother with Alzheimer's, vacation/trip to see said mom while she can remember you.....
I think we are actually doing pretty damn good here.
Booknblues wrote: "This one actually had more posts than I remembered, but I guess I wanted more people to become aware of it, as I think it is an interesting and important book:https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
."
I'll make it a point to comment on all the review threads of interest to me in PBT. I see you BnB in multiple groups and know I've commented on these somewhere. I was hooked on Beauty Is a Wound on Shelfari. Reading this thread, I added Tien's recommendation Man Tiger to my TBR. It's interesting to note that all this happened without me saying a word on the PBT thread.
I also added The Way Back to Florence and then snagged it as a Daily Deal about the same time. The funny thing is that it downloaded when I updated my Kindle, and I looked at it and wondered why the heck I bought it.
It is worthwhile to note that "Unread" and the individual folders can be sorted by any of the columns other than started by, either ascending or descending. The default is last activity, but that might be the easiest way some things get overlooked.https://www.goodreads.com/topic/group...
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "What do you mean by "visual cues?" (The title of the thread has the book title, author, and star..."
Some people just write a quick three line review to get participation points, and there's nothing wrong with that, but not sure they care that much if anyone reads or reacts to it.
Other people really write reviews that are very expressive and usually longer with bold and exclamation points and multiple paragraphs.
On Shelfari, you would open a thread and all the reviews were visible at once, so you could see where people really had something important to express . . .
On the very short reviews, I would be still likely to comment if I had read the book, but otherwise might just skim.
But if someone writes a longer review, I'd make the effort to read it on Shelfari.
Now, you can't tell unless you open every review . . .which I'd LOVE to do, but am finding challenging.
The solution is clearly just more hours in the day!
I do think that one of the other factors is we are all coming up a learning curve (together) and trying to get our shelves organized - - and this cuts into time we can spend together here at PBT. Honestly, I think participation here is actually UP overall so there may be more reviews to read (Cindy will know that).
I do like to use the "unread" topics feature which I sort by number of posts. When I visit, I like to look first at posts where no one has commented. Then, I look at things I've actually read where I feel like I can chime in. But in the ideal world, honestly, I'd really like to READ EVERYTHING here. I always thought on Shelfari that I did read close to everything. But now I'm not so sure that's true!
Jenni Elyse wrote: "If the giant thread happens, without the nested comments, I know I won't participate anymore. I know I'm "new" because I was inactive for so many years. So, take my feelings with a grain of salt."Well frankly I was a big advocate for the current set up as I thought anything else would be very confusing. So I'm certainly not rushing to change things, but am also opening to hearing member feedback always. I wouldn't want it to be "my way or the highway" so to speak, but want to do what is truly best for discussions of our reviews.
I love reading what everyone is reading and how they like it . . .it feels like all my personal friends telling me about their books . . .but at the pace the group moves, I just need more time.
Anita wrote: "Some people just write a quick three line review to get participation points, and there's nothing wrong with that, but not sure they care that much if anyone reads or reacts to it.Other people really write reviews that are very expressive and usually longer with bold and exclamation points and multiple paragraphs."
An idea to try for one season and see how it works/see if people like it.
Two Other Books folders (or, frankly, two folders for the tag): one for short(er) reviews, one for long(er) reviews. Moderator's could define short in the way they choose, from number of lines or short paragraphs, whether the review includes quotes, or some other criteria you know long-time members use.
Anita wrote: "The solution is clearly just more hours in the day! ..."Yes! Exactly! :-)
Anita wrote: "Honestly, I think participation here is actually UP overall so there may be more reviews to read (Cindy will know that)...."
I have to admit that the shelf is much easier here, since people can add their own books, themselves! I can't say for sure right now, as I am only double checking everything at the end of the month, whereas at shelfari, it was much more work, so I spent time on it every weekend.
As most of you have probably seen, though, I do keep stats and will post them at the end of each month for those who are curious.
Anita wrote: "Honestly, I think participation here is actually UP overall so there may be more reviews to read (Cindy will know that)...."
I think on shelfari, you likely did like I did: you at least opened each thread, so you could skim everything, even if you didn't actually read everything. Here, though, with so many threads, it's takes that much extra time to open every thread! (Hence the more time needed in a day!)
Denizen wrote: "The funny thing is that it downloaded when I updated my Kindle, and I looked at it and wondered why the heck I bought it. ."I'm glad I posted this then for a reminder to you. I think you will enjoy it.
Anita wrote: "I love reading what everyone is reading and how they like it . . .it feels like all my personal friends telling me about their books . . .but at the pace the group moves, I just need more time. "I know what you mean. Sometimes, for me, it is just more time to do all the things I want to do. Lately, I've been so involved with things online that my reading time is suffering big time!!!
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "An idea to try for one season and see how it works/see if people like it. Two Other Books folders (or, frankly, two folders for the tag): ..."A spin on what Elizabeth suggested:
We could have a couple of threads for non-monthly tag reads but perhaps divide them by general topic? Maybe a nonfiction thread, a contemporary fiction thread, a young adult thread, and one other? That way the threads would be shorter in general and easier to follow but also you could find genres you are interested in easier.
Would that be too complicated?
Nicole wrote: "Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "An idea to try for one season and see how it works/see if people like it. Two Other Books folders (or, frankly, two folders for the tag): ..."A spin on what Elizabeth s..."
That's a great idea
Nicole wrote: "We could have a couple of threads for non-monthly tag reads but perhaps divide them by general topic? Maybe a nonfiction thread, a contemporary fiction thread, a young adult thread, and one other? "Maybe even a better idea than the short/long review idea.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Nicole wrote: "We could have a couple of threads for non-monthly tag reads but perhaps divide them by general topic? Maybe a nonfiction thread, a contemporary fiction thread, a young adult thread, ..."Four categories fit on the first page so PBTers could see all new activity on the first page if 4 genres were selected to highlight by preference( nonfiction, literary fiction, mystery, etc) or a new thread could be created each week so the sort would be newer reads (April wk 1, wk 2 etc.).
Nicole wrote: "Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "An idea to try for one season and see how it works/see if people like it. Two Other Books folders (or, frankly, two folders for the tag): ..."A spin on what Elizabeth s..."
That would be easier than just one long thread. It's worth a shot.
Well, I think if we do anything, the idea of genre threads under other books is a good one to try although we'd have to ascertain the top genres and probably still have a general thread for those that don't fit the genres.At any rate, I feel like we are still getting the hang of Goodreads as it is so not sure now is the time to try a new thing just yet . . .but if we decide we need to, then I think this approach makes sense.
As an avid user of Goodreads, and belonging to over 20 groups here I can tell you that having all the reviews in one thread will NOT promote comment / discussion. It has always been one of my big frustrations here (though I absolutely love the challenges). I admit that I do not open each review ... I use the "unread" feature and go through them based on the title of the thread(book). If it's a book I am interested in or have already read, I'll be more likely to open it. If it's by a "trusted" friend (i.e. someone whose reviews I come to trust over the years ... and who, I know, doesn't typically include spoilers in reviews) I'm also more likely to open it.
This month's tag - mystery-thriller - makes me hesitant to open reviews though because this is a genre where you really do NOT want any spoilers. That may not be the case with FEMALE AUTHOR or other tags.
And, of course, my real-life issues this month have kept me away from the site in general.
AJ wrote: "I have recently realised that I am really struggling with the move to Goodreads. Not because I am finding it hard to figure the system out or any problems like that. I am just finding it really har..."Seeing that I just figured out how to participate here I'm guessing my answer would have to be YES! haha
Trying threads by genre might be an interesting idea but I'm worried about how hard conversations are to follow. For example in the reading suggestions and plans thread I just gave up because I find it too complicated to follow who's answering what comments and having a conversation about a particular recommendation is too messy. I can't skim easily and tell what I might be interested in. I also don't have time to open all the reviews although a lot of people are posting reviews which is good!
I'm sticking it out and I know the admins are doing their best to have an awesome format for exchange and discussion.
I do think that the discussions are much harder to follow here than they were over at Shelfari. I have found that with some threads, if i'm not following the threads daily (multiple times a day), I lose track of the conversation and miss some people's comments. I changed my settings so that at PBT i get email notifications for every message posted. It feels overwhelming at times but it's the only way I can follow along with the conversation.I don't do that for any of my other groups. the 1001 group is easier to follow because for the most part we are all reading the same books. I belong to one other group that I only follow by digest. The group is too big for any real conversation so I participate minimally in that group.
I do like it here but I find myself having to put much more time and effort into staying in the loop otherwise I miss comments. I also don't open all the book review threads here whereas at Shelfari I did read or skim most reviews.
Book Concierge wrote: "As an avid user of Goodreads, and belonging to over 20 groups here I can tell you that having all the reviews in one thread will NOT promote comment / discussion..."This is helpful information to know.
So basically, it really isn't us. It's the format. And we are just going to have to work with it. We probably are doing as good a job as we can do.
I do find that where conversations are happening on a review, they go well because we are all talking about the same thing.
I also find the suggestions thread gets overwhelming, and I want to respond to way more of people's ideas, but fear it will just confuse matters even more.
Wish there was a magic answer, but I fear there is not.
Anita wrote: "I also find the suggestions thread gets overwhelming, and I want to respond to way more of people's ideas, but fear it will just confuse matters even more. ..."So .... perhaps when you announce the tag, you should "reserve" a couple of posts right away for the suggestions. Of course, this would require that the moderator of that month's suggestion list, would actively monitor the thread and put the suggestions in those reserved spaces. (Only the creator of the reserved posts can edit them.)
I mention reserving more than one post because there is a limit to the number of characters you can have in one post.
How you would do this would be to type your original post announcing the tag of the month. Then IMMEDIATELY complete the next comment with just the word "reserved" and save it; repeat. So comment # 1 is your original post, #2 is reserved, #3 is reserved.
You can see an example of how I did that HERE
Hope that made sense.
While that is a good idea, BC, I cringe at the time commitment that would be for the admins.
Book Concierge wrote: "Anita wrote: "I also find the suggestions thread gets overwhelming, and I want to respond to way more of people's ideas, but fear it will just confuse matters even more. ..."So .... perhaps when ..."
So you are saying to use those reserved sections to create a giant running list of the books that are recommended?
I may not be understanding how those reserved posts would be used . . .
My issue is not with people's original posts where they list what they recommend and what they will read. I find the confusion to be when I want to respond to those posts and chat about their recommendations . . .those conversations are just hard to follow now . . .at least for me.
As to the monthly tag suggestions thread.Perhaps there could be two threads. One for suggestions, one for plans. I know there are comments about books in both threads, and that might not make things exactly easier, but it is a (somewhat) logical way of breaking it up, which just might make it more manageable.
I don't see how having nested threads solves the problems. I would hate to have to skim a huge thread every day to see what is new on the several book reviews that interest me, and having to filter out the comments on the book reviews that don't. I know all of you were used to that, but from outside it sounds just about as confusing as all get out. ;-)
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "I don't see how having nested threads solves the problems. I would hate to have to skim a huge thread every day to see what is new on the several book reviews that interest me, and having to filter out the comments on the book reviews that don't.."The new posts were marked as *new* in red, and you could display ONLY unread posts in the thread (which would show the main post with the new comment . . .not just the comment).
I will say that this feature kinda stopped working toward the end of Shelfari's life, and so became less useful.
If a thread got too long (over 200 posts), we would just make a new one.
You could also hide replies if you simply want to read the reviews and not see the conversations associated with them.
I will say that MOST messaging systems with threaded messaging do not work as well as Shelfari's did . . .there's other websites with threaded messages that I find annoying. But somehow, the way Shelfari did it, it worked well. They didn't allow nesting ad infinitum . . .it was just a couple of levels. That also really helped keep things easy to follow.
Anita wrote: "The new posts were marked as *new* in red, and you could display ONLY unread posts in the thread (which would show the main post with the new comment . . .not just the comment)."Like I said, I know you all liked this. At this moment, there are 116 reviews in the Other Books thread and all have new comments (because I don't read them all). It wouldn't really help. ;-)
Elizabeth, the way Shelfari worked you could also COLLAPSE or EXPAND replies. So if you chose "collapse" ... you'd see the main post (e.g. below) and a notation that there were new, unread replies.MY REVIEW OF XYZ BOOK * 3 unread replies
If I didn't care about that review or the responses to it, I wouldn't have to open those nested comments. Also because the unread button was not just a red text but an actual "button" - and it was always on the far right - it really stood out on the page and the page was very easy to scan / skim over.
Well, water under the bridge....
Book Concierge wrote: "Well, water under the bridge......"Yeah, and I wish I understood it better to understand how this transition might be more comfortable. I did look at PBT in Shelfari this morning, but being new, of course, everything was unread, uncollapsed, etc., so not a good "test."
You are so very familiar with both systems, you're probably in the best position to make suggestions.
Anita wrote: "Book Concierge wrote: "Anita wrote: So you are saying to use those reserved sections to create a giant running list of the books that are recommended?..."Yes, that was what I was thinking. But as Nicole R pointed out, this WOULD be a lot of work for the admin. Of course, this does NOT fix your problem with trying to respond and maintain a conversation about any one individual's recommendation / suggestion / plan for that month's tag.
I can only say that I think GR has one level of nesting: the folder. If one opens the folder, not the unread, all of the reviews are there. One can see how many comments and if there are new comments.But I think that really is helpful only for the monthly folders of the tag itself, and Open Books and not the suggestions/planning threads or for Footnotes, although perhaps marginally for Footnotes, too.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Perhaps there could be two threads. One for suggestions, one for plans. ..."I like this idea.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: I would hate to have to skim a huge thread every day to see what is new on the several book reviews that interest me, and having to filter out the comments on the book reviews that don't.. ..."
I was going to answer this, as well, but it looks like others already have. :-)
Book Concierge wrote: "Elizabeth, the way Shelfari worked you could also COLLAPSE or EXPAND replies. So if you chose "collapse" ... you'd see the main post (e.g. below) and a notation that there were new, unread replies...."Thanks for explaining this much better than I did.
Somehow, Elizabeth, it felt like it was working better, but maybe because I just didn't really pay attention to reviews that weren't getting comments. It wasn't quite as obvious because they were in the big, giant thread. Here, they stand out like a sore thumb . . .and maybe that's actually a good thing in certain respects, lol.
Anita wrote: "It wasn't quite as obvious because they were in the big, giant thread. Here, they stand out like a sore thumb . . .and maybe that's actually a good thing in certain respects,"OK, I'll use two of my posts this month as examples. My feelings can't be hurt on this because they're most certainly not books that I would expect to have many comments.
On Armadale, 9 people viewed the thread, but only 2 people commented.
On The Golden Lion of Granpere, 8 people viewed the thread but again only 2 people commented.
I think if I'd been posting on Shelfari, the results would have been no different. I think the number of views is just as important as the number of comments. Sometimes a person just doesn't have anything to say, and obviously, of the 164 members, not everyone thought it worthwhile to open the thread.
Change is hard. The good thing, from my perspective is that you're here. This group format is perfect for me.
I agree with you Anita about there not being much difference in the comments and number of views as on Shelfari. Sometimes I don't have anything to say after I have read a review, so I don't comment. I'm getting used to how things are here, and really the setup you have now works fine.
I read most everything in digest instead of clicking on individual reviews at the site so people who do likewise wouldn't even be acknowledged in the view count.
Blueberry wrote: "I read most everything in digest instead of clicking on individual reviews at the site so people who do likewise wouldn't even be acknowledged in the view count."I think I've been commenting on my Updates feed when posts show up there. I don't believe that shows up in the group posts either.
Denizen wrote: "I think I've been commenting on my Updates feed when posts show up there. I don't believe that shows up in the group posts either. "No, they don't. Only posts made in the group appear in the group.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Anita wrote: "It wasn't quite as obvious because they were in the big, giant thread. Here, they stand out like a sore thumb . . .and maybe that's actually a good thing in certain respects,"OK, I'..."
I appreciate everyone's thoughtful comments!
And I really agree that it probably is still a matter of becoming accustomed to Goodreads. In the first weeks, I was so excited about all the new things, and now that I'm settling in, I think I just want to be sure the things that made PBT so good are still in force here.
It sounds like it is more a matter of my perception. Or misperception as the case may be!
Did you know that GR has downloadable ebooks? Lots of classics, foreign material, and also book excerpts of more current stuff. www. Goodreads.com/ebooks?
Blueberry wrote: "Did you know that GR has downloadable ebooks? Lots of classics, foreign material, and also book excerpts of more current stuff. www. Goodreads.com/ebooks?"
A recent post says that they are phasing out that feature.
AJ wrote: "A recent post says that they are phasing out that feature."Do you know why?"
See this post:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
For reading ebooks in the future, we recommend you check out the free Kindle app. There are many more free titles on there than Goodreads has ever hosted, and we think the reading experience on that app is a lot smoother than we've been able to provide here.
Play Book Tag
Books mentioned in this topic
Man Tiger (other topics)The Way Back to Florence (other topics)
Beauty Is a Wound (other topics)
If the giant thread happens, without the nested comments, I know I won't participate anymore. I know I'm "new" because I was inactive for so many years. So, take my feelings with a grain of salt. The more seasoned players should make the decision and I'll bow out if needs be.