What We Saw by Aaron Hartzler → Start Date: December 25th, 2015

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

Vicki and I!
I can't wait!

[Vicki]

Yippee! Thanks for making the thread for us! I think this will be a good one.

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

I think this will be a very hard but very good one
I read up on the articles about the original crime to remember some of the details. I remember when this crime originally played out in the press. I remember being so so mad.

[Vicki]

Oh, I didn't realize that it was based on a crime that happened. What can I google to find out about it?

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

Steubenville High School Rape case

[Vicki]

Thanks!

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

okay I'm 10 chapters

Kate(view spoiler)[ wow same party
except she had Ben - who might have saved her (hide spoiler)]

Ben(view spoiler)[ but I have a bad feeling. I hope he wasn't involved. at the very least, I think he helped them cover it up or knew what the other boys were doing to Stacey (hide spoiler)]

[Katie]

I picked this up from the library today, and it will probably be the next book I read once I finish the one I'm currently so I'll plan on commenting about it on this thread.

[Vicki]

Great, Katie!

[Vicki]

Finished Ch. 10

Kate (view spoiler)[Yeah, she was totally WASTED and that's a BAD idea no matter what; however, no one deserves what happened to Stacey. When the story began I thought it was Kate who was going to get raped. (hide spoiler)]

Ben (view spoiler)[seems too nice to be involved in the rape, but it sounds like he (along with many others) were sent photos but he deleted what he got. That's what it sounded like anyway. (hide spoiler)]

John (view spoiler)[seems like a total creep. I think he was the one who had that evil, wicked grin. Anyway the arrests were shocking, I am sure, because of the police saying he was arrested in part due to child porn. I would think teens might think that was YOUNG children, not a 16 year old girl. (hide spoiler)]

The book is good so far, but knowing it's loosely based on such a tragic story makes it more difficult reading for me,

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

Katie wrote: "I picked this up from the library today, and it will probably be the next book I read once I finish the one I'm currently so I'll plan on commenting about it on this thread."


YAY! I'm so glad you can come chat with this

this is definitely a book to talk about.....

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

20 chapters

My worry(view spoiler)[ is that...people said they saw Ben going back into the house. AFTER he got her home.
My worry is that he took the photos or he knew somehow that they had her down there..... (hide spoiler)]

There are parts of this book that literally give me goosebumps
it's just so awful

Pep rally(view spoiler)[ I cannot believe what that coach said
I hate this feeling that athletes can get away with such horrible things and the coaches try to protect them so their team can win. it may not be a correct prejudice, but it's definitely one that people feel is true (hide spoiler)]

Kate(view spoiler)[ On one hand, I'm glad she's not following the news. She could be watching it, grilling everyone trying to get details
I like that she's trying to stay out and yet she's worried

it must be scary - to know you are at the same party and completely drunk
BUT she was in with the crowd - and friends with Ben so she was untouchable (hide spoiler)]

and how awful is it? that even I knew...from a very young age, that getting drunk at a party is a bad idea if you don't have friends around you to keep you safe.
How sad is that?

[Vicki]

My worry (view spoiler)[I don't recall reading that but it certainly makes me more suspicious. Ugh...I hope not! (hide spoiler)]

Pep rally (view spoiler)[ was just awful! It's almost as though the school, led by coach and even the principal, have found the boys innocent and Stacey as the girl who's causing trouble. Ugh...HATE that mentality! (hide spoiler)]

Kate (view spoiler)[is definitely confused. I think she wants to know what happened but is conflicted because she IS afraid of what she'll find. I wonder why Stacey said, "She's one of them"? I wonder if even Kate MIGHT have been there and seen something but doesn't remember it. I was glad that Kate at least attempted to see Stacey. That took courage. (hide spoiler)]

Stacey (view spoiler)[ is seen as "the girl who was asking for trouble" or the girl who "wanted it" just because of how she was dressed. I hate that some people really do believe that. She STILL has the right to say NO and the right be not be touched if she is incapacitated enough that she can't give her consent. (hide spoiler)]

[Katie]

10 chapters

Kate (view spoiler)[I'm glad nothing happened to her at the party, since she was really drunk. Obviously that wouldn't have meant that anything would have been her fault if something had happened to her. (hide spoiler)]

Ben (view spoiler)[He seems like a good guy, so I hope he isn't covering up for his friends. I hope he just doesn't even know that his friends would do something like that. (hide spoiler)]

Dooney (view spoiler)[Yeah, I don't like him at all. The whole arrest scene was quite shocking. I can't imagine being at school and seeing that happen. (hide spoiler)]

[Katie]

20 chapters

pep rally (view spoiler)[That was awful, how everyone assumed that Stacey was the one in the wrong, and that the boys couldn't possibly have done it. (hide spoiler)]

Kate (view spoiler)[I like how she isn't just making assumptions like everyone else and is really trying to get all the facts before jumping to conclusions. And I'm glad too that she tried to talk to Stacey. (hide spoiler)]

Stacey (view spoiler)[I feel so bad for her. This really shows why a lot of people don't speak up when something like this happens to them. They're afraid that everyone will assume they're lying. I can't imagine being in that situation. (hide spoiler)]

[Vicki]

Katie wrote: "20 chapters

pep rally [spoilers removed]

Kate [spoilers removed]

Stacey [spoilers removed]"

Good point on your Stacey spoiler. Of course that is true, but I hadn't thought to comment on it.

[Vicki]

Ch. 30

Two things really hit me in this part of the book: (view spoiler)[ Dooney is reveling in his "stardom" and that obviously makes me SICK! Secondly, according to Stacey Kate and Ben WERE there and I'm really worried if that's accurate how Kate will take it. I hope that somehow Stacey is wrong, but she was pretty adamant about it. Ugh...how horrible that would be. It also seems like Ben admitted it when he inadvertently said something that indicated he was involved and then quickly covered his mouth. Ugh! (hide spoiler)]

[Katie]

30 chapters

Dooney (view spoiler)[I don't like him acting like a star either. I'm pretty sure he really did that, and it's awful that he's acting that way after doing something so awful. (hide spoiler)]

Ben (view spoiler)[I don't like how he seemed so adamant that Dooney and Deacon were the ones telling the truth. And how the only reason he got Kate home safe was because he loved her, but he wouldn't do the same thing for another drunk girl. (hide spoiler)]

Will (view spoiler)[I feel like he's so into fitting in with the guys that he's becoming a bit of a jerk. Like that whole thing with ranking girls. And it definitely seems like he's on Dooney's side and not Stacey's side. (hide spoiler)]

Stacey (view spoiler)[I wonder what she remembers, because it seems like she knows things, even though she was supposedly too drunk to remember anything. (hide spoiler)]

[Katie]

I finished this, and this was a tough book, but really good. It was a really important read, and I think all high schoolers should be required to read it.

Rachel and Christy (view spoiler)[Wow, I can't believe they didn't stand by Kate when she did the right thing. (hide spoiler)]

Will (view spoiler)[I'm glad he ended up being a good guy and going to the police with Kate. (hide spoiler)]

Ben (view spoiler)[So, it ended up that he was just selfish and looking out for his own good. He should have stood up against his friends when he witnessed that. And I had really liked him before that, too. (hide spoiler)]

Lindsey (view spoiler)[I'm glad she at least stood by Kate through everything. (hide spoiler)]

Kate (view spoiler)[Doing what's right had to take a lot of courage on her part, and I am so glad that she did it. (hide spoiler)]

[Vicki]

Katie wrote: "30 chapters

Dooney [spoilers removed]

Ben [spoilers removed]

Will [spoilers removed]

Stacey [spoilers removed]"

Stacey (view spoiler)[ yeah, I thought that exact same thing. (hide spoiler)]

[Vicki]

I finished awhile ago too and I don't know that I can really add anything to your final comments, Katie but I'll try. LOL

Katie (view spoiler)[was definitely courageous! You know when you stand up for what's right that you aren't necessarily going to be praised for it. I was SO glad that she realized Ben wasn't the kind of guy to be with after all. I also liked him up until that point, but I pretty much knew he was involved somehow. It's almost just as bad as if he'd raped her too because he didn't even TRY to stop it, he covered it up, AND he lied to Katie about it too. (hide spoiler)]

Stacey (view spoiler)[I wasn't very satisfied with how the book ended for her really. I was hoping for more "closure" and to feel more of a punishment for the boys. They didn't serve their full time, they never showed ANY remorse, coach wants to give them a 2nd chance. I was not satisfied at all with all of the end. (hide spoiler)]

Christy and Rachel (view spoiler)[are the worst friends ever! I REALLY hate it when a female doesn't have compassion for another female who has been through sexual assault. How can they not empathize and ask how THEY WOULD feel if that happened to them?? (hide spoiler)]

I agree that this book is a difficult read! Who but by the grace of God could not at some time in their life have been a Stacey? I've been drunk twice in my life, once when I was 16 and once when on my 21st birthday and I HATED it!!! So I've never been a drinker.

[Trisha, lives on coffee]

I'm done too

Stacey(view spoiler)[ I'm sure she watched all the videos and tweets. i'm sure she wanted to know who all was there
so she'd know who to hate, who to fear. Just so she knew what happened to her (hide spoiler)]

In real life, 1 boy got 1 year behind bars and went BACK to the high school and played football again

In real life, the 2nd boy only got 2 years in jail and went out and joined a community college football team - he just couldn't live in the dorms because of his sexual assault conviction

So(view spoiler)[ I didn't think the punishment was far off the mark. Even though I hate it, it's the reality of our culture (hide spoiler)]

I agree with you guys, this was a really tough book to read, but one that is so so important.

My favorite part was the conversation the teacher had when the boy said he didn't want to give a permission slip to ride the bus because he wouldn't want a girl to call rape if she threw herself at him and was wasted and he 'couldn't help himself'

That teacher was dead on.

[Katie]

I'm glad you guys both liked it too (though "like" is probably the wrong word). But we all think it's an important book.

And yes, that teacher was great with the permission slip thing.

[Vicki]

Trisha, YES!!! That was a key scene!