Clean Romances discussion
Welcome!!
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Just a reminder about the purpose of this group
I'm curious about this book...I searched for it but found "it's extraordinary, my dear Winifred" is that your book?
Jenny wrote: "I'm curious about this book...I searched for it but found "it's extraordinary, my dear Winifred" is that your book?"Whose book? I do have several books out, but nothing about "my dear Winifred." None of the ones I recommended above were written by me either (more's the pity!)
Maria
After reading these comments, I am so glad I checked the group out. I am thrilled to see others share my views. I love reading, but I like there to be a little left to the imagination.
;)
Jenny wrote: "I'm curious about this book...I searched for it but found "it's extraordinary, my dear Winifred" is that your book?"I believe Miss Mae has a book titled that. Don't know if that is the one you are looking for or not. Good Luck!
My first post...I just wanted to say thanks for setting up this group! Books of this type are among my favorites but often difficult to find. I am a Christian as well but like the sweet contemporary romances too and, let's face it, the HEA usually includes marriage by the end of the story. YAY! :)
Mod
Hi Joyce! Haven't talked to you in a while. How are you? I've been busy editing my next book, Train Station Bride. I'd love to promote it here but it has a few intimate scenes that I don't think would work for our group like Romancing Olive did. But I haven't been around for awhile and felt like I needed to check in. Hope all is well!Holly
Mod
No, intimate scenes don't fit in our group. Sorry. Good luck with your edits, though!
Joyce
Joyce wrote: "Hi Holly,No, intimate scenes don't fit in our group. Sorry. Good luck with your edits, though!
Joyce"
No problem, Joyce! I'm glad your group is staying focused on clean romances because I like to read them and there's plenty of other groups that will work for Train Station Bride.
Hi Everyone!I'm also a newbie who is excited to have found a home for clean romance novels...and I plan to check out the books listed on the group bookshelf right away.
Thank you for creating a group to support this under-appreciated category of romance.
Are there length restrictions on the romances posted on the group bookshelf? I was wondering if it would be appropriate for me to post my own romance novelette; it's a clean work of about 18,000 words currently exclusive to Amazon Kindle.
Mod
We have no restrictions on story length for the group bookshelf. Welcome to the group! ♥
♥Jaimey♥
www.jaimeygrant.com
www.anauthorsart.com
Mod
Just wanted to say hi. I've commented on a couple other threads but thought I'd say an official hello. I was so relieved to find this group! I love the romance genre, but it must, must be clean romance for me to really enjoy it. How wonderful to find a group that supports my endeavors.
I'm also in the process if trying to get my first novel published. Does anyone know of any agents or publishing houses that support clean romance? Or does it tend to be more of a hit and miss?
Hi Annette,One of my books is with Astraea Publishing. They only publish clean reads. :)
Annette wrote: "Just wanted to say hi. I've commented on a couple other threads but thought I'd say an official hello. I was so relieved to find this group! I love the romance genre, but it must, must be clean ro..."
Welcome, Annette!!!
Thank you for the welcome. Like many others have mentioned, I'm glad to have found this group.
I'm so excited to have found this group! I love romance novels, but I've had to stop reading so many books halfway through because the "romance" gets to be too much for me. I love me a good inspirational/Christian romance every once in a while too, but sometimes, they are a bit too...cheesy? I've written my own historical clean romance novel called "A Secret Fire" that fits into the "clean romance, not christian" category, so I was so excited to find so many people liking the same! Anyway, I'm excited to be a part of this group to read more books I love and to talk about them with the people who feel the same way!
Hi, I've written a rom-com, but I'm not entirely sure whether my book fits into your group. I am pleased that there are people who don't need to read all the icky bits. Apart from not seeing the need to write about bed scenes, I couldn't seriously write them anyway - I'd probably burst out laughing.I had wondered for some time, am I strange for writing a book where the two main characters, dare I say it, actually fall in love? Why is Hollywood so obsessed with people jumping into bed on the first date?
In my book, Loosely Translated, the characters have to discover the real person inside, first. Isn't that what love is about?
There is, I have to say, terrible language, on the part of the male character. But that itself, is tackled by the female character, who never swears, and encourages him to change his vocabulary.
I'm interested to see what you think and won't be offended if you feel it's not completely suitable for this group. As I said before, I'm pleased that there is a market for clean romances. Keep up the good work!Loosely Translated
I totally agree. It seems much of society has sex mixed up with love. Although sex enhances a commitment of marriage, it is not love. It needs to become a result of love and commitment.Also, it is too special and sacred to be flaunted in detail to the public eye.
H.D. wrote: "I totally agree. It seems much of society has sex mixed up with love. Although sex enhances a commitment of marriage, it is not love. It needs to become a result of love and commitment.Also, it is..."
Absolutely!
Great group idea! :) I do think clean (but not necessarily inspirational) romance is a viable yet barely-tapped market.Anyone heard of Astraea Press? They seem to specialize in catering to this kind of readership. I've head a couple historicals from them and enjoyed the experience, but they have a good range of genres... Anybody heard of them?
http://www.astraeapress.com/
Mod
I don't know which one you got--they've got quite a few, but the Rachel Van Dyken stuff is pretty good. :) I've read three of those now. And I hear they've got contract with Moriah Densley coming up.
Mod
My YA memoir on Amazon Kindle is normally priced at $0.99 but will be free on Kindle Thursday 18 April 2013. The romance is of course true (my wife and I have been married more than 50 years). I wrote the work to encourage young people to "do their homework" to have a better chance in life. The work will (I hope) entertain readers of all ages. Here is the link to the paperback (just click on Kindle version). http://www.amazon.com/Miss_Williams_C...
WOW, I have only browsed to page 5 and it is unbelievable how many of these books ARE christian-or-inspirational, many are VERY STRONGLY SO! I know because I have read them!The publisher is often a clue,but many of these titles have been added leaving out the (Women Of Faith) or (Love Inspired) from their titles. Plus anyone familiar with Christian authors will immediately recognize many,many of the author's names.
Those like myself who were hoping to find a source of secular/non-christian clean reads are going to be mighty disappointed when they find out how few of these books truly ARE free of the religious proselytizing!
I think it is a shame how a person can't even try to set up something like this without people refusing to respect the guidelines.
Plus you can't even get clean/non-religious books at Amazon with a search.Someone needs to let them know that this would be very much appreciated.
Sorry for the rant!
Christine wrote: "WOW, I have only browsed to page 5 and it is unbelievable how many of these books ARE christian-or-inspirational, many are VERY STRONGLY SO! I know because I have read them!The publisher is often..."
Christine, I appreciate your rant. :>) Maybe you could list the books that are Christian ones that you know about? Or ask the moderator to delete those posts? It doesn't do any of us any good in this group to have incorrect posts. It just means people leave the group and look elsewhere.
Thank you Maria.I'm not sure where I should post such a list as it would be incredibly long!
Who is a moderator to contact?
It might help if the "group info" [when button is clicked]also specified secular/nonreligious books only,like I noticed the second link posted here for Christian groups when I checked it out specifies Christian Romances books only for their bookshelves.
I could maybe go through the pages making a list on notepad of all the Christian ones and give it to a Mod.
Christine wrote: "Thank you Maria.I'm not sure where I should post such a list as it would be incredibly long!
Who is a moderator to contact?
It might help if the "group info" [when button is clicked]also specifi..."
The front page of the group has a right sidebar and there are two moderators listed. You could PM them and ask if they are interested in a list to help narrow down this discussion. I'd ask before you go to the trouble to do it.
I know there is a "bookshelf" in this group too and I think authors just add their books there, but there is no way the mods could read all the books talked about in this group. I don't know how they handle this sort of thing. I do know they are both very nice ladies and active in the group as I've seen them post and one of them answered a question for me once!
Christine wrote: "Ok. will do,thank you again.:]"I do believe the thanks should go to YOU! :>)
Well you are most welcome. I think this is a wonderful idea to have a source to get clean books that are nonreligious,so I am happy to help others find such books.
I'm curious...at what point does one start defining a book as inspirational or 'religious'? Do you mean that if there is any mention of a deity or a character having a spiritual life it automatically becomes questionable? Anything by Zondervan or a 'Love Inspired' line seems pretty obvious, but what else encompasses the criteria and where does one draw the line?
Hi Angela,I believe this describes it perfectly~
Is it Christian or is it Inspirational?
http://voices.yahoo.com/is-christian-...
IMO clean nonreligious books mean no god-talk period.Or in other words- no mention of any deity or spiritual beliefs/life.
Otherwise it is religious proselytizing.
BTW, according to the article since secular is taken to mean 'anything goes',IMO we should just call what we want 'clean-nonreligious' books.
Ah, okay. Thanks for the link! Inspirational romance is apparently a little more loosened up than I'd originally given it credit for. Still not really my cup of tea, but it's good to know what to expect.I can't really relate with the idea that any mention of a character having spiritual beliefs would constitute proselytizing, though. I always feel like it adds depth and realism for a character or two to have an existential question/moment, as long as it comes naturally to a situation. Total sterilization, to me, feels almost as forced as an altar call.
Angela wrote: "Ah, okay. Thanks for the link! Inspirational romance is apparently a little more loosened up than I'd originally given it credit for. Still not really my cup of tea, but it's good to know what to e..."I think it differs for everyone, but it's like the distinction between paranormal romance and urban fantasy. Is the focus on the romance? Is the focus (often) on the sexual tension and related sex scenes? If it is then it's probably paranormal romance, rather than UF where the focus is generally more on the mystery plot.
With religious themes, it really depends on how much it's inserted. It's not the mere mention of a Catholic wedding, it's whether or not the character(s) spend pages agonizing over decisions based on their religion. And there's nothing wrong with that, but everyone has a different tolerance and a lot of readers don't want that inserted.
Mod
I am one of the group moderators so yes, please message me with any list of inspirational books that you believe do not belong on our bookshelf. I have removed such books before, but as was said above, there is no way Jaimey and I can monitor every book that's added to our shelf, so we do rely on group members to bring non-secular, as well as non-clean, romances to our attention.
However, I've said before and will say again that a simple mention of God or church in a book will NOT disqualify it from our group. For example, my books take place during the Middle Ages, when faith was an important part of the historical time period. It would be completely unrealistic for my characters never to attend a mass or be influenced by the beliefs of the Catholic faith. These are not predominate themes in my books, though the affect my characters actions and outlooks in a historical way. If a religious theme predominates over the romance, then it belongs in an inspirational group. If it is only lightly touched upon or part of the historical context, then we will allow it in our group.
Does that help?
Joyce DiPastena
Clean Romance Group Creator/Moderator
Joyce wrote: "Hi everyone,I am one of the group moderators so yes, please message me with any list of inspirational books that you believe do not belong on our bookshelf. I have removed such books before, but ..."
That's been my understanding. Just saying a character attends church doesn't make it religious. And when it comes to historical books, religion and politics were VERY closely tied. People were tried and condemned based on "church laws," which can be reasons for secrecy, characters actions and whatnot. It's a focus thing. It's a personal thing and there's no defining line...
Myself,I agree with what the article says "Christian fiction focuses on a relationship with God and God is the center of every romantic liaison", and that is what I, and I believe all non Christians do not want to read... is all that about God's plan,God's will,God will provide,and yada,yada,yada.That all problems faced by the characters will be resolved favorably for those who put their faith in the Christian god, and through prayer and clean living win their redemption and live happily ever after (or die and go to heaven).
I believe every Christian book that I have come across in the lists so far,is guilty of that!
Joyce wrote: "Hi everyone,I am one of the group moderators so yes, please message me with any list of inspirational books that you believe do not belong on our bookshelf. I have removed such books before, but ..."
Thank you, Joyce--oh creator of the group! ;) I appreciate the clarification--it feels reasonable and balanced to me. (And I'm sorry you've had to repeat yourself.) I just wanted to be sure there weren't any underpinnings of resentment/hostility going on in the purpose for the group.
Christine wrote: "Myself,I agree with what the article says "Christian fiction focuses on a relationship with God and God is the center of every romantic liaison", and that is what I, and I believe all non Christian..."Actually to clarify, I'm not fond of stumbling unexpectedly upon any religion that takes over the storyline (not just Christian themes.)
It's like anything else. If I want to read Christian inspirational versus a romance, I just want to know that when I pick up the book. Not when I'm halfway through it...
Mod
Maria wrote: "Angela wrote: "Ah, okay. Thanks for the link! Inspirational romance is apparently a little more loosened up than I'd originally given it credit for. Still not really my cup of tea, but it's good to..."Thank you, Maria! I think you're spot-on with that comparison of Christian/Inspirational to Paranormal romance/UF. (I just recently got a grip on the PNR/UF distinction, so you've made that much easier for me to remember. ;) )
Ok,so what I get is that the person who started this group 'Joyce' has no objection to religious proselytizing.... which means all the usual god-talk about how everything will be just hunky-dory as long as the characters put God's will first, and say a lot of prayers and spout a lot of scripture and try to convert every nonchristian character in the story is going to be accepted in any book, then this group is nothing at all like I was lead to believe and I am just wasting my time here. I already suspected that when I saw all those 'PREACHY' books here.Try reading the synopsis on them and especially the one and two star reviews and it's easy to see what people don't like about them,and why nonbelievers seek more realistic/true life clean reads without all that.
Mod
I'm pretty sure that's not at all what I said. :-) This group is not for books that proselytize any religion. That does not translate to absolutely no mention of God whatsoever. I've done my best to explain the difference. If you are unhappy with the group's guidelines, I understand. Only you can decide if this group meets your reading needs or not. Goodreads is a very open forum with lots of variety of groups to choose from. :-)
Christine wrote: "Ok,so what I get is that the person who started this group 'Joyce' has no objection to religious proselytizing.... which means all the usual god-talk about how everything will be just hunky-dory as..."Wow. That's not what I take away from the group at all. I think it's more that religion is a real part of life and it can fit in a story without the book being about preaching or religion.
Here's an example: Under Witch Moon--urban fantasy that I wrote. The main character was brought up Catholic. That is mentioned a couple of times in passing. She's a witch so she knows that her local priest would not approve of her "career." She is what she is and goes about her business. The book has nothing to do with religion. There's no preaching. Adriel lives in Santa Fe where probably 80 percent of the population is Catholic. There are vampires in the book so yes, a crucifix is used...maybe once in that first book as a defense. (There are three books in the series and off the top of my head, I can't tell you how many times a vamp appears. But religious symbols are used against vamps in the book. Holy water is used in protection spells too. But I am pretty sure that those spells do not make the book religious.)
In a historical book (and I haven't read Joyce's book) religion was a very big part of many cultures. Sure, you can write a book without it and some romance books don't touch on it at all, but I think you can also have mention of it and the culture without the book being religious. An example would be that if a guy is courting a lady in historical times, some of their routine meetings might occur at church gatherings or the politics of the time might involve church politics. There's a big difference in that and preaching for me.
But as I said, everyone's tolerance level is going to be different.
As for this list, keep in mind that a lot of authors post here. And authors are notorious for trying to fit their books into EVERY Possible Category Known To Man. If you ask for the best XYZ, some authors will immediately tell you the book is XYZ -- even if it doesn't have an X, a Y or a Z. That's how a lot of books end up in lists like this.
The moderators do the best they can and rely on readers to help with the group. It's that simple. No one is passing any tests or even taking any tests.
Hi Joyce,Well since your booklist/bookshelf is full of Christian books that ARE exactly as I described,that tells me that they ARE acceptable,and your guidelines are totally ineffective and far too loose to have any semblance of a sincere intention to become a source for 'nonreligious' clean books.
I'm sure you have no intention of removing those books on the list I sent you even though they all are guilty of proselytizing![or I should say god-talk]
Very disappointing.:(
Clean Romances
Books mentioned in this topic
P.S. I Like You (other topics)Bias (other topics)
Loosely Translated (other topics)
Romancing Olive (other topics)
Unicorn on Speed Dial (other topics)
More...
I'd also recommend Elizabeth Peters for romantic mysteries. Awesome stuff.
Dorothy Gilman has some romantic elements in some of her novels--and always a mystery or two to be solved.
Maria