Austenesque Lovers TBR Pile Reading Challenge 2016 discussion
Assorted & Sundry Matters
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Group Read- March
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What a great idea, Debbie! I read Emma again a couple of months ago so hopefully it'll still be fresh in my mind but a simultaneous read would be even better. It's made me wonder whether I can make the time...
Debbie, I look forward to your insights!!! I wish I didn't have so many things piling that I could read both simultaneously!!!
Great idea Debbie! I look forward to hearing more insights from the dual reading :) I haven't read Emma in ages... Maybe its just me but between the movies and Austenesque reading sometimes I forget what is actually in JA's books ><I am about 20% through and I love the relationship that the author established between Knightley and his brother. This is a re-read for me and I remember some of the letters between the two of them being pretty comical.
Perhaps this is something I have forgotten from the original but I am surprised at how frugal the author made this version of Mr. Knightley (not using a proper valet, no carriage horses, etc).
I love seeing Knightley's duties but I am excited to read about more interaction with him and Emma.
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It's been a while since my last read of the original, but I do remember that he doesn't call out his carriage for his own use around the village, but he did bring it out for the Bates. Not sure about the valet part. Guess I'm up for a re-read, too.
Oh, Mr. Woodhouse and that wedding cake! The man is such a fussbudget! He expounds on that subject extensively in Emma, fretting about it being unhealthy. The comments and understood winks on the subject in Charity Envieth Not prove that the entire neighborhood has affection for him and humors him in his delusions regarding what's harmful to everyone's health. Considering that it's just Mr. Woodhouse and Emma living together, though, it's no wonder she needs someone else to interact with regularly. I wouldn't have nearly the same patience with him that she does.So, enter Harriet into both books. Again, there's more about her in Emma than in Charity Envieth Not, which makes sense because Mr. Knightley doesn't interact with her as much as Emma does. But this is another odd relationship, and one that really shows how shallow Emma can be. She's convinced that Harriet is the "natural" child of a gentleman only because Harriet is so beautiful. The fact that the girl is a dim bulb doesn't influence Emma's opinion at all. In Charity Envieth Not, Mr. Knightley observes them together and wonders what's going on. He's disappointed that Emma is choosing to hang with a submissive girl who will be following her lead rather than a more accomplished woman who would help to elevate her.
And the readers get our first misleading clue regarding Mr. Elton's sentiments shortly after he is introduced in Charity Envieth Not. He stands at the window of Mr. Knightley's house intently watching the two women together. Hmmmmm....
Hmmmm....just finished and enjoyed it again, thank you! Some minor concerns/surprises....
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I learned that since this book was independently published, no libraries in Ohio have it (the closest was Syracuse, NY!). I love the idea of a group read though and hope you host another one during the year!
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Chelsea, do you have a Kindle or the Kindle app? I can loan you my Kindle copy if you want to join us. I'm reading my paper copy for the group read.
Sophia wrote: "So with a re-read came a few things that didn't stand out the first time. That's interesting, Kirk!"Mmmm, yes. Of course, I've been thinking about Mr K/Emma relationship with my (very) little blog post in Sarah Emsley's series "Emma in Snow". Yesterday's post from Sarah Woodberry(I think) was all in praise of Mr Knightley.
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Sophia wrote: "Chelsea wrote: "I learned that since this book was independently published, no libraries in Ohio have it (the closest was Syracuse, NY!). I love the idea of a group read though and hope you host an..."Sophia, Thanks so much for the offer! I don't have a kindle and don't like to read books on my computer since I already stare at a screen way to much for work. It's OK though since I'm in the middle of multiple books atm and well behind my goal. I'll use the time to catch up some so I can join in on the next one. :D
Thanks again!
I like Mr. Knightley's thoughts and feeling toward Emma in this book. I have read other Mr. K's POV's, and he came off as petty. He didn't seem that way to me in this.
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No problem! I've got plans for a May Group Read so hopefully you can join in for that one. Enjoy those other lovely books.
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His thoughts on the people around him is what I'm most curious about. Just getting underway with my reading.
Just finished (trying to squeeze it in before a trip) and will post review when I get a chance. Will wait till more have gotten through it to post thoughts here.
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And have a safe trip.
Thank you, Sophia! Looking forward to a real getaway, birding in south Texas along the Rio Grande with a cousin I haven’t seen in fifteen years.
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I just finished reading Mr. Knightley's visit with Mrs. Weston in both books. I was amused at the way Mrs. Weston tries to divert the subject away from whether or not Emma's close friendship with Harriet is a good idea by praising Emma's beauty and all her positive attributes. At the end of that chapter in Emma, it's made obvious that she and her husband have discussed the possibility of a match between Emma and Mr. Knightley. Meanwhile, in Charity Envieth Not, despite demonstrating his very accurate perception about the possible negative consequences of Harriet being a constant companion to Emma, Mr. Knightley completely misinterprets Mrs. Weston's hints. He leaves with the idea that she has someone in mind for Emma, but believes perhaps it's her husband's nephew, Frank Churchill (who hasn't arrived on the scene yet). Nice touch, Barbara Cornthwaite!
Debbie I just finished that part as well in Charity Envieth Not!!! That's funny about the comparison.
Sophia wrote: "Now those posts sound interesting, Kirk. Feel free to share the links."Here's a link to Sarah Woodberry's delightful post...
http://sarahemsley.com/2016/03/09/my-...
And to a lesser post...the comments are the most interesting part...http://sarahemsley.com/2016/02/24/why...
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Thanks for sharing, Kirk. I enjoyed both links and comments. Sara makes a lot of good points in her post in favor of the match between Emma and Mr. Knightley, but I'm still not convinced. Obviouly, it wasn't unusual for a married couple to have such a large age difference at that time. I doubt that many of them were real love matches, though. There may be wide age gaps for many of Jane Austen's couples, but those ARE fictional characters! My impression is that such matches were generally made for money or status, and younger wives were more likely to produce healthy children.
I see Mr. Kingsley as being a kind of avuncular figure in Emma's life. They speak freely with each other and know each other very well because they're around each other so much and it's like they're family members. But she's so immature in so many ways that it's hard for me to see them in an equal relationship. The age difference itself doesn't bug me that much, but the pattern of their longstanding relationship does.
I'm doing my best to read these 2 books together with an open mind on the subject - I'm willing to change my opinion if there's convincing evidence!
Debbie, I agree with all your statements. The Emma Knightley relationship has always made me pause. I guess I will just have to see how Knightley continues on while I read.
I agree with Debbie regarding the immaturity issue. The age discrepancy doesn't bother me but Emma's lack of maturity does and I am generally left wondering why someone at Knightley's age would wish to marry her. I did think this author did a good job of conveying Knightley's feelings on Emma that made it understandable (I am on the 2nd book). In his eyes she is smart, witty and beautiful but also caring and thoughtful to those she loves. He compares other women to her and they are left wanting in many categories.
I hope everyone is liking the book(s) so far :)
Food for thought...Why to older men marry younger women now days? I can't think the reasoning has changed all that much.
Ahnya wrote: "Food for thought...Why to older men marry younger women now days? I can't think the reasoning has changed all that much."I'd say it's changed a bit. When it's not for love, I'd guess more young women marry for money than the other way around, since only heiresses would have the ability/time to accumulate much wealth for a husband to latch onto. An older man would have more time to become a millionaire or billionaire. And the importance of status now is less being in particular social stratosphere and less related to being able to have children. Instead, some older men just want a beautiful young "trophy wife" for other men to lust after and be jealous that they can't have.
Shannon wrote: "I agree with Debbie regarding the immaturity issue. The age discrepancy doesn't bother me but Emma's lack of maturity does and I am generally left wondering why someone at Knightley's age would wis..."It's really interesting going back and forth between both books. So far, I think Barbara Cornthwaite really does a great job of echoing all the same basic events in Emma from George Knightley's perspective.
I agree, Debbie—I like retellings that stick closely to the original, especially when they’re telling the story from another character’s point of view. I’ve especially like how she has picked up on hints about Knightley’s more public life (relations with tenants, magistrate work, etc.) and expanded those to open up his worldview to us. Makes him a more sympathetic character!
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Well it's been nearly two weeks since the start of our first group read so hopefully everyone has had a chance to at least get under way. I notice some have already finished. Kudos, there! :)
I admitted up front that I've never been part of a group read or reading club so we're pantsing it here. Forgive me if I don't stick to the formula and ask the right questions. Oh, and feel free to toss out your own discussion questions (noticed Ahnya's question and there is more on that if folks follow the links that Kirk thoughtfully provided to the two blog posts).
On a side note, Debbie's style of reading the original Emma simultaneously with George Knightley has been an extra treat to us all as she shares her thoughts. Thanks for putting in the extra effort, Debbie. No pressure to maintain it if it gets too much.
I thought a safe (so we don't get spoilers) first discussion point was to ask folks to do a First Impression and First Date response. Strictly voluntary and you can respond in full or in part.
First Impression: Your anticipation thoughts going into reading George Knightley, Esquire: Charity Envieth Not. This would include cover art, title, blurb, prior discussions and reviews. Why did you want to read it? What level was your anticipation?
First Date: Your thoughts and beginning impressions through the first few chapters. Did the opening grab you? Author's writing voice? Pace? Impression after your intro to characters? Ability to see a clear thread to the storyline?
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First Impression: I heard of the duology years ago after I devoured all the other books available by the Crown Hill Writers. I found each of their JAFF retellings and variations worked hard to be faithful to Jane Austen's works. I figured this one would be no exception. The title told me immediately that I was getting a retelling from a hero's perspective, but the subtitle made me curious to know what it had to do with the story.
Though it doesn't seem like I've anticipated this story since I've waited a few years to read it, I truly wanted to get a good story from Mr. Knightley's POV. I've avoided all, but one and I wasn't completely satisfied with that one. I hope I don't have too much anticipation built up.
First Date: I've actually only read chapter one and I have been fighting illness so my mind is easily distracted. I'm going to reserve my opinion until I read more. But first impression is that George is a kind, thoughtful and dutiful man, family member, and neighbor. So far the pacing is slow and the feel of the story echoes the original. I definitely want to keep going.
Debbie wrote: "I just finished reading Mr. Knightley's visit with Mrs. Weston in both books. I was amused at the way Mrs. Weston tries to divert the subject away from whether or not Emma's close friendship with H..."its very interesting to see the parallels between the two books. Im considering re reading emma now.
Ahnya wrote: "I like Mr. Knightley's thoughts and feeling toward Emma in this book. I have read other Mr. K's POV's, and he came off as petty. He didn't seem that way to me in this."im liking how hes portrayed in this book very much
Sophia wrote: "Since it was my question, I'll go first.First Impression: I heard of the duology years ago after I devoured all the other books available by the Crown Hill Writers. I found each of their JAFF ret..."
what book did you read that wasn't satisfying? I hope you feel better soon.
Sophia wrote: "First Impression: Your anticipation thoughts going into reading George Knightley, Esquire: Charity Envieth Not. This would include cover art, title, blurb, prior discussions and reviews. Why did you want to read it? What level was your anticipation?First Date: Your thoughts and beginning impressions through the first few chapters. Did the opening grab you? Author's writing voice? Pace? Impression after your intro to characters? Ability to see a clear thread to the storyline? ."
I was not sure what to expect when i first began reading it. I feel bad to admit this but ive had a hard time reading emma when I did. It just took me a long time to get into the story book format. Movie versions of Emma however I got into, especially the 2009 version.
That being said I was not sure how I was going to like this. So far I am loving the authors writing style. I can;t believe she does not have more books out. If I didnt have work and other commitments I think I would be done by now! I think this is one of the best JAFF relating to Emma.
I began reading this couple days ago and I am halfway through chapter 11. There are things I am confused about and there words in the story I am unsure of - what is a parlour border? - and how many of the characters in here, are new through this story and not emma - like Spencer, Mrs. Mefford etc. Im trying to think back.
After i am done reading this book and before getting to the next one, I am going to rewatch emma.
First Impression: Probably would not have chosen this book on my own. I think it was in my TBR pile, but it was way down there. I like Emma, but I prefer variations based on Pride and Prejudice first, and Persuasion second, and all the others, including Emma, a distant third. And with the volume of good JAFF constantly released based on those first two, I just never seem to get to the others.First Date: Perhaps I've covered that already in my previous posts. I will add some additional thoughts, though.
The writing itself is excellent. I haven't noted any errors, and it flows nicely. The parallels to Emma, as I've already talked a lot about, are really perfect.
Like Abigail, I'm impressed with the research the author must have done into the responsibilities of a man in Mr. Knightley's position, especially one who takes those responsibilities seriously, as he does. Those extra characters Trish mentions that aren't in Emma just indicate how many different lives are directly influenced by Mr. Knightley's involvement, and how many different situations he has to handle. The man needs to wear a lot of different hats! He truly cares about everyone under his purview and wants what's best for them. As admirable a character as he is in Emma, getting to know him better in Charity Envieth Not makes me like him even more.
I'm still wondering about the title and what it signifies. Haven't picked up on any clues to its meaning yet.
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First Impression: I heard of the duology years ago after I devoured all the other books available by the Crown Hill Writers. I found each of..."
Hi Trish! I read Mr. Knightley's Diary by Amanda Grange. It wasn't a bad story at all, but it didn't really give me much insight into Mr. Knightley's character that I didn't already get from reading Emma.
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Glad you chose to answer the questions, Trish.
You asked about parlour boarders. That is someone who is staying in someone's home that is open to taking lodgers for income and the paying guest has access to at least one meal and the use of the parlour. In Harriet's case, someone is paying for her to participate in the ladies' school that is in Mrs. Goddard's home and Harriet lives in and is old enough to be able to use the parlour (tea, visiting, correspondence, etc).
Others might be able to elaborate or correct any errors I made in the explanation, but that's how I have thought of that term. Good question, Trish. Feel free to keep asking.
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Splendid, Eliza! I'm only in chapter 2 so you're not behind everyone.
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Yes, it is tough to find retellings and variations of the other novels so its neat to find one that seems to be done so well.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the questions.
Sophia wrote: "Debbie wrote: "First Impression: Probably would not have chosen this book on my own. I think it was in my TBR pile, but it was way down there. I like Emma, but I prefer variations based on Pride an..."Sophia, I had to chuckle when I saw that your original question for first impression included our opinion on the cover art. Because I use a kindle for all my reading, I glimpse the cover perhaps about 1 or 2 seconds before diving in, and I never see the cover again! I choose books to read strictly on book descriptions, ratings from other readers, and recommendations from JAFF friends. Because I don't have a physical book lying around, the cover is relatively meaningless to me.
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Oops, I had meant that to stay in when I tried to be clearer with the question. Oh well! I gave people enough questions.
It can be the same with me when I'm reading ebook version. One glance and then it's out of my thoughts.
I have finished re-reading both books and enjoyed them both again. Thank you for the excuse to re-read them :)First Impressions: The Fitzwilliam Darcy: Gentleman series was the start of my love for JAFF/Austenesque so I read all of the other books by the group of authors in the Crown Hill Writers Guild, which included this set. Since I enjoyed all the other works from the group I was looking forward to these books as well. While a bad cover has never detracted me from a book whose blurb piqued my interest, I can honestly admit that a stunning cover can (and has) drawn me in. I found the cover on these books to be average. The image of what I am assuming is meant to be Donwell Abbey is nice.
First Date: The pace of the book is a bit slow due to the extensive amount of detail the author puts into showing us the daily life of Mr Knightley. While that might bore some people, I thought it was worth the slower pace in order to get to better know the type of person Knightley was and learn what the life of a gentleman consisted of. I think the writing is excellent overall.
I am looking forward to hear what everyone else thinks :)
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Yes, the opening doesn't do a hook me in scene, but for those looking to get to know Mr. Knightley and his life and want something as close to the original as they can get, I think they will be drawn into the story.
Thanks for sharing, Shannon.
I see a significant contrast between the opening scenes of the two books. In Emma, you quickly get a sense that both Emma and Mr. Woodhouse are pretty self-absorbed. Her thoughts, their discussion with each other, and their discussion with Mr. Knightley when he comes to call are all about how circumstances affect THEM, particularly Miss Taylor's marriage to Mr. Weston. Granted, Emma does her best to soothe her father, but she does so by emphasizing how often they will continue to see the new Mrs. Weston.
In Charity Envieth Not, Mr. Knightley immediately demonstrates his sense of responsibility to others. He leaves his brother's home when he'd rather stay because he has a meeting to attend, he wants to confer with his steward about a property issue, and he's concerned to see how Emma and her father are handling the loss of Miss Taylor in their household. All of his thoughts are about others rather than himself.
I have more questions. What is a wussock? dictionary on kindle didn't recognize it. And who is larkins again?? just getting confused with side of the new characters..
Austenesque Lovers TBR Pile Reading Challenge 2016
Books mentioned in this topic
Lend Me Leave (other topics)Emma (other topics)
Charity Envieth Not (other topics)
Charity Envieth Not (other topics)
Emma (other topics)
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In George Knightley, Esquire: Charity Envieth Not, meanwhile, Mr. (George) Knightley can already see trouble ahead now that there's no one to rein in Emma at all. He recognizes that she's clever but, unfortunately, she doesn't really apply herself to developing her intellect and has never been pushed to pursue activities that she doesn't enjoy. Instead, he thinks she spends too much time on trivial things. He's especially appalled that she wants to take on matchmaking as an "amusement," as if meddling in people's lives doesn't have the potential for serious negative consequences.
Most ironically, Mr. Knightley wishes that he had a wife who could be a positive influence on Emma, but he hasn't found the right woman yet. He clearly is not looking at Emma as marriage material for himself!
So far, everything I read in both books reinforces my mental picture of Mr. Knightley's relationship with Emma as being more like an uncle to a niece than of two equals. Between their age differences and her comparative immaturity, I just don't see them working well together as a couple.