Mortal Instruments & Infernal Devices Lovers! discussion
The Mortal Instruments
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Clabastian vs Clace
@Atty Dollangangeri do think sebastian has emotions. in fact he is full of them. but i think the way he grew up with valentine really affected him.
Here's my opinion:I ship Clace. The only time I ever shipped Clabastion was when I thought Sebastian was Sebastian Verlac and he had black hair.
But other than that I didn't ship Clabastion. But I do think it's funny how when everyone thought Clace were brother and sister they still shipped it but when they thought Clabastion were brother and sister the were instantly hated it.
See that is where i finally understood what a misunderstood character Sebastian was. They don't understand that he does have emotions. He can feel. Valentine injecting demon blood into his son couldn't have affected his emotions. It was how much love Sebastian was shown that could've affected them. Sebastian grew up in isolation so the only person that could've showed him love was Valentine. And he didn't show him enough.
He thought the only people that understood him were Jace and Clary. But they didn't. But that was the last hope Sebastian had. And he couldn't just let go of it.
Even though i don't ship Clabastion i feel like she should've been there for him. Even though she thought he had no emotions, she should've kept her hope in her brother.
Gwynn wrote: "Here's my opinion:
I ship Clace. The only time I ever shipped Clabastion was when I thought Sebastian was Sebastian Verlac and he had black hair.
But other than that I didn't ship Clabastion. B..."
I think his white hair in a way suited him more maybe because it contrasted with his dark eyes.
That's because the fan girls of this series are hypocritical cliches.
Well at least you understand that much but valentine didn't shown him any love, it wasn't that he showed him little love it was that he barely showed him any if he even showed him any.
I think Sebastian was slightly interested to find what kind of person jace would be even though he already knew in a way but he did not think jace was like him and had no respect or compassion for him I think , maybe to a degree but a very regulated degree at that.
Of course she should have but just like Jocelyn and even Valentine she was very selfish and self absorbed and stubborn in a way that showed how little understanding she had of people that were different from her... she did keep a sort of hope for her brother at times if you pay attention carefully without any bias you will see she even had strong feelings for him but the author made sure never to explore that past a certain point and I think she created a boundary because she saw how people reacted when they thought jace and clary were siblings.
I ship Clace. The only time I ever shipped Clabastion was when I thought Sebastian was Sebastian Verlac and he had black hair.
But other than that I didn't ship Clabastion. B..."
I think his white hair in a way suited him more maybe because it contrasted with his dark eyes.
That's because the fan girls of this series are hypocritical cliches.
Well at least you understand that much but valentine didn't shown him any love, it wasn't that he showed him little love it was that he barely showed him any if he even showed him any.
I think Sebastian was slightly interested to find what kind of person jace would be even though he already knew in a way but he did not think jace was like him and had no respect or compassion for him I think , maybe to a degree but a very regulated degree at that.
Of course she should have but just like Jocelyn and even Valentine she was very selfish and self absorbed and stubborn in a way that showed how little understanding she had of people that were different from her... she did keep a sort of hope for her brother at times if you pay attention carefully without any bias you will see she even had strong feelings for him but the author made sure never to explore that past a certain point and I think she created a boundary because she saw how people reacted when they thought jace and clary were siblings.
Gwynn wrote: "@Atty Dollanganger
i do think sebastian has emotions. in fact he is full of them. but i think the way he grew up with valentine really affected him."
Well.. I mean.. of course it did.. it would affect anyone to some degree and I think given the catastrophic degree of circumstances Sebastian actually held together and took it very well.. very composed and was still compassionate. I don't respect people who don't at least find his character interesting or are disgusted by his feelings it's very hypocritical and very .. well.. dim witted .
i do think sebastian has emotions. in fact he is full of them. but i think the way he grew up with valentine really affected him."
Well.. I mean.. of course it did.. it would affect anyone to some degree and I think given the catastrophic degree of circumstances Sebastian actually held together and took it very well.. very composed and was still compassionate. I don't respect people who don't at least find his character interesting or are disgusted by his feelings it's very hypocritical and very .. well.. dim witted .
@Atty DollangangerOh! I did like his white hair better! i was just using a detail to explain what he looked like when i shipped him with Clary... but that was when i thought he was Sebastian Verlac
@Atty Dollanganger She might have had some hope but it wasn't enough. She gave up to quickly. You had to pay careful attention to really notice and understand that.
but anyways... i really can't say anything because the only person that truly understands everything about the series is cassandra clare.i love the series and i love the fandom.
i love the series and i love the fandom and the character and i would never want to say anything bad about them. they were each special in their own way. clary' stubbornness was not a bad thing. she was her own person. she wasn't selfish. sebastian wasn't a bad guy. he was just a misunderstood character.
Eww there were actually crazy people out there to ship Sebastian with anyone.
Gwynn wrote: "@Atty Dollanganger
Oh! I did like his white hair better! i was just using a detail to explain what he looked like when i shipped him with Clary... but that was when i thought he was Sebastian Verlac"
Ok i see. But either way they would make a great ship if Cassandra Clare handnt ruined it.
Oh! I did like his white hair better! i was just using a detail to explain what he looked like when i shipped him with Clary... but that was when i thought he was Sebastian Verlac"
Ok i see. But either way they would make a great ship if Cassandra Clare handnt ruined it.
Gwynn wrote: "@Atty Dollanganger
She might have had some hope but it wasn't enough. She gave up to quickly. You had to pay careful attention to really notice and understand that."
She didn't give up as quickly as you think if you really paid attention like you think you did.. if you were to truly take In what was said and implied she held out hope until the end in a way. But yes of course Cassandra Clare made sure to ruin it she wanted to make him as unlikeabke as possible and failed for anyone who could see past it. Some people saw through her crap but very few.
She might have had some hope but it wasn't enough. She gave up to quickly. You had to pay careful attention to really notice and understand that."
She didn't give up as quickly as you think if you really paid attention like you think you did.. if you were to truly take In what was said and implied she held out hope until the end in a way. But yes of course Cassandra Clare made sure to ruin it she wanted to make him as unlikeabke as possible and failed for anyone who could see past it. Some people saw through her crap but very few.
Gwynn wrote: "but anyways... i really can't say anything because the only person that truly understands everything about the series is cassandra clare.
i love the series and i love the fandom."
That's actually not true... Cassandra Clare is a money grubbing liar and she has proven that to be true through her books and through her real life. A lot of authors don't seem to understand their own characters or portray them accurately because you would have to understand each character put a glimmer of reality into each one and most authors just can't do it or don't try and they just give everyone cliche.
She did put a barrier between them and where their relationship could have gone and it's no secret she has nothing against it because she wrote a fanfic of Harry Potter with Ginny and Draco as I mentioned before who are cousins.
She lies and says it's weird and she never wants to touch the subject in one interview or in her Q&A with fans, then talks about how it's fascinating and how she likes the stories because they're intriguing and that she has no problem with it in another interview. I'm just tired of her bs .
She does like a lot of aspects of all sorts of things that are controversial but many are unhealthy such as abusive relationships and gay relationships , a guy who swings between both and can't make up his mind for a time lol.
i love the series and i love the fandom."
That's actually not true... Cassandra Clare is a money grubbing liar and she has proven that to be true through her books and through her real life. A lot of authors don't seem to understand their own characters or portray them accurately because you would have to understand each character put a glimmer of reality into each one and most authors just can't do it or don't try and they just give everyone cliche.
She did put a barrier between them and where their relationship could have gone and it's no secret she has nothing against it because she wrote a fanfic of Harry Potter with Ginny and Draco as I mentioned before who are cousins.
She lies and says it's weird and she never wants to touch the subject in one interview or in her Q&A with fans, then talks about how it's fascinating and how she likes the stories because they're intriguing and that she has no problem with it in another interview. I'm just tired of her bs .
She does like a lot of aspects of all sorts of things that are controversial but many are unhealthy such as abusive relationships and gay relationships , a guy who swings between both and can't make up his mind for a time lol.
Gwynn wrote: "i love the series and i love the fandom and the character and i would never want to say anything bad about them. they were each special in their own way. clary' stubbornness was not a bad thing. sh..."
No I just have to correct you, Clary had little to no redeeming qualities. The only time and I mean the only time I have ever seen her act more mature or intelligent or insightful ... the only her stubbornness paid off .. was when she was with Sebastian.
Most of the characters in the entire series fell flat.. but just like Clary Simon seemed to have some potential which the author quickly killed.
No I just have to correct you, Clary had little to no redeeming qualities. The only time and I mean the only time I have ever seen her act more mature or intelligent or insightful ... the only her stubbornness paid off .. was when she was with Sebastian.
Most of the characters in the entire series fell flat.. but just like Clary Simon seemed to have some potential which the author quickly killed.
Koumamo wrote: "Eww there were actually crazy people out there to ship Sebastian with anyone."
You're one of those idiot clace fan girls aren't you ? I could tell lol
You're one of those idiot clace fan girls aren't you ? I could tell lol
Clace. I didn't even know people shipped Clabastian before I read this.
@ Atty, I don't care much that you actually called me a idiot and I would proudly say that yes I ship the people that are not actually blood related. And say one time eeew to Sebastian and clary incest is not a thing in my book.
@Atty Dollanganger If you hate the series (and the author and the characters and the fandom) so much then why are you still here and talking about the series. you keep on complaining about everything that has to do the series yet you're still here still complaining about the characters and the author and the fandom. you're allowed to voice your opinion but you're not allowed to insult us out of nowhere.
Koumamo wrote: "@ Atty, I don't care much that you actually called me a idiot and I would proudly say that yes I ship the people that are not actually blood related. And say one time eeew to Sebastian and clary in..."
I consider it an idiotic "argument" if you could even call it one which it isn't . Clace is the worst ship ever because it is an unhealthy relationship even worse than the other could ever be.. the only reason clace works is because they are equally as awful as each other. Also blood relation in books being the thing that keeps people from shipping someone and preferring an awful ship over it is completely idiotic. I don't personally care ... if you don't want to ship it I don't really want you to either way I would prefer respectable people with intelligent minds to ship it,
I consider it an idiotic "argument" if you could even call it one which it isn't . Clace is the worst ship ever because it is an unhealthy relationship even worse than the other could ever be.. the only reason clace works is because they are equally as awful as each other. Also blood relation in books being the thing that keeps people from shipping someone and preferring an awful ship over it is completely idiotic. I don't personally care ... if you don't want to ship it I don't really want you to either way I would prefer respectable people with intelligent minds to ship it,
Gwynn wrote: "@Atty Dollanganger
If you hate the series (and the author and the characters and the fandom) so much then why are you still here and talking about the series. you keep on complaining about everyt..."
Because despite all that happened the books were still pretty good because they held potential and some of it shined through in each book. Also it helps that Cassandra was able to write one amazing character which is what I look for in a book .. but she didn't even know she had written an amazing and fascinating character so she is still an awful author she just happens to put out some interesting material in some parts of her books.
If you hate the series (and the author and the characters and the fandom) so much then why are you still here and talking about the series. you keep on complaining about everyt..."
Because despite all that happened the books were still pretty good because they held potential and some of it shined through in each book. Also it helps that Cassandra was able to write one amazing character which is what I look for in a book .. but she didn't even know she had written an amazing and fascinating character so she is still an awful author she just happens to put out some interesting material in some parts of her books.
@Atty Dollanganger honestly in my opinion:
Cassandra Clare is an amazing author. She is so talented and is a true inspiration. She creates the most amazing character! The characters may have some flaws but that is absolutely okay because it makes them so real!
Gwynn wrote: "@Atty Dollanganger
honestly in my opinion:
Cassandra Clare is an amazing author. She is so talented and is a true inspiration. She creates the most amazing character! The characters may have som..."
Uh..ok.. I mean it's fine to have an opinion but it doesn't mean it can't be wrong. There are formats and requirements for what makes a good character .. and most if not almost all do not fit them .. her storytelling isn't sol shabby but there's a lot of cliches and too many plot holes for some people. The problem I have though sometimes is that she rips off so many other books or movies .. line by line . The only thing Cassandra Clare has inspired me to do other than buying the book series because of one character lol ..is making a movie of her books but with different plots or altered plots and different outcomes .. especially the ending. But hey if the story made you happy I wouldn't have a problem with that what I have a problem with is you saying all the characters are great and realistic and I'm telling you they're not I know what realistic is .. it's Sebastian for the most part but I actually liked Simon too a little because he was realistic ... his story was too at times.
honestly in my opinion:
Cassandra Clare is an amazing author. She is so talented and is a true inspiration. She creates the most amazing character! The characters may have som..."
Uh..ok.. I mean it's fine to have an opinion but it doesn't mean it can't be wrong. There are formats and requirements for what makes a good character .. and most if not almost all do not fit them .. her storytelling isn't sol shabby but there's a lot of cliches and too many plot holes for some people. The problem I have though sometimes is that she rips off so many other books or movies .. line by line . The only thing Cassandra Clare has inspired me to do other than buying the book series because of one character lol ..is making a movie of her books but with different plots or altered plots and different outcomes .. especially the ending. But hey if the story made you happy I wouldn't have a problem with that what I have a problem with is you saying all the characters are great and realistic and I'm telling you they're not I know what realistic is .. it's Sebastian for the most part but I actually liked Simon too a little because he was realistic ... his story was too at times.
I would ship incest IF I like them together but I just don't see them together (or Mabey I'm just brainwashed by clace)I mean I shipped clace class when they were related because they're perfect for each other clabastian is a whole other story
Maggie wrote: "I would ship incest IF I like them together but I just don't see them together (or Mabey I'm just brainwashed by clace)I mean I shipped clace class when they were related because they're perfect fo..."
This is a very rare and interesting response. If by “perfect for each other” you mean they were both awful then yes , but I feel like sebastian brought out clary’s potential as a character and in the subtext you can clearly see they actually do have feelings for each other and really attracted to each other. The truth is with siblings or relatives , especially the way it’s portrayed in books is accurate, they have a bond ... a type of relationship that no other kind can even compare to. I ship Clary and Sebastian but with Clary as a better character. Lol
This is a very rare and interesting response. If by “perfect for each other” you mean they were both awful then yes , but I feel like sebastian brought out clary’s potential as a character and in the subtext you can clearly see they actually do have feelings for each other and really attracted to each other. The truth is with siblings or relatives , especially the way it’s portrayed in books is accurate, they have a bond ... a type of relationship that no other kind can even compare to. I ship Clary and Sebastian but with Clary as a better character. Lol
Clace! Clabastian incest (I didn't even know they had a ship name), Yes, there was a time when we thought *spoiler alert* Jace and Clary were siblings, but they are in no way related. Sebastian and Clary, on the other hand, are actually blood related. Not only that but Clace fought through so much together. One of the things they thought against WAS Sebastian. Plus, even if they weren't related, Sebastian would treat Clary like crap, and I hate toxic relationships like that. Yes, he doesn't understand love, but that doesn't make up for his actions. *spoiler* Remember that scene from Lost Souls where Sebastian hit her and stuff? I don;t remember why, just that he threw her into a wall and I remember there being glass or something. But point is, he did that to her. He tried to hurt her after she went against him. That is a toxic relationship.Now don't get me wrong; I love Sebastian. He's one of my favorite characters. But Clary and Sebastian is not a good ship at all (I mean no offence to those who ship it. This is my opinion.)
Luna wrote: "Clace! Clabastian incest (I didn't even know they had a ship name), Yes, there was a time when we thought *spoiler alert* Jace and Clary were siblings, but they are in no way related. Sebastian and..."
Oh please, you sound like a clueless idiot. Her relationship with jace isn’t exactly healthy... he always focuses on himself, treats her like she’s nothing , etc. The only reason they “belong together” in book terms in a sense is because they are both equally as awful.
Also , when Clary is treated badly by Sebastian, she’s usually earned it , she’s terrible . Sebastian gives what he gets but sometimes he gives more but it’s unappreciated.
You clearly don’t love the character as much as you think you do because you don’t even understand him and that’s part of how you come to love a character.
Oh please, you sound like a clueless idiot. Her relationship with jace isn’t exactly healthy... he always focuses on himself, treats her like she’s nothing , etc. The only reason they “belong together” in book terms in a sense is because they are both equally as awful.
Also , when Clary is treated badly by Sebastian, she’s usually earned it , she’s terrible . Sebastian gives what he gets but sometimes he gives more but it’s unappreciated.
You clearly don’t love the character as much as you think you do because you don’t even understand him and that’s part of how you come to love a character.
Ruby wrote: "Why is Clabastian even a thing!!??"
Because it’s the best!
Because it’s the best!
Atty wrote: "Luna wrote: "Clace! Clabastian incest (I didn't even know they had a ship name), Yes, there was a time when we thought *spoiler alert* Jace and Clary were siblings, but they are in no way related. ..."I understand him and the actions behind why he does what he does. In fact, it's very intriguing to see his character development. That being said, I just don't like Clary and Sebastian as a ship.
You said that when Clary is treated badly by Sebastian she deserves it. Whether you believe she deserves it or not, that's not an excuse to physically hurt someone whether he has demon blood or not.
Also, I'm not saying that Clace is my otp (I ship them, but I love Malec more), but they are a pretty good match. If you don't agree, I'd be interested as to hear some examples from the books as to why. As to why I think they're good together, I think they fit together personality wise. A common trait they share is their stubbornness and sense of fighting for what they believe in. While this may have gotten them into some tough situations, either way it's something they both have in common. From a writer's standpoint, having traits in common is one of the many factors that spells out a relationship between characters. I would go on with how else they fit personality-wise, but I will admit that it's been a while since I've read the books.
As I stated in my last comment, this is all my opinion. I'm trying to debate this in a polite manner. I don't think name calling is really appropriate.
Luna wrote: "Atty wrote: "Luna wrote: "Clace! Clabastian incest (I didn't even know they had a ship name), Yes, there was a time when we thought *spoiler alert* Jace and Clary were siblings, but they are in no ..."
I said I ship Clary and Sebastian but with Clary as a better character. Also people fight all the time it isn’t like he’s some older man abusing her and she can’t fight back, she’s not some delicate butterfly... she has angel’s blood and can survive it and in fact since she wants to be treated as a tough girl and as a grown up so much I would say shipping her with Sebastian is perfect.
I wouldn’t say demon blood necessarily has anything to do with it at all but it might play a part .
Ok well whatever you ship is your otp basically . Malec is the worst lol. I don’t mind magnus sometimes he can even be funny or set certain things in motion but I don’t ship two males or two females together.
Well ok if you want reasons I can literally link you to a debate I had with another user . But I’ll mention some of it here.
First of all, if we’re talking about similarities how did you not pick up on the fact that Sebastian is both those things ? He is stubborn but not to the point where he’s stupid usually and he fights for what he believes in more than the others could even dream of.
Here’s the similarities between jace and Clary
Stubborn
Selfish
Reckless
Single minded
Unfeeling at times based on their biases
Self centered
Stupid
Over the top
Unrealistic
That’s the only reason they work together
But here are some examples of why realistically any girl with any common sense would stay away from jace
When Clary is talking about what happened to her and how she reacted and how she felt jace started turning the conversation to focus on him and when Clary says not everything is about him he says yeah but you have to admit most things are
When Clary is out with Sebastian in Paris some attractive women pass by and he doesn’t even glance their way and his entire attention and affection is focused on her, she is the only thing he’s interested in and everyone else disappears around him. Clary mentioned that jace would have definitely looked at them and been glad that he was getting attention from other girls and feel proud of it .
Clary mentions a lot of women hang around jace and love him but she’s the only one who truly loves him as if it’s a good thing she’s attracted to such a selfish , egotistical character... that’s unhealthy.
Jace is bi polar with his emotions, sometimes she doesn’t matter but other times “she’s the most important thing in the world” to him and “she’s all he lives for” And “he would burn down the world and dig her out of the ashes if he couldn’t find her”
When Sebastian says he cares about her she automatically dismisses it because she has her predisposed biases against him no matter what . He says he would burn down the world for him and unlike jace actually goes through with it but he’s evil and heartless apparently even though all he wanted was for her to love him.
In the book Sebastian mentions that she’s a lot like him and tells her not to bother denying it because he knows what she’s really like underneath the facade. He knows her dark side while jace just thinks she’s an angel.
I can talk for a long time about this .
I didn’t realize you wanted a debate , most people just post their opinions here and bye mindlessly defend it without real arguments. I call names reflexively usually based on what someone’s says... if something sounds stupid I will say so because I have a good reason, if someone sounds stupid I will also point that out.
Appropriate is all based on context and perception.
I said I ship Clary and Sebastian but with Clary as a better character. Also people fight all the time it isn’t like he’s some older man abusing her and she can’t fight back, she’s not some delicate butterfly... she has angel’s blood and can survive it and in fact since she wants to be treated as a tough girl and as a grown up so much I would say shipping her with Sebastian is perfect.
I wouldn’t say demon blood necessarily has anything to do with it at all but it might play a part .
Ok well whatever you ship is your otp basically . Malec is the worst lol. I don’t mind magnus sometimes he can even be funny or set certain things in motion but I don’t ship two males or two females together.
Well ok if you want reasons I can literally link you to a debate I had with another user . But I’ll mention some of it here.
First of all, if we’re talking about similarities how did you not pick up on the fact that Sebastian is both those things ? He is stubborn but not to the point where he’s stupid usually and he fights for what he believes in more than the others could even dream of.
Here’s the similarities between jace and Clary
Stubborn
Selfish
Reckless
Single minded
Unfeeling at times based on their biases
Self centered
Stupid
Over the top
Unrealistic
That’s the only reason they work together
But here are some examples of why realistically any girl with any common sense would stay away from jace
When Clary is talking about what happened to her and how she reacted and how she felt jace started turning the conversation to focus on him and when Clary says not everything is about him he says yeah but you have to admit most things are
When Clary is out with Sebastian in Paris some attractive women pass by and he doesn’t even glance their way and his entire attention and affection is focused on her, she is the only thing he’s interested in and everyone else disappears around him. Clary mentioned that jace would have definitely looked at them and been glad that he was getting attention from other girls and feel proud of it .
Clary mentions a lot of women hang around jace and love him but she’s the only one who truly loves him as if it’s a good thing she’s attracted to such a selfish , egotistical character... that’s unhealthy.
Jace is bi polar with his emotions, sometimes she doesn’t matter but other times “she’s the most important thing in the world” to him and “she’s all he lives for” And “he would burn down the world and dig her out of the ashes if he couldn’t find her”
When Sebastian says he cares about her she automatically dismisses it because she has her predisposed biases against him no matter what . He says he would burn down the world for him and unlike jace actually goes through with it but he’s evil and heartless apparently even though all he wanted was for her to love him.
In the book Sebastian mentions that she’s a lot like him and tells her not to bother denying it because he knows what she’s really like underneath the facade. He knows her dark side while jace just thinks she’s an angel.
I can talk for a long time about this .
I didn’t realize you wanted a debate , most people just post their opinions here and bye mindlessly defend it without real arguments. I call names reflexively usually based on what someone’s says... if something sounds stupid I will say so because I have a good reason, if someone sounds stupid I will also point that out.
Appropriate is all based on context and perception.
Clebastian is incest and it's gross girl bye.
Jemcarstairss wrote: "Clebastian is incest and it's gross girl bye."
Everyone thought the main otp clace was too but they still shipped it so please shut up and get your tween girl ass out of the comments since you have no constructive argument to make.
Everyone thought the main otp clace was too but they still shipped it so please shut up and get your tween girl ass out of the comments since you have no constructive argument to make.
@Atty ohmygod can you please just stop? like seriously
we get it.. i mean if you want to ship a really messed up ship then be my guest... i guess it reflects on you character
but lord just stop being so rude
it’s getting annoying
we can talk about the ship and discuss and maybe politely disagree but god your getting really annoy with that lame attitude
Maggie wrote: "I would ship incest IF I like them together but I just don't see them together (or Mabey I'm just brainwashed by clace)I mean I shipped clace class when they were related because they're perfect fo..."I can see where you are coming from here and you are right sebastian does bring out the best in clary and i really do wish they had more time to get to know each other and for clary to except him but I personally see him as more of her brother than her partner(please don't get mad its just my opinion and i can see why you ship clabastion)
gwyn wrote: "@Atty ohmygod
can you please just stop? like seriously
we get it.. i mean if you want to ship a really messed up ship then be my guest... i guess it reflects on you character
but lord just stop ..."
First of all it’s not messed up, second of all I am explaining why clace is a crappy ship , if you don’t like it then unsubscribe from this entire thread or something.
You and your interferences in my conversations isn’t what’s getting annoying , I don’t have to politely disagree when people rudely insult my ship , now please shut the fuck up. I normally don’t even lose my temper but damn I can’t stand people like you.
can you please just stop? like seriously
we get it.. i mean if you want to ship a really messed up ship then be my guest... i guess it reflects on you character
but lord just stop ..."
First of all it’s not messed up, second of all I am explaining why clace is a crappy ship , if you don’t like it then unsubscribe from this entire thread or something.
You and your interferences in my conversations isn’t what’s getting annoying , I don’t have to politely disagree when people rudely insult my ship , now please shut the fuck up. I normally don’t even lose my temper but damn I can’t stand people like you.
Maggie wrote: "Maggie wrote: "I would ship incest IF I like them together but I just don't see them together (or Mabey I'm just brainwashed by clace)I mean I shipped clace class when they were related because the..."
Thank you I’m glad someone posted their idea and their argument in a rational and understanding way. It’s rare to see that.
Thank you I’m glad someone posted their idea and their argument in a rational and understanding way. It’s rare to see that.
I just feel that everyone is entitled to sharing their own opinion and that's exactly what your doing, so thank YOU for sharing your opinion.You actually gave me a new perspective on clary and Sebastian's relationship
Maggie wrote: "I just feel that everyone is entitled to sharing their own opinion and that's exactly what your doing, so thank YOU for sharing your opinion.You actually gave me a new perspective on clary and Seba..."
I would consider it more a stance than an opinion but yes I do have good reasons for why I ship them. No problem, thank you for accepting it :)
Glad to hear it . I actually wish I could show everyone specifically why and make them understand but hey if they wanna ship clace then that makes shopping clabastian that much more rare and special to me . I just hate when people attack my ship or call it disgusting or just make fun of it as if it’s a joke when really they’re the ones that are a joke! Lol sorry I went on a bit of a rant.
I would consider it more a stance than an opinion but yes I do have good reasons for why I ship them. No problem, thank you for accepting it :)
Glad to hear it . I actually wish I could show everyone specifically why and make them understand but hey if they wanna ship clace then that makes shopping clabastian that much more rare and special to me . I just hate when people attack my ship or call it disgusting or just make fun of it as if it’s a joke when really they’re the ones that are a joke! Lol sorry I went on a bit of a rant.
@Atty YOU DONT WANT TO DISAGREE RUDELY?!?!
i’m sorry to be the one say this sweetheart but that has been all that you have been doing
god help the people that disagree with you!
yea okay your allowed to have an opinion and all but so are people that don’t exactly like clabastion. if we say we don’t ship clabastion you just tell us we’re stupid and don’t know anything and go crazy!
honestly since i’ve been here all i’ve heard is how you hate the series and plot and books and characters and ships and author and people that don’t ship clace! i’m sorry but THAT is really annoying.
if you hate everything that has to with this series so much then YOU can delete you self from this thread.
gwyn wrote: "@Atty
YOU DONT WANT TO DISAGREE RUDELY?!?!
i’m sorry to be the one say this sweetheart but that has been all that you have been doing
god help the people that disagree with you!
yea okay your all..."
I said I don’t have to politely disagree , don’t be an idiot, learn to read instead of making crap up in your head.
Yeah I will defend myself and then argument , plenty of people have been rude to me and my ship so I will disagree in whatever way I see fit.
It’s not an opinion so much as it’s a fact based on evidence. Also real world experience I guess , or observations mostly.
I say clace shippers are stupid and ever single one of you are and you’ve proved it. Most clace shippers are hypocrites and they attack other ships. I’m sick of all of you . I didn’t say I hate everything, once again you seem to have zoned out and replaced everything I said with what you think I said. You’re the only one being annoying here ... right now.lol..
also it’s *yourself . Anyways I’m not deleting myself from this thread but if I’m as annoying as your teenage brain thinks I am then you should be deleting yourself from this thread any day now. Cya . Don’t bother responding.
YOU DONT WANT TO DISAGREE RUDELY?!?!
i’m sorry to be the one say this sweetheart but that has been all that you have been doing
god help the people that disagree with you!
yea okay your all..."
I said I don’t have to politely disagree , don’t be an idiot, learn to read instead of making crap up in your head.
Yeah I will defend myself and then argument , plenty of people have been rude to me and my ship so I will disagree in whatever way I see fit.
It’s not an opinion so much as it’s a fact based on evidence. Also real world experience I guess , or observations mostly.
I say clace shippers are stupid and ever single one of you are and you’ve proved it. Most clace shippers are hypocrites and they attack other ships. I’m sick of all of you . I didn’t say I hate everything, once again you seem to have zoned out and replaced everything I said with what you think I said. You’re the only one being annoying here ... right now.lol..
also it’s *yourself . Anyways I’m not deleting myself from this thread but if I’m as annoying as your teenage brain thinks I am then you should be deleting yourself from this thread any day now. Cya . Don’t bother responding.
@Attyokay first of all, the only one making up crap is um... YOU
second of all, us clace shippers aren’t stupid. don’t get me wrong, i love sebastian as a character. but he is definitely not right for clary. i think jace is the better option for that position. AND IT IS A MATTER OF OPINION. that is why your opinion is absolutely not fact.
third of all, i’m not going to delete myself from this thread because unlike you i actually love this series and author and characters because AGAIN since you have been in this conversation majority of what you have done is complain about the how stupid the series and characters are and how horrible and greedy the author is and everything! this series is amazing and is fantastical written. yea there are a few flaw but that’s absolutely fine because mistake make thing real and cassie has learned from them because she has definitely improved as an author. cassie is an inspiration and an amazing author with a creative mind.
last of all, why do keep on calling us teens and tweens like it’s an insult? what? are you jealous that we are younger yet smarter than you?
Please remember everyone that this is supposed to be a safe space where people feel that they can share their opinions on books. Every person has the right to be 'spoken' to in a kind and respectful way.
gwyn wrote: "@Atty
okay first of all, the only one making up crap is um... YOU
second of all, us clace shippers aren’t stupid. don’t get me wrong, i love sebastian as a character. but he is definitely not righ..."
Yeah you’re making crap up I even checked my previous message , you moron. So fuck off.
Dynamics and similarities are not a matter of opinion they are a matter of observation leading to factual conclusions, not that your teen brain can even comprehend what I’m telling you but I’m right, you’re wrong, get over it. Yes Clary and jace are a good fit on the basis of one thing, one logical conclusion: they are both equally terrible.
The author is greedy and terrible and anyone who isn’t now obsessed with her knows that, she’s also a liar and a hypocrite. The series isn’t amazing but some parts are decently written I didn’t say the entire thing was crap, if it was I wouldn’t have wasted my time.
She hasn’t improved at all as an author, she has disguised her new stories to look like they’re different but I see a lot of copy paste characters. She isn’t an inspiration to rational people, just to gullible unimaginative people but sure ok. She doesn’t really have a creative mind since she ripped off most of her ideas from other authors, pre-existing creatures and fairytales about faeries and such , and so on.
I keep calling you teens because most teens get caught up in a very group mentality sort of phase , they all gravitate towards the same things. I am not jealous of you at all, I pity you for being so clueless and the opposite of intelligent, you are irrational and agressive with your nonsense.
Don’t bother replying to me again. You clearly aren’t cut out for a debate.
okay first of all, the only one making up crap is um... YOU
second of all, us clace shippers aren’t stupid. don’t get me wrong, i love sebastian as a character. but he is definitely not righ..."
Yeah you’re making crap up I even checked my previous message , you moron. So fuck off.
Dynamics and similarities are not a matter of opinion they are a matter of observation leading to factual conclusions, not that your teen brain can even comprehend what I’m telling you but I’m right, you’re wrong, get over it. Yes Clary and jace are a good fit on the basis of one thing, one logical conclusion: they are both equally terrible.
The author is greedy and terrible and anyone who isn’t now obsessed with her knows that, she’s also a liar and a hypocrite. The series isn’t amazing but some parts are decently written I didn’t say the entire thing was crap, if it was I wouldn’t have wasted my time.
She hasn’t improved at all as an author, she has disguised her new stories to look like they’re different but I see a lot of copy paste characters. She isn’t an inspiration to rational people, just to gullible unimaginative people but sure ok. She doesn’t really have a creative mind since she ripped off most of her ideas from other authors, pre-existing creatures and fairytales about faeries and such , and so on.
I keep calling you teens because most teens get caught up in a very group mentality sort of phase , they all gravitate towards the same things. I am not jealous of you at all, I pity you for being so clueless and the opposite of intelligent, you are irrational and agressive with your nonsense.
Don’t bother replying to me again. You clearly aren’t cut out for a debate.
Might I remind everyone that there are ways in which offensive, abusive and hurtful comments can be reported to goodreads and possibly lead to sanctions. I would hate to see anyone removed from such a useful and fun site.
@Stringbean your right.. i’m really sorry if i made you feel uncomfortable...
its just that i don’t like being called name because of an opinion.. i don’t like getting pushed around and
i also don’t like it when someone offends my ship or fandom
Thank you Gwyn. I understand your viewpoint. I am glad you have the confidence to stand up for yourself in life. Social media is such a difficult media sometimes, we forget that there is a room full of people in on the conversation! Keep reading! Keep sharing! :)
well I love them both. clairyxjace and claryxsebastian. I don't mind with the incest things that happen on this series. I mean cmon, back then when valentine fooled all of people about claryxjace siblings plotline, I still ship them anyway.
deleted user wrote: "I think Clace has more depth to it."
Lmao good one . Depth! XD
Lmao good one . Depth! XD
Wow that entire first paragraph ... it's the rarest thing to see lol.. someone who at least has some grasp of what I'm talking about. But I should correct you.. he could feel emotion ... I don't think you were paying enough attention.
There's a flaw in your reasoning .. I don't think he particularly was fond of jace or thought he really understood much but he did think he could maybe have some sort of connection with him.. don't forget he knew how jace was raised.. he knew very well. He realized that jace was a very irrelevant and very untrusting person and he lost interest because jace wasn't as smart or strong or understanding or anything remotely close to comparing with him.
Yes clary didn't understand but more like she was unaware of her own history, her life, her family, her powers, her origin.. everything.
Sebastian didnt mean to kill max , that was true and it made sense because it explained why Isabelle wasn't dead and max was.
Yes you spelled it wrong lol it's Clabastian .
No I don't agree with the whole be with whoever makes you happy .. certain boundaries are important and it's not like they're that restricting they're just healthy boundaries .
Ok I will say this clary did understand him to a degree but as I said Cassandra Clare on purpose hindered that and made sure it didn't cross a certain line even though at times she let it slip and even showed that they were actually very similar. So all in all Cassandra Clare killed Clary's potential as a character.
It's a book series that could have been better and could have ended in a much more satisfying way with all of the characters potentials being grown and concluded with a great deal of character development but that didn't happen .. she chose the completely unrealistic , cliche , safe ending that she knew her fans wanted.