Fringe Fiction Unlimited discussion
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How many reviews does a book need to seem enticing?
I would assign a higher priority to a book with a favorable review from one or more of my "friends", if there was no friend's review, then I would look at the make up of other reviews. One favorable review that seemed articulate and detailed would suffice. But I would have a greater sense of security if there were 3 or 4 favorable reviews.
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Hopefully people will be up for ARCs if I offer them here...
Courtney wrote: "Hopefully people will be up for ARCs if I offer them here..."You can count me in already, Cour. :)
As for the reviews, I feel comfortable with almost any number, as long as the blurb and the LookInside grab my attention.
Great question Courtney, it's something I've given a lot of thought, from an author's perspective. As a new author, I of course hope the majority makes informed decisions as Dan describes, for a fighting chance haha. Its very difficult to gain reviews without a line up of readers. But, I fully respect Pink Avenger's rationale, as it would allow for less disappointment. Less chance of finding a new gem, perhaps, but it would yield a higher percentage of enjoyable reading.
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Courtney wrote: "A lot of things draw me to a book but I do compare publication dates to number of reviews. It gives me an idea if a book is having a slow start or early buzz. I do feel more excited about books w..."Great point, about the publication date.
I don't put too much stock in reviews. I've read quite a few with loads of 5stars and ended up really disappointed and a little annoyed (like I've been misled). I do like to take a chance, and I've discovered numerous little gems that way. And, with those, I know my review will have more of an impact than when its one of hundreds. I'll happily take an ARC :)
Well I can't speak for other readers but if it's just a recently released book, I probably will more than likely read it if I see a few friends have either added, rated or reviewed it. So it doesn't necessarily even need reviews, let alone a lot for me.
These days, the first thing I do is read the blurb, and if that really catches my interest, then I'll read a couple of sample chapters. If those two things fail to peak my interest any further then a review has very little chance of swaying my opinion even if it has 1000 5-star reviews. I'll always check out a book if it's recommended to me, but I won't buy it based on the recommendation alone. A perfect example is my sister who loves Twilight, Vampire Diaries, etc and is always telling me I have to reach such and such book similar to those two series when they are nowhere near my cup of tea. However, I'm probably in the minority here, and I do believe that a lot of people get caught up in the popularity/hype of a book (50 Shades) and will read it just because everyone else is or at least think 500 reviews = great book.I'm with you, Courtney - I'm highly suspicious of books with mostly 5-star reviews, especially if they're new releases. Unfortunately, these days authors and especially indie authors are driven to get reviews any way they can because of the power of advertising sites like BookBub with their review minimums. I sent out a lot of ARCs with my debut novel (people are always eager to read ARCs so no problems there), but most of the reviews I got from them ended up getting eaten by Amazon's bots. You can take that with a grain of salt since that was probably just my rotten luck as some authors I've talked to haven't had that problem.
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I only care about reviews because it indicates how ambitious the author is in generating that initial interest, which might suggest something about how much time they invested in creating a story. That follow through encourages me to think they take their writing seriously and so should I.
Courtney wrote: "...I only care about reviews because it indicates how ambitious the author is in generating that initial interest, which might suggest something about how much time they invested in creating a story. That follow through encourages me to think they take their writing seriously and so should I."True, but the other side of that coin is that it's hard to get people to review at all. I sent out ARCs and advertized like mad before my novels came out, did several giveaways here and on blogs, and have thus far only received a handful of reviews. I also know a couple of indie authors who did absolutely no advertising before their initial book launch and still sold an obscene amount of copies and received quite a few reviews within that first month. Of course, their genres are Romance and Mystery, so that along with luck probably had a lot to do with it. That pesky luck...lol
I'm with C.G. Given the cost of books and the faltering economy, people have limited funds to drop on books, and they don't want to get "bit." So if you want to sell books, you need to have a track record of selling books. My story isn't atypical: I offered a giveaway of ten books, had about 350 people sign up, and actually gave away about twenty if you include friends and coworkers. To date, I have three reviews, including a "1" from a winner who didn't get the book soon enough to suit her, and plainly states in her "review" that she doesn't actually have the book; it's brutal out there!
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I'll have to figure some way to screen ARC recipients because that's so lame people flaked on you guys.
For me it's the quality of the reviews that matters, rather than how many there are. One that spends a long time talking about the plotting, the feel of the book, and the characters and seems well rounded and considered then it'll be worth twenty saying "its' grate!!1!"If you're still looking for readers I could have a go? I can't promise five stars but I'll give you honesty.
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Unfortunately I'm still composing the rough draft but I'll be asking for interested parties to give honest reviews once it's go time :)
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I don't know many other writers other than my mother, and she writes animal care books.
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Nothing against philosophy of what makes you ultimately read but I'm curious about the sound number that makes a reader perk up a bit when browsing.
Minimum 1 detailed review, I mean I already like the synopsis, so if the detailed review was positive and reinforced my own impression based on the synopsis I would go for it... Point where I would feel likely that I would like it = 4 or 5 positive out of 6 or 7 total.
Point where I would be really impressed that I probably would like it = 80% positive out of 25+ reviews.
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Like C.G. for me The blurb is key. If I don't like it then no amount of reviews will convince me to read it. If I like it, I may look at a review or two but usually the 2 to 4 star reviews to see why they didn't give it 5 stars and if the reasons are something I care about. For example too much foul language or poor proofreading.
I'll read a book with 5 good reviews, though that just gets me to download the sample. If I don't like that, it doesn't matter how many good reviews a book has, I won't pay for it. You'll probably have to send out a lot of ARCs to get a decent amount of reviews. I can tell you that I sent copies to more than 20 blogs (after they agreed to review it) and only about 10 actually wrote a review, and of those not all of them posted on Amazon/GR. Some only posted on their blogs, which is great too, but it's nice seeing them all together in one location because I agree that the more you have, the more likely readers will notice.
C.G. wrote: "Courtney wrote: "...I only care about reviews because it indicates how ambitious the author is in generating that initial interest, which might suggest something about how much time they invested i..."LOL, yes, luck does seem to follow romance writers quite closely.
I read a book recently with less than 10 ratings before (only 1 review). However I'd read some of the authors other books so I knew I'd probably like it. It doesnt really matter to me. I dont read reviews prior to reading a book (in case of spoilers) and Ive read books that have a lot of 5 star ratings that I've hated so I dont always look at ratings either.
The thing that entices me to a book is if the blurb (about the book) is interesting or I like the cover.
However if I like a book and it doesnt have many ratings/reviews I'll make a point to write one.
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As a writer, I don't really pay attention to how many reviews a book has. I understand they are difficult to get even if you do have a fairly steady line-up of readers. Many more people will download a book and read it then will review it.Also, I don't mind reading bad books. It's a learning experience for me as a writer. Reading a bad book teaches me a lot more about writing than reading a great book does.
As far as your question about what seems to impress people. I think if a book has 20 to 30 reviews that's pretty impressive (unless they are all horrible) because I know that probably twenty times that number have read the book already.
As a side-note, does anyone have any tips on how to get more reviews? I've sent out requests to some of the reviewers listed in Indie Reader but haven't heard back from anyone yet.
One way to get more reviews might be to find folks here who have posted a lot of reviews, and ask them if they would be interested in a review copy in agreement for an honest review.. (if that is allowed here on GR).
Since publishing my book and realizing how difficult it is to get reviews, as a reader I now place more importance on the blurb. After that it's the number of 1 or 2 star reviews and the reasons given for those ratings that I look at next. Since you're looking for an actual number of reviews needed to attract a reader, for me that used to be 15. Good luck with your ARCs. At least a third of all my R2R never bothered to review and of those that did,only half posted on GR not Amazon. I think that GR and Amazon have made readers more obsessed with review statistics than the blurb and their gut feelings. With that in mind, try to get as many as you can.
@Dan I know that's what some people say, but as an author and a reviewer myself, I'm not too sure about the practice. First, I will never bug anyone to review my book unless it's in an appropriate thread on GR. I would never send a private message. I find it a little intrusive. I advise authors to be careful if they go that route because a lot of reviewers are turned off by that practice.Personally, I often receive private messages for requests, but I accept very few. Rule number one, it has to be in the genre(s) I read and enjoy, or a sequel to something I have read and reviewed already. Even at that, there is one I put on hold that I am dying to read because my list is rather big and I can't seem to see the end of it.
I also accepted some in the past that I couldn't even leave a review. The person had specified to only leave one if I was going to rate it 4 or 5 stars. Needless to say that I soon realized after a few chapter that it would never make the cut, so I never finished it. However, since then, I am a bit weary when I see such email/pm.
EDITED: Oh and by appropriate thread I meant a R&R thread.
So far I tried that once after having read the person's review of Cold Energy and then some of his other reviews. No response. Would you consider that being spammed if you received that kind of inquiry?That was not my intent but I wonder if he felt that was the case.
Courtney, as a moderator can you tell us if that is allowed?
G.G. wrote: "@Dan I know that's what some people say, but as an author and a reviewer myself, I'm not too sure about the practice. First, I will never bug anyone to review my book unless it's in an appropriate ..."Based on what G.G. said I am now reluctant to use that approach again even if it is allowed.
Does anyone know if there is a discussion thread where reviewers ask for books to review in the genres they like?
I go more or less by synopsis when checking out a book (unless the reviews are generally very negative). After self-publishing my first book, I've learned first-hand how difficult it is to get reviews. TONS of review sites are grossly backlogged (some for over a year) or not even willing to read a self-published book, and a lot of readers just aren't interested in putting the time in.
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I would advise against 'cold calling' reviewers via private messages. I'd say that it will be perceived as intrusive 99.99% of the time.Post your book in a R4R thread. If someone picks it up and reviews it favorably, then you might want to hit that reviewer up and ask if they'd like to review your follow-up. However, it's best to be extremely cautious when using this approach, as well. As an author, the last thing you want to do is piss off readers.
by Dan: One way to get more reviews might be to find folks here who have posted a lot of reviews, and ask them if they would be interested in a review copy in agreement for an honest review.. Is this allowed? It may be a mute question in light of G.G.'s comment
@M.D. If you are asking me, I am not at that point yet. I don't consider any private message spamming. Maybe because I am an author myself and I understand the cravings for reviews. Without them, we are nothing. So I will never get mad at someone for politely requesting a review as long as they understand if 1- I refuse, or 2- I accept but warn them that it could take a little bit.Now if you asked someone and he didn't answer, I would take that as a 'not interested' and leave it at that. Whether I would consider it a spam or not is irrelevant because not two people will react the same way. :(
On the other hand, someone who jumps in a discussion thread just to push their book to someone, without having participated in that thread before hand, THAT irritates me.
I'd say be careful who you ask for a review. I wouldn't ask random people unless they specifically have a blog. And I wouldn't ask a blogger unless I've read several of their reviews, not anymore anyway. I learned the hard way that even some book bloggers don't have a standard for reviews. Many of them give away major spoilers. If you pick random people who aren't reviewers, the results might be very bad. You could even end up giving an ARC to someone who will upload a copy to an illegal download site. Look for reputable blogs. It's better to have a few well thought out reviews than several spoiler-filled or poorly written ones.
I started a separate topic for suggestions for obtaining reviews.
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If your question is whether you can message people I don't have an official moderator opinion on this subject other than PMing people for self-promoting is tricky to succeed at, which is why this group has a few outlets for that purpose.
Back on-topic, if people want to post numbers that they think would be a solid showing for reviews I would be obliged to know what the census is. Not to say I don't like the philosophy on the whole significance and subjectivity of reviewing but I'm hoping to just figure out a good commercial numbers since most readers aren't authors viewing it from every angle.
Sorry if I wasn't clear there. Its more a marketing question than one about the merits of reviewing >. <
Also, a word of warning to those going solely by the number of reviews: there are still plenty of unscrupulous authors willing to pay people for good reviews, so tread lightly.
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It has been interesting reading about how many reviews you need and the one that stood out to me was at least 100 reviews. It is so difficult to find readers, let alone reviews. Many of the books, not all of course with over 100 reviews are books that have been out for a while or famous writers. My opinion is that if you only pick books with over 100 reviews, you are missing out on so many new writers only looking for a chance. No doubt reviews are important, but they can very difficult to obtain, even if the book is well written.
Michael wrote: "It has been interesting reading about how many reviews you need and the one that stood out to me was at least 100 reviews. It is so difficult to find readers, let alone reviews. Many of the books, ..."
Thank you, Michael. I too found that startling, for want of a better word, to find on a Fringe Fiction site. No one who needs to see 100 reviews is going to read anything that shows up here. And that criterion doesn't guarantee a quality read anyway. I have been deeply disappointed by some of my favorite mainstream authors from Tom Clancy to R.A. Salvatore. The new ideas are going to come from the new writers. They're always worth a look.
Thank you, Michael. I too found that startling, for want of a better word, to find on a Fringe Fiction site. No one who needs to see 100 reviews is going to read anything that shows up here. And that criterion doesn't guarantee a quality read anyway. I have been deeply disappointed by some of my favorite mainstream authors from Tom Clancy to R.A. Salvatore. The new ideas are going to come from the new writers. They're always worth a look.
I'm asking so I can decide on a respectable amount of ARCs to help build momentum.