The Outsiders
discussion
Dialogue in The Outsiders
BiGBEN wrote: "Maybe she tries to act like she cares in front of different people."That's probably right.
[Josh wrote: Kyle wrote: "[Clea wrote: Kyle wrote: "This shows that Johnny's mom thinks she has cared for him and would rather have Johnny lover her than hang out with the gang. Additionally, she hates the gang because she ..."Actually, Kyle, Johnny's mother went to Johnny while he was in the hospital because if she didn't, it would be known that she doesn't care. She went to mask the fact that he really doesn't care. If she truly cared, she wouldn't be saying such bad things when he was in the hospital. Remember, they barely even acknowledged his existence when he was in his own house. Why would they suddenly care about him? Also, if they really cared, they would have at least shown that they knew he existed before the accident. They didn't even care when he ran away. Why would they care now? They also had to show up to pay the hospital bill, and if they didn't request to visit him, it would seem as if they were bad parents, which they were. They just didn't want anyone else knowing that. ]
If Johnny's mom didn't care she wouldn't even have demanded to see Johnny even after the nurse refused :
As we walked out into the hall, we saw Johnny's mother. I knew her. She was a little woman, with straight black hair and big black eyes like Johnny's. But that was as far as the resemblance went. Johnnycake's eyes were fearful and sensitive; hers were cheap and hard. As we passed her she was saying, "But I have a right to see him. He's my son. After all the trouble his father and I've gone to to raise him, this is our reward: He'd rather see those no-count hoodlums than his own folks..." She saw us and gave us such a look of hatred that I almost backed up. "It was your fault. Always running around in the middle of the night getting jailed and heaven knows what else..." I thought she was going to cuss us out. I really did. (pg. 123)
She also complains that he would rather stay with the gang which she wouldn't bring up if she really didn't want Johnny at all. She wouldn't blame the gang for Johnny's death either if she was trying to act caring and didn't want Johnny at all.
Kyle wrote: "[Josh wrote: Kyle wrote: "[Clea wrote: Kyle wrote: "This shows that Johnny's mom thinks she has cared for him and would rather have Johnny lover her than hang out with the gang. Additionally, she h..."Well, if she didn't demand to see her son, then she would be seen as what she really was; a horrible mother that doesn't care about her child. She didn't want anyone to know that is what she was, so she hid it.
I disagree with you JOSH. She never did demand to see her son. And if you find a quote please state the pg #.
I think it's interesting how Ponyboy is the "Smart one" when his grammar throughout the whole book is poor.
Also, a piece of dialogue is from when Ponyboy go a ride back from the hospital and started bleeding in some randoms person's car who he would likely never see again and felt bad. That quotes shows a lot about Ponyboy.
One example of dialogue in the outsiders is between Soda and Pony. This example of dialogue is very powerful, especially when Pony asks Soda if Darry loves him. What do you guys think?
I agree with Josh because from what we know about Johnny's mom, she is a very ratchet mother and doesn't seem like a good mother at all. But now that we know that she cares that her son is near death and she is demanding the nurse to let her see Johnny, we know that she is at least a better parent than Johnny's father is.
Ben, that is an interesting point, I never thought about that. Soda and Darry's grammar must be awful
Ellie wrote: "Also, a piece of dialogue is from when Ponyboy go a ride back from the hospital and started bleeding in some randoms person's car who he would likely never see again and felt bad. That quotes shows..."What does it show about Ponyboy?
Yeah Nikhil, that is an important piece. It really shows how Pony can talk to Soda and vice versa. Also, the dialogue is powerful when Pony asked Soda if he was going to marry Sandy.
ellie wrote:[Also, a piece of dialogue is from when Ponyboy go a ride back from the hospital and started bleeding in some randoms person's car who he would likely never see again and felt bad. That quotes shows a lot about Ponyboy.] It never said that he felt bad in the book
Darren wrote: "I disagree with you JOSH. She never did demand to see her son. And if you find a quote please state the pg #.""She was saying, "But I have a right to see him. He's my son..." (123).
Luke wrote,: I agree with Josh because from what we know about Johnny's mom, she is a very ratchet mother and doesn't seem like a good mother at all. But now that we know that she cares that her son is near death and she is demanding the nurse to let her see Johnny, we know that she is at least a better parent than Johnny's father is. I agree with you Luke and I think that you made a very strong point with that statement.
Josh wrote: "ellie wrote:[Also, a piece of dialogue is from when Ponyboy go a ride back from the hospital and started bleeding in some randoms person's car who he would likely never see again and felt bad. That..."You would think he would say he felt bad, that is an interesting point and I never thought of that Josh
I feel like even if Ponyboy's parents were still alive Darry would still treat him with strict rules
Luke wrote: "I agree with Josh because from what we know about Johnny's mom, she is a very ratchet mother and doesn't seem like a good mother at all. But now that we know that she cares that her son is near dea..."That is an interesting point.
The interesting thing about the gang's grammar is that they all seem to know exactly what the other person listening to them is saying.
Thanks David,Also Do you think that by the example you I gave, that it shows that Ponyboy does not feel secure talking to Darry about person questions?
BiGBEN wrote: "I feel like even if Ponyboy's parents were still alive Darry would still treat him with strict rules"I disagree Ben because Pony said he got along really well with Darry before his parent died
BiGBEN wrote: "Ellie wrote: "Also, a piece of dialogue is from when Ponyboy go a ride back from the hospital and started bleeding in some randoms person's car who he would likely never see again and felt bad. Tha..."It shows that he is very conscientious and caring
Yeah, I think Pony is just closer with Soda because Soda does not worry about being the man of the house.
Kyle wrote: "She wouldn't blame the gang for Johnny's death either if she was trying to act caring and didn't want Johnny at all. "Actually, her blaming the gang seems to suggest that Johnny's mom is trying to act overprotective. She never blamed Johnny himself, rather, she blamed his gang. She is trying to convince the nurses that it's their fault, that the gang is corrupting Johnny.
In fact, Johnny's mom said "It was your fault. Always running around in the middle of the night getting jailed and heaven knows what else...(pg.123)" She acts innocent, like she treats him well, which is not the case. Blaming the gang is simply her way of acting innocent.
Luke wrote: "The interesting thing about the gang's grammar is that they all seem to know exactly what the other person listening to them is saying."Thats true that is a perfect example of the dialogue between the gang
Johnny's mother went to Johnny while he was in the hospital because if she didn't, it would be known that she doesn't care. She went to mask the fact that he really doesn't care. If she truly cared, she wouldn't be saying such bad things when he was in the hospital. Remember, they barely even acknowledged his existence when he was in his own house. Why would they suddenly care about him? Also, if they really cared, they would have at least shown that they knew he existed before the accident. They didn't even care when he ran away. Why would they care now? They also had to show up to pay the hospital bill, and if they didn't request to visit him, it would seem as if they were bad parents, which they were. They just didn't want anyone else knowing that. Anyone care to comment?
[Clea wrote: "Kyle wrote: "She wouldn't blame the gang for Johnny's death either if she was trying to act caring and didn't want Johnny at all. "Actually, her blaming the gang seems to suggest that Johnny's mom is trying to act overprotective. She never blamed Johnny himself, rather, she blamed his gang. She is trying to convince the nurses that it's their fault, that the gang is corrupting Johnny.
In fact, Johnny's mom said "It was your fault. Always running around in the middle of the night getting jailed and heaven knows what else...(pg.123)" She acts innocent, like she treats him well, which is not the case. Blaming the gang is simply her way of acting innocent." ]
If Johnny's mom was only trying to act innocent she wouldn't have looked like she would have cussed out. Also I don't see why she would need to convince nurses in another town that she is innocent.
Kyle wrote: "[Clea wrote: "Kyle wrote: "She wouldn't blame the gang for Johnny's death either if she was trying to act caring and didn't want Johnny at all. "Actually, her blaming the gang seems to suggest th..."
Nobody wants to look guilty of anything, especially of mistreating a child. That extends to even people that are guilty.
Divson wrote: "Do you guys think Johnny's parents found out about his death? If so, do you think they cried or did they just not care?"Well, it never says so in the book, but Johnny's mom should have found out by the end. She probably would have only cried about it in public, so she isn't seen as a bad person.
As for his dad, there is no mention of him after Johnny's description in the beginning, so whether he is even alive is up to debate. If he did find out, he simply would not care.
Hope this helps!
I feel that Johnny's parents dislike him, but that his mother is the only parent in their family that actually cares that Johnny is dying, because his dad doesn't even seem to make an effort to go visit his son.
Clea wrote: "Divson wrote: "Do you guys think Johnny's parents found out about his death? If so, do you think they cried or did they just not care?"Well, it never says so in the book, but Johnny's mom should ..."
I don't even think the mom would even mention it to the dad
Johnny's mother went to Johnny while he was in the hospital because if she didn't, it would be known that she doesn't care. She went to mask the fact that he really doesn't care. If she truly cared, she wouldn't be saying such bad things when he was in the hospital. Remember, they barely even acknowledged his existence when he was in his own house. Why would they suddenly care about him? Also, if they really cared, they would have at least shown that they knew he existed before the accident. They didn't even care when he ran away. Why would they care now? They also had to show up to pay the hospital bill, and if they didn't request to visit him, it would seem as if they were bad parents, which they were. They just didn't want anyone else knowing that. Anyone agree??
Kyle wrote: "[Clea wrote: "Kyle wrote: If Johnny's mom was only trying to act innocent she wouldn't have looked like she would have cussed out. Also I don't see why she would need to convince nurses in another town that she is innocent."As Josh already pointed out, nobody wants to be known for child abuse. She would want to look innocent because child abuse is illegal. If the cops found out, she would probably be arrested, and most likely imprisoned for who knows how long.
Luke wrote: "I feel that Johnny's parents dislike him, but that his mother is the only parent in their family that actually cares that Johnny is dying, because his dad doesn't even seem to make an effort to go ..."It seems to me that the mom is faking it though
Has everyone been enjoying this conversation Ben aka the genius has created?
I agree with what you wrote there Clea.
I feel like the last sentence that Johnny ever said was so powerful. it gave me chills because the poem they Pony said was really meaningful to him because when he finally wanted to live he died, which in the poem it kind of relates.
Zach wrote: "Johnny's mother went to Johnny while he was in the hospital because if she didn't, it would be known that she doesn't care. She went to mask the fact that he really doesn't care. If she truly cared..."I feel that she didn't need to show up because I don't think anyone asked for her
Ben wrote: "Has everyone been enjoying this conversation Ben aka the genius has created?"YES WE HAVE!
BiGBEN wrote: 'I don't even think the mom would even mention it to the dad."True. Neither of them really cared about Johnny, so it would make sense that they would never speak of him again. But Johnny is still their son, so they would probably find out from other people, particularly the nurses treating Johnny.
I think Johnny's mom's dialogue really reveals her based on what we already know. We know that she lied to try to see her son, because when she says "I raised him" that is a lie because the gang really raised him. We also learn that she hates Johnny even more than the gang thought, because not only does she yell at him, even when he is dying, she wants to tell him how much trouble he caused.
I have been enjoying it Ben
One example of dialogue in the outsiders is when Bob and his gang shows up at the park where Johnny and Ponyboy were. Dialogue comes up in this scene when Bob says "You know what Greasers are? White trash with long greasy hair" and when Ponyboy comes in and says "You know what a Soc is? White trash with blue mustangs and Madras. These quotes are examples of Dialogue because it shows us that Greasers and Soc's are rivals. What do you guys think?
Ryan wrote: "I think Johnny's mom's dialogue really reveals her based on what we already know. We know that she lied to try to see her son, because when she says "I raised him" that is a lie because the gang re..."I agree.
Nikhil wrote: "One example of dialogue in the outsiders is when Bob and his gang shows up at the park where Johnny and Ponyboy were. Dialogue comes up in this scene when Bob says "You know what Greasers are? Whit..."I agree Nikhil because it really shows how much they hate each other and their rivalry.
This isn't current times. The book takes place in the 60s so things were different back then, child abuse was not cared for much back then.
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that's what I said! I said that she doesn't care!