Everything I Never Told You, by Celeste Ng (Anything Goes BOM) Start Date: December 12, 2015

[Sarah]

Team Artemis

1. Do you like this book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?

I'm liking the easy, fluid writing so far. I decided to read it because of the tower team challenge. It is a book I could have read otherwise for a quick read.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977( first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parent's met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book( or in history if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?

In the 50's women were expected to be the "happy homemaker" and not aspire to be more. Finding a husband was and getting maaried was the ideal. The 70's was the time of the ERA, and it was becoming more accepted for women wanting to work outside the home. Both Marilyn and her mother wanted for their daughter to have/be the one thing they could not, whether the daughter wanted to or not. Marilyn was an only child so of course the pressure wold all be on her to fulfill her mothers wants. Lydia being the first daughter was the one favored by Marilyn to be everything she wanted. As for James, she was the one who looked like Marilyn the most so she could blend in with everyone else and be accepted by society whereas he could not.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets"? How is Lydia different from her siblings?

I thought it was kind of weird. What child of that age could have secrets? Maybe a little projection? She is obviously he favorite since for both parents she is the one to be what they could not.

4. How does your high school experience compare to Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are to meet her parents' expectations?

I was in high school in the 90'sso it wasn't unusual to have people of different races/nationalities. It was also more accepted to be of "mixed" heritage. I think that Lydia is letting her parents believe that she actually wants the same things they want for her.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?

Their parents wouldn't even listen to them anyway. I don't think Jack has any direct involvement in Lydia's death.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?

Lydia

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?

Not sure.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers...Because more than anything, her mother wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible"? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?

I'm pretty happy to blend in to my environment

9. What do you think oh Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?

I thought it happened too fast.

I think she went back to college to prove she could still be what she always wanted to be.

[Allison Ann]

Joanne wrote: "I agree you could kind of go either way as to whether it was suicide or an accident. On the one hand she did have those thoughts about changing her life and the dock not being very far. But she cou..."

I do agree. I'm leaning toward accident, but the accident occurred because she was so unsettled because of her suicidal ideation.

[Suzanne]

I agree with some of the above posters - I have no sympathy for Marilyn just leaving to go to school. It was extremely cruel of her - especially since she gave them no idea of what happened. I also am continuing to feel sorry for Hannah and how they ignore her.

[Caroline]

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?

Yes! I love books that spoil themselves as I am very pro spoilers and the discussion of race and gender so far is fascinating! I decided to read this book because I've never done a BOM, it's worth a bunch of points in tower teams, it sounded interesting and I thought it would be easier to get from the library than it was.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?

There was a lot more tolerance in the 70s than 50s but not as much as today. I think things would have gotten easier for the Lee's. I would like to know more about the demographics of academia at both times, because Asian professors were about as common as white at my uni.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?

I don't understand that reaction at all. I don't know why anyone would be suspicious of a one year old, but it makes me wonder if the suicide was a result of this type of suspicion.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?

High school sucks, but I had dreams and hopes of a life afterwards.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?

Not really. It seems like a suicide. Maybe she's pregnant or something but I don't think he was directly involved. I think Lydias siblings have an idea that their sister wasn't happy. They may unwilling to admit their suspicions. I also think they would be hesitant to shatter their parents perseption of Lydia

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?

Lydia?

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?

I think she killed herself

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?

I think it's a great line, although I don't identify with either side.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?

I thought it was interesting. I'm worried about Marilyn. I wouldn't be surprised if the disappearance may be like a midlife crisis of realizing she is more like her mother than the doctor she dreamed of being.

[Caroline]

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?

Idk, there's starting to be what looks like forshadowing, but I still think suicide makes more sense.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?

That was so stupid and creepy. I mean professor/student relationships are always inappropriate due to the power imbalance and likelihood of abuse. But it's especially creepy when he said in a previous chapter how much Louisa reminds him and looks like Lydia. I also don't know how that just all of a sudden happened. I thought his feelings were more paternal and not sexual. The whole thing seemed weird and out of the blue.

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?

That's life, no? So much to do and so little time to do it? Seems like everyone could relate to that.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?

I thought his dad needed to be more supportive of the activities his son did well and enjoyed instead of getting upset that he wasn't going to vicariously live the life of a popular kid through his son.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?

She should have told them. I thought her decision to go back to school was great, but just disappearing like that was cowardly

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?

My parents were extremely supportive and helped me achieve my dreams. But they were much more concerned about MY dreams, not what they wanted my dreams to be, than either of Lydia's parents. Or Marilyn's.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?

I like it. I think I enjoy the flashbacks more than the whole Lydia plot.

[JoLene]

12/12-- Day 1 Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

This is a re-read for me, so I'm not going to answer all the questions since I know the whole story.......
1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
I picked this up because it had a lot of good buzz. I was also intrigued about a story about Asian Americans in the midwest during the 70's. I grew up in a small farm town in IL and I know that there were no asians and only 1 black family at my school. Now, I live in Bay area where it is a gigantic melting pot of every nationality that you can think of :-D


2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
While times have changed a bit between the late 50's and the late 70's, it was not enough for it not to play a role in the family dynamic.


3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
I think that this statement is more about Marilyn than anything about baby Lydia. As the first born girl, I think that Marilyn had high expectations for her daughter to fulfill the dreams that Marilyn didn't realize. I think this put a lot of pressure on Lydia which Nathan didn't feel as a boy and Hannah didn't have because she came along so much later.


4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
I doesn't compare to my experience (a long time ago), it never would have occurred to me to pretend to have friends. I've always had a few close friends.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I agree with others comments about they were trying to protect Jack.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM? No comment

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim? No comment

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
I would say that I'm a blender, but I currently have purple-dyed hair so I guess standing out doesn't bother me.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
I remember thinking how forward Marilyn was to go after her professor. I found their courtship odd in that I'm not sure what they say in each other besides the novelty. James wants to fit in and be American and what is more American than a blond wife. Marilyn likes to stand out so now she has an exotic husband.

[Megan]

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
I'm not sure about this book. I'm interested and yet I'm not, its all a little confusing to be honest.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
It according to the book is more accepting that a girl be educated, they seem to push Lydia more. I don't think it changed in terms of race though.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
She acts like Lydia is a genuis child who worked out how to hide her walking from her mother. She also is trying to live her life through Lydia because she didn't get to do what she wanted as an adult

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
I didn't go to high school. Its not called that in England and so comparing my experience in school to Lydia's would be different as it was different cultures... similar but different. She doesn't because she is strange and different in terms she is half white and half chinese or 'oriental' as they refer to her. That she is a good girl that she studies all the time and doesn't do bad things.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
Because they are protecting her even with her dead. I think she committed suicide personally so he has responsibility because he hurt her but I don't think he literally killed her.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
Lydia.

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
Suicide.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
Blend in but not be unheard.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
If it happened today. A professor and student there would be so much uproar. I have no idea, maybe he wanted to leave her? Not sure.

[☼♎ Carmen the Bootyshaker Temptress ☼♎]

Team Artemis
Day 1 Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
Not sure what I thought about the beginning of the book. It just seemed sad and I was just curious as to where Lydia was.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
It was sad to see that the 20 yrs didn't change the way being a mix family or being of a different race was still fronded upon.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
I have 5 children and I would never think that of any of my children. I thought that was a weird statement and wondered what was Marilyn's problem.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
My HS experience was any other kid. With who didn't like who, who made fun of the other person and the rest of the usual childish stuff but with Lydia she must had felt different and with the things both her parents said to her, it must have been confusing for her too.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I'm not sure why they didn't say anything . I was thinking maybe they just didn't want to disappoint their parents by telling them that Lydia was hanging around with Jack.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
I think it might have been ?

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
Well if she committed suicide I guess she was looking for something that was quick and if it wasn't a suicide then it had to be someone that knew she wouldn't be able to get herself out no matter how much she tried.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
I thought they should have went slow like everyone else and not rush into things. I feel like something is missing in this whole picture yet.

Day 2 Discussion Questions Chapters 3-4

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?
Some yes but not sure.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?
I didn't like the fact that he did the professor/assistant thing because it's not professional and don't like the fact that he made the creepy remark between Lydia and Louisa. It was like he was comparing and it creeped me out. Even with asking Louisa about a gift for Lydia and he didn't see how weird that situation seemed.

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?
I see it a lot with the differences in someone's age or someone who undermines someone because of their age.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?
I think Jack should of been more supportive of Nathan. I feel the parents push their life experiences on their children. I believe Nathan should have told Marilyn because she seems to have the opposite view of Jack.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?
I think she could have did it in a different way. Not just up and leave her family that way. I think it should more of who she wanted to be and then something must have changed or happened and then she become the person she is now. Maybe an influence from her own mother.

14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?
I think they each have a different way of seeing and being a housewife. I don't think Marilyn wanted to be her mother. She seemed to be more of a determined women.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?
My parents only told me to do the best that I can as long as I was proud of myself and what I accomplished because they would always be proud as long as I did my best.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?
I liked it because it gives you a sense of what was going on with the family and how each saw through their eyes.

[☼♎ Carmen the Bootyshaker Temptress ☼♎]

Dec 14 - Day 3 Discussion Questions Chapters 5-6

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
I think she does and it's sad that the whole family feels like they can't say anything to each other.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?
I think it fits the theme of the book. I don't think the police are looking into the parents because they can see the sad situation the family is in and the things that they are finding out about Lydia that it's looking more and more like a suicide.

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
I think it was placed there to gain attention from her parents.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?
I think this was only during the stress that has surrounded them.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?
I use to think that way but nowadays you see more and more male nurse and female doctors that I don't label anymore.

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?
I think she does in a way.

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
She might have been and no one was paying attention but most of the time I think Lydia was just playing a role for her parents.

Discussion Questions
Dec 15 Chapters 7-8 Pages 158-216

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?
I think a little but most of it was that Nath just wanted to get away from all the craziness at home and try to live a normal life.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?
I think Marilyn wanted to live her life through Lydia and James is trying to save her from the embarrassment and pressures that he went through from happening to Lydia but it's actually doing the opposite.

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?
I think she was looking for anything that her parents would give her. It's sad that the kids feel like they needed to fight for attention and poor Hannah doesn't get anything at all.

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?
I hope she tosses him because he's a jerk for doing what he did.

29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?
I think Lydia told him something and he made fun of her or (view spoiler)[ I honestly think that Jack was gay because of all the asking about Nath (hide spoiler)] and she just felt like her only friend disappointed her and set her off the edge.

[☼♎ Carmen the Bootyshaker Temptress ☼♎]

Discussion Questions
Dec 16 Chapters 9-12 Page 217-end


30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the book?
I thought that from the beginning because of the dysfunctional family they were.

31. Some posters have mentioned now that the book became predictable and/or repetitive as it went on. Agree or disagree?
I agree with some of it being predictable but not repetitive.

32. When Nath ends up under the water, this quote, “he’s already learned how not to drown.” (p 290) is stated. What do you think this means?
I think it's a matter of instinct that would take over for him and that fact that he knows how to swim.

33. We had a high suicide rate at the high school where I taught. We could not pin down only one reason that this happened so much at our school. What do you think is the major cause of teen suicide?
In my opinion I think it could be a matter of different things like popularity, teasing, boyfriends, not being wanted or depression.

34. Was the ending realistic and did you like it? Why or why not?
I think it's realistic and I did like some of it because some people just need to let some steam out or take their anger out on the person they think is the cause but then realize that it's not going to change what happened.

[VNerdbooks]

I'm just starting this today

[VNerdbooks]

Discussion Questions
Dec 16 Chapters 9-12 Page 217-end 


30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the book?

I was suspicious but didn't really know if there was going to be a big twist

31. Some posters have mentioned now that the book became predictable and/or repetitive as it went on. Agree or disagree?

not predictable but yes quite repetitive, a couple of times I found myself thinking that I had already heard this bit before!

32. When Nath ends up under the water, this quote, “he’s already learned how not to drown.” (p 290) is stated. What do you think this means?

He has learned not to drown by living/coping on his own after leaving home (maybe)

33. We had a high suicide rate at the high school where I taught. We could not pin down only one reason that this happened so much at our school. What do you think is the major cause of teen suicide?

I honestly think that teenagers are put under a tremendous amount of pressure now days, with school and getting the grades and not disappointing their parents.

34. Was the ending realistic and did you like it? Why or why not? 

I think that it was an okay ending but I hoped that Nathan and Jack could have been friends, Hannah had seen the attraction from a long way away, and although nothing would have come of it, it would have been nice for them to be able to talk about Lydia together.

I didn't like this book as much as I thought I would, it was just an okay read for me

[JoLene]

12/13-- Day 2 Discussion Questions Chapters 3-4

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?
Again, I already read this, so I'm basing this answer off my memory of the first reading. I don't think he was responsible, but maybe that he knew more than he was letting on.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?
Yes!! my opinion definitely changed. At first, I thought he was a sympathetic character but starting an affair made me think otherwise (even though he didn't have the greatest releationship with Marilyn).

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?
Of course --- I think that almost everyone feels pressure or expectations --- even if they are self-inflicted.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?
James just wants Nath to fit in, but trying to force him to play and make friends is the wrong way to go about it. I felt sorry for Nath and thought that Jack was trying to be nice at first --- although I'm not exactly sure.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?
I didn't really like Marilyn from the beginning, but I also found this horrible. Her life wasn't turning out what she expected, but instead of trying to work things out, she picked up and ran away. As someone else said, leaving a husband is one thing...but leaving kids is entirely something else.

14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?
I think that we don't really know about Marilyn's mom, since we mostly see her through Marilyn's eyes. Because Marilyn doesn't want to be a stay-at-home mother, she obviously thinks that no one would be happy with that life.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?
Growing up I definitely felt like I wanted my parents approval so I was a good kid and didn't do a lot to worry them.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?
I like the flashbacks and think that they are used effectively --- especially to build the suspense around Lydia's death (since we know she died from the very beginning!)

[JoLene]

Dec 14 - Day 3 Discussion Questions Chapters 5-6

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
I'm sure that she feels a bit guilty about not speaking up --- but I think that anyone who has lost of a sibling like that would have feelings of guilt or regret.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?
I think that it illustrates how dysfunctional the parents are --- however, I did not really get the feeling that they were suspects. They always seemed to self-involved to actually do something like kill their daughter ;-)

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
I think that she was definitely smoking as it is mentioned that her room smelled of smoke. If she was smoking in her room, I think she was trying to get her parents attention. As for the condoms, I'm not so sure that she was using those, but I like someone's response that she was being practical knowing how children had "ruined" her mom's life.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?
I don't think it played into Lydia's death. This is back in the 70's when actually spanking or slapping your child was not considered abusive behavior so I think this was just a period detail.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?
I think that Marilyn resents all of her children, but Hannah's neglect could be because she is just so much younger than her siblings.

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
I don't think that Lydia is a happy girl --- I can't comment on the scene since this is a re-read for me.

[Caroline]

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?

It didn't help. Usually people don't kill themselves if there is hope or another way of coping. He protected her through school and helped with her parents. Now they barely get along and she is falling ever shorter of her crazy parents expectations.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?

Her mom just wants to live out her dream of being a doctor and James sees all his failures in nathan. And no one cares about poor Hannah

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?

Probably, but she also doesn't want to face her brother leaving. There's no way she could be happy for him.

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?

I really don't care. I just want Hannah to succeed. She seems to be the only likable character and she is so neglected.

29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?

I thought the whole book he was a nice guy, just trying to be friends with the lees. I'm not shocked to find out that he had a special interest in Nathan, but it makes me dislike Nathan more. He always seemed to jump to irrational conclusions about Jack and now we know for sure they were irrational.

[JoLene]

Discussion Questions
Dec 15 Chapters 7-8 Pages 158-216

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?
I agree with Brie's statements that it was not directly related. However, I'm sure that Nath's leaving was causing some feelings of anxiousness for her.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?
Well -- I think that Marilyn focused on her so that she could place her dreams on her. Maybe James saw that Nath wasn't fitting in with the example of what happened at the pool so he also place his dream of fitting in onto her.

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?
I think that the whole family is a dysfunctional mess of failed communication :-D

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?
29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?
Since this is a re-read, I'm not going to answer the last two questions.

[Stacie]

This finally came in from the library! Only a little late. Can't wait to get it started!

[JoLene]

Discussion Questions
Dec 16 Chapters 9-12 Page 217-end


30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the book?
I thought it was suicide almost from the beginning. I think that as I was reading, it made me think of how dysfunctional this family was.

31. Some posters have mentioned now that the book became predictable and/or repetitive as it went on. Agree or disagree?
Agree -- but I like what someone said about it being similar to her life.

32. When Nath ends up under the water, this quote, “he’s already learned how not to drown.” (p 290) is stated. What do you think this means?
Nath is getting out and leaving his family and the toxic environment.

33. We had a high suicide rate at the high school where I taught. We could not pin down only one reason that this happened so much at our school. What do you think is the major cause of teen suicide?
We have a local community where there is a high suicide rate. I think that kids are under enormous pressure to excel and get into good colleges. Also in this area, there is probably an higher rate of over-achieving parents. I think this coupled with the fact that as a teenager, things seem very black and white and small problems can seem insurmountable.


34. Was the ending realistic and did you like it? Why or why not?
Like several others, I think that what happened ended up being an accident. While the suicide angle was tragic, I think it was even sadder to think that she was actually trying to change her life. Overall, the amount of dysfunction in this family will leave lasting effects for them all.

[Sophie, The other one]

Playing catch up!

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
Reading it because it's BOM. Enjoying what I've read so far.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
Race relations aren't a strong point of mine. Hadn't even fully clocked the time period - thought it was set more recently than that...

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
I think this says a lot about Marilyn. Sort of fits with the idea of post natal depression that someone mentioned earlier.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
I think she's been put under a lot of pressure to meet their expectations and it's sad she feels she has to find a way not to let them down.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I don't think he's that involved. Think the fact they don't tell the parents is more a symptom of the problems in the family dynamics.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
Maybe Lydia, not sure though

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
Wondering about suicide.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
I want to blend in more than stand out most of the time.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
This was where the time it was set in began to ring true. Would be interested to hear more about what Marilyn got up to. Makes me wonder a bit if Lydia is James' daughter or not

[Denise]

12/12-- Day 1 Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read? This isn't my usual genre though I like to read a bit of everything. This was recommended to me by several people and has been on my TBR for a while so it seemed like a good time to get to it.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings? I've finished the book so I'm not sure how to answer this or what I was thinking at the time!

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations? No idea about this - at least not this early in the book. I don't think there was enough info given yet to really figure it out yet.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death? No idea!

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM? Lydia...

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim? Suicide? At least that was my guess at the time (I've already finished the book)

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in? I really liked that line! Personally I can go either way, depending on circumstances and who I am around.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death? I thought that it was all a bit rushed. Not going to comment on the disappearance etc since I've already finished the book. ;)

[Stacie]

Rachel wrote: "12/12-- Day 1 Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
--I was really interested in the mystery of Lydia'..."

I just started the book but I have to say, I felt the same way when I got to the part about finding her body in the lake. Especially with seeing Jack there earlier and then a lone boat (which sort of symbolized Lydia I think but that's another story) and then her not knowing how to swim so now I'm all murder? suicide? accident? TELL ME NOW!

I'm sure questions get answered but this is what I'm thinking so far.

[Stacie]

Ashley wrote: "12/12-- Day 1 Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?

I saw this floating around with lots of good revi..."

It's a lot of pressure to grow up with parental expectations wanting you to be exceptional. I feel for Lydia in that aspect as I grew up in a similar manner where I may not have been the favorite but there were a lot of expectations that I would exceed at everything academic-wise.

[Stacie]

I finished the book last night. I was surprised by how much I enjoyed it as I had kept putting it off and putting off. One of the hardest parts of the book for me was that I kept forgetting it was set in the 70s and I cringed every time someone said Oriental. I'm still going through the thread and responding to what other people have thought about themselves.

[Stacie]

JoLene wrote: "Discussion Questions
Dec 16 Chapters 9-12 Page 217-end


30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the b..."

Your answer for #32 about Nath already learning how not to drown was spot on I think. It felt to me like he had to figure out how to swim in an environment that kept trying to drown him out whether it was all the attention to Lydia or the way Lydia tried to keep him from knowing about Harvard, he completely had to learn how to survive on his own to prevent himself from getting lost.

[Grace]

very late to this, I found the book hard to get into
1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?

I am not sure what I think. The description sounded interesting and I will give anything a go.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
Not sure I don't know much about the time frame, especially in the US.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
I think maybe it is a way of saying she didn't understand her even as a baby she seemed more complicated.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
Hard to tell at this point, she seemed to want to be left alone and acted the way she needed to.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I am not sure, he obviously knows something.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
Not sure, maybe Jack ?

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
It sounded suspicious, hinting either at suicide or being dumped there.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
I hate standing out, I would rather just blend in and not be noticed.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
Very fast and no clue.

[Grace]

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?
I am still not sure, I think he knows more than he is saying, but I don't get the feeling he was directly involved in her death.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?
I think the death and grief was the catalyst, it started the day of the funeral when James was emotional and vulnerable and Marilyn wasn't comforting him or vice versa. I don't have much of an opinion on James at this point

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?
Not really


12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?
James wants Nathan to fit in like he didn't and he wants to pretend everything is okay

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?
I can't really relate, I have never been able to leave my kids for more than weekend but then I am not filled with regrets and what ifs like Marilyn. I think it was a role she drifted into not the one she wanted or planned and at that period in time she couldn't really see how she could have both.


14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?
I am happy as a SAHM it is the most challenging and most important job I have done.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?
Can't really answer this raised by my Gran.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?
Not a fan of flashbacks.

[Kelsey]

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
Yes I do like the book so far. I decided to read this book because it was on my TBR list and when it came up as book of the month, I decided to read it. I read from a variety of genres, so it is not unusual for me to read a book like this.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
Well it was mentioned about the difficulty for Asian families when James Lee was growing up. Mixed race marriages were also not celebrated and were discouraged. I think that over time those things changed, but perhaps in 1977, being a mixed race child would still be something that could be problematic from the perspective of bullying in a school. It doesn't appear that Lydia was particularly popular, so perhaps she had mental illness.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings? Lydia is perceived as a child that is intuitive and ahead of her time. She is eager to figure out things and discover how to do things quickly. I think being a parent for the first time and seeing these things can be startling, so perhaps she wasn't as different as her siblings, but as a first time parent, these things seemed unusual.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
I think that my high school experience matches Lydia's a little bit. Especially doing what was right and expected at school. I wasn't a high honor student, but I got my work done and I was attentive to the task at hand. I think that Lydia is a bit of a loner and that unfortunately kids use her. I don't think that Lydia wants to be alone, but she allows these students to be her fake friends, so that her parents don't worry about her.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I think that Nath thinks that Jack is somehow involved in her death, or at least he knows something. I don't think that Nath wants to tell his parents, because he doesn't want Lydia to be in trouble. He also knows that Lydia has no friends and telling on her about Jack could hurt her one friendship, or one person that makes her happy, and Nath also doesn't want to ruin his relationship with his sister.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
I think that she went to see Jack.

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
I don't think that it was intentional. Perhaps she just wanted to go out to the lake and didn't think she would fall in. When you are in a boat, your first thought isn't that I am going to have to swim.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
I definitely prefer to blend in, but I often stand out, not sure if that makes sense, but I always feel different, like others see those differences, even though I so desperately want to just blend in to the crowd and not be seen.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
I think that their love story was a really great chapter. I loved how bold Marilyn was and how much she admired James and wanted the relationship to work. I also appreciate how much she stood by him, no matter what anyone close to her would think about the relationship.
I think that Marilyn disappears, because she has mental illness, perhaps post partum depression. I don't think it is linked to Lydia's disappearance, but certainly depression and the genetic components of mental illness could be linked to it.

Team Sphynx

[Grace]

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
I think she does feel guilty, she feels invisible.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?

I think they already had concluded suicide and were trying to see if this fit. I don't think her parents were ever suspects

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
Wasn't sure on this, thought it was connected to Jack.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?

No I don't think so it says he had never hit Nathan before or after it was an extreme moment he regretted.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?
No probably as I had a female doctor as a child and my cousin was a male nurse I never really saw the stereotypes so I never assume.

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?

Yes I think she does but I don't think she has admitted that to herself she is too busy trying to make Lydia do what she didn't

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
I think she may have been overwhelmed by her mother's demands. It brought her closer to Nath.

[Grace]

Discussion Questions
Dec 15 Chapters 7-8 Pages 158-216

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?
I think she felt abandoned, wondering how she would cope without him when he was such a huge part of her world.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?
I think it was because Marilyn was trying to live through Lydia and James encouraged it he hoped it would be enough for Marilyn.

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?
I thought it was more deliver the blow when the parents were in a good mood. Nath had done so well they might not care that she wasn't.

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?
I honestly didn't know or care, neither of them seemed to care that much about each other.

29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?
Not really

[Grace]

30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the book?
From the start it seemed liked a possibility.

31. Some posters have mentioned now that the book became predictable and/or repetitive as it went on. Agree or disagree?
Pretty much I wasn't a fan

32. When Nath ends up under the water, this quote, “he’s already learned how not to drown.” (p 290) is stated. What do you think this means?
I think it can't be taken both literally in that he was a swimmer and his body knew what to do by instinct but also he had learned how to survive within in his family.

33. We had a high suicide rate at the high school where I taught. We could not pin down only one reason that this happened so much at our school. What do you think is the major cause of teen suicide?
Pressure, peer, parental , self. A dear friend committed suicide at 15 his letter said it was too much he couldn't see ever getting through.

34. Was the ending realistic and did you like it? Why or why not?

It fitted the story. I didn't like anything about this book. It was slow repetitive and it took me multiple attempts to plough through it.

[RachelvlehcaR]

12/12-- Day 1 Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
I like the beginning of the book but after that I’m not really interested in it. Honestly, I’m only reading it for TT4. It’s not a genre I like to read, so this is a tough one but not as bad as others.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
I wouldn’t want to be in their situation during those time periods. I think Ng did a good job in showing what some of the difficulties are like. The school with James was typical and even so in the 1980s and 1990s with children that English isn’t their first language in America. Interracial marriages were frowned upon. Lots of prejudices from it, even hate crimes. It happened to my grandparent too.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "...Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
She had most of her expectations in the first born daughter. It’s quite common, even more so with first born sons. It’s the curse of being the first born.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
Lydia is a ghost generation. It’s really difficult to be and second generation or third generation child in America. They don’t fit in with the main society culture because of their looks and they don’t fit in with their family culture because they are more Americanized. Because of this they tend to feel like they are on their own. We studies this in sociology and it’s sad to be in this ghost culture, a lot of people tend to have some isolation issues when a preteen or teen. I’m a ghost generation too.

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I don’t think Jack had anything to do with her disappearance. I think that she was actually lonely and had issues with the not fitting in on their side (ghost culture) and committed suicide from family pressure and not feeling like she fits in with them and will just disappoint them.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
Don’t know.

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
I think she committed suicide. It’s odd that in the beginning it talked about some serial killers. Maybe just to make us think something more.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
She nailed it. The grass is greener on the other side. During different parts of my life I’ve wanted to stand out and other times blend in.

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
The marriage is pretty much like how it was. When my grandfather married my grandmother his family told him he wasn’t welcome back to his hometown. Her family was very accepting. I don’t think there was any connection with the few says of disappearance and Lydia’s death.

[RachelvlehcaR]

12/13-- Day 2 Discussion Questions Chapters 3-4

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?
No, my opinion hasn’t changed of Jack. It makes sense. Lydia wanted to feel something and must have been very alone to seek out Jack’s attention. He for sure has a reputation of sleeping with virgins and just is the wham bam thank you mam kind of guy. I think she killed herself.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?
He just wants to feel something, other than shock. No, my opinion doesn’t change of James; a death of a child is one of the most devastating things you could experience. Many people just shut down completely, life just kind of stops. His way of stopping the numb feeling he needs to just feel anything and seeks it in her.

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?
We all have pressures and expectations, if it isn’t from family it’s from society. We are groomed for this once born. The further you see yourself from the norms from family or society the more issues you will have with self-esteem, self-image, or self-confidence.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?
Teasing pecking orders are really difficult. The reason why Nath was teased a lot is his reaction. If he reacts he is showing his weakness and he becomes lowest on the pecking order. It’s harsh and happens so much more with boys. Many times if the boy who has been teased stops getting teased it’s because another boy has shown more of a reaction and he is now the lowest. The boy that was first teased will either be silent and just will not do anything to stand out while the boy gets teased. It’s a shame that James didn’t do anything to teach his son or show empathy about the situation to Nath about it with a teachable moment. No words of compassion or comfort to Nath. It’s typical that guys don’t share this with females, especially mothers or wives.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?
She is questioning her life. Seeing if she made the right choices and what she can do to get herself on track with it. Life normally isn’t want you thought it would be when you were a child. You had all these ideas of where you’d be and it might not be what you thought.

14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?
It really shows who some people in the generations don’t see eye to eye. It’s a different way in life and its changes in society. It was a big change. They were coming out of time when women stayed at home while the men went off to work and had mistresses. It was the time period of when housewives were hopped up on meth and alcohol. Where they smoked while pregnant, and racism was in full force. Marilyn was living through a time women liberation was happening and society was changing. Women were getting more rights and there was a shift in freedoms even for minorities. I don’t think one if happier than the other. I think life is what you make it.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?
Family has influence on you even if you don’t think they do. You might do something just to not be like them or to be like them. It’s a very complex answer for me. I can’t shut off my psychology hat so I’m going to just skip this question.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?
I think this is a long round-a-bout to get to why Lydia is dead. I am getting tired of it because I feel like I’ve been tricked and lied to. This book looks so promising from the beginning then it’s a book about generations and how if they communicated and things would have been different.

[Sara]

I'm in for the discussion, Team Poseidon :)
Just got the digital version of the book so I'm playing catch up!


DAY 1 - Discussion Questions Chapters 1-2

1. Do you like the book so far? Why did you decide to read it? Is this a genre you normally read?
I think the book is pretty good so far. Mistery and thrillers are not my fave genres and I don't usually read them often, but this book caught my interest and a few GR friends of mine enjoyed it so I thought it was time to try it myself.

2. Lydia dies May 3rd, 1977 (first lines of the book so this isn't a spoiler) and Lydia's parents met in September 1957. What differences and similarities do you see in regards to race and gender relations between these two time frames in the book (or in history, if you looked it up)? What part does it play in the Lee family dynamics?
I think the author gave a fair idea of how mixed race marriages were not only very rare but especially discouraged at the time James Lee was growing up. I believe there was a lot more tolerance in the 70's than in the 50's though, but I think Lydia's parents would have had some issues if they had met in the 70's nonetheless.

3. What do you think of Lydia's mother, Marilyn's description of her first born daughter's first steps and the line "... Lydia, still small enough to cradle, had secrets" ? How is Lydia different than her siblings?
I actually think this deals more with her mother's perception of her.

4. How does your high school experience compare with Lydia's? Why do you think Lydia doesn't have any "real" friends? What other things do you think Lydia is letting her parents believe are true to meet her parents' expectations?
During high school I used to have a small circle of friends only but it was okay to me, as I felt I was too introvert to be the constant focus of the attention as some of the most popular girls were.
Probably Lydia doesn't have any "real" friend because she too is considered unpopular or weird, different. I don't think it has much to do with her being Chinese, but probably because of her personality?

5. Why do you think Lydia's siblings, Nath and Hannah, do not tell their parents about Lydia's friendship with Jack? Do you think Jack is involved in Lydia's disappearance and/or death?
I think her siblings just don't want to get in trouble by telling their parents about her friendship with Jack. I'm actually not sure yet if he is involved or not.

6. Who do you think Hannah saw/heard on Wednesday at 2AM?
I really don't know. Lydia maybe?

7. What do you think of Lydia's body being found at a lake when Lydia could not swim?
Maybe her body has been dumped there by someone who knew she wasn't able to swim.

8. What do you think of the first lines of Chapter 2, "How did it begin? Like everything: with mothers and fathers... Because more than anything, her mother had wanted to stand out; because more than anything, her father wanted to blend in. Because those things had been impossible" ? Where are you on the personality spectrum of wanting to stand out versus wanting to blend in?
I definitely prefer to blend in!

9. What do you think of Marilyn and James' courtship and marriage? What do you think happened in 1966 that made Marilyn disappear for a few days and do you think it is related to Lydia's disappearance and death?
Marilyn could have left for a few days because she felt trapped in her own realtionship with James and she wasn't happy with how her role of mother and wife turned out.
I personally don't think it has anything to do with Lydia's disappearance and death but I could be wrong!

[Sara]

DAY 2 - Discussion Questions Chapters 3-4

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?
No, my opinion hasn't changed about Jack.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?
I kinda liked James at first, but his affair with Louisa made me change my opinion of him. Despite he doesn't have one of the best relationship with his wife, I think he doesn't have such strong personality as I thought he had. I believe he's kinda weak instead.

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?
Definitely. I believe almost everyone feels pressured by expectations; most of mine are self-inflicted.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?
I don't think James handled the situation very well. He acted as nothing had happened at all, while I believe he should have been way more supportive towards his son.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?
I somehow expected such a strong decision/reaction from Marilyn sooner or later. That didn't change my opinion of her, though.

14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?
Marilyn didn't want to be like her mother at all but she ended up having a very similar life to hers in the end, and she realizes that's rather frustrating. At the same time I'm not sure that her mother was satisfied with her own life either.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?
My parents definitely influenced my childhood and teenage years. And my grandparents did the same too, luckily.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?
I really like flashbacks, and I believe they work very well here. They've been essential so far in order to have a better understanding of the characters' personalities, I think.

[Sara]

DAY 3 - Discussion Questions Chapters 5-6

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
She probably does.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?
Their different reactions underline how little they both really know about their daughter, but I don't think they are suspects.

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
I don't think Lydia placed them there to gain attention but she probably used them with Jack, as he said to the police.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?
I don't think it played a part into Lydia's death, but it was something more period related.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?
I usually try not to stereotype professions so female doctors and male nurses do seem the norm to me nowadays.

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?
It's definitely possible, especially for Marilyn.

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
She was probably unhappy and much burdened already by her mother's expectations, but in addition to this she couldn't even swim so all that could have been just too much to handle for her.

[Sara]

DAY 4 - Discussion Questions Chapters 7-8

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?
I think she felt abandoned again and this might have had a huge impact on her.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?
I think Marilyn tried to place her dreams on Lydia, while James mainly wanted to prevent her from feeling excluded.

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?
Yep, definitely. She hates and craves attention at the same time!

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?
I don't know. I hope James will be honest about it at least, but I think they'll probably just end up pretending it never happened!

29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?
Jack has probably been the only one who was sanely supportive towards Lydia, so maybe he has been the only real friend she had.

[RachelvlehcaR]

Dec 14 - Day 3 Discussion Questions Chapters 5-6

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
I feel Hannah feels that she might have been able to save Lydia if she informed her parents. Hannah is the invisible child. This book is very much about the dysfunctional roles in the family. The golden child, the scapegoat, the lost (ghost) child.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?
Yes, it’s a foreshadowing. It shows how the family doesn’t really know each other and only sees it in their way. James has suffered socially and that is something that he hopes his children experience. Marilyn feels like she is the stuck housewife and wants so much more in the world and tries to live that through Lydia so education is important. The police don’t suspect them at all. They are just trying to figure out if Lydia was murdered by jealous boy or girl or accident or if she off herself maybe from family or friend issues.

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
Lydia used them. Since they were hid she didn’t want her family to find the smokes and condoms.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?
What?! This book isn’t able domestic violence. Look at the time period. Hell, the schools could spank the kids with paddle boards. This isn’t violent at all. They were just some family disputes. I don’t think it happens often and there isn’t really anything into it just a lack of communication.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?
I don’t get mixed up with male and female nurses/doctors. They are pretty equal in my area. As for Marilyn you have to remember the time period. It was a time when there weren’t many female doctors. It was kind of rare. I think if you really are aware of the time period, it makes sense.

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?
Oh course. She is the reason why Marilyn has to lose her freedom and stay at home like her mother did. She wanted to be a professional not a stay-at-home. She wanted something more in her life, of course SAH’s, can have it just as rough and busy. Hannah is a slap in the face to Marilyn, the reason why she had to stop everything again.

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
I think it’s typical jealousy of older and younger sibling. The golden child and the scapegoat. Nath no matter what he does his family doesn’t care. He does wonderful great things but they don’t recognize him. They care all for Lydia. If she does well if she does bad, it’s all about her.

[RachelvlehcaR]

Discussion Questions
Dec 15 Chapters 7-8 Pages 158-216

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?
I don’t think that it has an impact at all.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?
Lydia is obvious with the mother. She wants her to have everything she didn’t have and if she doesn’t live up to it, she will make her live up to it with any help possible. The father, I thought it was because maybe Lydia looks less Chinese and he thinks she has more of a chance.

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?
Of course she craves the attention. She had it most of the time; it’s what is normal to her. I don’t think she did if for attention. I think she feels guilty for having low grades on something that her family thinks should be getting easily.

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?
No, I think she will stay. But she might leave.

29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?
Jack hasn’t anything to do with it. Jack is the boy that was there for Lydia in a way the others can’t be. He doesn’t fit in and Lydia feels like she doesn’t fit in so she went to him.

[RachelvlehcaR]

Discussion Questions
Dec 16 Chapters 9-12 Page 217-end

30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the book?
The entire story I knew she did. It was very clear. It didn’t have an impact on me at all, just predicable.

31. Some posters have mentioned now that the book became predictable and/or repetitive as it went on. Agree or disagree?
Yup, 100%. Very disappointed with it. I do think it’s good in the fact that it’s a good discussion for teens to talk about generations, family structures, interracial marriages, etc.

32. When Nath ends up under the water, this quote, “he’s already learned how not to drown.” (p 290) is stated. What do you think this means?
He can adapt and survive. He is more resilient. He can do it will little support.

33. We had a high suicide rate at the high school where I taught. We could not pin down only one reason that this happened so much at our school. What do you think is the major cause of teen suicide?
No, it isn’t just one thing. There are a lot of factors in it. I think people that say it’s just one thing are so off. Teen suicide happens because of depression, isolation, bullying, the distance from society norms and their life or distance from their family and themselves. It can be from having so much praise over and over then when they break up with a bf/gf they never had that rejection or loss and don’t know how to handle it. There are just so many factors but the most is lack of communication and active listening. There is also home life, neighborhood, if they are different in looks or likes. It’s a complicated issues and it’s one of those that is copied. When Kurt Cobain committed suicide there were many teens and adults that followed along with him and wrote it in their notes. This is why we put in a lot of sources for help and prevention. I had to teach parent education classes for middle school aged children and one of our topics is suicide. Since we have educated a lot more parents and families, there has been a drop in suicides in our area. It was a guinea pig program from the University of Washington that we funneled through United Way.

34. Was the ending realistic and did you like it? Why or why not?
I do like how Marilyn figured out that Lydia didn’t want what she wanted and in that moment she thought it was going to be the ghost Lydia walk through her room door but it was Hannah. I’m hoping that at that moment it’s a turning moment for Hannah and Marilyn to have a better relationship. Maybe James seeing Hannah on the floor might make him change his relationship with her too. Poor Jack. I feel bad for him.

[Sara]

DAY 5 - Discussion Questions Chapters 9-12

30. At what point in the book did you suspect that Lydia’s death was a suicide and do you think that had an effect on your reading of the book?
I was suspicious about the suicide and it seemed a possibility from the beginning, but I wasn't 100% sure of it until the very end.

31. Some posters have mentioned now that the book became predictable and/or repetitive as it went on. Agree or disagree?
I don't think the book became predictable nor repetitive, but I didn't expect such a "happy ending" for Lydia's parents afterall.

32. When Nath ends up under the water, this quote, “he’s already learned how not to drown.” (p 290) is stated. What do you think this means?
I believe it was meant to relate to his ability to cope with his family issues.

33. We had a high suicide rate at the high school where I taught. We could not pin down only one reason that this happened so much at our school. What do you think is the major cause of teen suicide?
Too much pressure and very high standards put on teen nowadays, I think.

34. Was the ending realistic and did you like it? Why or why not?
As stated above, I didn't expect such a "happy ending" for Lydia's parents and I actually think it could have been developed a bit better. Despite the ending was not my favourite part of the book, I rather enjoyed it!

[Kelsey]

Day 2 Discussion Questions Chapters 3-4

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police? I think that Jack may be just a person in the wrong place at the wrong time. It appears that he may know something about Lydia, but knowing about her as a person doesn't mean that he is involved. She may have told him things about herself that would lead more towards a suicide attempt, and maybe he has guilt for not telling anyone or stopping her.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship? I think the death had little to do with the affair as much as his strained relationship with Marilyn. It appears that her going away created great strife in the family and perhaps he is just getting back at his bad feelings about his wife. Tragedy makes you reach out for support, but not everyone who has tragedy in their life has an affair, so there is definitely more to the back story of his marriage.

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?I think that since having children I certainly understand the difficulty of holding a career that you are able to give everything you can to when you have parental responsibilities. One thing that is very tricky for me as a teacher is making sure I am able to meet the needs of my students without putting the amount of hours that I did prior to having my own children. This can be very demanding on me both professionally and personally.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened? Well I think you mean that James deals with his thoughts around being teased as a child. I think that he wanted Nath to stand up for himself, but understood why he didn't, because he wouldn't have as a child himself. James just wanted to be hidden when he was a child, he didn't want others to know who he was.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character? I think that it was selfish. I also think that she was having some sort of post partum episode where she was feeling like everything she had wanted and hoped for was gone, because of her new found responsibilities. I don't think it makes her a bad wife or a bad mother, but yes she should have handled it differently. Had she asked for help I am sure that James would have helped her reach her dreams if he valued their relationship.

14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?Definitely times have changed since the time frame of this story, so women in the workplace was not a have to and stay at home mothers were sort of the general responsibility of the wife. In the 70's this shifted as two parent homes started to have more scholarly women that were choosing career instead of staying at home. I don't think that the advice was meant to send her in a different direction, it was just thoughts written down. Perhaps her mother was passive aggressive and felt her dreams hadn't been reached as well, so she just jotted these things down out of spite.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you? I go to therapy, enough said :)

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here? I think it helps to keep the pace of the story and makes things interesting. It also puts some of the puzzle pieces together as you read the story.

Team Sphynx

[Kelsey]

I enjoyed reading your number 15 question Rachel, as I feel the same way, shut it down!

[RachelvlehcaR]

Kelsey wrote: "I enjoyed reading your number 15 question Rachel, as I feel the same way, shut it down!"

Lol, for me it's a really involved and long drawn out answer. I didn't feel like being that invested in this book then going into why James and Marilyn did this and how it influenced the kids both unconscious and consciously. So, i decided to shut it down. :P

[RachelvlehcaR]

Kelsey wrote: "I think that since having children I certainly understand the difficulty of holding a career that you are able to give everything you can to when you have parental responsibilities. One thing that is very tricky for me as a teacher is making sure I am able to meet the needs of my students without putting the amount of hours that I did prior to having my own children. This can be very demanding on me both professionally and personally. "

That is really tough on parents because the guilt factor is really strong. I have always struggled with this too. The really difficult part was when my son was in the same class. Trying to make it seem like i wasn't giving him more or less attention than the others.

[Kelsey]

RachelvlehcaR wrote: "Kelsey wrote: "I think that since having children I certainly understand the difficulty of holding a career that you are able to give everything you can to when you have parental responsibilities. ..."

My daughters will never be in my class, thankfully, I will be sure to make that happen :) I have had co-workers children though, but so far no big issues in 15 years of teaching.

I relate a bit to Marilyn's character, as it seems like she has post partum depression. I have been dealing with that since the birth of my second daughter, which also compounds my work load, mommy guilt, etc. I just feel like Marilyn feels so defeated, but seeing her walk away from the family was horrible. I find it so strange that she can be so in love with James during their "love story", but seems so distant beyond that, why wouldn't she just talk with him? Puzzling, as my husband knows everything. Maybe the time period it just wasn't discussed.

[RachelvlehcaR]

I think she had post partum depression too. I bet she just was nothing but this defeated feeling that she was pregnant with Hannah. It's like TRAPPED again! When will my body be my body!?

With her just not talking to James, I think the whole book is about a lack of communication. Just everyone living under the same house just only spinning in their own corners. If anything this book shows distance between everyone. Very sad book but there is a little glimmer of hope here and there.

[Sophie, The other one]

Day 2 and 3 questions

9. Nathan has decided not to let anyone know about his suspicions about Jack. Has your opinion about Jack or his possible role in Lydia’s disappearance and death changed after Nathan confronted him and/or after he overheard the exchange between Jack and the police?
No, my opinion hasn't changed about Jack.

10. James begins a new kind of relationship with his research assistant, Louisa Chen. What role, if any, do you think his daughter’s death/ funeral play in his moving toward this change? Do your opinions of James (as a dad, husband, character) change as a result of their relationship?
This annoyed me. I'd felt some sympathy for him as feeling like an outsider and that he just wanted to fit in. I wish he and Marilyn had the ability/willingness to talk to each other.

11. In the flashback to 1965 in chapter 4, we see some of the various pressures that Marilyn feels on her life and her decisions. Are there any areas in your own life where you feel competing pressures or expectations that influence your decisions?
Certainly, although a lot of those expectations are now self imposed.

12. When Jack and Nathan are at the pool, Nathan is teased by his peers. Jack remembers his own experiences with teasing. What did you think of the way that Jack handled the situation at the pool? How did Jack’s expectations for Nathan and Nathan's behavior contribute to the situation and how it went? Why doesn’t he tell Marilyn what happened?
More sympathy and empathy would have been good - maybe talking to Nath about it and talking about his childhood so he doesn't feel so alone. I'm not sure how bothered Marilyn would have been.

13. In the summer of 1965, Marilyn leaves her family for a period of time. What did you think of that decision and how she did it? Did it change your thoughts about her as a mother, a wife, a character?
I wasn't too surprised - she's been striking me as pretty selfish throughout.

14. Marilyn finds her mother’s old cookbook with advice about being a good housewife. What do you think they’d each say about being stay-at-home mothers? Do you think one is happier or more satisfied?
I think it's a bit of a case of the grass is greener in a different situation. I don't think either of them are happy with their lives for different reasons.

15. Already, the novel says a lot about how people are influenced by their parents. How did your parents influence your childhood and teenage years? Do you think they understood their influence (and the limits of their influence) on you?
My parents have generally been a good influence. I think my mum was very aware of her influence, but my dad has largely been oblivious.

16. What do you think of the author’s use of flashbacks in this novel? Do you like this strategy? Does it work well here?
I really like flashbacks, and I believe they work well. I don't think the story would work well told in chronological order.

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
I suspect so. I'm not sure how much she'll be able to find out.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?
Their different reactions underline how little they both really know about their daughter, but I don't think they are suspects. I think James subconsciously has a very good idea what Lydia's life was like, but doesn't want to admit it to himself.

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
I think Lydia smokes. I don't think they are there as attention seeking devices.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?
I took the parents fight to be a verbal disagreement, which would happen at any time. The slapping Nath I think was a stress reaction. I don't think James has any coping mechanisms at all to deal with stress.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?
I'm a doctor and am often asked if I'm the nurse or the physio and can I please get the real doctor. It's more often the older patients who do this and I've had to work hard at staying calm and not showing my frustration when it happens. Unfortunately patients are still likely to be racist towards doctors and refuse to be treated by some members of staff.

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?
I feel really sorry for Hannah throughout this - she seems to be overlooked and unwanted. She and Nath both seem to be ignored as they've been inconvenient to Marilyn's plans for her life.

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
I can see the relief that you don't have to deal with the pressure that is put on you anymore. I'm glad that it bought her and Nath closer together. I think she could see how things were going to go and how unhappy she would turn up. I would have liked her to be less passive in her life.

[Stacie]

Kelsey wrote: "RachelvlehcaR wrote: "Kelsey wrote: "I think that since having children I certainly understand the difficulty of holding a career that you are able to give everything you can to when you have paren..."

I'm not sure they talked about it much back then. I think it's only recently that PPD (post-partum depression) has been a subject of discussion and even now, a lot of people dismiss it or belittle it which makes me sad.

[Kelsey]

Discussion Questions Chapters 5-6

18. Hannah has made a promise that she will find out what happened to Lydia. Do you think she feels guilty for not speaking up about what she saw the night Lydia disappeared?
When there is a death, especially one that is unexplained or unexpected, everyone has a different way of dealing with their grief. I am sure that they all feel some blame or wonder as to whether someone could have done more.

19. In Chapter 5 when the police stop to update the Lees, James seems embarrassed when Officer Fiske mentions Lydia's lack of friends, and Marilyn just talks about Lydia's school work and intelligence. Do you think this foreshadows something, or is this just fitting in with the theme of the book? Do you think the police are looking into Lydia's parents as suspects? Does their suspicion have merit?
I think they are trying to find out whether she could have attempted suicide, especially with lack of friends. I think that James wasn't embarrassed, but he was concerned that the police may think that she took her own life if he knew that she had no friendships. Marilyn doesn't realize at this point at least, that Lydia was just trying to please her mother so that she would stay at home and not that she truly enjoyed what she was doing.

20. Marilyn finds Lydia's hidden contraband. Do you think Lydia was really using these items, or were they placed there to gain attention?
I think that she could have very well smoked and had sex. It would seem silly to carry them around just to create a stir, especially since they had no reason to suspect that she would do that, so why would they search her backpack.

21. There seems to be some familial violence like Hannah being under the table when her parents are fighting and James slapping Nath when he asks about astronauts. Do you think this has always been this way, or only during stressful times like Lydia's death and Marilyn leaving? Do you think the violence plays a part in Lydia's death?
I find the whole dynamic between the father and Nath to be interesting. I don't know why he doesn't want him to pursue his dreams of being an astronaut. They seem very controlling and whether or not the violence was only during stressful times, talking to the kids like that is emotional abuse as well.

22. Even Marilyn, who was studying to be a doctor thinks of a "man" when she hears the word doctor? I work in the ER as a nurse. The male nurses are still mistaken for doctors and our female doctors are mistaken for nurses. Is anyone else guilty of thinking this way?
I think that this happens more with male nurses than female doctors.

23. Marilyn finds out she's pregnant with Hannah so she gives up on her schooling again. Do you think Marilyn resents Hannah because of this? Do you think this is why Hannah seems to be ignored by the rest of the family?
I think that if she had so much resentment she could have ended the pregnancy. She obviously values her children and her marriage. I find it so frustrating that this book is like you either have a family or a career, sometimes you can have both.

24. During the scene where Nath pushes Lydia into the lake she seems to accept death and let herself drown. What do you think of this scene? Was she unhappy back at this point in her life?
I think that she is unhappy since her mother left and perhaps even earlier. She has conditioned herself to take a lot of the blame for what happens in the household.

[Sophie, The other one]

Discussion Questions
Dec 15 Chapters 7-8 Pages 158-216

25. Nath and Lydia seem to be very close up until a bit before her death. How much of the fact that Nath was going off to college do you think impacted what happened to Lydia?
I think it's sad that she pinned so much of her happiness on him. I can understand that she felt hurt that he was going, but I don't think it's his fault in any way.

26. I've often joked when our eldest does something ridiculous that "Oh well, this one's ruined, we'll try again with the next." However, the Lee's seem to have actually taken that to heart. Why do you think it was Lydia that they focused on?
I think it was the fact that Marilyn could see herself in Lydia, if she hadn't got pregnant. On the other hand James seems quite fixed on Nath and that he embodies all his disappointments.

27. Do you think Lydia mentioned she was failing at physics just to put attention back on herself? Does she hate and crave the attention?
Wow this was an attention grab! This chunk of the book crystalised how dysfunctional the relationships in this family were.

28. The affair has been found out! Or at least very strongly confirmed. What do you think the fallout will be?
I don't think there'll be as much fall out as I'd like. I'd love Marilyn and James to actually talk to each other!

29. Thoughts on Jack? Thoughts on what really happened?
Bless him.