2015 - December - Theme Read - The Ardennes Offensive 1944

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Reading my current book on the Ardennes I am constantly reminded that I need to read a book in my library that covers in detail the fighting around Rocherath-Krinkelt and Wirtzfeld, and the significance that this fighting had on the course of the German offensive. The book was written by William Cavanagh and titled Battle East of Elsenborn.


Battle East of Elsenborn by William Cavanagh

[Manray9]

Dimitri wrote: ""I thought it interesting that Lt. Colonel McKinley was the great-nephew of William McKinley, but then he wasn't the only relative of a U.S. President to serve in WWII."
Popular accounts often incl..."

Gerald Ford served aboard the light carrier USS MONTEREY (CVL-26) in the Pacific.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I got a smile out of this account from my book:

"When the Ardennes offensive started, several British officers at 21st Army group were teased by Belgian friends, who said that their Resistance groups were making preparations to hide them. When they replied that that would not be necessary as everything was well in hand, they received the answer: 'That is precisely what you said in 1940, and you left us the next day'."

[Dj]

Betsy wrote: "Was that John? Didn't he graduate from West Point on D-Day? I thought I read that somewhere."

That seems about right.

[Manray9]

From Peter Caddick-Adams' --

Snow and Steel: The Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45

Generals Westphal and Krebs were called to the Wolfsschanze in East Prussia to represent their bosses, Rundstedt and Model, at the briefing by Hitler and Jodl presenting the plan for the Ardennes offensive:

'We knew we could only succeed if we were able to cross the River Meuse within two days,' Westphal later observed. He left unsaid 'before the Americans reacted.'
Two days was a tall order indeed, given that in the brilliant conditions of May 1940 it had taken Rommel three days to achieve the same results.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

From Beevor's book; Ardennes 1944:

"Leutnant wrote to his wife. ‘It looks as if the Americans cannot withstand our important push. Today we overtook a fleeing column and finished it . . . It was a glorious bloodbath, vengeance for our destroyed Homeland. Our soldiers still have the same old zip. Always advancing and smashing everything. The snow must turn red with American blood. Victory was never as close as it is now. The decision will soon be reached. We will throw them into the ocean, the arrogant big-mouthed apes from the New World. They will not get into our Germany. We will protect our wives and children from all enemy domination. If we are to preserve all tender and beautiful aspects of our lives, we cannot be too brutal in the deciding moments of this struggle.’ Goebbels noted that, following the announcement of the offensive, the entire Christmas ration of schnapps was consumed in Berlin. But sceptical Berliners, on the other hand, were less impressed. With characteristic gallows humour, they joked about the approach of a very unfestive Christmas: ‘ Be practical, give a coffin.’ Their thoughts focused more on the threat from the east, and many privately prayed that the Americans would break through and reach the capital before the Red Army."

by Antony Beevor

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Another account from my book, in regards to US forces retreating across the River Salm on the 23rd December:

"A survivor from one infantry company, who managed to escape with the 17th Tank Battalion, recounted how after several running firefights they finally reached the lines of the 82nd Airborne. A paratrooper digging a foxhole put down his shovel and said: 'What the hell are you guys running from? We been here two days and ain't seen a German yet.' The exhausted infantryman retorted: 'Stay right where you are, buddy. In a little while you won't even have to look for 'em'."

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Many of you would have read about General Patton ordering his Chaplain, Father O'Neill, to come up with a prayer for good weather during the Battle of the Bulge. Here is that prayer:

Almighty and most merciful Father, we humbly beseech Thee, of Thy great goodness, to restrain these immoderate rains with which we have had to contend. Grant us fair weather for Battle. Graciously hearken to us as soldiers who call upon Thee that, armed with Thy power, we may advance from victory to victory and crush the oppression and wickedness of our enemies, and establish Thy justice among men and nations. Amen.

Here is a link with some great information on Father O'Neill:

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions...

[Manray9]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Many of you would have read about General Patton ordering his Chaplain, Father O'Neill, to come up with a prayer for good weather during the Battle of the Bulge. Here is that prayer:

Almighty and ..."

Grant us good weather so we may smite our enemies. Kind of Old Testament isn't it?

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I think Patton preferred the Old Testament didn't he? :)

I read that Father O'Neill was awarded the Bronze Star for his efforts!

[Dimitri]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "I think Patton preferred the Old Testament didn't he? :)

I read that Father O'Neill was awarded the Bronze Star for his efforts!"

He did so rightly, the New Testament doesn't have much belligerence on offer, alltough whipping bankers out of a church belongs to the possibilities of WWJD :p

[Manray9]

Dimitri wrote: "'Aussie Rick' wrote: "I think Patton preferred the Old Testament didn't he? :)

I read that Father O'Neill was awarded the Bronze Star for his efforts!"

He did so rightly, the New Testament doesn'..."

Dimitri: As an ex-banker let me say I've known quite a few who needed to whipped out of church. :-)

[happy]

Dj wrote: "Betsy wrote: "Dimitri wrote: ""I thought it interesting that Lt. Colonel McKinley was the great-nephew of William McKinley, but then he wasn't the only relative of a U.S. President to serve in WWII..."

IIRC all of FDR's sons served - one of them (James?) was a Marine Raider and I think was on the Makin Raid, but I might be misremembering that part. Plus all of TR son's served in one capacity or another

[Manray9]

happy wrote: "Dj wrote: "Betsy wrote: "Dimitri wrote: ""I thought it interesting that Lt. Colonel McKinley was the great-nephew of William McKinley, but then he wasn't the only relative of a U.S. President to se..."

James was Evans Carlson's XO in the USMC 2nd Raider Batt.

[Adrian]

This is a passage from the book I am reading at the moment on The Ardennes offensive;

“These divisions and heavy weapons might or might not suffice for the task at hand, but the total represented the best that the Wehrmacht could do. Of the armored complement on the Western Front-2,567 tanks and assault guns-Army Group B and OKW reserve had been given 2,168. About a third of this latter total would have to be left for the time being with the Fifteenth Army to shore up the right-wing defenses in the Roer sector. Some four hundred tanks and assault guns were all that remained to German divisions on the rest of the long Western Front.”

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

From Antony Beevor's book; Ardennes 1944:

"With priority on artillery ammunition in the airdrops, the food situation for troops barely improved. Many depended on the generosity of Belgian families sharing what they had. Both in Bastogne and on the northern shoulder, ‘rations were frequently supplemented with beef, venison and rabbit when these animals set off the mines by running into the trip-wires’. Snipers shot hare and even boar, but the longing for wild pork was greatly reduced after hogs had been sighted eating the intestines of battle casualties."

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Some interesting information provided by Antony Beevor in his Ardennes book:

"Lessons learned in one sector were rapidly passed to other formations through 'combat observer' reports. German patrols would cut cables at night and run one of the severed ends into an ambush position, so that they could seize any linesman sent out to repair it. German soldiers sometimes fired a bullet through their own helmet in advance, so that if they were overrun they could play dead and then shoot one of their attackers in the back. They often mined or booby-trapped their own trenches just before withdrawing."

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I found this story interesting as well:

" ... The closest his panzergrenadiers came to Marche was the treeline north-west of Champlon-Famenne overlooking the town, where they were constantly bombarded by American artillery. To this day the local landowner cannot sell timber from the forest because of the shards of metal buried deep in the massive conifers."

[Betsy]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "From Antony Beevor's book; Ardennes 1944:

"With priority on artillery ammunition in the airdrops, the food situation for troops barely improved. Many depended on the generosity of Belgian families..."


It does sound unappetizing, but I'm sure the POWs of the Philippines, the Germans at Stalingrad, and the prisoners of the concentration camps (despite religious concerns) would have consumed it willingly.

[Manray9]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "From Antony Beevor's book; Ardennes 1944:

"With priority on artillery ammunition in the airdrops, the food situation for troops barely improved. Many depended on the generosity of Belgian families..."

Yum!

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Here is another interesting account from Beevor's book on the Ardennes:

"Major von Cochenhausen, with some 600 of his men, managed to escape on foot across country after splitting up. Many were only too willing to give up. Around Celles, hidden Germans begged locals to find the Americans and tell them that they were ready to surrender. They were worried that if they appeared suddenly, even with their hands up, they might be shot. Some were afraid that, because they wore so many items of American uniform, they might be mistaken for members of the Skorzeny Kampfgruppe. In a few cases as a sign of goodwill they handed over their pistol to a Belgian civilian, who would then hand it over to the American soldiers. The locals did not realize until it was too late that they could have made a lot of money selling them instead. ‘The Americans were mad to get their hands on one,’ a farmer said. Many civilians were also afraid of holding on to items of German equipment in case the enemy returned yet again and found them in their houses."

[Dimitri]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Here is another interesting account from Beevor's book on the Ardennes:

"Major von Cochenhausen, with some 600 of his men, managed to escape on foot across country after splitting up. Many were on..."

That's why my operational sense for the Bulge doesn't improve much with Beevor: the bits stick way better :)

[Manray9]

From Peter Caddick-Adams' -- Snow and Steel: The Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45

I may have mentioned this previously, if so please forgive the repetition. Caddick-Adams presents the recollections of Capt. Charles P. Roland (XO, 3rd Battalion, 394th Infantry, 99th Division, U.S. Army). Roland went on to a distinguished career as a historian at Tulane and the University of Kentucky. He's still kicking at the ripe old age of 97. Roland has written several books on the American Civil War, including the definitive bio of Albert Sidney Johnston --

Albert Sidney Johnston: Soldier of Three Republics

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Manray9 wrote: "From Peter Caddick-Adams' -- Snow and Steel: The Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45

I may have mentioned this previously, if so plea..."

I didn't know that and you have just mentioned a book that I will have to have a closer look at, thank you MR9 :)

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Reading my book on the Ardennes has got me watching the series Band of Brothers again. I never get tired or bored watching this series, even my wife likes it!

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Just read about the actions of Sergeant Isadore Jachman who was awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor for his actions in the Ardennes.

Medal of Honor Citation:

For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity above and beyond the call of duty at Flamierge, Belgium, on 4 January 1945, when his company was pinned down by enemy artillery, mortar, and small arms fire, 2 hostile tanks attacked the unit, inflicting heavy. casualties. S/Sgt. Jachman, seeing the desperate plight of his comrades, left his place of cover and with total disregard for his own safety dashed across open ground through a hail of fire and seizing a bazooka from a fallen comrade advanced on the tanks, which concentrated their fire on him. Firing the weapon alone, he damaged one and forced both to retire. S/Sgt. Jachman's heroic action, in which he suffered fatal wounds, disrupted the entire enemy attack, reflecting the highest credit upon himself and the parachute infantry.

For more details:

http://theirfinesthour.net/2015/01/ja...

https://army.togetherweserved.com/arm...

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Here is a poem written by General Patton after RAF Bomber Command bombed and flattened Houffalize since it was a major crossroads for the retreating Germans:

Oh little town of Houffalize
How still we see thee lie:
Above thy steep and battered streets
The aeroplanes sail by.
Yet in thy dark streets shineth
Not any goddamned light
The hopes and fears of all thy years,
Were blown to hell last night.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

Another grisly account from the final fighting in the Bulge:

" ... German jackboots were known to be more weather-resistant. The commanding officer of the 1st Gordons in the 51st Highland Division came across one of his sergeants in a wood, where he had strung up the corpse of a German soldier from a branch and had lit a fire under him. 'He was trying to thaw him out,' he wrote, 'in order to take off his boots'."

[Manray9]

from Peter Caddick-Adams' -- Snow and Steel: The Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45

Here's something that made me raise an eyebrow. On the subject of the 2nd Panzer Division, Caddick-Adams wrote:

Raised in Austria by its first commander, Heinz Guderian, in 1935, and known as the Wiener (Vienna) Division, it had fought in Poland, France and the Balkans.

Guderian raised an outfit in Austria before the Anschluss? I think Caddick-Adams is mistaken. Anyone know differently?

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

He has his chronology a bit wrong, it was in fact created in 1935 and later based in Austria:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2nd_P...

[Manray9]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "He has his chronology a bit wrong, it was in fact created in 1935 and later based in Austria:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2nd_P..."

I suspected so.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

How are you enjoying the book besides that little error?

[Manray9]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "How are you enjoying the book besides that little error?"

Very much. Detailed, well-researched, and readable.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I'm glad you are enjoying it, I rate it as one of the best military books that I read in 2014.

[Manray9]

Peter Caddick-Adams' Snow and Steel: The Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45

is quite a thorough and detailed account of the Ardennes offensive of '44-'45. A number of facts presented have been new and particularly informative to me. I was unaware of the extent to which the German formations reorganized before the attack were filled with dragooned Luftwaffe and Kriegsmarine personnel. Many of these men received only the most rudimentary infantry training before being thrown into battle. One German regimental commander, Goswin Wahl, was a Luftwaffe aviator who had never commanded troops in battle.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I also found that information interesting as well MR9. Some of the German troops went into combat without ever having fired their weapons or learning the basics on weapon maintenance.

[happy]

That's one thing that struck me as well.

[Bevan Lewis]

'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Reading my book on the Ardennes has got me watching the series Band of Brothers again. I never get tired or bored watching this series, even my wife likes it!"

Yes I was planning on cracking open Episode 6. I haven't watched it for years but a great series.

[Manray9]

Bevan wrote: "'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Reading my book on the Ardennes has got me watching the series Band of Brothers again. I never get tired or bored watching this series, even my wife likes it!"

Yes I was plan..."

I seen it several times too. Still good with each viewing.

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I've been watching two episodes a night, just finished the one on Bastogne, should be the fighting around Foy tonight. I hope "Masters of the Air" will be just as good if not better!

http://reelbrief.com/hbos-masters-of-...

[Dimitri]

currently reading Nuts!: A 101st Airborne Division Machine Gunner at Bastogne. P.44 : He just obtained an MG from a retreating unit, so we've reached the Bulge theme. Just in time before I'm off to Bastogne to drink an Airborne beer with the man.

[Manray9]

From: Snow and Steel: The Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45 by Peter Caddick-Adams

Caddick-Adams has presented several pieces of info new to me and rather interesting and illuminating.
1. I knew the German army was heavily dependent on horses, but not that it used 50,000 in the Ardennes offensive. Think of how much fodder would be required to maintain 50,000 horses in the field.
2. Most German soldiers didn't know how to drive motor vehicles. Based on 1935 figures, only 1.60% of Germans owned automobiles. 20.5% of Americans did. According to Caddick-Adams, the Wehrmacht awarded a driver's certificate to those "who could sit behind a steering wheel with proficiency."
3. During the Ardennes attack, the Wehrmacht used thousands of horse-drawn artillery pieces retired after WW I.
4. In 1944, German outfits didn't have radio comms below company level -- and even those were bulky, difficult-to-handle units.
5. In the UK, German POWs "who undertook farm labouring, construction work or cleared bomb damage were actually paid at current union rates, of between three and six shillings for a forty-eight hour week."

[Deborah]

What interesting facts!!

[Manray9]

The NY Times Sunday Book section includes a review by Eliot Cohen of --

Ardennes 1944: Hitler's Last Gamble by Antony Beevor

According to Cohen:

What makes “Ardennes 1944” so effective, however, is not just the vividness of the prose, the clarity of the author’s presentation of tactical events or his skill at evoking through description and careful quotation the look and even the smell of the battlefield. Beevor also does a brilliant job of weaving together the grand operational and the tactical narratives, showing how the decisions of generals do, or do not, shape circumstances on the ground.

The review:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/13/boo...

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

That's a great review, thanks for sharing the link MR9, much appreciated.

[Adrian]

Just got my new book today; Ardennes 1944 by Antony BeevorArdennes 1944: Hitler's Last Gamble,will start reading it after I've read this one; The Ardennes - Battle of the Bulge (World War II from Original Sources)The Ardennes - Battle of the Bulge

['Aussie Rick', Moderator]

I hope you enjoy it Adrian, keep us posted on your thoughts once you get started.

[Robert]

It's a minor story relative to the Battle of the Bulge, but for anyone interested I've posted on Scribd an account of the famous "Patton Prayer" excerpted from Patton's Oracle. The prayer itself often has been distorted. Here's a link:
https://goo.gl/1CKcaL

Patton's Oracle: Gen. Oscar Koch, as I Knew Him

[A.L.]

Here’s an incident from December 18th with a few members of the 28th Division defending Consthum, Luxembourg:

Shortly before dawn, a [German] patrol came through, but instead of passing the command post, it set up a machine gun to the right of and a little behind L Company’s positions. The crew sprayed the house next to the command post with several bursts of machine gun fire, setting it afire with tracers. Fearing that their own house might burn next, Saymon’s group, along with a few others from the company who had taken refuge in the command post when the firing began, slipped out of the house and into the next building which proved to be a combination house and barn with several cows still in the barn. The L Company infantrymen realized that they couldn’t stay there long, as the fire would soon spread to the houses on the street. In addition to driving them out of the house, the fire would light up the entire area and make anyone who ventured into the open an easy target for the German machine gunners.

After some deliberation, they devised a plan of driving the cattle into the street, heading them in the direction of the German machine gun, and firing a few shots over their heads to stampeded them. In the resulting confusion the men of L Company hoped they would be able to escape and rejoin the rest of the 3rd battalion units in other parts of Consthum.

The cattle were quickly herded out into the street and started in the direction of the Germans. While some of the men prodded them in their rumps with bayonets and trench knives, the others fired several shots over their heads. The cattle stampeded in the direction of the German machine gun. The men from L Company (now down to about 15 men) sprinted across the sunken road and headed up the hill to the rear of their former positions, apparently without being detected. Saymon speculated that either the Germans didn’t see them or they were shot at but took no note of it in the hurry to get out of there.

From To Save Bastogne

[Manray9]

A.L. wrote: "Here’s an incident from December 18th with a few members of the 28th Division defending Consthum, Luxembourg:

Shortly before dawn, a [German] patrol came through, but instead of passing the comman..."

STAMPEDE!!! Works every time.