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Medical Industrial Complex (The Underground Knowledge Series, #3)
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MEDICAL INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX > Fluoride - is it safe for consumption?

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message 1: by James, Group Founder (last edited Sep 30, 2015 10:24AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments This pic lists some facts and theories concerning fluoride and how it apparently is detrimental to human's health... https://www.goodreads.com/photo/group...

Tap water usually contains high levels of fluoride. Numerous studies have shown fluoride reduces IQ levels and in some cases even causes brain damage (never a good thing for those wanting to become geniuses!).

In January 2013, physician and author Dr. Joseph Mercola wrote an article for the Huffington Post titled 'Harvard Study Confirms Fluoride Reduces Children's IQ'.

“A recently-published Harvard University meta-analysis funded by the National Institutes of Health (NIH),” the article states, “has concluded that children who live in areas with highly fluoridated water have "significantly lower" IQ scores than those who live in low fluoride areas.”

The Harvard study showed that Flouride causes neurotoxicity which negatively impacts learning and memory.

“There are so many scientific studies showing the direct, toxic effects of flouride on your body,” Dr. Mercola continues in the Huffington Post article, “it’s truly remarkable that it’s NOT considered a scientific consensus by now. Despite the evidence against it, fluoride is still added to 70 percent of U.S. public drinking water supplies.”

Besides fluoride there are a whole host of other contaminants usually found in tap water – such as Chlorine and lead – and none of these will do a human brain any favors.

Be interested to hear what others think about fluoride being in our water supply.


message 2: by P.J. (last edited Oct 01, 2015 09:17AM) (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments Industrial fluoride cannot possibly do us any good because it is inorganic, hence indigestible. We are plant eaters who cannot digest inorganic matter. We cannot digest rocks, sand, plaster, chalk, dolomite, salt, etc., or the minerals in them. We need to get our minerals from organic (plant or animal) sources. Anything we eat or drink that is indigestible is harmful. If industrial fluoride does anything to prevent tooth decay, it would have to be due to its toxicity to bacteria that cause decay. In other words, its anti-biotic properties. Assuming that it is bacteria that cause decay.


message 3: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments “The power to assimilate crude inorganic matter as it is found in the soil, and convert it into living protoplasm and other organic substances, or to use such substances in performing physiological function, does not belong to the animal organism. It is the office of plant life or vegetation to convert the primary elements from their crude inorganic state into the organic state. This conversion cannot be accomplished by any synthetic process known to the laboratory.

After the plant has raised the crude inorganic matter of the soil into plant protoplasm, the animal may take these and raise them to a still higher plane—that of animal protoplasm. But the animal cannot do the work of the plant. He must get his food either directly or indirectly from the plant kingdom. That is, the animal must either eat the plant or its fruits, or he must eat the animal that has eaten the plant. Food must be in the organic form. Air and water form the only exceptions to this rule. ”

--HERBERT M. SHELTON


message 4: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments So even carnivores are still getting plant nutrients, albeit by eating other animals that eat plants?


message 5: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments James Morcan wrote: "So even carnivores are still getting plant nutrients, albeit by eating other animals that eat plants?"

Right. Only plants can convert inorganic matter into organic matter.


message 6: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Okay, great. I often have trouble thinking scientifically, so really appreciate those with the right mindset sharing their knowledge. Such insights concerning health are invaluable!


message 7: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments I recommend the books of Herbert M. Shelton.


message 8: by Dave (new)

Dave Agans (daveagans) | 6 comments As I often tell vegetarians: vegetables are what food eats.


message 9: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments So what does that mean for vegetarians, Dave?


message 10: by Lisa (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lisa Norris | 485 comments that their bellies are not a grave yard for sentient beings ;)


message 11: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Ha!

Don't some think plants are sentient too tho? :)


message 12: by Dave (new)

Dave Agans (daveagans) | 6 comments James Morcan wrote: "So what does that mean for vegetarians, Dave?"
It means they won't convert me.


message 13: by Lisa (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lisa Norris | 485 comments I tried being a vegetarian once...I made it until dinner that same day.


message 14: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments I have been vegetarian, mostly vegan, since 1969. I have no interest in changing.


message 15: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments P.J. wrote: "I have been vegetarian, mostly vegan, since 1969. I have no interest in changing."

Respect.
I don't know much about it, but it seems a lot of people seem to lose weight successfully and keep it off by turning vegan.


message 16: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments It is harder to get fat on a vegan diet. But we are getting off the topic of fluoride.


message 17: by Beem (new)

Beem Weeks (BeemWeeks) | 7 comments Steak, good. Fluoride, bad. Okay, there's my two cents. Now, a quick look at any toothpaste tube (or outer box) and you'll see the warning to call poison control. Aim (for kids) warns: "If more than used for brushing is accidentally swallowed, get medical help or contact a Poison Control Center right away." Now, suppose you drink a lot of water that's been fluoridated? You drink it daily for your entire life. You (presumably) brush your teeth two or three times a day for life. What is it doing to your body?

This is not a natural compound; it is the byproduct of the production of Superphosphate fertilizer (according to Wikipedia, among other sites). It is "rapidly and quite extensively absorbed" by the body.

To answer the initial question, one must research the subject to gain an accurate answer. Trusting others to give us answers often leads us down roads we never intended to travel.


message 18: by Kelly (new)

Kelly Higgins | 77 comments Some fluoride is useful but a lot is damaging. So basically get one of those drink bottles with the filters and drink your water that way, and only have the stuff for oral health (toothpaste, floss and mouthwash (if you do the last two. I know and see a lot of people who don't.). This is easier. Or you can try and find toothpaste etc that doesn't have fluoride and just drink your regular tap water. But I know some people who freak out about this stuff who have really bad teeth.


message 19: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments Kelly wrote: "Some fluoride is useful but a lot is damaging. So basically get one of those drink bottles with the filters and drink your water that way, and only have the stuff for oral health (toothpaste, floss..."

If fluoride is "useful" for oral health, how does it work?


message 20: by Kelly (new)

Kelly Higgins | 77 comments Protection from demineralisation and remineralisation of enamel. However too much can lead to fluorosis which leads to white streaks on teeth, browning of the teeth, bone disease, rupturing or stomach lining, and hyperparathyroidism. Strangely some of the areas where natural water has too much fluoride include ,Southern Asia, Eastern Mediterranean, and Africa (including Turkey, China, Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, India and Thailand).


message 21: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments How can teeth enamel remineralize from inorganic minerals? The body is a living organism that needs organic minerals.


message 22: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Even if fluoride does remineralize teeth, it appears it's very bad for the rest of the body...including the brain!

So surely there has to be an alternative to fluoride for the teeth? Like something that doesn't harm the entire body.


message 23: by P.J. (last edited Oct 10, 2015 09:20PM) (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments According to Tanya Harter Pierce, author of "Outsmart Your Cancer," the original tests done on fluoride used calcium fluoride (CaF2) or dietary fluoride, the type of fluoride found in plants. Being organic, it was found to be beneficial. But the type of fluoride used in fluoridated water supplies is sodium fluoride (NaF) which is highly toxic and carcinogenic. Being industrial waste, this kind of fluoride is inorganic and cannot be beneficial to the body.


message 24: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments P.J. wrote: "But the type of fluoride used in fluoridated water supplies is sodium fluoride (NaF) which is highly toxic and carcinogenic. Being industrial waste, this kind of fluoride is inorganic and cannot be beneficial to the body. ..."

So the fluoride used in toothpaste is also toxic and carcinogenic?


message 25: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments According to Tanya Harter Pierce, "Even Proctor and Gamble, the makers of Crest toothpaste, have admitted that the fluoride in a family-sized tube of Crest toothpaste could, if ingested all at once, be enough to kill a small child!"


message 26: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Why does the United States fluoridate water? -- https://www.goodreads.com/videos/9324...

p.s. The above video mentions that the Japan and most of Europe have banned fluoridation of public water supplies...


message 27: by J.J. (new)

J.J. Mainor | 63 comments James Morcan wrote: "So even carnivores are still getting plant nutrients, albeit by eating other animals that eat plants?"

You know the saying, "you are what you eat." That goes for the animals you eat as well. Think about the slop pigs are fed. Think about the garbage and waste food products they eat and now think about how that goes into your body when you eat pork.


message 28: by Andrew (new)

Andrew (whatmatters) | 14 comments Fluoride is a by-product from aluminum production. Where can we deposit the waste product?


message 29: by Lisa (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lisa Norris | 485 comments is it the job of city water utility to provide medical/dental treatment to its residents?
Should not the resident have the right to choose whether they want fluoride treatment? it's not like the fluoride is preventing a communicable disease..... sounds like a distorted understanding of Freedom of Choice


message 30: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Fluoride Officially Classified as a Neurotoxin in World’s Most Prestigious Medical Journal -- http://wakingscience.com/2016/02/fluo...

Some key excerpts:

"The world’s oldest and most prestigious medical journal, The Lancet, has officially classified fluoride as a neurotoxin — in the same category as arsenic, lead and mercury."

"The report coincides with 2013 findings by a Harvard University meta-analysis funded by the National Institutes of Health that concluded that children in areas with highly fluoridated water have “significantly lower” IQ scores that those who live in areas with low amounts of fluoride in their water supplies."

"Sodium fluoride in drinking water has also been linked to various cancers. It is functionally different than the naturally-occurring calcium fluoride, and commonly added to drinking water supplies and used by dentists who posit that it is useful for dental health."

Read full article here: http://wakingscience.com/2016/02/fluo...


message 31: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Harvard Study Confirms Fluoride Reduces Children's IQ -- http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-merc...


message 32: by Lance, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

Lance Morcan | 1985 comments This topic is now a group poll which asks group members: Do believe fluoride should be in your town's water supply?

Vote and have your say here: https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...


message 33: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Medical Journal Designates Fluoride as Neurotoxin -- http://www.globalhealingcenter.com/na...


message 34: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments 6 Ways To Detox Fluoride – A Known Neurotoxin – From Your Body -- http://www.bodymindsoulspirit.com/det...


message 35: by Kilig (last edited Jul 15, 2016 06:50PM) (new)

Kilig (Kiligs) | 12 comments I grew up with city water. I had a pretty bad case of eczema on my legs up until I moved out. I have well water now and my eczema is gone.

I came to the conclusion that it was triggered by the city water because I went back to visit my mother and the water smelled like chemicals to me. . . I got a bath and the eczema returned that night.

I told my doctor I have well water now and he prescribes me fluoride pills :D


message 36: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Do you take those fluoride pills?


message 37: by Kilig (new)

Kilig (Kiligs) | 12 comments I don't usually take medications unless I absolutely have to. I try to take a more holistic approach to medicine.

I will never take fluoride pills. It just doesn't really sit well with me.


message 38: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Kilig wrote: "I don't usually take medications unless I absolutely have to. I try to take a more holistic approach to medicine."

Ditto


message 40: by Virginia (new)

Virginia Rand P.J. wrote: "How can teeth enamel remineralize from inorganic minerals? The body is a living organism that needs organic minerals."

I just wanted to point out that a mineral is a mineral is a mineral. Each mineral has a specific structure and it's the same regardless of how you make it.

And in chemistry, an inorganic compound generally just means one without carbon. You know, like oxigen doesn't.


message 41: by Virginia (new)

Virginia Rand Kilig wrote: "I grew up with city water. I had a pretty bad case of eczema on my legs up until I moved out. I have well water now and my eczema is gone.

I came to the conclusion that it was triggered by the city water because I went back to visit my mother and the water smelled like chemicals to me. . . I got a bath and the eczema returned that night."


But you can't say it was the water, though. When you went back you were also exposed to all kinds of things that are different in the country. How do you know which one it is?


message 42: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments Most Bottled Water is FILLED With Fluoride: Here’s a Complete List of Brands to Avoid http://www.organicandhealthy.org/2017...


message 43: by Laureen (new)

Laureen (laureenandersonswfcomau) | 478 comments Yes. Everything in moderation though. You wouldn't eat a bucket of salt in a day yet salt is necessary for survival. Same with fluoride.


message 44: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments Virginia wrote: "P.J. wrote: "How can teeth enamel remineralize from inorganic minerals? The body is a living organism that needs organic minerals."

I just wanted to point out that a mineral is a mineral is a mine..."


If what you say were true, you could treat a calcium deficiency by eating sand. There is calcium in sand.


message 45: by Lance, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

Lance Morcan | 1985 comments FORBES: Does Adding Fluoride To Water Have Any Side Effects?
https://www.forbes.com/sites/quora/20...

We are poisoning our waters with fluoride http://www.aspentimes.com/opinion/let...


message 46: by James, Group Founder (new) - rated it 5 stars

James Morcan | 7753 comments This isn't fluoride, but it's more dangerous stuff in water supply...

For 10 years, a chemical not EPA approved was in their drinking water https://edition.cnn.com/2018/11/11/he...
"(CNN)For 10 years, some residents in Denmark, South Carolina, have been suspicious of the rust-colored water coming from their taps. They've been collecting samples in jars and using bottled or spring water, even though the local and state government assured them it was safe."


message 47: by P.J. (last edited Nov 11, 2018 05:23PM) (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments Laureen wrote: "Yes. Everything in moderation though. You wouldn't eat a bucket of salt in a day yet salt is necessary for survival. Same with fluoride."

Salt is not necessary for survival. In fact, it is harmful. Organic sodium and organic chloride are necessary, but neither is available in salt, which is inorganic. Millions of people have lived for many generations without any knowledge of salt. Salt is indigestible and therefore is toxic in any dosage.


message 48: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 534 comments The behaviour of sodium ions and chloride ions is the same irrespective of origin - a consequence of the first law of thermodynamics.


message 49: by P.J. (new)

P.J. Sullivan | 16 comments Ian wrote: "The behaviour of sodium ions and chloride ions is the same irrespective of origin - a consequence of the first law of thermodynamics."

What kind of "behaviour"? Active or passive behavior? Salt is not necessary to balance electrolytes. Dr. Max Gerson put all his patients on strict salt-free diets and gave them potassium supplements. And his patients did very well.


message 50: by Ian (new)

Ian Miller | 534 comments Hmm - I would find a new doctor. Getting the potassium/sodium ratio too high and you trigger a heart attack. For thriller writers, potassium chloride is an excellent poison because it is quite deadly, and if injected, it diffuses alway and is untraceable.

"Behaviour" was used to mean "doing whatever…"


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