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The Bully Pulpit ~ October 2015
Alias Reader wrote: "Alias<<<< Still plugging away reading Bully Pulpit. ;-O"It's a giant book--don't feel bad! :)
I agree. PLUS, my notes are on our desktop computer which i only have at hand when we are in Dallas. I've held off sharing the rest of my notes until our return, probably in February.
Amy wrote: "Alias Reader wrote: "AliasIt's a giant book--don't feel bad! :)"
I like the book but I am not loving it. So it's just not calling me. I don't care for the way the book is structured. I think a chapter on TR and then a chapter on Taft. Would have been enough. Throw a little of the muckraking in each.
As it is, as soon as I get into one person she switches to another all within the same very long chapters. Also too much minutia. She needed an editor big time, IMO.
Still, I am soldering on!
I agree with you, Alias. I though the book had a lot of interesting stuff in it--but almost TOO much stuff. I understood why she included the story of why the muckraker journalists were important to Roosevelt's pushing his agendas, but I thought that the minutiae of the details (i.e the biographies of all the writers and editors) could have been left out. In many places it read as if she realized she didn't have QUITE enough for another whole book on just the journalists, so she shoehorned those notes into the larger book about TR and Taft.
I agree with you both about the construction of the book. She did the same thing with Lincoln's cabinet, too, but it worked better. Are all her books like this? I presumed it was standard with her.
Chapter 11Page 327
The Pulpit, the Press, and the Novel, Norris argued, "these indisputable are the great moulders of public opinion and public morals to day."
This made me think. What novels do you think changed public opinion?
These three came immediately to mind.
The Grapes of Wrath
The Jungle
Uncle Tom's Cabin
page 327This book was said to have "spectacular reviews." "...it justly justifies the author to rank among the very first American novels."
I thought I would post a link and note that the book is still in print. There is also an illustrated edition. It is a free book for the Kindle.
The Octopus: A Story of California---Frank Norris
p334Here is the book by Kathleen Brady, Tarbell's biographer.
Ida Tarbell: Portrait of a Muckraker---Kathleen BradyIn this first definitive biography of Ida Tarbell, Kathleen Brady has written a readable and widely acclaimed book about one of America’s great journalists.
Ida Tarbell’s generation called her “a muckraker” (the term was Theodore Roosevelt’s, and he didn’t intend it as a compliment), but in our time she would have been known as “an investigative reporter,” with the celebrity of Woodward and Bernstein. By any description, Ida Tarbell was one of the most powerful women of her time in the United States: admired, feared, hated. When her History of the Standard Oil Company was published, first in McClure’s Magazine and then as a book (1904), it shook the Rockefeller interests, caused national outrage, and led the Supreme Court to fragment the giant monopoly.
A journalist of extraordinary intelligence, accuracy, and courage, she was also the author of the influential and popular books on Napoleon and Abraham Lincoln, and her hundreds of articles dealt with public figures such as Louis Pateur and Emile Zola, and contemporary issues such as tariff policy and labor. During her long life, she knew Teddy Roosevelt, Jane Addams, Henry James, Samuel McClure, Lincoln Stephens, Herbert Hoover, and many other prominent Americans. She achieved more than almost any woman of her generation, but she was an antisuffragist, believing that the traditional roles of wife and mother were more important than public life. She ultimately defended the business interests she had once attacked.
To this day, her opposition to women’s rights disturbs some feminists. Kathleen Brady writes of her: “[She did not have] the flinty stuff of which the cutting edge of any revolution is made. . . . Yet she was called to achievement in a day when women were called only to exist. Her triumph was that she succeeded. Her tragedy ws that she was never to know it.”
Paperback: 296 pages
Publisher: University of Pittsburgh Press (September 21, 1989)
It's not a novel, but I thought of "Silent Spring" as a book that changed public opinion. And perhaps "Invisible Man" by Ralph Ellison?
Silent Spring.....definitely. Good one. I am not sure about Invisible Man. I've read it but I don't know enough about it's history when it was published.
We have listed books that were not recently published. Do you think the novel or book is not the mover it once was ?
From Bully Pulpit- The Pulpit, the Press, and the Novel,
I think The Pulpit now has little influence. The Press yes. The novel I would say not so much.
Today I would add the internet. Specifically, Facebook and Twitter.
Also cable TV. John Stewart The daily show ( don't know if it still has the same impact without Stewart) cable news shows.
Films? Music ? Newspapers?
What do you think moves the general public?
Hi Alias! I'm currently overwhelmed with Eudora Welty's work, just a few weeks to finish.1.
The Collected Stories by Eudora Welty 2.
Complete Novels: The Robber Bridegroom, Delta Wedding, The Ponder Heart, Losing Battles, The Optimist's Daughter 3. Eudora Welty by Ruth M. Vande Kieft
4. A Still Moment: Essays on the Art of Eudora Welty
Good questions, Alias. I was trying to think of recent novels which may have had impact on the public. There are novels which enlighten the public about specific topics, such as autism, but not with major impact of those listed. (I couldn't get the html book link to work but was thinking of The Incedence of the Dog in the Night, or similar title.)
Silent Spring is a good one still often mentioned, although, as noted, it's not a novel. Maybe film, particularly documentaries, have taken their place?
I don't recall any film that I can say really moved public opinion. Here is the link for the book you mentioned.
The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time
I don't think that book changed thinking on autism.
On that topic maybe Temple Grandin has had some influence.
Carol wrote: "Hi Alias! I'm currently overwhelmed with Eudora Welty's work, just a few weeks to finish.."Sounds like enjoyable work !
Alias, you may be correct about Grandin but i hadn't heard of her until after reading Mark Haddon's book. Which rather leads us back to the question. In today's world news/ideas travel so quickly that trends can be identified in a flash and publishers can offer books on that topic fast. Right around the time i read Curious Incident it seemed a dozen novels, nf and bios were available on the topic, which many folks had never heard mentioned previously. I remembered it from an old episode of "Marcus Welby, MD", believe it or not!When i mentioned documentaries in my last post i was thinking of one about McDonalds, which began as a book, i believe, and one on police wrongly framing suspects, set in Texas, i believe. Vague enough but the internet connection at this motel is "iffy".
Carol, is there a reason you must complete the Welty books on a deadline? I haven't read much by her but liked her depiction of southern life.
Madrano wrote: In today's world news/ideas travel so quickly that trends can be identified in a flash and publishers can offer books on that topic fast..."Deb, maybe I will just sound like an old so and so. However, I wonder if today news/ideas/causes come and go so quickly and we are on to the next. We seldom seem to have time for thoughtful reflection much less action before we are on to the next big thing.
It seems our attention span has lessened. Also our interests have narrowed due to our ability with cable and the internet to stay in one little corner of news/ideas/causes. Often we just get our own ideas reflected back at us.
Okay, Ms. Old Cranky will go have breakfast and some hot tea now. :) It's a cold windy day with temps right now about 25 with a dusting of snow. A good day to maybe read some Bully Pulpit. Though I do have errands to run.
In term of us not being able to think of recent novels that have swayed public opinion, I think it's also perhaps that the book market is flooded. It's not just publishing houses that are producing novels and other works--with the advent of self-publishing, there is now a deluge of stuff through which we must wade. There are more and more books out there that are competing for our attention across multiple genres. And many people seem to stick to the specific genre(s) that they like best without branching out of their comfort zones. I think there is less opportunity now for one specific book to capture the attention of the masses in such a way that it sways public opinion.
"Carol, is there a reason you must complete the Welty books on a deadline?"I was interested in her life and career. In my opinion, she was an interesting woman, who was determined to reach her personal writing goals, that were focused on short stories and novels about the American South. In 1973, she received the Pulitzer Prize for Fiction, The Optimist's Daughter.
She also was the first living author to have her works published by The Library of America. After her death, her house in Jackson, Mississippi has been designated as a National Historic Landmark and is open to the public as a house museum.
The Eudora Welty House, where she lived for 80 years. -- http://www.flickr.com/photos/nataliem...
I've read a few books A Still Moment: Essays on the Art of Eudora Welty, Eudora Welty and currently reading The Collected Stories. Personally, I really liked her depiction of every person's "everyday life": old times, HS boy bringing RX to your home; riding our bikes in the woods; the men listening to the clink of horseshoes while the women giggled and laughed too loud in the humidity. (Memories of our small neighborhood, where everyone knew everyone, house to house, truck filled with kids in the back, neighborhood every kids waiting for Gus to push them HIGH on the tire swing.)
Amy wrote: "In term of us not being able to think of recent novels that have swayed public opinion, I think it's also perhaps that the book market is flooded. It's not just publishing houses that are producing..."After reading your post, I also recalled that many books that moved people were Book Of The Month selections. Again, just like when everyone had maybe a dozen TV channels and watched the same evening news, the Book of the Month, gave people a common knowledge to act upon.
This reminds me of the book
Bowling Alone: The Collapse and Revival of American Community----Robert D. Putnam
Drawing on vast new data that reveal Americans’ changing behavior, Putnam shows how we have become increasingly disconnected from one another and how social structures—whether they be PTA, church, or political parties—have disintegrated. Until the publication of this groundbreaking work, no one had so deftly diagnosed the harm that these broken bonds have wreaked on our physical and civic health, nor had anyone exalted their fundamental power in creating a society that is happy, healthy, and safe.
Like defining works from the past, such as The Lonely Crowd and The Affluent Society, and like the works of C. Wright Mills and Betty Friedan, Putnam’s Bowling Alone has identified a central crisis at the heart of our society and suggests what we can do.
Carol, thanks fo the reply. I was sad when we went to visit her home after it became a museum because they were closed that day. Bummer. My first Eudora Welty book was her nonfictional, One Writer's Beginnings. I liked it very much and moved on to her fiction.
Good points made about the number of books today, as well as how we must move on to the next topic or news item. This is why i stopped watching "60 Minutes" and reading Mother Jones magazine, overloaded by issues. Sad but true. It may also be true that when a cause/event occurs there are many books about it released at once, fast but not necessarily good. Think of the number of post-Katrina books, for instance. Or Watergate.
Chapter 14I was really surprised when I read that TR offered Taft a seat on the Supreme Court twice and he turned it down. I know his wife didn't want him to take it. However, it was a life long dream of his. This really showed his dedication to his Philippine Commission.
Have you watched 'The American Experience?'(CPTV) February 6th at 9pm -- Murder of a President, James Garfield.
James Garfield
* born November 19, 1831 in Orange, Ohio
* 20th President, Republican
* he was an educator before he served the union in the Civil War
* he helped to establish the US Geological Survey and to strengthen the Smithsonian Institute while in Congress
* Vice President: Chester Alan Arthur
* First Lady: Lucretia Rudolph Garfield
* Garfield was shot by a mentally disturbed man. On September 19th, 1881, surgery removed the bullet, but it was the infection on the bullet, that took his life on September 19, 1881.
Alias, i know what you mean. This is one of the traits of Taft one admires. He committed to a project once begun. I suppose it helped that the family was thriving there, too. But to delay a lifelong dream is remarkable. The truth is, however, he really was a man who wanted to make his wife happy. I haven't seen that show, Carol, but reading Candace Millard's book Destiny of the Republic: A Tale of Madness, Medicine and the Murder of a President was informative, as far as how clumsy the doctoring was, despite the fact professionals understood by then something about germs. It's a good book. And i fell in love with Garfield as i read.
You haven't seen the "American Experience" show about Garfield because it isn't on until later this week, Deb. I already have it set to record on my DVR. I too really enjoyed Millard's book about Garfield. It left me with an appreciation of and respect for him as a man and a president. And a sadness for what might have been had the medical professionals of the time understood and followed the need for hygiene and infection control.
Carol wrote: "Have you watched 'The American Experience?'(CPTV) February 6th at 9pm -- Murder of a President, James Garfield.
James Garfield
* born November 19, 1831 in Orange, Ohio
* 20th President, Republica..."
No. I hope my PBS station is showing it. Thanks for the heads-up.
madrano wrote: I haven't seen that show, Carol, but reading Candace Millard's book Destiny of the Republic: A Tale of Madness, Medicine and the Murder of a President was informative, as far as how clumsy the doctoring was, despite the fact professionals understood by then something about germs. It's a good book. And i fell in love with Garfield as i read..."I second that recommendation.
a little more on Garfield . . . On the morning of July 2, 1881, Garfield headed for the Baltimore and Potomac Railroad station on his way to a short vacation. As he walked through the station toward the waiting train, Guiteau stepped behind the president and fired two shots. The first bullet grazed Garfield’s arm; the second lodged below his pancreas. Doctors made several unsuccessful attempts to remove the bullet while Garfield lay in his White House bedroom, awake and in pain. Alexander Graham Bell, who was one of Garfield’s physicians, tried to use an early version of a metal detector to find the second bullet, but failed.
Historical accounts vary as to the exact cause of Garfield’s death. Some believe that his physicians’ treatments—which included the administration of quinine, morphine, brandy and calomel and feeding him through the rectum–may have hastened his demise. Others insist Garfield died from an already advanced case of heart disease.
Guiteau was deemed sane by a jury, convicted of murder and hanged on June 30, 1882. Garfield’s spine, which shows the hole created by the bullet, is kept as a historical artifact by the National Museum of Health and Medicine in Washington, D.C.
video . . .
http://www.history.com/topics/us-pres...
Amy wrote: "You haven't seen the "American Experience" show about Garfield because it isn't on until later this week, Deb. ..."That explains it, Amy! I didn't even notice the date.
Bully Pulpit helped me tonight with the final Jeopardy question. The question was what place did TR say all Americans must visit. None of the Jeopardy contestants got the answer. I did ! The Grand Canyon. I had just read in chapter 12 that TR arrived at the Grand Canyon where a debate was raging over whether to preserve the landmark as a national monument or open it up for mining. Yikes !
"...the president resolved to ensure the designation of the Grand Canyon as a national park. If Roosevelt had done nothing else as president, Douglas Brinkley has observed, his advocacy on behalf of preserving the canon might well have put him in the top ranks of American presidents."
Thank you, President Roosevelt !!!!
Yay, Teddy! And Alias! I love it when I get "Final Jeopardy" and the contestants don't. It makes me feel smart for a brief moment in time!
Well done! I was astounded to learn the idea of mining the GC was even considered. I know folks want to open some of our National Parks to businesses (& do so) but that just sounded over the top. Grateful to TR for that.
Carol wrote: "Have you watched 'The American Experience?'(CPTV) February 6th at 9pm -- Murder of a President, James Garfield.
James Garfield
* born November 19, 1831 in Orange, Ohio
* 20th President, Republica..."
Looking forward to seeing this.
Did you like it? I stayed up to 11 pm to see the entire film.
I was listening to The New York Times Book Review podcast the other day -- it wasn't the newest one; I think it was from December, maybe? Anyway, the host was interviewing David Greenberg, the author of Republic of Spin: An Inside History of the American Presidency, which is about image making, public relations, and media relations as they have been used in politics. (The book went onto my TBR list, by the way!) As part of the interview, Greenberg played a clip of a Teddy Roosevelt speech. Apparently it was one of the very first presidential speeches that was ever recorded. The thing that struck me was how different Teddy sounded than what I expected. He spoke with a stammer, and he had a rather squeaky, high-pitched voice --the author called it a "high falsetto." That's the complete opposite of what I heard inside my head when I imagined him talking! It was fascinating.
Here is a recording of TR. I don't know if this is the first speech.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhlzd...
Chapter 14Oliver Wendell Holmes who was appointed by TR to the Supreme Ct.
I often thought it would be a nice book challenge to read various books on the members of the court. I've only read a few.
Lazy B: Growing Up on a Cattle Ranch in the American Southwest which I didn't care for.
My Beloved World Which I enjoyed a lot.
I do have Notorious RBG: The Life and Times of Ruth Bader Ginsburg on my TBR list.
I also own a few others but can't think of the titles at the moment.
Anyway, I had to lol when TR said of Holmes and his dissent in the Northern Securities case, "I could carve out of a banana a judge with more backbone than that."
I've read "The Nine: Inside the Secret World of the Supreme Court" by Jeffrey Toobin, which was very good. I gave it 4 stars. Another good one is "The Brethren: Inside the Supreme Court" by Bob Woodward.
Chapter 15p 414
I had to smile when TR exclaimed, "Fiddle-dee-dee !" I've only heard Scarlet say that in Gone With the Wind. :)
It's interesting that in this chapter they talked about corporations and campaign contributions. I guess some things never change and IMO it's worse now.
I would rather we do it like some European countries and have the presidential campaigns funded by the govt. A friend of mine suggested just the other day that all contributions go into a general fund and be evenly distributed. I like that idea, too.
Chapter 16p425
The Industrial Revolution, Roosevelt maintained, had generated both marvelous material well being and the care and anxiety inseparable from the accumulation of great wealth...
This also brought a smile to my face. I recall in high school I used to say if I didn't know the answer to a essay question on a test I always said the cause was the Industrial Revolution. :)
I was surprised that right after TR won his second term he went on a two month vacation. That with his Secretary of State also on a "long cruise" to recover his health. So Taft was left in charge as President, Sec. of State, and Sec. of War !
Can you even imagine such a thing like that happening today? And we have instant communication today.
Amy, you have me curious as to the clip you heard. The link Alias shared sounded about as i expected him to sound. I suppose i expected a deeper voice. Alias, i wonder if campaigns would get the same amount of contributions if it was to be shared by all. To me it doesn't matter, i'd be glad if there was less money and, one presumes, fewer ads, etc.
madrano wrote: Alias, i wonder if campaigns would get the same amount of contributions if it was to be shared by all. To me it doesn't matter, i'd be glad if there was less money and, one presumes, fewer ads, etc. ..."I would like it for a few reasons. It would eliminate a lot of the influence big donations now have on the politician.
I also think the pool of people running would widen dramatically if they didn't need to raise billions to run.
I think I read that in Europe they limit the campaign season. So one can't run ads before the set time. Six months come to mind but I can be totally wrong about this.
I've heard that about the UK but don't know the specifics. A limited number of months or weeks would suit me fine. Who isn't already tired of hearing about the candidates, the race, the polls? And i rather like politics!About funding, i agree that the pool would be wider but it seems there would have to be some qualifying. Already a number of odd folks (about whom we seldom hear) run for President officially. Eliminating the influence major contributors have would be a joy. I wonder if the Washington D.C. economy would shrink as a result?
Chapter 20Reading about the "Roosevelt Panic". I believe TR when he said Wall St. circulated the tract "to destroy his program of reform."
Up to chapter 21I can't help but feel that Taft's heart was to have a seat on the Supreme Ct. He only pursued the presidency due to his wife.
I sort of felt bad for Taft. Though I think he should have just stood up to his wife and said his joy was the law and being on the Supreme Court is what would make him happy.
Don't faint !!! I finally finished this book. I'm really sorry it took me months. I am not really sure why it took me so long. I guess the book just did not call to me. I had little interest in reading hundreds of pages about tariffs. I also wasn't that interested in the muckrakers angle.
As I noted above. I think the book need to be edited way down. I would have cut out the journalist stories. They could be mentioned briefly but not in the detail that she did. I also prefer more personal stories. I would have liked to read more about things like Nellie after her stroke, the Titanic and Major Butt. For me, DKG just got lost in too much minutia. It was overwhelming.
Because of all this I gave the book a final 3/5 rating. I admire the work that went into the book. However, after reading close to 800 pages I don't really feel like I know TR or Taft as human beings.
I'll comment further on the last chapters and any thoughts that I had.
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:)
Alias<<<< Still plugging away reading Bully Pulpit. ;-O