Time Travel discussion
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So You Created a Wormhole
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SO YOU CREATED A WORMHOLE: THE TIME TRAVELER'S GUIDE TO TIME TRAVEL
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I am near the end of the book and am in the survival guide for 1940-2050.
What is your take on computers and specifically smart phones? Helpful, hurtful, waste of time? All of the above?
Also, who would you go back and assassinate?
Nathan wrote: "I think it was probably designed to be read in short bursts like the Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbooks. The kind of thing you have on your coffee table or the back of your toilet for brief mom..."That makes sense, Nathan. I think you're right. I'm spoiling it by trying to read it cover to cover. Unfortunately, the library wants it back so ... ;-)
Lincoln wrote: "Discussion Question:I am near the end of the book and am in the survival guide for 1940-2050.
What is your take on computers and specifically smart phones? Helpful, hurtful, waste of time? All..."
Helpful!
mmmmm Hitler!
MK wrote: "Lincoln wrote: "Discussion Question:I am near the end of the book and am in the survival guide for 1940-2050.
What is your take on computers and specifically smart phones? Helpful, hurtful, was..."
Computers and Hitler. An often-forgotten fact is that IBM's German subsidiary made the Final Solution possible for Hitler: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dehomag
Hitler's blitzkrieg tactics were made possible by use of FM radio sets. So the question is... would a smart phone have made things easier for Hitler, or would the free flow of information made it impossible (Arab Spring) for him to snatch power in the first place? Or would the availability of music at the touch of a button mellowed the evil bastard out? And if you assassinated Hitler, would Stalin have marched into a weakened Europe and murdered even more than the 30 million people whose lives he was responsible for ending?
Mika wrote: "Lincoln wrote: "Also, who would you go back and assassinate? "Hitler is always the first answer for these, but I think his effects on history are too well established. Someone more contemporary w..."
ROFL! What about Putin? But then Putin's nasty reign was only made possible by the amiable drunkard Yeltsin. I believe that - to a certain extent - history will throw certain kinds of people to the fore. If it hadn't been Putin it would have been another 'strong' Soviet-style leader, because that's what the Russians have always responded to.
But you're right Lincoln - someone more contemporary. But then that's only the present, and not time travel. Plus you're more likely to get caught and jailed!
Mark wrote: "would a smart phone have made things easier for Hitler, or would the free flow of information made it impossible (Arab Spring) for him to snatch power in the first place? Or would the availability of music at the touch of a button mellowed the evil bastard out? And if you assassinated Hitler, would Stalin have marched into a weakened Europe and murdered even more than the 30 million people whose lives he was responsible for ending? "A smart phone might have made things easier for Hitler, but so too would it have been made easier for his opposition. Terror thrives in rumor and unknown and fear. Communication, information, organization by his opposition might have been formidable to go against.
And Stalin might have faced the west organized against him, rather than allied with him, had not the west allied with him against the horror of Hitler.
Mika wrote: "Lincoln wrote: "Also, who would you go back and assassinate? "Hitler is always the first answer for these, but I think his effects on history are too well established. Someone more contemporary w..."
His effects on history are exactly what I would seek to change .... were he assassinated, they would *not* be established at all. Too well, or otherwise.
edit - also, I think the reason that Hitler is always the first answer to questions like these are self-evident, and valid ;-)
Mika wrote: "MK wrote: "Mark, I'm relieved to know it isn't just me :D.Lincoln, I'm still plugging away at it :)"
It does slow down after the initial funnies."
I'm up to chapter 6 or so. It's evened out, or maybe I've made my peace with the juvenalia ;-). Either way, I'm still plugging through it :D
MK wrote: "Mika wrote: "MK wrote: "Mark, I'm relieved to know it isn't just me :D.Lincoln, I'm still plugging away at it :)"
It does slow down after the initial funnies."
I'm up to chapter 6 or so. It's ev..."
Hi MK, keep plugging away. I'm a completer-finisher too! :-)
Mark wrote: "Hi MK, keep plugging away. I'm a completer-finisher too! :-) "heh ... :)
I've cracked the second part - the "Surviving in Time" sections. Prehistory, and Dinosaur age. The key to finishing is to deploy my skimming and scanning skilz :D
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I've not thought of that angle before, but you're right. If Hitler were out of the picture and we'd not allied with Russia against him, we'd probably have fought Russia instead ... and most likely lost. The whole world might have gone red. Those time travelers who thought offing Hitler would solve the world's problems would then have to face a possibly larger problem. Millions more would have certainly died.
Add a smart phone, the internet, etc. into the mix of World War II and I'm not sure much would have changed. While the internet can be a vehicle for spreading enlightenment and truth, it can also be an effective tool for spreading propaganda, rumors, and lies. The existence of Snopes certainly is evidence of that. Hitler and Stalin would certainly have instigated blocks for certain sites, banned media groups from reporting in their countries, etc. The difference would be that we'd be all viewing war in clips on YouTube, making it that much more real than black and white photos.
Amy wrote: "Mark wrote: "And if you assassinated Hitler, would Stalin have marched into a weakened Europe and murdered even more than the 30 million people whose lives he was responsible for ending? "I've no..."
The problem is that history 'grows' certain kinds of people out of certain situations. No punitive humiliating Treaty of Versailles would have meant no German hyperinflation and no Hitler. Yes: we can blame the French for him! :-)
No Hitler would also have meant that Churchill would have died an obscure and eccentric figure, forgotten to history. There would have been no European Union (for better or worse), and maybe a continuation of the thousands of years of petty squabbles on the Continent. The US might have been threatened on her Western seaboard by a powerful Japan that had conquered China. Maybe Japan and Russia would have restarted the war they waged at the turn of the century (which Russia lost)? Would a powerful Russia have asked for Alaska back? Would Palin have been the new Putin?! LMAO!
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You're making my head spin. It's amazing how many huge changes hinged on one event or another going exactly a certain way. Funny. I was browsing the biographies a couple of days ago and ran across some Churchill biographies and noted how ridiculously thick all of them were. I wonder who would have gotten that thick biography sans Hitler.
A Palin vs. Putin political campaign would be top-notch insane. Where's the popcorn?
So are these alternate histories figuring into your writings, Mark? Because if they are, I'm jumping on them.
Amy wrote: "Mark wrote: "Amy wrote: "Mark wrote: "And if you assassinated Hitler, would Stalin have marched into a weakened Europe and murdered even more than the 30 million people whose lives he was responsib..."Hi Amy, I think you gave Doctor How and the Rings of Uranus to your husband for his birthday. Doctor How and the Kennedy Assassination Conspiracy has some what-ifs, and I think you'd like it. The full novel Doctor How and the Illegal Aliens is mainly full-on comedy-thriller. (Blatant plugs not intentional, but you did ask...!) The rest of the series will become a little more focused on what-ifs.
Did you ever read The Eyre Affair, which is the first of the Jasper Fforde's Thursday next series? He deals a lot with alternatives, and in a literary way. I read the first after being introduced by a colleague, but he says the rest aren't quite as good. Fforde has a big cult following over here, but his novels are maybe a bit UK-centric and I wonder what a US reader would make of them. His dystopian future novel Shades of Grey is stunning.
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That title must always be a pun whether intended or not.
I've not read any of the books you've mentioned. With the Eyre Affair, I thought I should probably read Jane Eyre first, but I found myself too annoyed with everyone's abuse of Jane to continue. Does it stand alone without having read Jane Eyre?
Amy misunderstands literary jargon when saying 'a pun whether intended or not'Amy, that's the purpose of a pun; it's true either way.
They're much put upon but great to use & the greatest use them & always have, a la Groucho.
To put it another way: A broken pencil is pointless.
Amy wrote: "Mark wrote: "Hi Amy, I think you gave Doctor How and the Rings of Uranus to your husband for his birthday. Doctor How and the Kennedy Assassination Conspiracy has some what-ifs, and I think you'd l..."Yes, it was a little frustrating that I'd not read Jane Eyre beforehand. I should have read a summary on Wikipedia. Nevertheless, a good read - and there are other bits of history that are not of our timeline. Fforde has legions of middle-aged fans here who go to his (very regular) readings dressed as characters and with fake dodos (the extinct bird).
Mika wrote: "Mark wrote: "But then that's only the present, and not time travel. Plus you're more likely to get caught and jailed! "That depends on *when* you do the assassination. Getting Cameron or George O..."
See previous comments about history squeezing out the right people for the time. We are in an age of beige so far as political leadership goes in this country.
Age of Beige. I love that phrase. I'm working it into a sentence tomorrow at the office.
Okay, just saw Howard post above. Now I have to find a way to work both "Age of Beige" and "A broken pencil is pointless", into a sentence tomorrow.
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I was going to say something but who cares...
Lincoln wrote: "age of beige and A broken pencil is pointless!I was going to say something but who cares..."
I now feel almost compelled to write a diatribe or polemic about the state of politics in the West and call it 'The Age of Beige'.
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Well, let's drop all politicians into a one-way wormhole and have some peace & quiet.
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Ha. That would be a never-ending task.
If you laid all the politicians in the world end to end, they still wouldn't reach a conclusion...
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*rimshot*
Lincoln wrote: "PRE-READING QUESTIONSThis is hilarious. You guys are such an active group it is so fun to read through everyone's answers. I had to butt in with my own opinion here, 'cause, hey, who hasn't dreamed of time travel? Especially in this group?
1.Do you normally read humorous books? Why or why not?
I find humor hard to translate into novels. So often emotion is lacking, sarcasm is hard to hear. The voice has to be especially strong in order to pull it off.
2. Do you believe it's possible to be in humor with 2 people at the same time? Absolutely. Cue the cousin get-together sleepover where we laugh and laugh all night long, the result of cheesy overused jokes.
3. What do you think about "insta-humo..." Laugh at first sight! I love that expression. It has to have substance in order to hold the laugh, but it definitely is possible!
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Time Travel
Books mentioned in this topic
So You Created a Wormhole: The Time Traveler's Guide to Time Travel (other topics)Doctor How and the Rings of Uranus (other topics)
Doctor How and the Kennedy Assassination Conspiracy (other topics)
Doctor How and the Illegal Aliens (other topics)
The Eyre Affair (other topics)
More...
Nathan, very succinct.
Really.