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The Fatal Flame by Lyndsay Faye - questions for the author
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John
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Aug 31, 2015 08:32PM
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Lyndsay - I'm interested in how you create a voice for your narrators. Many authors sound very much the same from book to book, but you have created Tim in a very different voice from Dr. Watson in Dust and Shadows and again different from Lomax in The Gospel of Sheba. Do you think your acting background has aided in the ability to get into the heads of these different characters? And did you find writing a female narrator to be either more or less difficult (you did have Jane narrate, yes?) ?
Hey Karen--yes, I do think it has a lot to do with being an actor. I'm trained to perform in about two dozen different accents and I was always a character actor rather than much of a leading lady type (though I did both). So these quirky voices are very fun for me to invent and they fit into an actual trained skill set that I wouldn't use anymore if not for writing. So that's very fun for me.Regarding JANE STEELE, yes, she narrates. I always find it challenging to find the specific voice of a brand new character, but I don't find one gender any harder than the other. Writing Watson, Lomax, and Tim come very easily to me for some reason. It's a gender reversed reference, but someone once asked George R. R. Martin how he managed to write such strong female characters and he answered (I'm paraphrasing) "Well, that was fairly simple since I've always thought of women as people." It's the same with me. I used to worry about allowing male characters to show "too much" emotion, etc, and then I quite literally re-read the complete works of William Shakespeare and got over it. Those dudes cry their eyes out constantly and no one seems to think he was a hack. :) It was freeing.
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A writer often writes what they know; is there anything you can share about your ability to create such a distressingly marvelous character?
Thank you! Yes, I've heard and loved that quote from GRRM - always seemed so obvious to me! Another question - you do such good research and create a very clear sense of place and time. Do you ever find bits of history that you discover in your research to be totally enticing and then have no place to put them? Has finding an enticing bit of history changed what you were writing?
Also, registration for Bouchercon 2016 and hotel registration has opened up, please, please say you're going!
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1) We've been discussing Tim and Mercy's complex relationship in the book discussion. I was wondering if you had any comments or insights on the characters and their relationship?
2) Do you have a favorite character in your series?
3) I'm looking forward to reading Jane Steele! I think I read on one of your Facebook posts that you were working on a fantasy novel? Can you tell us anything about that?
John wrote: "Based on Tim's evolving testimony it would appear that Valentine Wilde has lived much of his life with a severe existential dichotomy: as the ultimate survivor, doing everything and anything necess..."Oh! Thank you very much. Well, I am still learning about my own brain all the time, and one day when I know more I'll write up a big blog about that. But I grew up in a very conservative environment with a lot of guilt over what I was thinking and/or feeling (not from my lovely parents), and addiction problems run in my family like the bulls in Pamplona. So I did absolutely know where Val was coming from there.
Additionally, and this might be more interesting, I challenged myself to write what seemed like an entirely id-driven character whose moral compass actually points true north towards family. Timothy is literally the reason Val is still breathing. Val does everything he does for what's left of his family--the being a badass, a hard worker, someone who is feared in case he needs to defend Tim, etc. This is planted very early in GOTHAM, but I think it comes home better in SEVEN when Tim recounts this leftover garbage vegetable "salad" Val made and says he gave Tim more than his own portion. That was telling.
Val Wilde is absolutely completely messed up, but he's in fact a very good person. I always like the Sondheim lyric "nice is different than good." He's not a bit nice, but he's good, and I also think that's what Jim sees in him, and what he sees in Jim.
Ask me Val questions all day, I love that guy. :)
KarenB wrote: "Thank you! Yes, I've heard and loved that quote from GRRM - always seemed so obvious to me! Another question - you do such good research and create a very clear sense of place and time. Do you ev..."
Oh, I definitely find bits of history I can't include. I call my research process brickwork vs. architectural study. I need to know the architecture of the world I'm writing before I write it, but the bricks (the words I put in books) are only allowed to apply to things Tim would notice. He doesn't give a shit when particular buildings were constructed, for instance, or about any of the fascinating political rhetoric of the time period. Tim is Tim, and Tim cares about people in front of him. Not current events.
And I can't go to Bouchercon this year because my publishers are sending me on not one but three tours for JANE STEELE, and I need to keep my head right and kiss Gabriel once in a while. :)
Sabrina wrote: "Hi Lyndsay! Three questions:1) We've been discussing Tim and Mercy's complex relationship in the book discussion. I was wondering if you had any comments or insights on the characters and their r..."
Great questions! I'll answer them in the order they were asked.
1) It's tough for readers to get a handle on Mercy because Tim is so over the moon about her, but there are plentiful clues in the books indicating she deeply cares about him. We also have to think about the crazy environment she grew up in, with her beloved mother dying and her father blaming the Irish. She was a victim of both physical and psychological abuse, so it often baffles me when people think she should be somehow a better, more together person.
She's not. She had a crazy father who instead of comforting her locked himself in his study drawing mourning bands on every page of her mother's books after her mom died, and Tim and Val had to break in. Then her dad burned her manuscript and tried to kill her. I mean, I should have given this poor girl a break, but literally nobody does.
Then she writes very apologetic letters to Tim from London about the facade she constructed in SEVEN. I can speak to this: when you have mental health problems, it's extremely difficult to present anything to the world other than "I'm fine." That was true then, and it's still true now.
2) Val is my favorite. :) He's not OK, but he tries very hard, and I love that.
3) Yes, thank you! JANE STEELE will be out before we know it. Meanwhile, I was totally working on a (finished) YA fantasy, but it's not right yet. I have to fix it up.
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Thanks for answering, Lyndsay. Totally excited about the YA fantasy now. It will be great to read and discuss with my two daughters.
Sabrina wrote: "Lyndsay wrote: 3) Yes, thank you! JANE STEELE will be out before we know it. Meanwhile, I was totally working on a (finished) YA fantasy, but it's not right yet. I have to fix it up. Thanks for a..."
Aw, you're too kind, Sabrina. I have no idea when it'll be around because I just signed a deal for another historical. But you can always ask me for a pdf. :)
I was thinking more about Tim and Mercy and one significant aspect of the reason she's not inclined toward him romantically is a thing most people don't notice (but you're all very apt readers, far more apt than I am, so maybe you did!). Timothy never laughs once throughout the whole trilogy. Now, it would be extremely difficult for me personally to 1) fall for someone who never asked me to and 2) fall for someone who literally never laughs. Tim doesn't notice this about himself--in fact, the closest he gets to commenting on it is saying, "I almost laughed. It was a near thing" at one point. I can't recall which book at the moment. But Valentine does notice, and my personal head canon is that Tim hasn't laughed since their parents were killed, and Val does mention it during their huge argument in FLAME when Tim says don't make me laugh and his brother replies, "As if that's even possible. You never laugh."
John wrote: "Lyndsay, this might be cart before the horse, but any idea when Jane Steele tour details could make an appearance?"I have literally no idea at the moment. I can tell you that they're sending me to trade shows in October, and a pre-pub tour in January, and a real tour in likely March. Because (good news!) the pub date has been moved up to March 22nd.
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Merrily wrote: "Hi Lyndsay and all, just popping in to say that among you, you've asked all my questions - and kudos to Lyndsay for NOT feeling that she has to use every single piece of interesting information tha..."Ha! I have rather strict standards about that, indeed. :)
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Hah, so true! I read this one historical thriller where the author stopped to tell the reader when building was built and its various uses during a tense chase scene. Other than the odd historical facts thrown in at weird times, the book was great though.
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We will be patient! Unless you are looking for some beta-readers. Congrats on another book deal!
On the subject of Tim and Mercy. I think it was pretty clear that Mercy wasn't romantically inclined towards Tim. I mean, he never even asked her out before the whole business with her father. Maybe she viewed him more as a little brother?
I just couldn't wrap my mind around Tim's obsession with her. Like you said, it was hard to get a handle on Mercy because of Tim's skewed POV. I felt like Tim never seemed to be in love with her, but rather, the idea of her, until maybe the very end. So because of all the unspoken things and lies, there was never a solid connection between the two for me.
It almost reminds me (to a much lesser extent) of Don Quixote's Dulcinea del Toboso, who he professed to be the love of his life, quested in her name, but never even talked to her.
Was that concept, I guess of knight-errants and their lady, something you were aiming for?
Sabrina wrote: "Lyndsay wrote: Aw, you're too kind, Sabrina. I have no idea when it'll be around because I just signed a deal for another historical. But you can always ask me for a pdf. :)We will be patient! U..."
That is an incredibly intelligent reading of the text! But not exactly. Here are some further thoughts that may or may not add up. And we can also chalk it up to bad writing! ;)
--Timothy lived on the streets, malnourished and protected by a questionably sane elder brother, until he met the Underhills. Mercy was a part of that, and his attachment to her in the beginning was absolutely based in fantasy rather than in fact.
--Afterwards, I did try to make it clear that they were close friends. Very much thrown together, but close. In GOTHAM, Mercy actually screams at Tim that she's really not allowed male company apart from him, because her father respects him. So there's quite a bit of back story there. They spent countless dinners with that family, and knew them well (not well enough, obviously).
--Tim feels as if he knows Mercy better than he might otherwise because he has read all her anonymous short stories (so has Mrs. Boehm, for that matter). I have had the personal experience of people feeling as if they knew me very intimately because they knew the words I had written. That is both true and untrue. Her stories, which are only briefly quoted, were a series Tim loved, and when he discovers that she wrote them, to some extent he does learn things about her perspective and poetry he hadn't caught previously. And he loves her all the more for her talent afterward.
--I do think there's a difference between Mercy lying and Tim failing to ask questions. She's trying to mask a severe mental illness at the same time she's trying to recover from horrific events, and she trusts Tim, so to that extent she confides in him in the second and third books. Tim just happens to be completely tongue-tied around her, because she's not only been an aspect of what pulled him out of homelessness and starvation, but also wrote a lot of his favorite prose, and is at heart a very kind and giving person.
Does that answer it better? I can go on, if anyone wants me to. XD
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There is definitely no bad writing in your trilogy! And thanks for your further thoughts. Points to keep in mind when I reread the books. I think with as complex as your characters and their relationships are, that every reader will probably take something different away based on their own experiences.
Regarding Mercy's mental illness. I don't know much about schizophrenia, but I did read that it usually manifests itself very suddenly, and witnessed this firsthand when a girl was running at cars in the middle of the night, and my brother and I had to tackle her and restrain her until the ambulance arrived. The family (who we later talked to) said that she had been fine before that day. (The girl got help and was doing fine last I spoke to her mother. So yay!)
In Mercy's case, was the trigger when her father tried to kill her? Or had she been trying to hide the mental illness before that? I also did not realize that loss of memory was part of schizophrenia, with Mercy not remembering who Tim was at the end. Or did she have some other stuff going on too?
Sabrina wrote: "Lyndsay wrote: That is an incredibly intelligent reading of the text! But not exactly. Here are some further thoughts that may or may not add up. And we can also chalk it up to bad writing! ;)Th..."
Frankly I think she also has some PTSD issues that are not related to schizophrenia, including memory loss. But my best friend growing up was living in foster care because her mother suffered from that illness, and I largely based things on personal experience.
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My previous lost post had to do with the special relationship which developed among Tim, Val, and Jim. Considering the era, and the stigma placed on "aberrant" sexual relationships and practices, I thought it said a lot about Tim's character development that, after the initial surprise of the reveal, he not only accepted Tim and Val's unorthodox friendship but grew to trust and love Jim enough to essentially make him a de facto family member. The violent shared experiences that the three of them survived forged an exceedingly strong bond among the trio, with each of them having the others' backs, whatever the price. I just loved the development of their relationships, and it stood out for me as one of those unexpected gems in a story which provide me with unlooked for pleasure.
I guess I should have a question here after babbling a bit: Did you have the trio's eventual relationship in mind early on; did it develop organically as the characters developed; or something completely different. Is there any basis in real (your) life as an inspiration (if I'm not prying too much)?
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That makes sense. And I guess, really, she wasn't hiding the illness. She was probably largely unaware of it herself, like most illnesses before they are diagnosed.
And yes, what John said (he says everything much better)... thank you for your time and participation.
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I got the sense in GOTHAM that Tim had this sort of dream of happy families. He wanted to marry Mercy and try and get back to what his family was before the big fire that killed his parents or something. He definitely was doing that "I can't ask her out until I can afford to marry her" thing that I assume (I have no idea, now that I think on it!) was fairly common for the period.
Given the time period, I think I would have expected Mercy to jump on the chance to marry someone like Tim because I expect the benefits of marital status would have outweighed the potentially stifling relationship. Just from a practicality standpoint. Even after her mental health started to deteriorate, it seems like the more practical solution. Crappy choices all around.
Aaaaaand all of a sudden I have Tina Turner in my head, completely out of context. "What does love got to do with it"
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True, Erin. And lol about the song stuck in your head. All in all, not a bad one to get stuck there. :P
That seems like what Elena pretty much did, and I was totally happy for her. I don't know... I feel like Tim got struck with the lightning bolt type of love (and Mercy didn't). But even if they both did, and fell madly in love, that wears off, and they'd have to make a choice to stay in love like any long term relationship.
Love always reminds me of a new pair of shoes. When you first get a pair of shoes, you're hyper aware of their shininess every time you walk and you're strutting around all happy in the new pair, but then the newness wears off and you can either toss them, or keep wearing the shoes. And if you keep wearing the shoes, then they become so worn in that they feel like a part of your feet. And at that point, you love them more than when you first bought them.
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What a great analogy, Sabrina! Hopefully one's marriage becomes like that great pair of shoes that you can never bear to throw away because you know you'll never find another pair as comfortable!
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LOL, Merrily, that sounds like a wedding toast.
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Feel free to use my toast at the next wedding you attend, Sabrina!
Hi, folks! Good grief, wish I had gotten here sooner. But I always wish that. Want to put in 2 cents re the mental illness thing. (I was So Sorry that was Mercy's fate, but it did not seem discrepant) Re memory and schizophrenia, as a society we did not have really effective treatment for it until the '50s. So folks might have long periods of time in which they were pretty out of touch with reality. You might not remember because delusional stuff was in the way, as it were.
Thank you, Lyndsay, for your wonderful books, your thoughtful answers to our questions, and for your generosity in taking the time to participate in this discussion. I am, as I'm sure many here are, very much looking forward to your next writing endeavor!p.s. I'm still not convinced cauliflower is a worthwhile vegetable.
I, too have never been a cauliflower lover, but for a milk intolerant friend, I just tried using steamed cauliflower blended smooth instead of cream to make a salmon bisque. Not quite as creamy tasting but delicious anyway.
John wrote: "Lyndsay, once again, thank you so very much for being so generous with your participation. I think everyone here very much appreciates your willingness to spend time interacting.My previous lost ..."
Hey John--thanks for bringing this up, I adore their relationship.
A few things. First, since I never really know all the ins and out of my plots before I sit down to write them, a great deal of the relationships develop just as organically as real relationships do. I think for Valentine, Jim truly is his closest friend, as he protests in SEVEN. So when he swans off with some nubile young Irish miss, I don't believe he sees it as being at all out of the ordinary (though I highly doubt that by the time FLAME rolls around, Jim is sleeping with anyone else). Another significant fact is that Jim saved Timothy's life in that book without question by fetching Val to Tammany even though he'd just been gashed in the throat, so that would instantly catapult Jim into hero status in Val's estimation, saving his brother like that. And though it was probably true before FLAME, by the end of the terrible traumas you mentioned, it's likely much more obvious to Valentine that he's in love with the fellow. All that is simply to state that anyone Val was in love with, Tim would make an effort for, no matter who they were. Clearly Jim is a good influence and Val needs every good influence he can get!
Second, it may surprise some people to learn that anti-queer sentiments haven't always been as virulent as they became in the 20th century, for the simple reason they weren't discussed by the sort of people who would have objected to them! There was none of this self-loathing "I'm a gay televangelist myself, so I can be around a load of gay stuff if I'm trying 'curing' them, that'll be fun." Yes, it was illegal and considered perverse, but unlike the tragic trial of that other Wilde across the pond, it really wasn't prosecuted. New York was a highly homosocial and even homoerotic town. Gentlemen's clubs, bathhouses, fire halls, gangs, any sort of bawdy house you could wish for, what have you. There was a stigma, certainly, but since so much of it was behind closed doors, it was a non-issue for most people.
I guess it sort of develops in this way: Jim falls in love with Val, therefore he would risk himself for Tim; Val would do anything for Tim, which adds to his love for Jim; and Tim would do anything for Val, who loves Jim, so they're really sort of stuck with each other. ;) Not to imply they don't all genuinely enjoy each other's company--they do.
Regarding my personal experience and how that applies, I just happen to think representation in literature is very important. Not all my friends are straight white people, not everyone in the 19th century was straight and white, so why should my characters be? One of the major characters in JANE STEELE, Sardar Singh, is a Sikh gentleman who happens to be asexual. Why not? People want to see themselves reflected in books, and they've every right to want that.
Erin wrote: "Sabrina wrote: "I felt like Tim never seemed to be in love with her, but rather, the idea of her, until maybe the very end."I got the sense in GOTHAM that Tim had this sort of dream of happy fami..."
I absolutely agree that Mercy would have married Tim had he ever bothered to ask, his being incapable of laughter notwithstanding. They were close friends, she cared deeply for his health and happiness, she simply wasn't in love with him. And what does Tim do? He sends her away to London! Most people don't blame Tim for any of this complete cock-up, but after he blackmails Silkie in GOTHAM, he could have marched right up to Mercy with money in his pockets and asked her to marry him, but NO, he marches up to her and ships her off to another continent. She must have thought he considered her tainted goods at that point. Where Mercy is concerned, Tim is often a prize ass, but he's so well-intentioned that people don't notice. You can be well-intentioned and still be an idiot. :)
Merrily wrote: "Sabrina wrote: "Erin wrote:Given the time period, I think I would have expected Mercy to jump on the chance to marry someone like Tim because I expect the benefits of marital status would have outw..."LOVE the shoe metaphor. xoxo
Meredith wrote: "Hi, folks! Good grief, wish I had gotten here sooner. But I always wish that. Want to put in 2 cents re the mental illness thing. (I was So Sorry that was Mercy's fate, but it did not seem discre..."That's also true--not only was there a huge stigma attached, but you might not have known what was happening to you, and simply lost bits of your life to delusions.
KarenB wrote: "Thank you, Lyndsay, for your wonderful books, your thoughtful answers to our questions, and for your generosity in taking the time to participate in this discussion. I am, as I'm sure many here are..."Ha, thank you! I hardly ever met a vegetable I didn't want. I am the Val Wilde of veggie eaters. ;)
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