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New York - reading schedule and discussion
message 51:
by
Meg
(new)
Oct 05, 2015 06:26PM
Oh man, I am sorry guys. I am so caught up in the reading I guess I couldn't stop!!! Sorry for the confusion.
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Sorry for the mic up. I just kept reading loving this book
I did read too far, so sorry guys.So how are we doing with the reading? Hooked? Do you think the author set the "stage" well? How do you feel about the characters?
Mod
I am really enjoying learning about the history of the area, and I think the author is doing a good job showing us the variety of people that settled in New York. The 1600's were and interesting time, with different countries repeatedly fighting for control of, and to settle in, the American colonies.
I tried to stop but it is too good to put down.
I'm behind on my reading but hope to catch up today and tomorrow. It's ok so far but I'm not in love with it. I'm very picky about how authors portray different cultures and I just don't know much about the Dutch and north Native American tribes yet. I am willing to learn though ... More reading ...This novel reminds me of Ken Follets books although I've only skimmed a few.
Mod
I am hooked. I think the author does a great job with setting the stage well. After starting the next section just yesterday I found out how much I have enjoyed Quash's narration. I am still really curious about the Master's family. I did feel for the Misses when Clara married and how upsetting it was to her that her daughter married outside their faith. It's too bad that she was so that she didn't show up for the wedding. At least the mother did warn Clara about what her status as women would be vs. a Dutch women. I think you will discover more as you read Queen Amidala28. I thought the author gave rich insights into history and peoples. Not much with the Native American tribes but given their class status in society was so poor I think it makes sense. I am hoping I get more into the next section with the trial.How is the next section Sheila compared to the first?
Mod
I find I am not minding characters fading out and new ones coming in. It is like reading a saga
I find I am not minding characters fading out and new ones coming in. It is like reading a saga
RebeccaI liked how the author compared women''s roles ( i.e. Dutch V's British)
I was disappointed there was not more on the Native Americans
What have you learned about the time period while reading New York?
If anyone is interested the movie that reminds me a little about the issues in this novel is, The Patriot.
What do you think about James's approach to Cousin Eliot Master every time they meet? Why do you think he feels the way he does?
I see General Washington continues his fetishes with chopping down cherry trees. Cleverly inserted by the author. LOL
Again, I'm behind, but I do enjoy learning of the laws especially between the Dutch and English. Especially since the Dutch controlled a huge aspect of trade back then; this illustrates how they were able to work with other cultures and dominate the waters. I also like their will system better!At first I was sick of the voice the author gave Quash. The author gave him this Uncle Tom voice where everything was beautiful and being a slave was just dandy - *** spoiler alert***** it literally made me sick and I was about to stop reading the book then he got sold and things got real.
I wish the author had done more on the diseases but then the terminology may be too much for a novel. I'll have to look those up on my own.
This is what I found on diseases. Though Yellow Fever and Smallpox were two very destructive diseases that affected Colonial America, many other diseases affected the area during this time. During the early days of the colonial settlement, people brought with them contagious diseases. After the importation of African slaves, more serious parasitic diseases came to Colonial America.
My understanding is that one thing that wiped out a lot of the population was measles
Queen I think Rutherford was trying to show that there were some families that treated the slaves more humanely than others What was awful was how quickly and awfully the MIstress changed after her husband's death and how vengeful she was. If she were an English woman she would not have been able to weild the power that she had
OK now we can talk about the trial! Any thoughts? Lessons learned?
Hamilton was brilliant. He studied the jury and was able to use events that had occurred because of abusive government officials. Then made the point that it's about freedom of the press. Good lawyers do know how to use tactics like this.
Mod
am not quite finished with this week's reading, but am far enough. Although I enjoy some of the trivia of history (did not know about this landmark court case, for example), It feels as if the family saga is simply a backdrop on which the author can teach us history, as if the reader has to be tricked into learning American history by wrapping it in a piece of fiction. The history lessons are just so overt, the explanations put in the mouths of various characters or given by the narrator makes the fiction feel artificial.
I taught American history, so it is a pleasure to read it so thoroughly.
Mod
Such as the description of the "macaroni" hat and fashion now makes me understand the lyrics from Yankee Doodle where the verse is "stuck a feather in his cap and called it macaroni."
I immediately thought of the same song, Sheila.
I had the same Yankee Doodle moment. I get what you're saying about this book being a history lesson, Irene, but it works for me. If I had to read an actual history book on the topic, I'd be bored to tears and wouldn't get very far. This way, the history is dressed up as fiction and is much more palatable. I'm enjoying the read and learning loads.
I really enjoy learning more historical facts this waySome are new and some were forgotten long ago
I think the book is very successful because of the way it weaves the facts into a story. There are some facts, told this way, I will never forget
I think there was a lot of writing potential from the "Lie".
Waterloo Rd, Stanhope, NJ 07874is an outdoor museum that takes you through American History. It's a terrific place to take the family.
Irene, I grew up in N.J. and never heard of this one. Interesting.
I am interested in how the author talks about the rich vs the poor. It sounds very much what a majority of the people complain about now. What is the answer?
I think the author wanted to portray the way that the Rvolutionary War divided families, but then seemed to back off. Father and son fighting on opposite sides of the conflict should have resulted in a bit more tension than we are given. I also thought that he reconciled the Charlie White issue far too quickly. It did not seem realistic that a militant like Charlie would have rescued a wealthy, prominant loyalist.
Irene, I visit there often. I used to take my fourth grade class every year. I also went there with my children. I went last year with my family. I plan to go again. It's a great experience and there are people dressed up for the part talking about the history of the era.
Meg, it seems things haven't changed a bit. The rich always seem to get richer.
I was thinking the same about the political parties Whigs and Torries. Not much has changed.
I was particularly appalled about the paragraph on the slaves. It made me sick
Meg, which paragraph are you referring to?
Meg, I was wondering what page you were referring to.
page 192 bottomAnd if all these Black people are chattels, why then most people nowadays agreed--it must be God created them inferior,
it goes on and gets worse
Yes, certainly the terrible thinking of so many at that time. One has to dehumanize another in order to enslave.
I felt disappointed with the war chapters as well. I expected a bit more drama and action.I can't imagine the many times that parents would have to worry about their children being sold and have to wonder where they might be and not knowing. I hope we find out what happens to Solomon.
I am wondering what people think about the women in the book so far?
Mod
Women are not getting a big part of this story, at least in my opinion. This is more about the men, the Masters men, the slave men, the sons, the military men, the founders of our country men, etc. Women appear to be just side line characters.
I have read through the part to be discussed next week, so I have read up to the start of the next war. With the exception of the first Dutch family in which the man was the kinder and more moral of the two, the women have been supporting roles, often giving voice to a moral or religious element in the culture. (OK, well James' wife is also an exception, not exactly a voice of morality). I also agree that the story moves from episode to episode so swiftly that we get little character development. I feel as if all the humans are supporting characters to the one, central character, the city of New York.
I feel that there is some character development but the story keeps going which doesn't allow for the depth we usually get.For example, poor Abigail so in love and filled with hope. Then her brother intervenes and tells her Albion is dead. She is devastated, I am sad too, and the next thing she is married. Then, she finds out not only is he alive but also married. This part of the book troubled me greatly.
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