The Lightning Thief (Percy Jackson and the Olympians, #1) The Lightning Thief discussion

Could Percy Jackson learn anything from Harry Potter?

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message 1: by Frog (new) - added it

Frog What, in your opinion, does J.K Rowling do that Rick Riordan doesn't?

Nabaa Nabil i guess make the character more mature , i mean harry grew up from a eleven years old kid who was soked to hear thar he was a wizarred , and to the man who will sacrifice himself for the greater good , even though he didnt die . but my point is that he grew up , unlike percy who was still a bit un mature in the end :D

message 3: by Frog (last edited Aug 26, 2015 10:00AM) (new) - added it

Frog He did come across as full of himself; not sure if that was Rick Riordan's intent.
Rick Riordan only seemed to be able to create one personality, and it was reflected in all the characters.

message 4: by Frog (new) - added it

Frog I don't really see how those passages prove Percy is mature. If anything they just make him seem sarcastic and arrogant, in my humble opinion.

I must have forgotten how much I didn't like this book. He has a character named Bobofit? (a stock bully at that) and uses the word "doofus." Yikes.

message 5: by Frog (last edited Aug 26, 2015 02:01PM) (new) - added it

Frog I think Riordan hides behind sarcasm, but honestly can't make characters relatable. He tries though.

message 6: by Frog (new) - added it

Frog Same age as Percy.

message 7: by Frog (last edited Aug 26, 2015 02:06PM) (new) - added it

Frog In what way did you find them relatable? (Out of curiosity. I'm not arguing).

Serena I think Harry and Percy are very similar. When some of you argue that Harry is more mature than Percy, I disagree. Harry is just as immature, for example: "Sir," said Snape pointedly. "There's no need to call me sir, professor." Harry replied smoothly. And when some mentioned Harry being more willing to die even when he knew he could die also, he did that once? Seven times? Depends on how you look at it, I suppose. But Percy did it constantly! Remember, loyalty is his fatal flaw? Lastly, I found all the PJO/HOO characters very relatable in at least one way.

message 9: by [deleted user] (new)

Fish wrote: "What, in your opinion, does J.K Rowling do that Rick Riordan doesn't?"

Yeeeees!! Persassy is the best of them all!! Harry potter could learn quite a few things from Percy however. Like how to have the perfect comebacks, and how to have the fangirls adore you.

Persassy is the best!!!

message 10: by [deleted user] (new)

My heart sunk when I saw how you guys think Percy is so immature. He is loyal to his friends (fatal flaw, duh) and would do ANYTHING for them. Yeah, he's dum. But that's why we all love our Seaweed Brain. The characters are VERY relatable. I'm a mixture of Annabeth, Piper, Percy, Leo, Hazel, Frank, Nico, and Jason. A little bit of them all.

message 11: by Frog (last edited Nov 22, 2015 10:44AM) (new) - added it

Frog The fact that Percy's fatal flaw is loyalty makes him a worse character, not a better one.

He's a Gary Stu in the way that you're supposed to always be impressed with him, and he never grows or changes except to be more "hot" and muscular.

If you compare him to Harry, he never grows in any meaningful ways whatsoever. It's all about thinking he's awesome.

message 12: by Frog (last edited Jan 05, 2016 10:28AM) (new) - added it

Frog You're confusing moral character and literary character. It doesn't matter who is the bravest or most loyal. If it was solely about virtue, there wouldn't be Mary Sues.

The fact that we're always supposed to be adoring Percy and thinking he's cool and awesome (and has no flaws besides... loyalty????) is exactly what makes him worse. I prefer characters who learn from others around them and strive for virtue. Percy is just contrived.

message 13: by Ruby (new) - rated it 3 stars

Ruby I think that Riordan has the ability to write really entertaining books. They're funny. And long. And they make sense. And there's worldbuilding. Kind of like the Marvel movies, which I love.

But it kind of ends there for me because in terms of deepness and richness in plot/meaning/morals/vocabulary/concepts, Riordan has pretty much nothing. His characters are flat (give or take a trait or two) and his villains all alike in the way that they are idiot/slapstick-comedy-defeatable monsters or monologuey masterminds. Very similarly to the way that it makes no sense to compare HP to LotR, it makes almost no sense to compare PJ to HP:

Rowling has a more intricate world (note that she worldbuilded strongly for seven books where Riordan did a little worldbuilding but mainly took everything from Greek mythology), more developed characters, more varied scene types and plot elements, and just has a richer world and story in general.

What Rowling does that Riordan doesn't is worldbuild, develop characters by making them deep/have motives/have complex backstories/seeing them develop over time, vary the plot elements/structure (Riordan's plot structure is very, very similar for his books: "we group of demigodly-powered teens need to stop X mythological being from ruining the world by Y significant date by passing through of Q, R, and L historic and famous sites"), and just in general add more meat to the world and characters.

message 14: by Frog (last edited Nov 24, 2015 12:09AM) (new) - added it

Frog I agree that they are entertaining books.
When I read Percy Jackson, I read it with the same attitude as when I watch Power Rangers. I don't expect it to be good quality, I just like the fun of it.

However, in both cases, it's worth trying to imagine how they could be better, as a way of learning. It's not necessary though.
I've personally been interested lately (about story telling in general). I might over analyze these things or be too harsh, but thanks to everyone who joined in the discussion, because it's always really interesting to me.

Cleopatraselene2 You guys say that Percy is immature and arrogant (I totally agree), but that is just one character in the whole series. Annabeth was quite level-headed and Grover was mature.

I personally think J. K.Rowling could have learned from Rick Riordan though. She mashed a bunch of myths and legends together, not even looking at Egyptian magic when they invented the concept. Rick Riordan separated his myths into different book series and sometimes writing logical crossovers (such as the mixing of Greek and Egyptian cultures and deities during the Ptolemaic period).

Rick Riordan also incorporated many characters of diverse backgrounds and personalities. His whole reason for writing the books was to teach kids that differences and disabilities are not weaknesses, as taught by society. He teaches you that anybody has the power to save the world and to make it a better place.

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