The Shadow Rising
question
what did you think of the wheel of time series
Benjamin
Mar 05, 2014 12:59PM
im on book four and it's starting to get alittle boring should keep with it or move on and find something else to read
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It's a good story over all, but the author does seem to ramble and write his characters in circles.
Have reached Book 6 Lord of Chaos and have slowed down. Becoming fed up with the continual adjusting of the braids and straightening of skirts.
I'm halfway through book 8 and it's definitely a trying read at times. The male characters are written fairly well. Through the books, we definitely see a lot of growth in those characters.
That said, the female characters are almost intolerable at times. Like Beverly, I can read a series over and over if I love them (like Dune), but this will only get one read mainly because of the female characters.
That said, the female characters are almost intolerable at times. Like Beverly, I can read a series over and over if I love them (like Dune), but this will only get one read mainly because of the female characters.
I'm on the last book alexis. If you're this far along, I would say it's worth finishing. Brandon Sanderson does well at picking a dying story up and dragging it back toward the finish line.
I loved it!!! PERIOD!!! This is the story that pulled me into these fantasy worlds that I've come to love. I didn't think I could feel any other way about these stories...and then along comes GRRM!!! I've learned to NEVER start a story unless the LAST LINE of that story has already been printed and released!!! I've learned that these authors that we like to put on pedestals are just like everyone else...with some being greedy, lazy, asses that consider the story finished the minute they get that big check!!! I mean- to hell with the fans that put you there, right?!?! All I know is that when Jordan died, we lost the last of an amazing breed. They lived for THE STORY!!! He continued writing and editing right up until his death...and MADE SURE that the story got completed!! Here's something that GRRM should know. Since his death in 2007, Robert Jordan has released more books(a new one just last month) than GRRM has in that same time period!!! If I were an author, I would be ashamed to know that a DEAD MAN is putting out more work(caring more about his fans) than I am!!
I discovered this book series when they brought out the game on the pc back in the 90s I think. Still one of my favourites and I've read it through several times now. I was devastated when Jordan died before completing the story. But I agree with others. Sanderson did a brilliant job of finishing Jordan's vision.
On the front cover of each volume of The Wheel of Time, at least the editions I read, is a quote from The New York Times: "Robert Jordon has come to dominate the world Tolkien began to reveal”. I found this quote to be exaggeration in the extreme. JRR Tolkien was a master of language, not only English, but several others, including languages he invented; Robert Jordan shows an inability to compose a sentence in English, much less any other language.
There are multiple instances of badly or improperly formed sentences, and he seems to think that if two words sound alike, they can be used interchangeably. Many sentences are so poorly constructed, I had to re-read them multiple times to try to figure out what he was trying to say.
As far as his ability to create a language — throwing made up words together in random order does not constitute creation of a language; it just produces syntactic noises. Robert Jordan may have aspired to inherit the mantel of JRR Tolkien; these books will not fulfill that aspiration.
At times, I found these book excruciating to read because of the poor quality of the writing, and often found myself angry because of the lack of fulfillment of the promise made by the quote on the cover of each book.
Tolkien’s characters are fully formed and memorable. Not only are they three dimensional, but each has a personality. Each new character advances the plot, and yet there are not so many, nor are they so burdened with insignificant details, to make it difficult to remember them.
Jordan adds dozens, if not hundreds of characters without tying them into the main plot, many of whom are mentioned once or twice, never to be heard from again. He seems to delight in creating characters on opposite sides of a conflict with similar names, but gives the reader no other way to identify them, so it's very difficult to tell them apart. In addition, many of the characters change their names multiple times throughout the books making it even more difficult to keep track of who is who.
In rambling on and on with no direction or sense of purpose, Jordon denies the reader the privilege of forming a story line — we can’t join him in his world. For instance, there is one scene where a person addresses another person across the room. By the time he finishes describing the walls, the clothing of the people in the room, and other irrelevant information, ten pages pass before we hear the second person’s response, then another three before the first person continues. There is so much padding in these volumes, he could probably have told the entire story in four volumes or less, with no loss.
The amount of distrust and prejudice expressed by the authors was almost overwhelming. Men don't trust women, women don't trust men, no one trusts anyone outside their race, nationality, social, or employment group. Nobody trusts the Aes Sedai, including other Aes Sedai. Everyone denigrates anyone they don't trust. Even the main characters don't trust one another.
Taking this out of the realm of fantasy for a moment, I think the difference in the level of respect shown to the male and female characters is a sad commentary on our present society. The number of descriptions of women's breast, naked or otherwise, was disturbing, and the number of descriptions of women's bottoms being spanked was overwhelming. The amount of overt sexism and open prejudice in the book was almost enough to make me stop reading on more than one occasion.
Both Robert Jordon, and co-author, Brandon Sanderson, seem to be fond of the "I've got a secret" game. There are several places where one character tells another an innocuous piece of information, but the authors don't tell the reader. In fact they go out of their way to point out to the reader that they are not being told. This is a childish gambit and is unworthy of the writing to which they aspire.
At the beginning of almost every chapter you have no idea who is being talked about, or where they are. You may have to read as much as a quarter of the chapter to find out what's going on, and often a chapter will end in the middle of some action, and the climax of the chapter will only be revealed later by another character referring in passing to that result. Many side stories are never resolved.
I got the impression that Robert Jordon, and Brandon Sanderson were trying to write a story that could be turned into their idea of a movie script at a later date. This impression was increased in the later volumes as each chapter was divided between multiple characters, with each character getting a few (often only one) paragraphs before a blank line across the page would announce that the reader was about to be transported to another scene. While this purely cinematic effect may make a movie more interesting, it makes the books very difficult and frustrating to read.
One of the things I liked very much throughout all the books was his description of sword fights. His use of inventive names for each position in an engagement made these descriptions entertaining to the point of being poetic, and made it possible to almost see with the minds eye exactly what was happening. For example, “The Swallow Takes Flight met by Parting the Silk” followed by “Boar Rushes Down the Mountain”.
I think Robert Jordan has created an interesting and enchanting story that would be a pleasure to read if only he could write some elements more skillfully. I found the story to be fun and engaging when he could bring himself to actually just tell it. If Robert Jordon had limited this writing to the adventures of the main characters, without all the side stories and incidental fluff, he might have a had a pale reflection of The Lord of the Rings.
There are multiple instances of badly or improperly formed sentences, and he seems to think that if two words sound alike, they can be used interchangeably. Many sentences are so poorly constructed, I had to re-read them multiple times to try to figure out what he was trying to say.
As far as his ability to create a language — throwing made up words together in random order does not constitute creation of a language; it just produces syntactic noises. Robert Jordan may have aspired to inherit the mantel of JRR Tolkien; these books will not fulfill that aspiration.
At times, I found these book excruciating to read because of the poor quality of the writing, and often found myself angry because of the lack of fulfillment of the promise made by the quote on the cover of each book.
Tolkien’s characters are fully formed and memorable. Not only are they three dimensional, but each has a personality. Each new character advances the plot, and yet there are not so many, nor are they so burdened with insignificant details, to make it difficult to remember them.
Jordan adds dozens, if not hundreds of characters without tying them into the main plot, many of whom are mentioned once or twice, never to be heard from again. He seems to delight in creating characters on opposite sides of a conflict with similar names, but gives the reader no other way to identify them, so it's very difficult to tell them apart. In addition, many of the characters change their names multiple times throughout the books making it even more difficult to keep track of who is who.
In rambling on and on with no direction or sense of purpose, Jordon denies the reader the privilege of forming a story line — we can’t join him in his world. For instance, there is one scene where a person addresses another person across the room. By the time he finishes describing the walls, the clothing of the people in the room, and other irrelevant information, ten pages pass before we hear the second person’s response, then another three before the first person continues. There is so much padding in these volumes, he could probably have told the entire story in four volumes or less, with no loss.
The amount of distrust and prejudice expressed by the authors was almost overwhelming. Men don't trust women, women don't trust men, no one trusts anyone outside their race, nationality, social, or employment group. Nobody trusts the Aes Sedai, including other Aes Sedai. Everyone denigrates anyone they don't trust. Even the main characters don't trust one another.
Taking this out of the realm of fantasy for a moment, I think the difference in the level of respect shown to the male and female characters is a sad commentary on our present society. The number of descriptions of women's breast, naked or otherwise, was disturbing, and the number of descriptions of women's bottoms being spanked was overwhelming. The amount of overt sexism and open prejudice in the book was almost enough to make me stop reading on more than one occasion.
Both Robert Jordon, and co-author, Brandon Sanderson, seem to be fond of the "I've got a secret" game. There are several places where one character tells another an innocuous piece of information, but the authors don't tell the reader. In fact they go out of their way to point out to the reader that they are not being told. This is a childish gambit and is unworthy of the writing to which they aspire.
At the beginning of almost every chapter you have no idea who is being talked about, or where they are. You may have to read as much as a quarter of the chapter to find out what's going on, and often a chapter will end in the middle of some action, and the climax of the chapter will only be revealed later by another character referring in passing to that result. Many side stories are never resolved.
I got the impression that Robert Jordon, and Brandon Sanderson were trying to write a story that could be turned into their idea of a movie script at a later date. This impression was increased in the later volumes as each chapter was divided between multiple characters, with each character getting a few (often only one) paragraphs before a blank line across the page would announce that the reader was about to be transported to another scene. While this purely cinematic effect may make a movie more interesting, it makes the books very difficult and frustrating to read.
One of the things I liked very much throughout all the books was his description of sword fights. His use of inventive names for each position in an engagement made these descriptions entertaining to the point of being poetic, and made it possible to almost see with the minds eye exactly what was happening. For example, “The Swallow Takes Flight met by Parting the Silk” followed by “Boar Rushes Down the Mountain”.
I think Robert Jordan has created an interesting and enchanting story that would be a pleasure to read if only he could write some elements more skillfully. I found the story to be fun and engaging when he could bring himself to actually just tell it. If Robert Jordon had limited this writing to the adventures of the main characters, without all the side stories and incidental fluff, he might have a had a pale reflection of The Lord of the Rings.
I enjoyed the series - though there are some things that I disliked enough I'm tempted to write fan fiction to get the ending I want - but I did dislike how the relationships between men and women were handled. Lots of "If they'd just bothered to TALK to each other...." crap going on.
Benjamin wrote: "im on book four and it's starting to get alittle boring should keep with it or move on and find something else to read"
Stop now and move on, the series is a trap in my opinion. The first three are very enjoyable, but if you keep reading Jordan starts to stretch his books needlessly. Chapters are filled with pointless character perspectives that add little to no value to the plot line. It is so bad, you could cut out third of the chapters not lose any depth to the book series.
This is all opinion, of course, some people really enjoy the series. Try book five and determine for yourself. Just be warned that I found the fluff only gets worse as I continued series.
Stop now and move on, the series is a trap in my opinion. The first three are very enjoyable, but if you keep reading Jordan starts to stretch his books needlessly. Chapters are filled with pointless character perspectives that add little to no value to the plot line. It is so bad, you could cut out third of the chapters not lose any depth to the book series.
This is all opinion, of course, some people really enjoy the series. Try book five and determine for yourself. Just be warned that I found the fluff only gets worse as I continued series.
Ode to Rand al'Thor
Inside the vacuum I sit
Carved out of molten lead
Nothing can penetrate
Nothing can get inside my head
I feel no pain
I feel no joy
There is nothing to gain
And nothing to lose
Inside the vacuum I sit
Long ago I chose my path
I cannot deviate now
I cannot lay my head upon the hearth
Or listen to the song of the lark
Nor wander beside meandering streams
My song is the hells spawn in the dark
Born out of treachery, nourished on fear
Inside the vacuum I sit
I am the saviour and destroyer of the world
I will return
There is no doubt of this
To cleanse and burn
and make my mark
To do what is written
and emerge from the dark
Then, beware, for outside the vacuum I will stand...
Inside the vacuum I sit
Carved out of molten lead
Nothing can penetrate
Nothing can get inside my head
I feel no pain
I feel no joy
There is nothing to gain
And nothing to lose
Inside the vacuum I sit
Long ago I chose my path
I cannot deviate now
I cannot lay my head upon the hearth
Or listen to the song of the lark
Nor wander beside meandering streams
My song is the hells spawn in the dark
Born out of treachery, nourished on fear
Inside the vacuum I sit
I am the saviour and destroyer of the world
I will return
There is no doubt of this
To cleanse and burn
and make my mark
To do what is written
and emerge from the dark
Then, beware, for outside the vacuum I will stand...
Read the whole series, and loved most of them, though some of the books are slower than others.
Always got the feeling that when he slowed down, he was doing some groundwork, prep time for the next book.
I don't know if it was his ilness but in the two books before Brandon Sanderson takes over, he seems to have lost track of all the threads. Still, in a while I will reread the whole series, but will read only two or three in one go, read a good thriller and only then go back to the series.
Brandon Sanderson energized the series at the end.
Always got the feeling that when he slowed down, he was doing some groundwork, prep time for the next book.
I don't know if it was his ilness but in the two books before Brandon Sanderson takes over, he seems to have lost track of all the threads. Still, in a while I will reread the whole series, but will read only two or three in one go, read a good thriller and only then go back to the series.
Brandon Sanderson energized the series at the end.
I read and worshiped faithfully up until he died, then I turned and walked away. I spent years waiting on every new book (years ago obviously)and once he was gone, the series died in my opinion. To try and scam through with supposed "notes and conversations is BS. Only RJ knew where it was going. Sorry, but I just couldn't go on after spending time pacing the floor year after year, waiting for the next book. Something inside of me died when he did.
I loved this series. Brandon Sanderson did a fantastic job on the last couple of books.
Like Mike, I also loathe Elaine. I must say I didn't particularly like Rand either. I read the books for Perrin, Matt, Egwene and Nynaeve.
Like Mike, I also loathe Elaine. I must say I didn't particularly like Rand either. I read the books for Perrin, Matt, Egwene and Nynaeve.
I've started the series three times. Each time I've made it to #9. I haven't once finished #9. A lot of people say that starting with 4 or 5 and definitely by 6 or 7, it starts to plod. I think I liked the 5/6/7 region of the series best of all, but I must have some sort of block about the 9th book.
And I'm irritated with myself. I love the plot. I love the world. I love the Forsaken. I love the scientificness of the One Power. I love how epic it is. (Not to say that I don't see the faults. And I loathe Elaine.)
One of these days, maybe when my to-read pile is a little less ridiculous, I'm going to start from scratch again. I really do want to know how it all turns out.
And I'm irritated with myself. I love the plot. I love the world. I love the Forsaken. I love the scientificness of the One Power. I love how epic it is. (Not to say that I don't see the faults. And I loathe Elaine.)
One of these days, maybe when my to-read pile is a little less ridiculous, I'm going to start from scratch again. I really do want to know how it all turns out.
I put off forever starting the series, because I can't stand getting to a certain point and then having to wait for the next installment (are you listening GRRM?). That said, it's WAY too much to try to read through the entire series back-to-back. Take some time between to go read something else and decompress a little. Yes, it gets slow at times. RJ could have done with a slash and burn editor in places, but the myriad of plot lines and intricacies just wouldn't come out in a short story now would they?
The male characters are written very well but the female characters are written terribly for the most part. Still, I loved the first six books and having finished book eight I have found myself to be a bit reluctant about picking up book nine.
Benjamin wrote: "im on book four and it's starting to get alittle boring should keep with it or move on and find something else to read"
I can almost never stop reading a series if I read through book 1 or 2 and have enjoyed them. By then I am vested to know what happens in the end. With WOT, I did a lot of skimming through books 5 to 11. I loved books 12 and 13 where Sanderson picked up the pace and gave the characters a boost of energy, but then 14 was a let down for me because I expected to get more page time and action from the principle characters, Rand, Mat and Perrin. Especially Rand.
If I love a series, I can reread the books multiple times and not get bored. I don't think WOT will ever get a 2nd read from me.
I can almost never stop reading a series if I read through book 1 or 2 and have enjoyed them. By then I am vested to know what happens in the end. With WOT, I did a lot of skimming through books 5 to 11. I loved books 12 and 13 where Sanderson picked up the pace and gave the characters a boost of energy, but then 14 was a let down for me because I expected to get more page time and action from the principle characters, Rand, Mat and Perrin. Especially Rand.
If I love a series, I can reread the books multiple times and not get bored. I don't think WOT will ever get a 2nd read from me.
If you love character and world building, stick with it. If your more into a fast-paced plot, you might want to try something else.
They have all the pacing of treacle running uphill in winter
I stopped reading at book 7. I loved the first 4. Then they started getting drawn out and separating to much for me. At that point I think I didn't like Rand either. So that didn't help. Someday I think maybe I'll try them again and work at reading through them all. But there are so many other books out there to read.
Great series...seems to be widely acknowledged that it slowed down between, say, books 5/6 to 9/10 (depending who you talk to) but loads of world and story development goes on though this period.
For me, seeing the development of Matt, Perrin and Rand through this period is particularly interesting.
Things (for me) came back up to speed from Book 10 on. I'd recommend sticking with it...I think its worth the time.
For me, seeing the development of Matt, Perrin and Rand through this period is particularly interesting.
Things (for me) came back up to speed from Book 10 on. I'd recommend sticking with it...I think its worth the time.
Since the series is finished I went back and read the whole thing through as one story start to finish. It took me about 10months and I really enjoyed it.
Things slowing down didn't bother me as much since there was an ending. We got there.
Brandon Sanderson did an amazing job completing Robert Jordan's vision.
Things slowing down didn't bother me as much since there was an ending. We got there.
Brandon Sanderson did an amazing job completing Robert Jordan's vision.
I loved it, didn't want to start reading it, but once I did I was hooked.
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