The Great Gatsby
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What is the Premise of The Great Gatsby?
Monty J
(last edited
Mar 03, 2014 08:43AM
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Mar 03, 2014 12:11AM
The meaning of the book can be summarized in a sentence: "Love founded on crime and deception is doomed." Or: "True self is the pathway to true love."
Gatsby was a fake, a mental construct contrived to win the affection of a beautiful, educated woman from a wealthy family.
Jimmy Gatz gave Daisy a false name, deceiving her from the moment they met. Nick: He might have despised himself, for he had certainly taken her under false pretenses. I don't mean that he had traded on his phantom millions, but he had deliberately given Daisy a sense of security; he let her believe that he was a person from much the same stratum as herself - that he was fully able to take care of her. As a matter of fact he had no such facilities - he had no comfortable family standing behind him and he was liable at the whim of an impersonal government to be blown anywhere in the world."
Repeatedly and early in the novel, like the tolling of a bell, the existential question is voiced,by party-goers, by Nick, by Daisy's husband Tom: "Who is Jay Gatsby?" Even by Daisy: "Gatsby? What Gatsby?"
In the opening paragraphs, Nick feeds us a clue about Jay's deception: ["If personality is an unbroken series of successful gestures, then there was something gorgeous about him, some heightened sensitivity to the promises of life..."] Nick's statement brings into focus the false, deceptive, even self-delusional nature of Gatsby's personality.
Jay Gatsby is a phantom, a mental construct, incapable of offering Daisy, the woman of his dreams, an authentic relationship because he is afraid she will not accept the real man, Jimmy Gatz, who kept as a boy that diary with the weekly schedule and budget.
Only in death is Jimmy Gatz revealed, and it is too late for Daisy to get to know the real person behind the facade. And here the archetypal nature of Gatsby springs into the spotlight.
Everyone, male and female, has a polished public persona, a social veneer they present to the world and particularly to a potential mate. Jay Gatsby represents that polished version of self, which happens to be irreconcilable with his ethically compromised authentic self whom Tom has exposed as a criminal.
Everyone has a moment of reckoning when their public persona bubble withers before their potential mate: a balloon of credit card debt, unfiled tax returns, snoring, he sees her in daylight without make-up, etc. Jay's conundrum reminds us of ourselves. Who, really, are we and how much of our secret true selves are we willing to reveal and how close is it to the polished version? (For that matter, how much of our True Selves are we even acquainted with or willing to face?)
In the end, Tom's secret life of crime is revealed by Daisy's husband, Tom, and she, wisely, rejects him.
What is your proposed premise for the book?
Gatsby was a fake, a mental construct contrived to win the affection of a beautiful, educated woman from a wealthy family.
Jimmy Gatz gave Daisy a false name, deceiving her from the moment they met. Nick: He might have despised himself, for he had certainly taken her under false pretenses. I don't mean that he had traded on his phantom millions, but he had deliberately given Daisy a sense of security; he let her believe that he was a person from much the same stratum as herself - that he was fully able to take care of her. As a matter of fact he had no such facilities - he had no comfortable family standing behind him and he was liable at the whim of an impersonal government to be blown anywhere in the world."
Repeatedly and early in the novel, like the tolling of a bell, the existential question is voiced,by party-goers, by Nick, by Daisy's husband Tom: "Who is Jay Gatsby?" Even by Daisy: "Gatsby? What Gatsby?"
In the opening paragraphs, Nick feeds us a clue about Jay's deception: ["If personality is an unbroken series of successful gestures, then there was something gorgeous about him, some heightened sensitivity to the promises of life..."] Nick's statement brings into focus the false, deceptive, even self-delusional nature of Gatsby's personality.
Jay Gatsby is a phantom, a mental construct, incapable of offering Daisy, the woman of his dreams, an authentic relationship because he is afraid she will not accept the real man, Jimmy Gatz, who kept as a boy that diary with the weekly schedule and budget.
Only in death is Jimmy Gatz revealed, and it is too late for Daisy to get to know the real person behind the facade. And here the archetypal nature of Gatsby springs into the spotlight.
Everyone, male and female, has a polished public persona, a social veneer they present to the world and particularly to a potential mate. Jay Gatsby represents that polished version of self, which happens to be irreconcilable with his ethically compromised authentic self whom Tom has exposed as a criminal.
Everyone has a moment of reckoning when their public persona bubble withers before their potential mate: a balloon of credit card debt, unfiled tax returns, snoring, he sees her in daylight without make-up, etc. Jay's conundrum reminds us of ourselves. Who, really, are we and how much of our secret true selves are we willing to reveal and how close is it to the polished version? (For that matter, how much of our True Selves are we even acquainted with or willing to face?)
In the end, Tom's secret life of crime is revealed by Daisy's husband, Tom, and she, wisely, rejects him.
What is your proposed premise for the book?
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To me, the premise of the book is: What you want will never be good enough.
Isn't that the whole point of the green light at the end of Daisy and Tom's dock that Gatsby reaches for? The light represented Gatsby's dreams (or dreams in general). He reached for the light but never could grasp it.
For example, when Gatsby was a child, all he wanted was to be great (i.e. wealthy, respected, etc) and when he got all of that he realized he wanted Daisy, too. So, once he had become 'great' he suddenly changed his dream to wanting Daisy which in turn, for all we know, could have progressed farther into wanting other things.
In other words: We will never achieve our dreams (aka the green light at the end of the dock) because we will always want more. Or dreams will always evolve. It will always be too far away for us to grasp. And we will die trying to reach that light that we will never, truly, reach.
Isn't that the whole point of the green light at the end of Daisy and Tom's dock that Gatsby reaches for? The light represented Gatsby's dreams (or dreams in general). He reached for the light but never could grasp it.
For example, when Gatsby was a child, all he wanted was to be great (i.e. wealthy, respected, etc) and when he got all of that he realized he wanted Daisy, too. So, once he had become 'great' he suddenly changed his dream to wanting Daisy which in turn, for all we know, could have progressed farther into wanting other things.
In other words: We will never achieve our dreams (aka the green light at the end of the dock) because we will always want more. Or dreams will always evolve. It will always be too far away for us to grasp. And we will die trying to reach that light that we will never, truly, reach.
F. Scott Fitzgerald's first love was a wealthy Chicago debutante named after a da Vinci painting, Ginevra King. The young romance ended, however, when Ginevra's father famously proclaimed "Poor boys shouldn't think of marrying rich girls."
From that moment on for Fitzgerald, Ginevra represented "not only his condemnation of the rich but his ambivalence, his fascination with wealth and his sense of inferiority around it," according to James L. West III, author of "The Perfect Hour."
Whether Fitzgerald realized it or not, I believe that is the seed from which the Gatsby tree grows.
Eat What You Kill: A Novel
Ted Scofield
From that moment on for Fitzgerald, Ginevra represented "not only his condemnation of the rich but his ambivalence, his fascination with wealth and his sense of inferiority around it," according to James L. West III, author of "The Perfect Hour."
Whether Fitzgerald realized it or not, I believe that is the seed from which the Gatsby tree grows.
Eat What You Kill: A Novel
Ted Scofield
I kinda don't see that as the main premise at all. Sure Gatsby was a fake but in other ways, he was living more truly than anyone else in the cast.
Nick's statement makes that plain. Yes, it is a veneer of falsehood which Gatsby wraps around himself; but it is the truth in his heart which is the driving force which leads him to Daisy after the passage of all those years.
The main premise of the book (as I see it) is, can you defy society, defy America, defy the world, defy time, defy everything..can you retrieve a lost dream if your motive is pure, 100%, all-encompassing love?
The answer is yes, you can. TGG's structure is that of Orpheus and Eurydice; and you remember in that tale Orpheus conquered the toughest part of the rescue of Eurydice. The gods allow him to descend into Pluto's realm and lead his lover back up and out to the land of the living. It is Eurydice who fumbles the victory at the last moment.
Similarly, Gatsby climbs 'down/up' into the American plutocracy and nearly wins Daisy away from the powerful Tom, but it is Daisy who 'blows it' at the last threshold.
Nick's statement makes that plain. Yes, it is a veneer of falsehood which Gatsby wraps around himself; but it is the truth in his heart which is the driving force which leads him to Daisy after the passage of all those years.
The main premise of the book (as I see it) is, can you defy society, defy America, defy the world, defy time, defy everything..can you retrieve a lost dream if your motive is pure, 100%, all-encompassing love?
The answer is yes, you can. TGG's structure is that of Orpheus and Eurydice; and you remember in that tale Orpheus conquered the toughest part of the rescue of Eurydice. The gods allow him to descend into Pluto's realm and lead his lover back up and out to the land of the living. It is Eurydice who fumbles the victory at the last moment.
Similarly, Gatsby climbs 'down/up' into the American plutocracy and nearly wins Daisy away from the powerful Tom, but it is Daisy who 'blows it' at the last threshold.
I see the premise of the book is that social mobility is not achievable in the USA. And SF makes a horrible case that it is not, which is why I find on the social commentary level, the book is a failure.
To me, the premise of the book is: Love cannot be bought.
Gatsby wasted his time trying to achieve a social status that would put him even with Daisy and Tom, but he did not have the right kind of currency. Gatsby was new money and Daisy wanted old money backed up by a prestigious family name. He became a bootlegger to be able to offer Daisy the life of luxury she was used to; however, it was all a waste of time. You cannot go back in time and you can never recover the love that somebody once felt for you.
Gatsby wasted his time trying to achieve a social status that would put him even with Daisy and Tom, but he did not have the right kind of currency. Gatsby was new money and Daisy wanted old money backed up by a prestigious family name. He became a bootlegger to be able to offer Daisy the life of luxury she was used to; however, it was all a waste of time. You cannot go back in time and you can never recover the love that somebody once felt for you.
Okay, so right now I'm struggling to get through Nietzche's Zarathustra thing, so like everything else I read at any given time, it becomes a filter for the things I see around me.
How about this: Jay Gatsby as a superman - a "self-made man" - beyond good and evil; he gives birth to himself, and the being he envisioned himself to be when he met Daisy. He would've become that person, whether he met her or not. He just loved her and wanted to include her in his vision of himself and his world.
I don't know what that makes Daisy in this scenario.... merely his dream of a perfect mate, or his downfall. Both, I guess.
Feel free to fill in if you see some potential for this idea. These are just some sketchy thoughts...
How about this: Jay Gatsby as a superman - a "self-made man" - beyond good and evil; he gives birth to himself, and the being he envisioned himself to be when he met Daisy. He would've become that person, whether he met her or not. He just loved her and wanted to include her in his vision of himself and his world.
I don't know what that makes Daisy in this scenario.... merely his dream of a perfect mate, or his downfall. Both, I guess.
Feel free to fill in if you see some potential for this idea. These are just some sketchy thoughts...
Not just for the love of Daisy. Gatsby also wants to get rid of the stench of being middle class. His fatal flaw is in thinking that money will get him the girl and the respect. It doesn't: he will never win respect for boot-legging his way to a fortune and feckless Daisy wants the special status "old money" affords her. I think it illustrated the class system and morals of the rich in the 1920's.
For a good explanation of the meaning, or the premise watch this vlog brothers video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VhYM...
The premise of the book is that reading any novel by a genius is a better use of your time that reading any other million books off the "best seller" list.
Shelley, http://dustbowlstory.wordpress.com
Shelley, http://dustbowlstory.wordpress.com
No matter how much money you have, or what a good show you put on, the old rich can always tell the new rich and will always see the new rich as inferior.
Can't be what you ain't.
Can't be what you ain't.
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