The Sound and the Fury (July - Aug 2015)

[Susan]

Finally done with Jason's section! Good riddance!! On top of everything else, he's just plain mean. Burning the tickets just to torment Luster, for example.

I'm not sure if Amanda's finished yet, so ... (view spoiler)[ Am I right that he's stealing the money Caddy sends, both to their mother and to Quentin? And what do we suppose Quentin is needing money for so desperately right now? (hide spoiler)]

This section is dated the day before the one narrated by Benjy. I wish I remembered more what that one told us about the current moment. We must be coming to some kind of climax. Hopefully there will be a decent resolution in the last section.

[Susan]

I think I'm having a different overall reaction from Bea's. Yes, I'm finding it very difficult to read, Benjy's and Quentin's parts because of how their minds work and Jason's because I detest him so much. But if it's meant to be the picture of the tragic downfall of a Southern family, it certainly succeeds in that. I have to admit I'm finding it very powerful, in spite of how hard I'm having to work at it.

I think Faulkner is admired in part as a major example of the "Southern" school of writing in the U.S. Tennessee Williams (Cat on a Hot Tin Roof) is another example, and I can see some similarities.

[Bea]

Susan, I think (view spoiler)[Jason was embezzling and trying to make money on the stock market (hide spoiler)].

I think I have also lost the sequence in the time frames. I know that Quentin's section was 18 years prior to Benjy's and that Benjy's was the day after Jason's. Yet with so many events mixed in time in each section, I have missed the chronology.

[Susan]

To answer Bea's question about other Faulkner books ... Yes, I think so. The only other one I've read is As I Lay Dying. Here is the first sentence from my review of that : "The stream of consciousness technique Faulkner uses, combined with the many characters whose voices he uses to narrate the story, make this a difficult book to read."

I think Faulkner is considered ground-breaking in part precisely for his use of this stream of consciousness technique we all find so frustrating. This was published in 1928. James Joyce pioneered the technique in 1922 with Ulysses. Coincidentally, I'm also struggling through that right now. I find the Joyce even more difficult than the Faulkner.

And I do think listening to this (rather than reading it on paper) has helped immensely. So if you do decide ever to try another, that might be a good idea.

[Amanda]

I did read that Light in Augustwas his most accessible book, which leads me to believe that the rest would also be challenging.

[Amanda]

An aside, Tien, have you always done RWS challenges ? I just saw your Itinery post come up, and I don't remember seeing your name over there before !

[Tien]

Susan, Bea is right: (view spoiler)[Jason is speculating with wool -I don't think the stockmarket as it is these days is quite established yet back then (hide spoiler)]

And isn't stream of consciousness is very hard to get into anyway, whoever the writer is?

[Tien]

Amanda wrote: "An aside, Tien, have you always done RWS challenges ? I just saw your Itinery post come up, and I don't remember seeing your name over there before !"

I've been there for years though I haven't participated for a year or so... not since pregnancy, I think... though I've always lurked about and may try to plan quietly but if I didn't get any readings done then I don't bother posting etc :)

[Bea]

Hmm. I quit RWS a couple of years ago because I did not have the time for it, while working. I have been thinking about going back. The challenges are much tougher for me, but I have read a bunch of books for it that I would never have picked up. Really stretches me in a different way than SRC or PAS.

[Susan]

Tien wrote: "Susan, Bea is right: [spoilers removed]"

cotton, though, not wool, right?

[Bea]

I am enjoying this last section. Have already read half of it.

[Amanda]

Bea wrote: "Hmm. I quit RWS a couple of years ago because I did not have the time for it, while working. I have been thinking about going back. The challenges are much tougher for me, but I have read a bunch o..."

I tried SRC, but found there were too many " blah, blah " on the cover challenges which I found really hard to find. I do think the two groups are geared towards different kinds of readers.

That said, both challenges have lead me to books I would never normally pick up. ( And, can I say, if it wasn't for the group read, this book would be well down y list ? )

[Amanda]

Bea wrote: "I am enjoying this last section. Have already read half of it."

Yep, started last night, and if my eyes hadn't gotten droopy I think I would be almost done.

[Tien]

RWS is geared more towards literary style which is why I sometimes find it quite challenging to do every season because I love my popular & guilty pleasure fictions ;p

And seriously, SRC... I've been with them since the very humble beginning of very simple tasks (30 in number tops!) but it's so very complex these days with so many rulings etc. But they've grown so big! I think I completed ONE but man, that season I did nothing but read! I don't know how those people complete each season...

[Tien]

Susan wrote: "Tien wrote: "Susan, Bea is right: [spoilers removed]"

cotton, though, not wool, right?"

sorry, Susan, yea, I had 2 weddings over the weekend. My head's definitely not up to par. I think I need next weekend to be here to recover :p

It would've been wool if these people were Australian ha ha ha...

[Bea]

Tien wrote: "RWS is geared more towards literary style which is why I sometimes find it quite challenging to do every season because I love my popular & guilty pleasure fictions ;p

And seriously, SRC... I've b..."

I noticed when I went over to RWS the other day that the fall tasks are being posted. Can you imagine my surprise to see "20.3-Difficult - In honor of The Sound and the Fury, read one of the top 150 novels from the list Most Difficult Novels"?

How funny is that?

[Tien]

Oh goodness, maybe we should've waited for next month to read it lol

[Amanda]

I may have groaned when I saw it. And then was surprised at how many books out of that 150 I had actually read!

[Bea]

I'm done. Of all the sections, this one was the clearest in storytelling for me.

[Amanda]

Almost! Tuesday I don't get to read, so will be finished tonight.

[Tien]

Bea wrote: "I'm done. Of all the sections, this one was the clearest in storytelling for me."

Me too - it was very short too.
It was a bit strange though as there wasn't a specific POV; that is it was more 3rd person -is this the right term? Moving back & forth between Dilsey & Jason

(view spoiler)[ re:Jason --> ha, karma!
The Compsons -for crying out loud, Dilsey's old, she needs to retire. (hide spoiler)]

Must say that I found this novel, 'blah!' probably because I find it hard to read (not only the stream of consciousness but also the accented southern) and not liking the family AT ALL so nobody has my sympathy.

[Amanda]

Tien wrote: "Bea wrote: "I'm done. Of all the sections, this one was the clearest in storytelling for me."

Me too - it was very short too.
It was a bit strange though as there wasn't a specific POV; that is it..."

I always find a book difficult if I cannot find one sympathetic character. I think it would have been different if the first 2 parts weren't stream of consciousness, because I could have become comfortable with Benjy or Quentin.

[Bea]

Amanda wrote: "I always find a book difficult if I cannot find one sympathetic character. I think it would have been different if the first 2 parts weren't stream of consciousness, because I could have become comfortable with Benjy or Quentin."

If I have sympathy for any character, it would be Dilsey, who no one else in the book gave two cents for.

For another challenge I considered a book about Faulkner and the Southern way of life. The library had a bit on a card about Faulkner's extended family and his representation of life in the south in his writings. Seems some of his characters come straight out of his own life. If so, his family life must have been hard.

[Amanda]

Finished. Have to say the ending was a little flat. Jason didn't get half of what he deserved.

[Susan]

I'm behind the rest of you now. I'm listening to the last section, savoring it -- even as I know what they're going to discover when they unlock Quentin's door. It's nice that the book at least ties up in a normal narrative style. It's sometimes a bit flowery, but I still enjoy hearing in a straightforward way what's happening.

[Susan]

I finally finished last night. Did the rest of you have an appendix in yours, after the fourth section? My audio book didn't have it, but the paper copy did. Apparently, Faulkner wrote it 16 years after the rest. It tells a lot about the history of the family before the story, and a bit about after. It confirms, for example, about (view spoiler)[ Benji's castration, and about the amount of money Quentin stole from Jason. (hide spoiler)] And, unfortunately, it seems that Jason (view spoiler)[ went on to do not so badly for himself (hide spoiler)].

[Susan]

Tien wrote: "Must say that I found this novel, 'blah!' probably because I find it hard to read (not only the stream of consciousness but also the accented southern) and not liking the family AT ALL so nobody has my sympathy."

But I really did like Caddy and, to some extent, Quentin (the brother). And I felt bad for Benjy. It was Mrs. Compson and both Jasons that I couldn't stand.

[Susan]

Bea wrote: "The library had a bit on a card about Faulkner's extended family and his representation of life in the south in his writings. Seems some of his characters come straight out of his own life. If so, his family life must have been hard. "

I looked for evidence of a hard early life on Wikipedia, and didn't find it, Bea. I'm curious about it. Tell more of what you learned?

[Susan]

Amanda wrote: "Finished. Have to say the ending was a little flat."

Agreed, Amanda. And I didn't quite understand why it ended just where it did. "... each in its ordered place" -- does that mean all this we've been reading about is as it should be?

[Susan]

Thanks, everyone, for doing this together. I guess, overall, I ended up liking it better than any of the rest of you. But I also found it very difficult to read, and it helped immensely to hear what everyone else thought about it.

[Amanda]

Susan wrote: "I finally finished last night. Did the rest of you have an appendix in yours, after the fourth section? My audio book didn't have it, but the paper copy did. Apparently, Faulkner wrote it 16 years ..."

No, no appendix in mine. Hmmmm, i do like further explanations, wonder if I could find it online.

Did it give an extra sense of closure that the original ending doesn't ?

[Amanda]

Susan wrote: "Amanda wrote: "Finished. Have to say the ending was a little flat."

Agreed, Amanda. And I didn't quite understand why it ended just where it did. "... each in its ordered place" -- does that mean all this we've been reading about is as it should be? "

Perhaps it means there cannot and won't be any change ? Benjy dislikes change and becomes happy again once they return to the routine of the drive.

From what we rad of Benjy's chapter, I suspect that she has always been the same.

I don't think Jason would be any happier or any different if he had got the bank job. I think he is a man who likes to feel begrudged and hard-done by.

[Susan]

Amanda wrote: "Did it give an extra sense of closure that the original ending doesn't ?"

Yes, it did give a bit more closure. You find out what happened after Apr 8 to several of the characters.

[Bea]

The book I referred to above about Faulkner is William Faulkner and Southern History. Here is what my library noted:

"William Faulkner and southern history
Williamson, Joel.
Summary
One of America's great novelists, William Faulkner was a writer deeply rooted in the American South. In works such as The Sound and the Fury, As I Lay Dying, Light in August, and Absalom, Absalom! Faulkner drew powerfully on Southern themes, attitudes, and atmosphere to create his own world and place--the mythical Yoknapatawpha County--peopled with quintessential Southerners such as the Compsons, Sartorises, Snopes, and McCaslins. Indeed, to a degree perhaps unmatched by any other major twentieth-century novelist, Faulkner remained at home and explored his own region--the history and culture and people of the South. Now, in William Faulkner and Southern History, one of America's most acclaimed historians of the South, Joel Williamson, weaves together a perceptive biography of Faulkner himself, an astute analysis of his works, and a revealing history of Faulkner's ancestors in Mississippi--a family history that becomes, in Williamson's skilled hands, a vivid portrait of Southern culture itself. Williamson provides an insightful look at Faulkner's ancestors, a group sketch so brilliant that the family comes alive almost as vividly as in Faulkner's own fiction. Indeed, his ancestors often outstrip his characters in their colorful and bizarre nature. Williamson has made several discoveries: the Falkners (William was the first to spell it "Faulkner") were not planter, slaveholding "aristocrats"; Confederate Colonel Falkner was not an unalloyed hero, and he probably sired, protected, and educated a mulatto daughter who married into America's mulatto elite; Faulkner's maternal grandfather Charlie Butler stole the town's money and disappeared in the winter of 1887-1888, never to return. Equally important, Williamson uses these stories to underscore themes of race, class, economics, politics, religion, sex and violence, idealism and Romanticism--"the rainbow of elements in human culture"--that reappear in Faulkner's work. He also shows that, while Faulkner's ancestors were no ordinary people, and while he sometimes flashed a curious pride in them, Faulkner came to embrace a pervasive sense of shame concerning both his family and his culture. This he wove into his writing, especially about sex, race, class, and violence, psychic and otherwise. William Faulkner and Southern History represents an unprecedented publishing event--an eminent historian writing on a major literary figure. By revealing the deep history behind the art of the South's most celebrated writer, Williamson evokes new insights and deeper understanding, providing anyone familiar with Faulkner's great novels with a host of connections between his work, his life, and his ancestry."

[Susan]

Bea wrote: "The book I referred to above about Faulkner is William Faulkner and Southern History. Here is what my library noted:"

Thanks, Bea! Now that you've named the book, I see that the exact description you copied in is what Goodreads has for it.

I can see how the maternal grandfather might've given F some ideas for Jason. And I can see the "pervasive sense of shame concerning both his family and his culture ... [woven] into his writing." It's nice to have a bit of the background, but I don't think I'd have the energy for 544 pages of it. :)