Time Travel discussion
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Winner Declared February "An Extended Journey" by Paul Sherman
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TIME TRAVEL APPROVED BY GOOGLE!!Today's Google Homepage deals with my favorite character in Paul's fine book.
How did they know?
Paul & I believe the secret is Amber.
Well, maybe only I think that but glad to know that Google's on top of this.
Go Ms Moses.
Lincoln wrote: "
Paul is giving away 5 copies of his book..."Thanks for including "An Extended Journey" in the February Giveaway, Lincoln. I'll be checking in to see if there are questions or comments where I can help. The question you've posed to the Group could have many answers, of course, but it was clearly not an issue the Travelers in "An Extended Journey" were prepared to deal with. It's fun imagining oneself in their place.
And many thanks for selecting "An Extended Journey" for your coveted Temporal Jester Award for 2013! I'm honored. And the small issue about it being "still nonexistent" is no problem for a Time Traveler. :-) Much appreciated.
Mod
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Sorry I never jumped on the wagon to read this yet myself :( Seems I missed out given the accolade by Amy, Lincoln and John, its just I didnt have an attraction to the era and location its based on...but its always on my to read list so will get round to it.
Anyway, onto the excellent question.
As a health and fitness professional of just recent years, if given the opportunity, I would approach the people I love and as many more others I can, whom I know have developed illnesses or even passed away too early in their lives due to poor diet, smoking, drugs or lack of exercises. I would show proof of what would happen to them and try to convince them to live a healthier lifestyle, I would teach and train them how to enjoy a healthy lifestyle and to spread the knowledge as widely as they can. I want to see everyone around me and everyone I know around the world to be conscious of what they eat. That's all the changes I would make. No doubt the universe will try to stop me but I will try to defy it.
Mod
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Sorry I never jumped on the wagon to read this yet myself :( Seems I missed out given the ac..."
Good call Tej I had not seen where John had reviewed An Extended Journey. I have edited the original post to include it.
Paul,
I will continue to contemplate the discussion question but in the mean time is that a Sound of Thunder reference? Watch out for butterflies.
Lincoln wrote: "Tej wrote: "John had also given it 5 starsI will continue to contemplate the discussion question but in the mean time is that a Sound of Thunder reference? Watch out for butterflies. ..."
No, Lincoln, not Sound of Thunder, but I guess I should check that out. The "butterflies" (effect) reference is merely to the generic danger all Time Travelers face, that one small change may affect more than you intend.
That would include risks in what Tej describes in his wonderful answer, but I could see going for it. I can think of three people in my past whose company I would still be enjoying if someone had passed on this wisdom to them. Assuming they'd listen.
As for John's Review, I'm grateful and humbled that he enjoyed AEJ when he did. We all miss him.
Lincoln wrote: "An Extended Journeyby our very own
Paul ShermanPaul is giving away 5 copies of his b..."
Lincoln wrote: "
An Extended Journeyby our very own Paul ShermanPaul is giving away 5 copies of his b..."
Lincoln's question reminds me of concept I've pondered a little over my years of increasingly long teeth and disappearing hair: If I knew then what I know today, would I have led a difference life ... or at least avoided a few of the errors I committed? (Does anyone else ever ponder this or am I the only one?)
Something tells me that, given one's inherited lizard brain, predispositions, genetic makeup, imprinted predilections — whatever you want to call it — access to more or better information wouldn't have changed the behaviors I wish I had done without.
No mystery here --- I'm just talking about all the old human failings.
It's like people who want to lose weight but can't resist that stupid grande mocha latte. They KNOW how this works but something very powerful takes over their brains and makes them do exactly what they shouldn't .... If you went back to turn your fat self with bad habits into a six-packed adonis nice guy, do you really think you could pull it off?
As for going back and changing something big, something more important than one's own little self, I guess the paradox behind that notion has been well explored: How can you change a future you've already seen? If you were there in the future once upon a time, how can you change something that's already happened?
And if you could, what would you be going back to?
Paul's terrific book touches on this sort of thing. For his protagonist, the topic is slavery and it involves an historical figure I wrote about too in my own quirky book.
You all will have to read "An Extended Journey" to find out what I'm talking about .... although I guess the review mention it.
Mod
A brain injury that can result in very severe conditions, perhaps no speech, no walking, no motor control to control hands to do basic of life skills...writing, eating, etc.
I was very lucky. I am technically should not have the coordination to learn to type...I walk with a limp, my balance is terrible...The left side of my body is extremely weak by comparison to the right. However, I walk unassisted, I talk just fine. I do not have the best coordination but I am very capable.
I know the car accident remains as one of my Mother's biggest regrets. I love time travel and talking about history or theorizing on the future but on more than one occasion I have heard my mother say...I would go back to your birthday...
I think it would be harder for me if I was not born with it. If I was without disability and than suddenly woken up with it, I would not cope well, however being born into this world and not knowing any better, I think I deal with it better.
I do not regret it. I admit I can not deny thinking back and wondering what my life would be like if only...but at the same time you cheapen the life experience I have had because of the disability. I think this is the question of all time travel books and the genre in general.
Right now I think the best example of explaining how I feel is summed up in
Niki Alling's book
Ginny's Sacrifice - A Time Travel NovellaWould I go back and change it? No...it is a part of who I am.
Lincoln, thank you for sharing your story. How touching to consider how even the "bad" things become part of our life's tapestry. Pull those threads we dislike and we are, in truth, someone all together different.
The story shared by Lincoln (of which I hear in this thread for the first time, although I am in contact with him, to chat about books, time travel, etc.) is very touching. And I agree with the conclusion. Probably each of us would not change the past, that is what made us to be what we actually are.... And if we could change something in the past, the present would not be the same, including us...
About Paul's book. I guess I will read it once again (maybe not all, it is huge :))))) , but random pages). I have quickly read it some time ago, and I imagine that going through some passages once again will let me discover something new ;)
Thanks for sharing your experience and wisdom, Lincoln. It's the universal Time Travel question, but if there is ever justification for changing events of the past, surely a trip to prevent unfair injury is high on the list. It's a serious quest and you'd have the right. Ahhh, but as you point out, what else might change? Would you still be the same person with the strengths, skills, personality, and intellect that may have been honed by challenges you've faced? Such risks can apply to any of us, of course. Random actions we take in the present can unknowingly affect ourselves and others in the future. Happens every day, whether we're aware of it or not. My own feeling is that given the chance to Travel as you've described, there's no easy answer, but it would be entirely up to you.
I suppose we're accustomed to Time Travel issues being fictional and often frivolous, but not so here. You've given us much to think about. Thanks again.
My answer is one personal, similar to Lincoln's,and at first I thought of course I would change this one thing; this one thing that has changed almost everything about me- but things I don't like- taking medication everyday, doctor's visits average once a week. What is this thing I would change? My first week of law school I became very sick and it became progressively worse. I was finally diagnosed with PSORIATIC arthritis which has caused severe damage and pain in my joints. I was only able to practice law for 8 years. What is the one thing I would attempt to change? The rheumatologist told me my disease was probably brought on by the stress of law school and he encouraged me to choose a different profession. However, (butterflies) while I was an attorney, I worked for the indigent and I helped so many lives that I could never count. I treated them as though they were paying me their last cent. Also, I met my husband in the first year of my job ,who has never complained because of my illness or the many restraints it puts on us,including going from a two income family to one. I am lucky to have him and the one healthy child I was able to have. I wouldn't change a thing. I would stay in law school. When we look at what we have or can do versus what we don't have or can't do,it really makes a big difference!!
Mod
I can't say it as nicely as Paul did right before your post. But yes in a world where time travel is a fun thing to contemplate and read about, Instead of a reality helps to count our blessings and find the great things about our lives despite the garbage that happens.
Were you a public defense attorney?
Yes and I loved it!Edited later to add- I was about to start watching Winter's Tale so I couldn't finish my post- it has an element of moving in time, though I'm not sure it's time travel, what would you call that?
As a defense attorney, people often thought I was putting bad people back out on the street again, but I was a strong believer in the justice system- in the innocent until guilty, but even more importantly- if I didn't do my very best zealously defending each client, the system wouldn't work. I believe the work I did was good work. I helped many people who needed it. I did private work for awhile because the money was unbelievably more than that of govt. work, but the clients felt entitled, entitled to phone calls in middle of night, or asking me to cross ethical lines which I never did. I went back to indigent clients who appreciated all the help I gave them (this was the majority of them! Lol)
Sorry if this was too much off subj. here!
I can think of changes I might make in my life, too, not a clear, single, event so much, but things I'd do better with 20/20 hindsight. Still, I wouldn't chance it; changing the past would endanger what has gone right, with my family at the top of that list. But we can only imagine what might be different without Candace's commitment to fair representation for those individuals she helped. The rule of law benefits us all, and isn't supposed to be influenced by net worth. Thanks so much, Candace.I gave much thought to unintended consequences when writing "An Extended Journey," but our Time Travelers (Monica and David) had no advance notice to consider the dangers. They landed in 18th century Virginia not knowing how or why they were there, and had enough on their minds already: Their two young daughters had been transported with them to the time of the American Revolution.
Mod
An Extended Journey features Thomas Jefferson. What made you decide to focus on him instead of other pivotal American icons?
Lincoln wrote: "Paul, An Extended Journey features Thomas Jefferson. What made you decide to focus on him instead of other pivotal American icons?""An Extended Journey" isn't specifically about Thomas Jefferson, but he inserted himself into this story by his prominence in the American Revolution and especially the issue of Slavery. He was the author of the Declaration of Independence, Governor of Virginia, a proponent of freedom and democracy, and he called slavery an "abominable crime," yet he was a slaveholder his entire life. A total contradiction in an otherwise inspiring man in so many fields.
Story ideas can develop on their own, it seems, and this one started with a trip to Virginia and imagining 21st century technology in the Revolution. That idea was mostly set aside -- there must be something more important. There was, and that is what I call the biggest mistake the Founders ever made. They permitted slavery to continue in a nation built on Freedom.
This story isn't solely about slavery or Jefferson or the war, but more about a 21st century family's struggle to assimilate and survive when thrust into this turbulent Time. Meeting Thomas Jefferson, his wife, and their contemporaries -- plus one very determined lady from another century altogether -- was part of the enjoyment in considering what might have been. I'm sure historians will especially appreciate Monica and the little girls getting to know Mrs. Jefferson so well, since so little was known about her previously. (Not to worry. Experienced Travelers in our Group have no trouble telling where history ends and fiction begins.)
The question, what would you change if you could travel to the past, is a challenging one. I have been thinking about this all day, and each time I think of something, I follow the logic through to possible ramifications, and decide against it. This is especially true of scenarios where I would alter another person's actions. The alteration would, in the end, likely be ineffective. If Hitler had never been born, Germany would still have faced the same prolonged depression. Isn't it possible the Nazi party would have risen to power, just led by a different egomaniac? If I should stop Oswald from killing Kennedy, well...was there a second shooter?
The only thing that I can't immediately rule out is changing my own action. However, as Lincoln so poignantly illustrated, even the misfortunes in our lives, played a role in making us who we are today. I can think of a few things in my life I would rather not have done. Nevertheless, the lessons I learned from my mistakes are of great value to me. So, my thought today is that I am for protecting the integrity of history.
That being said, if I should actually find myself in the past, and someone needs my help. It would be very difficult not to offer some assistance. A garbling of the message received by the man in charge of the engine room on the Titanic. "Shut the engines down," he hears. "Full stop!"
Or, perhaps Madam Curie might be made to discover the health risks of handling radioactive material, in time to save herself. What else might she have discovered if she had lived longer?
Ah, I know in my heart that history should be left alone, but wouldn't it be a challenge if you were suddenly plopped into the past and it wasn't just an academic question?
Cynthia, the Garrett half of Garrett Smith
Mod
Having read the book I agree with you Paul...Thomas Jefferson is in the book, the revolutionary war is on going, but what makes it so great is the ease of falling in love with the characters.
So a follow up question:
It takes a knowledge of history to write a book like this obviously, but also geography in this case Virginia. Are you familiar with the area or did you have to go and research that aspect of your book as well?
Garrett wrote: "The question, what would you change if you could travel to the past, is a challenging one. I have been thinking about this all day, and each time I think of something, I follow the logic through t..."Some excellent thoughts here, Cynthia, and I'm with you, no easy answers. Time Travel may have been on your mind before. :-)
Actually, I know it has. I downloaded your Garrett Smith TT novel, "Rabbit Hole" (Paradox Series), a couple of days ago, hooked by Lincoln's fine review. Looking forward to it.
Lincoln wrote: "It takes a knowledge of history to write a book like this obviously, but also geography in this case Virginia. Are you familiar with the area or did you have to go and research that aspect of your book as well? ..."The bare bones story idea came to me from reading so much history and Time Travel, but the details required substantial research. I'd been to Virginia before, but not to these historical areas, and knew I needed to go there in person to get it right -- not always practical with TT, but it still helps with enough imagination. So I studied the streets and structures of Colonial Williamsburg, always an inspiring place, as is Monticello, and also visited Richmond and Yorktown. Most visits were with family and included other destinations, but my final trip to Yorktown was spent quietly wandering among its hills and ghosts, absorbing details that weren't available from books. The research helped in two ways: 1) for Historical Accuracy, accomplished (hopefully) with the help of the Rockefeller and Jefferson Libraries, Historical Societies, and on-site experts, and, 2) for Storyline development, as nothing stokes my imagination better than really knowing the setting, including geography, and subject matter. Truth is, I totally enjoyed the process.
Well Paul, write what you know is always a fine adage, but that alone never insures a good product.After all, writing language is merely a craft, something learned, while writing well is an art & fairly gauged only by the reaction to what has been written.
That's true in any Timeframe, my friend & especially so of you in this one.
Of course, stories concerning real events naturally add another level of complexity, but you don't need a Time Machine to know your History in that department is now also firmly fixed in place.
Bo would be proud of you, but not as much as am I.
So, next?
Just wondering.
Mod
Care to elaborate?
Lincoln wrote: " . . . quietly wandering among its hills and ghosts, absorbing details that weren't available from books. Care to elaborate?"Lincoln, it's just that Yorktown Battlefield can be a different experience from Colonial Williamsburg or Monticello with their flocks of other tourists. There's a Visitors Center run by the National Park Service, which provides maps, exhibits, lectures, and detailed information, but if you time your visit right (avoiding special events) you can explore the battlefields in solitude at your own pace. Guidebooks are helpful, but I needed to stand where the opposing lines and defensive works had been, get a feel for distances and terrain, and try to visualize for myself what happened in 1781. It's not that I'm so into military history (I'm not), but these were real people at war with former compatriots, and I wanted to imagine being among them. What were they seeing and feeling? This led me to other considerations somehow overlooked at the Visitors Center: What could happen with a scattering of Time Travelers in the mix? Even those who knew not to interfere? What unintended consequences could change history? How many more might die? And questions we've already considered are always in the air: Can we justify changing history? Who decides?
As we said before, the story isn't "about" the war, but since our Time Traveling family was going to land in the middle of it, I tried my best to get it right.
Paul, you paint a vivid picture. I have always loved reading about the people who lived during historic times. Not just the major players, but the everyday folk as well. And don't we all feel a bit like a time traveler, when we read a book that pulls us into the time and place. From the reviews, it sounds as if your book does just that.
Mod
Thanks, Lincoln. A couple of influences led me in that direction. I realized that stories I enjoyed most, at the time, were about ordinary people, not superheroes. And even though the regular folks in AEJ travel two and a quarter centuries into the past, it isn't by their own doing. They're not scientists, veteran Time Travelers, or Time Tourists on a mission of their own. They're totally unprepared, and don't know how or why they're there. I thought it might be fun to see how they'd respond, and to consider the same possibilities for ourselves. What would we do?Ordinary people take vacations with their families, so this is where the "write what you know" influence came in. My wife and I have two daughters who were well into their teens when I was writing AEJ, but I reached back to borrow their 5 and 7 year old personalities, same age as the children in the story. I chose the younger ages so the characters could be part of the story without taking over the entire plot. And it was fun, having Subject Matter Experts in the family. Barbies require research, too, you know.
Mod
Peter AKA Piero (sorry other Peter)
Lynne
Garrett
Howard
Candace
Congratulations to our winners! It is such a great book enjoy it. I can't believe the losers of this competition did not mention that they would go back and change the results so they would win.
Hold on tight for next months giveaway...its going to be a Scavenger Hunt!
Legalese entries into this giveaway were assigned a number and then using the random number generator found at http://www.random.org/ the winners were determined. No chocolate was exchanged or human biases existed. thank you!
Mod
Lincoln, I've already read this fine book & discussed it at length with Paul both on and off thread & for this reason I nominated it for the group read some months back.So, give my copy to someone else, thanks, perchance the other Peter.
Thanks, Lincoln, and thank you all for participating! Winners will receive gift Kindle copies of "An Extended Journey" directly from Amazon, so please let me know via GR Private Message what email address they should use. OK? Thanks again. Now I want to see what this Scavenger Hunt is that Lincoln has planned for next month.
Paul wrote: "Now I want to see what this Scavenger Hunt is that Lincoln has planned for next month. "Me too! :)
Time Travel
Books mentioned in this topic
Ginny's Sacrifice - A Time Travel Novella (other topics)An Extended Journey (other topics)
An Extended Journey (other topics)
An Extended Journey (other topics)
Authors mentioned in this topic
Niki Alling (other topics)Paul Sherman (other topics)
Paul Sherman (other topics)
Paul is giving away 5 copies of his book. Only available in Kindle format.
David Gearns is an ordinary guy who responds to extraordinary circumstances. He’s a 21st century white, middle-class, corporate employee who travels with his wife and young children on a combination business and pleasure trip, unaware that they will soon be on a different journey entirely. Their visit to Colonial Williamsburg becomes much too authentic when they are whisked through time to Virginia of 1780.
An Extended Journey was a group read back in September https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Here is Amy's Review https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Here is John's Review https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Here is my Review https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
The Extended Journey is also the winner of the still nonexistent award The Temporal Jester quite, frankly the best book I read in the year 2013.
I will select 5 winners at random from those who answer the following discussion question:
If you were transported to the past by any means, are there circumstances under which you would intentionally change the future? Save the world? Win the lottery? Make up with that lost love? Think big or think small, but have fun and watch out for butterflies.