SciFi and Fantasy Book Club discussion
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A self-publishing renaissance? Most writers making less than $1k a year
V.W. wrote: "First of all, volunteer review groups in places like this should be more focused and pro-active. "Volunteer groups are probably going to do what's most fun and easiest, and whether they should is moot.
Mary wrote: "V.W. wrote: "First of all, volunteer review groups in places like this should be more focused and pro-active. "Volunteer groups are probably going to do what's most fun and easiest, and whether ..."
Fun and easiest is reading what you already like to read, and the groups (like this one) are already set up to channel readers according to interest, and most review sections in forums are already divided in very general genre classifications.
My suggestion was for said classifications to be more specific so that committed/regular reviewers would know what they were in for - not what the reviewers themselves should or should not do.
Kevan wrote: "This article from Guardian Books offers another perspective on self-pub."That's the kind of article that the OP was offering the counter for.
While there's nothing particularly wrong about the article's particulars, it does focus only on the successful self-publishers while discussing the pitfalls for new/mid-list authors in traditional publishing, which feeds the unrealistic expectations of some people.
A more realistic approach is to realize from the start that as a self publisher, you're a small fish in a very wide ocean. You're not likely to make the big time with your first book, or your second, or possibly not even your seventh or tenth. Play for the long term, and along the way expect to have to do a lot of work.
L.G.A. wrote: "Think of two guys on the corner with their hands out.#1) Holds a sign - "Need money for food for my kids. Lost my Job and My home."
#2) Just stands with his hand out for your spare change..."
The way I'd look at spending a lot of time on marketing a small catalog vs creating a larger catalog with a minimal marketing push would go more like this:
Think of two guys looking for hand outs.
Guy #1) Holds a huge sign and shouts into a megaphone - "I need money for food for my kids. Lost my Job and My home!" [This guy's only got one book published.]
Guy #2) Just stands on a corner with a tiny sign that says the same thing; carries no megaphone . . . but on 5 other corners around the city he has clones holding the same tiny sign. [This guy's got 6 books published.]
On the shared corner, the second guy isn't going to get noticed much. But Guy #1 has no presence at all on the other 5 corners. Who has more opportunities to get a hand out?
More published works = more opportunities for people to find your work, and every person who finds one, finds all of them.
Not saying that a big marketing push is useless--you never know what will work--but you can spend a lot of time and money on one and get little or no return. Especially if you've only got one book out there.
Another interesting article: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/deborah..."3. Book promotion is not for the fainthearted. With over 400,000 self-published titles a year, getting a self-published book noticed is a challenge even for professional book promoters. Book promotion requires traditional marketing, social media marketing, guerrilla marketing and a bag of chips. An even greater challenge is that promotion must be done within a limited time frame. Providing advanced copies to booksellers can be problematic for self-published titles, especially with publishers like Createspace that do not offer pre-distribution copies. Booksellers, book reviewers, notable book bloggers, radio and newspapers require advance copies to promote a book. A successful book campaign begins six months prior to the book release and continues for at least another three to six months after the release. After six to nine months, the book is no longer new and it becomes very difficult to get it noticed among the over 35,000 new titles released each month...and those are just the self-published titles."
"Quality will out."In time. 'Tis true, though.
"A successful book campaign begins six months prior to the book release and continues for at least another three to six months after the release. After six to nine months, the book is no longer new"That's very much from a traditional publishing perspective, though. The differences with self-publishing are 1) in the six months you spend pre-hyping a book, you could write and publish at least one additional book instead. It's traditional publishing that moves at the glacial 1-2 year pace to put out a book. 2) Unlike books in brick & mortar bookstores, self-published books do not get pulled from the shelf and returned/destroyed after a few months. Once your self-published book is available for sale, it's available forever/until you the author unpublish it, whichever comes first. And you never know if a book will take off sometime down the road - it's happened before that a book several months or even a few years old suddenly gets discovered or rediscovered.
V.W. wrote: "First of all, volunteer review groups in places like this should be more focused and pro-active. Using SF as an example, one review cluster would actively search out new self pubbed (say) Military SF, while another would search out Space Opera, and so forth.
This triage method would reduce the amount of actual books that any one group of reviewers would have to look at. It would also perform the review with the base assumption that (say) Military SF is a *good thing* and only comment on how well it is written, plotted, etc."
Here you are assuming too many things:
1) That these groups work together
2) That there is an organizing body
3) That the blog(s) will not be overrun IF they do what you suggested.
I ran a small blog with some friends. We only reviewed now and again. We used to get SLAMMED with craptasic books on a daily basis. So many books and so many BAD books that we just stopped. It was overwhelming and depressing.
We'd turned into a slush pile. And it was not fun. It became WORK and we are not paid employees.
We were simply readers. But we were being treated as Betas and editors. Tried to be nice. Nice gets you treated worse. Had one girl who sent me...a smorgasbord of bullshit. The writing stank. The formatting stank. The idea was decent but damn. It was PAINFUL to read. I stopped 2 chapters in like, "I'm being fucked. Royally and with no lube. This is a joke. I'm done."
Tried to be nice about it and sent the book back with the review I WOULD have published. Then I (being nice) gave her some places to look for resources so she could hone her craft. Her response? Trying to explain the issues I had away and then sending me back the damn book 3 months later. "It's been fixed!" I emailed her back and told her there was NO WAY it was fixed in that short period of time. She got an attitude but went away. She came back again about 6 months later. It was at that point that I just stopped talking to her. Being nice was too much work.
MrsJoseph (taking back my data & giving GR the middle finger) wrote: "I ran a small blog with some friends. We only reviewed now and again. We used to get SLAMMED with craptasic books on a daily basis..."Wow. I feel for you. That's exactly what I would expect in this environment, though.
Just go to amazon and read a dozen "Look Inside" on self-published works and you can see the tip of the iceberg.
Anyone doing a review blog has my sympathy. More so because almost universally the "Top X Self-Publishing Marketing Tips" articles online start with #1 - Send your junk to review blogs!
I can't imagine running a blog like that without charging a consideration fee just to review the first 1 or 2 chapters...But if you do that, then you get slagged as being a money grabbing scam.
**Shrug**
Yeah. Basically.I run a personal blog now. I review there but I don't accept review requests. In fact, there's no email address on my blog so no one can contact me.
Of course, I've had people drop review requests into my comments section. DELETE!
MrsJoseph (taking back my data & giving GR the middle finger) wrote: "V.W. wrote: "First of all, volunteer review groups in places like this should be more focused and pro-active. Using SF as an example, one review cluster would actively search out new self pubbed (..."
I was actually talking about review sections in groups like this one and related forums, which are already structured.
Setting up a "review" blog is painting a target on your back. One way out might be to state on the main page that you will only publish reviews for books that you like and fix the number of reviews per month. Ones you don't like or are not top ranked are out of luck. It's your site.
V.W. wrote: "I was actually talking about review sections in groups like this one and related forums, which are already structured.Setting up a "review" blog is painting a target on your back. One way out might be to state on the main page that you will only publish reviews for books that you like and fix the number of reviews per month. Ones you don't like or are not top ranked are out of luck. It's your site. "
I guess. It would be difficult to review on a group. But the problems would still be the same.
As to the review blog - not worried about it anymore. I just ignore everyone.
Right now I've challenged myself to read a few chapters of some of SPA work I've collected. That always gets them excited but I don't take requests so... Life is easier for me.
Byl wrote: ...As a potential reviewer--I've never really done this being newly active and essentially a new sign-up here--..."Now you've done it. Everyone and his grandma will be sending you books to review :-P
Best tell us which ones you like to read before you have the same problem that's been discussed here.
I can keep you busy for quite a while if you take "anything".
Al wrote: "Byl wrote: ...As a potential reviewer--I've never really done this being newly active and essentially a new sign-up here--..."Now you've done it. Everyone and his grandma will be sending you book..."
Heh. Oops. I was writing more in the context of an already-organized group or forum topic. Newbie mistake. I would do something like that more in a social context if that exists--think book review club--but that said I have a full plate of books in my to read pile at the moment and don't expect that to change anytime soon. I still have quite a bit more to explore and poke at on GR.
Byl wrote: "Heh. Oops. I was writing more in the context of an already-organized group or forum topic. Newbie mistake. I would do something like that more in a social context if that exists--think book review club--but that said I have a full plate of books in my to read pile at the moment and don't expect that to change anytime soon. I still have quite a bit more to explore and poke at on GR. "There used to be a book review club here. Not sure what happened to it.
Re: message 42Hi Guys
And thanks for the responses, particularly MrsJoseph, DavidO, Byl , and L.G.A.
I shall be giving some thought to your advice - I think the only thing that did not immediately sound right to me was MrsJoseph's criticism of the cover - and even there, I shall look (and think) carefully.
Thanks again
Alan wrote: " MrsJoseph's criticism of the cover - and even there, I shall look (and think) carefully."Just wanted to change this to:
"MrsJoseph's and DavidO's criticism of the cover - and even there, I shall look (and think) carefully."
Alan wrote: "Byl wrote: "I don't know what the mechanism will be for the better self-published books to rise to the top. Over the short run it will be the distributors. Over the longer run sites like this will ..."Alan - I had the same worries about social media a couple of years ago when I was switching publisher for my second poetry collection. My new editor urged me to get active on Twitter as his authors who tweeted both sold better and had better connections across the poetry world. I was stumped as to how to do it. I was terrified of getting on there and having people think I was doing it just to try and sell books, or just looking like a loser and not having anything to say.
But I did it and survived - yay! The key is not to do it just to try and sell books, but to genuinely get into it first - enjoy it and talk about other things - yourself, what you are reading etc. Use it for discovery and sharing - the cool and interesting, the funny, the human. Follow other authors, and publishers reply to their tweets when you have something interesting to say, retweet tweets of theirs you think are good. It takes time, but people will follow you. But they'll follow you because you say interesting things about yourself, or because you follow them and they think you sound interesting, or because you tweet or retweet articles they are interested in.
Once you properly enjoy Twitter and are active on there, you will feel you have the right to tell people about how things are going with your book - after all, your writing is a part of who you are and Twitter is all about sharing yourself as well as anything else.
Beware becoming a human spambot, though. I've accidentally followed a couple of self-published authors who do pretty incessant hard promotion (ie Buy my book, in so many words - even using the same wordings over and over) and it (ahem) doesn't endear them to me.
And on the "is it worth it?" front...I've now also self-published a novel and I have to say that when I'm active on Twitter, I sell books. Don't get me wrong - I don't sell many, but I sell more than when I'm not active on Twitter. When I'm not active on Twitter things go eerily quiet.
So in short, I think it's worth it, but you have to tweet for the love of it in the first instance.
If you do go for it, good authors to follow are Neil Gaiman, William Gibson and Margaret Atwood. All tweet interesting stuff. And if it's not for you you can just quietly slip away...
Having a Facebook page on the other hand hasn't worked for me. I just don't enjoy doing it the same way as I enjoy Twitter. I worry more that I'm bothering people!
Sorry - a bit long-winded, but I hope it helps.
Cleland wrote: "Sorry - a bit long-winded, but I hope it helps. ..."Hi Cleland (Angela)
Many thanks - lots of advice, clearly based on experience and 'from the heart' - and not long-winded, this much detail is appreciated . . . I think I shall probably have to take your advice, though I must confess to considerable reluctance!
Various objections:-
The first is our background. Graham and I started writing back in the early 80s (Gods! 30 years ago!) and we did it initially as a sort of private joke. We have said to each other several times that A) if we had been able to produce quickly (by 1985 or thereabouts) what we have got now, we would have had a very good chance at a conventional publishing contract, and by now might well have been rich and/or famous . . . but the world moves on, tastes and markets change . . . we have missed that boat!
And B) "Rich" is not the point - we have both had reasonably successful careers as teachers (until fashions and bandwagons changed there as well and we both got the push) so we don't particularly need the money - but we would enjoy the fame!
Given those factors, we don't want to actually work at publishing/publicity - we want to write because we enjoy it! And Twitter, to me, looks like 'work' - and I have looked properly at it, I had to study it as teaching material when I worked for OU. Now that was three years ago, so it might have changed - but what I saw of it did not appeal to me at all. Partly, I suspect, this is a generational thing - with a few notable exceptions it seemed to be principally inhabited by people between a quarter and a half of my age. But fair enough, that is the principal market for what we write, so that is where I must go.
So I accept your points - it can work, it clearly has worked for you (and for a few other authors I have been in touch with) and it looks as if I shall have to force myself, reluctantly . . .
Thanks again for a carefully crafted message of advice. I shall have a look at your book (the Amazon reviews are quite promising!) and I have already checked through your websites and blog and noted that like me, you are running several 'threads' of your life.
One last thing - I was surprised you didn't advise me to run an active blog . . why not?
Alan...I don't know what you're thinking; I'm the opposite: I'd love the money, the fame I could do without!;)
I hate twitter. Too much, too overwhelming. I don't blame you for not getting involved in it. It's a cesspool masquerading as a madhouse.
Micah wrote: "Alan...I don't know what you're thinking; I'm the opposite: I'd love the money, the fame I could do without! ;)"Hi Micah
Understood - but the first thing I did when I saw this comment was go to your profile and check your age . . .
I don't know the details of your situation, but by current UK standards you would have another 10 years to go before you got your pension. I have mine, and a small amount of inheritance, and no family to leave it to. By most standards I am a long way from rich, but my income currently (just) exceeds my expenditure - and from that point on, I refer you to Mr Micawber.
Fame, on the other hand, would give me the status to publicly thumb my nose at some former colleagues who believed that children should be brought up to read certain approved texts - which in my opinion were boring as hell, and could be guaranteed to put kids off reading for ever! Guess I had better not give any examples at this point . . .
MrsJoseph (taking back my data & giving GR the middle finger) wrote: " It's a cesspool masquerading as a madhouse."Cesspool? I recently met some politicians (no names so I can't be sued). If you think Twitter is a cesspool, take a look at politics! Not just a cesspool, but a shark-infested one!
Alan wrote: "by current UK standards you would have another 10 years to go before you got your pension..."I live in the US. What is this pension thing of which you speak? [This isn't the time or place to go into that discussion!]
Seriously, once I retire from full time employment, I'll write full time. The sooner any $ comes my way from writing, the sooner I can say goodbye to the job that's paid my living for the last 24 years.
But I don't write for the $ (or else I would be writing erotica). I've been involved in art/music/writing all my adult life and have never managed to make a living at any of it (mostly because the business side of it really turns me off, but also because I prefer less commercially viable art/music/writing). So I don't expect riches. But being able to make a comfortable living from creative endeavors would be nice.
Fame, though, sounds like a pain in the you-know-what to me. Especially if you're not really making any money off it.
MrsJoseph (taking back my data & giving GR the middle finger) wrote: "It's a cesspool masquerading as a madhouse."Well, you know, it's what you make it ;-)
But seriously. I appreciate it's not for everyone, but I use it to keep in touch with authors I enjoy, keep in touch with poetry buddies, get headlines from news/science sites I rate, and get little pickups in the form of tweets from comedians I find funny. I was lucky enough to find I enjoyed it and that means I can use it to tweet about writing stuff too.
On the blogging front, Alan, I'm a bit of a novice, though before I stopped work to look after our kids I had to write a weekly blog post for our company blog, which I found agonising. I resisted blogging territory for a long time because it seemed like too much work and have only just taken the plunge. So I suppose that's why I didn't mention it. I enjoy it, but it is hard work, requiring (when you're me) big chunks of time and you've reminded me I haven't written anything on it this week yet :-(
Still swithering about switching on comments on my blog actually - I'm interested if any of you experienced bloggers have a take on that. I'm wary of trolls and extra admin, but I would like to see if I'm starting any conversations and feel it might be frustrating for readers not being able to comment...Thoughts anyone?
On fame vs money, apparently when I was five-ish my mum asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up and I said, "Famous."
Think I'd now downgrade that to "Recognised and comfortably-off." How the dreams of youth grow ragged at the edges...or something.
Cleland wrote: "MrsJoseph (taking back my data & giving GR the middle finger) wrote: "It's a cesspool masquerading as a madhouse."Well, you know, it's what you make it ;-)
But seriously. I appreciate it's not f..."
So many meltdowns happen there. *shudder*
Re: blog Comments
I allow comments on my blog but I moderate everything. Mostly because of SPAM and Bots (of which I get a lot) - but I have rather low traffic: I average around 20-30 views per day and mostly people who like specifically fantasy and romance books.
Not sure how I'd feel if I got real traffic.
Great idea. Some Goodreads groups sort of do this, but not to the extent you're talking about.
I think some are the problems are these:Writers often don't know how to market a book (I didn't) and there is a lot of contradictory info about.
Marketing on a low budget means a lot of avenues are simply not there and the line between a bit of promo and spamming is hard to fathom. Someone recently told me to mention my books to as many people as possible as often as possible and I disagree. Sometimes it is simply not appropriate. We have all seen the type of people who spam constantly with no other interaction and they tend to get avoided.
Another problem is target audience - is that the romance folks, for example, or the fantasy folks? If it is the romance folks then is it better to target the historical romance types or just romance readers in general?
There is also the idea within the reading community that SPAs are of a lower quality. Whilst this isn't true, it is a pervasive idea. And there ARE some books which are substandard but many are great.
Unfortunately, some indies are not willing to be patient and save the necessary funds to promote properly. Or they don't take the time to start grass roots and expand outward. Too many new authors want things to happen instantly. It can happen, but it's rare. Mostly, it long hours and hard work. I've sold quite a few books and make a good living, and I'm still out there promoting at least three hours a day.
A.L. wrote: "I think some are the problems are these:Writers often don't know how to market a book (I didn't) and there is a lot of contradictory info about.
Marketing on a low budget means a lot of avenues a..."
The spamming thing is definitely an issue. I've seen people waltz into a thread and just spam non-stop about their novel. Heck, when I first joined Goodreads, I saw another member clutter one of the groups I'm part of with a dozen separate threads about their books. You can imagine how well that went. Yeah, not well.
Yeah. But it's met with dismissive irritation. Not blatant hostility. It's not hard to puzzle out that a spammer is a first time author. Posters teach them a lesson then move on to their conversation.
If a person spams too much in my groups I kickban them. It's one of the only two rules:1. Don't be a douchebag
2. Don't Spam
Brian wrote: "Unfortunately, some indies are not willing to be patient and save the necessary funds to promote properly. Or they don't take the time to start grass roots and expand outward. Too many new authors ..."Some people don't have the option to save like that.
@ A.L.That's what the "Or" is about. Marketing without a budget is a grassroots effort. You must pay for it with money or pay for it with time.
I'm working on a very tight budget, but recently decided it was more cost and time effective to divert some money I made tutoring to pay for a little advertising rather than try to drum up interest in a promotion purely through social media.
By grassroots I mean close to home. There are local stores, libraries, if your book is child friendly, schools, local cable access, new papers, and other events. I know a woman who held a book signing in her back yard. She sold 50 copies and ended up with two dozen reviews that helped her get another 300 more amazon sales.
Brian wrote: "I know a woman who held a book signing in her back yard. She sold 50 copies and ended up with two dozen reviews that helped her get another 300 more amazon sales. "That is great! I wish more people did that.
Singer Jill Scott started that way. I'm from a college town and the year her first album came out - there was no real "promotion" as we think of it today. It was 100% grassroots word-of-mouth. The only marketing materials was a black piece of paper about the size and thickness of a paper bookmark. It said "Who is Jill Scott?" in big white font.
But it was plastered all over every college campus (and thus town). People actively went looking to find out who she was.
A.L. wrote: "Brian wrote: "Unfortunately, some indies are not willing to be patient and save the necessary funds to promote properly. Or they don't take the time to start grass roots and expand outward. Too man..."When I was writing my first book, I took on extra work to pay for what I needed. Not much, just a little here and there where I could find it. It added up in the end. I even saved aluminum. Sometimes it's a matter of "will or won't", not "can or can't".
I am not an expert in the art of promotion. The following suggestions were accumulated during 14 months of writing, 11 months of learning and participating in the publishing process, and 2 1/2 years of having the end result available for public consumption.Active participation in websites designed to bring avid readers and writers together within a continuous communication forum can be a very effective promotional tool. However, it is imperative that authors avoid becoming too aggressive or self-centered and avoid certain practices.
Avoid spamming. It is annoying and causes more harm than good. If your work speaks for itself, don't interrupt!
Avoid the "I" syndrome. Excessive use of personal pronouns - I, me, my, mine - often irritates readers.
Resist the temptation to rate and review your own work. It is akin to a proud new parent's opinion of how cute, adorable, and exceptional their little bundle of joy is.
Proofread postings to a discussion prior to adding it. If your post is riddled with mis-spellings, improper punctuation, and bad grammar, the reader may presume that your book will be as well.
Proactively soliciting and scheduling events such as book signings and/or formal presentations at book stores, libraries, reading clubs, and literary conventions are a great way for authors to introduce their book and themselves to the reading public. Networking is a very effective promotional tool.
For those fortunate enough to have a contract with a mainline publisher, the recommended course of action is to allow the publicist and marketing representative assigned to promote your work to do their job and just stay out of their way.
Express your appreciation for the energy and time they expend on your behalf by following up on every lead they provide and be well-prepared to act professionally at scheduled events.
Not all aspiring authors will be commercially successful; but no one who has tried their best can be considered a failure. I look forward to being just one of many who read your book someday.
Outside of the sales issue, some books just aren't likely to sell to a trade publisher. Poetry has had a strong self-publishing culture for a long time. Short story collections are also pretty common in self-publishing, as publisher deals are very limited for them. Some novel genres aren't very popular. Or alternatively, are too popular and have become saturated. Self-publishing may not bring in millions for most people, but it is a home for those projects which are difficult to sell for reasons other than quality. Low sales may be expected for those projects, but that doesn't mean they weren't a success for the type of project.Personally, I'd like to do a bit of both. I have some self-published stuff, but I'm hoping some of my future projects will be more commercial. I need to finance my cupcake decorating habit somehow.
I'll tell ya, because of my luck with finding a job in my degree field and some medical issues, I'm probably banking more on the whole self-publishing thing than I should while I continue trying to find something. I write because I love to write and tell stories, but is that enough? I just don't know.I don't know what I'm doing marketing wise, and I don't have the money to spend on it. I'm just throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks. Ha.
Sure enough though, I'm going to keep writing because that is what I love to do. The fact that I can publish to the Kindle just means that I now have a chance to make a living off of it that I didn't have before.
Didn't work out for me to get my Ph.D, so maybe I'll be able to live this dream. You don't know until you try, right?
J.M. wrote: "I'll tell ya, because of my luck with finding a job in my degree field and some medical issues, I'm probably banking more on the whole self-publishing thing than I should while I continue trying to..."I live in Thailand, so neighbourhood marketing is out of the question, since no one reads English.
I find that GR is as good a place as any to publicise your work. I started out writing because there was a certain kind of stories that were not being published (self or mainstream).
I'm not getting rich, but I am getting a useful stream of income, and sales are slowly rising.
Sheer numbers help too. Having 10 books out is better than 1 and so forth. When someone "discovers" one of your books, that isn't the end.
L.G.A. wrote: "Marketing. Marketing. Marketing.There, I said it.You may write the next great classic, but if no one knows about it...
A mentor told me that the next book is always the best marketing tool. Ther..."
You are absolutely correct.
I've been writing since I was eleven, and finally decided to publish one of several novels - just to say I did it. However, as the process went on, I found myself enjoying the rediscovery of my graphic design skills, and utilizing my marketing and branding skills learned in my daily job.
To me, the writing appeals to my creative side, and the marketing, data analytics, and investment decision-making pleases my consultant side.
I'm actually in the middle of ginning up a web-based lessons learned article on my website (http://www.susherevans.com - it's not available just yet) that speaks to how to market on Facebook, Twitter, Goodreads, etc. You have to consider things like investment money - how much of your own hard earned cash should be put in what advertising vehicle, and what kind of payback should you expect. And you have to look at what your intent is - if you have a series, is it worth it to under-price your first book to build your audience base.
For me, I'm looking at making anywhere between $2.60-$5.50/book (ebook and print, respectively). Right now, as a new author, I'm interested in building my audience and credibility. So I'm okay with shipping free copies of my book to potential readers and reviewers (feel free to PM me if you're interested).
And on that note...
Double Life, the first book in the Razia series, is available for pre-order now on Nook and iBook, and will be available on all eBook stores and Amazon.com on June 12th. For more info, check out my website:
http://www.susherevans.com/book-info
J.M. wrote: "I'll tell ya, because of my luck with finding a job in my degree field and some medical issues, I'm probably banking more on the whole self-publishing thing than I should while I continue trying to..."I was in much he same place though in my case I was more undereducated for many jobs. spent my youth traveling around the world in the army then with the pipeline until I adopted a few kids... Now I write. I do well enough for myself so for those of you still starting, keep it up, and the best of luck.
I indie published because I enjoy the creative control it allows. I have a wonderful editor, a great cover artist, and I get to write and promote at my own pace. What's not to like about that?
Thaddeus wrote: "Blogs and review sites may rise to become Gatekeepers (for example, a seal of approval from Site X could end up being worth a lot to a self-published author)."Hmmm. Yes and no. There's a feeling that all these 'pro-am' blog/book review sites are somehow tuned into buying patterns. (If they like you, you'll do well sort of thinking) They're not, or at least not all of them are. They're just readers with opinions who make those opinions known; they have no special talent for picking winners any more than the broad spectrum of agents have. So I'd advise authors looking to market through blogs to research their reviewers thoroughly - you wouldn't waste time sending your sample chapters to any old agent would you?
Mark wrote: "Thaddeus wrote: "Blogs and review sites may rise to become Gatekeepers (for example, a seal of approval from Site X could end up being worth a lot to a self-published author)."Hmmm. Yes and no. T..."
Most reviewers have very specific tastes, even when they say they will review (almost) anything. Their followers will also have corresponding tastes. It would be prudent to make sure your book falls within the reviewer's general preferences and limits in order to get a fair hearing/reading.
Mark wrote: "readers with opinions [...] have no special talent for picking winners any more than the broad spectrum of agents have." Agreed - so far as individual readers are concerned. The question is whether a mass average of opinions becomes valid - and how this is to be reached. Compare the 'crowdsourcing' and 'Wiki' concepts.
"So I'd advise authors looking to market through blogs to research their reviewers thoroughly - you wouldn't waste time sending your sample chapters to any old agent would you?..."
It depends how desperate you are . . . and whether you can even get a top agent or top reviewer (within your genre) to take an interest. I had a very good review from an Amazon top 500 reviewer - but it still didn't do me much good! You offer good advice, but not everyone is in a position to take it.
Brian wrote: "A.L. wrote: "Brian wrote: "Unfortunately, some indies are not willing to be patient and save the necessary funds to promote properly. Or they don't take the time to start grass roots and expand out..."I disagree, sometimes extra work or extra money simply isn't an option. Although it depends on individual circumstances, of course.
I don't make much but I do make some and unless I am lucky I doubt I'll ever be able to give up the day job. That is fine, for now.
After trying for years to get published via a publishing house (at a time when self-publishing was not widely practiced or even known), I gave up on trying to sell my novels. However, since writing for me is a hobby (and a major one), I then decided to simply put them online for free, so that others could get to know and enjoy them (my novels now enjoy over 90% approval rating, with my Goodreads.com average rating for my nine online novels presently at 4.44 stars after 32 ratings). While they don't bring me money, the results are certainly good for the ego and encourage me in continuing to write new stories. I say to other indie authors that can't get their books sold to continue writing anyway: imagination is too precious to be blocked by a simple lack of revenues.
SciFi and Fantasy Book Club
Books mentioned in this topic
Wrede on Writing: Tips, Hints, and Opinions on Writing (other topics)Double Life (other topics)
Authors mentioned in this topic
Hugh Howey (other topics)Patricia C. Wrede (other topics)
J.K. Rowling (other topics)
Debora Geary (other topics)
Hugh Howey (other topics)
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That's an excellent idea and very practical. As a potential reviewer--I've never really done this being newly active and essentially a new sign-up here--it would be easier to be more open to spending the time working through a book or books if it were a sub-genre that was of particular interest.