Bright Young Things discussion
This topic is about
A Farewell to Arms
Group Reads Archive
>
A Farewell to Arms by Ernest Hemingway (2014 Reading Challenge)
I've just got this out of the library and started reading - not sure if I have read it before many years ago. I'm immediately impressed by the famous terseness of Hemingway's prose. Has anyone else started reading 'A Farewell to Arms'?
I read it years ago. Am looking forward to rereading it.
I will certainly be reading it sometime however my next Ernest Hemingway book will be A Moveable Feast, which we are due to read for our February 2014 non-fiction read. I have it out of the library.
I've realised that I definitely have read it before, but it was probably 30 years ago! More recently I saw the 1932 film directed by Frank Borzage, starring Gary Cooper and Helen Hayes, which I liked a lot but I can now see there were a lot of changes from the book - Hemingway didn't really like the film even though he and Cooper were close friends. If anyone decides to see this version, I'd just like to warn you that there are two versions - the first time I saw it, I saw a 79-minute version which has been censored so heavily that it makes no sense! The film should really be 10 minutes longer. I did review this film a while back at my movie blog and explained about the different versions - but I should say that the review does contain spoilers.Once I've finished reading the book I'm hoping to see the 1950s remake starring Rock Hudson and Jennifer Jones - has anyone seen that version?
I'm not sure if I ever saw the remake. One of the comments at IMDB saw that Hemingway disowned it.I have liked the earlier version.
Apparently there is 'restored' version of 'A Moveable Feast' coming out about April. How the author intended it to be...
^ I'm not even sure he intended it for publication. His fourth wife put it together and then his grandson revised it about ten years ago. I assume some scholars have gone back to the manuscripts and made some more changes. Anyway that's all grist for the mill in Feb. For now let's talk A Farewell to Arms - which I am very much looking forward to reading.
The Kindle copy I have of Farewell includes alternative endings (per the introduction/forward/prelude or whatever it is called which was written by his grandson).
Thanks Jan! I'll have look at what is available. Ta!
Many thanks for that information, Jan - it looks as if the Hemingway Library edition of 'A Farewell to Arms', which is available on Kindle and also as a print book, is far superior to the other editions - with 47 different endings, many deleted passages and forewords by Hemingway himself, his son and his grandson!After just reading the novel in another edition, I've just "looked inside" at Amazon and read the various forewords, which are full of interesting information and insights _ I'm now not sure whether to get a print copy of it or download it.
PS, here's a link to a New York Times article about the special edition - it discusses the various endings, so it's an article to look at after reading the book!There are also free Spark Notes
about the novel online and I thought the essay there about themes, motifs and symbols was interesting.
^ Very helpful information - thanks Judy and Jan
A few months ago, we saw the film version of The Silver Linings Playbook. There is a wonderful scene in which the main character, played by Bradley Cooper, rouses his parents in the middle of the night to share his opinion of Hemingway's choice for the ending of A Farewell to Arms. I thought the scene was really,really funny, especially since I share the character's opinion of Hemingway's choice :-)I recommend waiting until you've read A Farewell to Arms and formed your own opinion before reading/viewing The Silver Linings Playbook.
I really enjoyed that film. Great scene too.
I haven't seen 'Silver Linings Playbook' yet but would like to do so soon and will watch out for that scene, Portia.Just came across an article in the Daily Telegraph
about the original of Catherine, a nurse called Agnes who had an affair with Hemingway when he was recovering from injury in Italy. A new book, Love Letters of the Great War, includes the 'Dear John' letter she sent him, explaining that at 26 she was too old for him at 18 - 'you're just a kid'. Strange to realise just how young he was when he served as an ambulance driver in Italy, but of course so many of them were teenagers.
Very interesting, Judy, because wasn't Hedley eight years his senior?
Must admit I don't know much about Hemingway, Portia, but you are right, there was a gap of nearly 8 years - I have just checked. Something else I found interesting was that the wording of the letter sounds rather like the way Catherine speaks in the novel, especially when Aggie says "You know I’m not really bad, & don’t mean to do wrong" - sounds a lot like Catherine repeatedly describing herself as a good girl.
Well, and I spelled her name incorrectly. It was Hadley.
^ ^ ^ ^ The link to the article in the Daily Telegraph article doesn't work for me.I googled it and found it...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/wo...
Thanks Judy.
By the by, Hadley appears regularly in our February non-fiction read A Moveable Feast.
On the question of the various alternative endings to A Farewell to Arms that New York Times article that Judy highlights concludes with...
After reading the various endings, Ms. Moldow added, she didn’t question the author’s decision; the actual ending — cool and passionless after an epic tale of war and love, with the protagonist leaving a hospital in the rain — has stood the test of time.
“Ultimately,” she said, “I think we have to be glad that he went with the ending that he went with.”
On that basis I think I'll content myself with the original ending - and version.
Nigeyb wrote: "^ ^ ^ ^ The link to the article in the Daily Telegraph article doesn't work for me.Thanks, Nigeyb - I checked and I had a double 'http' in my link, so have now removed the second one! Glad you found the article, anyway.
It's hard to imagine a greater ending than the one he decided on, but I'd still like to see how he got there.
I've just posted my review - thought I'd post it in this thread too. There are no really major spoilers, but I'll hide the last couple of paragraphs anyway as they do mention one plot point which might come as a shock otherwise.I'd read 'A Farewell to Arms' once before, many years ago, and the thing that had stuck in my mind was the love story - helped by a more recent viewing of the 1930s film starring Gary Cooper and Helen Hayes.
Going back to the novel now, though, what really struck me more than the romance was the portrayal of the First World War on the front line in Italy. Hemingway's drawing of the weary ambulance drivers is very convincing, not surprisingly, since he served in this role himself as a teenager. One thing that really comes across is the constant hunger, as each snatched meal is sharply described. There are also telling incidents like the meeting with a scared young soldier who has deliberately removed the truss from his hernia, in the hope that it will get worse and he will have to go to hospital.
I've been reading a couple of writers whose style seems rather more highly-wrought lately, and it was refreshing to come to Hemingway's famously spare prose, with not a word wasted. At times he uses expressions which would seem like clichés in the hands of a lesser writer - such as "he was a fine boy", of one of the soldiers. However, phrases like this seem all the more poignant because they are so restrained, with such a distance between what is being said here and the novel's whole mood and setting.
(view spoiler)
"Whose style is more highly-wrought". Well written, Judy!
Thanks, Portia, very kind of you!
I've now seen the 1950s film starring Rock Hudson and Jennifer Jones, and felt it was worth watching. This adaptation feels very slow and wordy at times compared to the 1932 film, which I liked much more... but the 1950s film sticks more closely to the book some of the time and does keep a lot of Hemingway's dialogue intact. I've read that Hemingway disowned this version because he thought Jones was too old, but I can't say that bothered me much. And her English accent is perfect!
I just found a few First World War poems by Hemingway online - as literature, they maybe aren't of the same standard as his prose, but interesting to read as something he wrote at the time.
I just finished reading this. I really enjoyed it! Going in, I expected more of a focus on the love story but was surprised that the majority of the book seemed to focus on the war. Usually I get quickly disinterested in war novels, but instead I found the war sections of the novel to be more believable and enthralling than the love story (that may have been the point). The really affecting prose came from the war sections. The only time I really ever 'felt' the romance was towards the end.Also, I read through the articles that were posted, and was especially interested in the NYT article Judy linked to. I noticed that ending no. 34 mentioned in the article was used at a different place in the book, it seems word for word. I wonder if Hemingway liked the quote so much that he decided to find a new home for it in the novel? Either way, I think the quote sums up the novel pretty well so I'm glad he found a way to incorporate it.
Amanda, glad to hear you loved this book too! In the introduction to the special edition, it says that Scott Fitzgerald was especially enthusiastic about that line when he saw it in another part of the novel and suggested it should be the ending, so Hemingway tried it. So I'm guessing maybe he decided to put it back in the place where it was originally. Definitely agree that it is a great line.
That makes so much sense, thanks Judy. I think I prefer Hemingway's placement of the quote.
Having just finished A Moveable Feast, I was struck by how similar the writing style was in A Farewell to Arms. If I'd read Farewell without knowing it was written by Hemingway, I think I would have guessed. This was a much more polished work, but it was clearly from the hand of the same author. Even some of the stories were the same--the decision of Frederic/Ernest and Catherine/Hadley to wear their hair at the same length, the skiing episodes, the horseracing...As a WWI novel, there was a lot of description that made me feel like I was there. The account of the retreating army was very interesting. While Henry said there was no more disorder in a retreat than in an advance, this retreat sounded pretty disorganized. Hemingway described an army and its leadership as confused and poorly run as Waugh's in the next war. He detailed the soldiers' doubts that it would ever end and their disillusionment with the idea of war as glorious.
For me, one of the most powerful passages was in chapter 27. Lt. Henry is speaking about the war and its supposed sacredness. He says, "I had seen nothing sacred, and the things that were glorious had no glory and the sacrifices were like the stockyards at Chicago if nothing was done to the meat except to bury it....Abstract words such as glory, honor, courage, or hallow were obscene beside the concrete names of villages.." He is beginning to make his farewell to arms, although he has not yet come to that decision.
The whole book had a very auto-biographical feel. (Well, that's the point of a first-person narrative, isn't it?) It also had a sense of immediacy to it that made me forget it was written 10 years after the end of the war. Looking forward to reading Goodbye to All That to compare an actual memoir with this novel.
I forgot to say that it was also interesting to read something about the Italian front, as opposed to the more usual Western front fare. The details were different but the war-weariness was the same.
^ As soon as I read your comment Barbara I had a clear recollection of this book. I now realise I read it about 10-15 years ago. Funny how the phrase "the Italian front" suddenly unlocked my memories of this book. I will be reading it again for this challenge and feel very enthused given the comments so far. Thanks all for your contributions so far, which I have found interesting and enjoyable.
Barbara wrote: "I forgot to say that it was also interesting to read something about the Italian front, as opposed to the more usual Western front fare. The details were different but the war-weariness was the same."Yes Barbara, I think a lot of people forget about the Italian Front or are not sure which side Italy was on. I don't think I knew anything about it before I read this book for the first time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_...
A teenage Hemingway did serve with the Italian army for a few months as an ambulance driver and this book is based on his experiences.
I have read it before, as I said, but I think I will read it again now. None of the ones I have not read are available yet.
I have just finished reading...
A Farewell to Arms by Ernest Hemingway
I raced through it in a day. This was the second time I have read A Farewell to Arms. It is set during the Italian campaign of World War One and is based on Ernest Hemingway's own war experiences. Published in 1929, A Farewell to Arms is the first-person account of Frederic Henry, an American volunteer in the ambulance corps of the Italian Army. Henry starts an affair with a recently bereaved English nurse, Catherine Barkley, and the book charts the story of their relationship.
The first part of the book is based on Hemingway's experiences as an ambulance driver and this section is very convincing and evocative. What follows is fictional. Hemingway did not take part in the retreat, after the Battle of Caporetto, however, despite not being informed by first hand experience, it is a very powerful section particularly the shooting of retreating officers by the Italian battle police.
A Farewell to Arms is a moving love story, and an evocative account of life during World War One.
4/5
I've just started this, only about 50 pages in, but I agree with comments above that it has a very similar feel to A Moveable Feast
^ Thanks Pink. Keep us informed. It's interesting you draw a parallel with A Moveable Feast as I really couldn't get on with that one at all but, in contrast, enjoyed A Farewell to Arms.
Perhaps I was in a more receptive mood?
Despite drawing a parallel, I'm finding the same thing...I didn't much like A Moveable feast, but so far I'm enjoying A Farewell to Arms much more. I think it's the writing style that I find similar, with sparse wording and short clipped sentences. This feels more refined and is flowing like a proper story, plus I like the war topic.
I'm 38% in (Chapter 23) and I liked A Moveable Feast more than I'm liking this. This is just okay to me. I think I read it before so that may have something to do with it.
I finished this a week ago, but haven't updated as I wanted to digest my thoughts. Firstly I enjoyed this so much more than A Moveable Feast and think my opinions are pretty similar to Nigeyb on these 2 books. I found the writing style similar but this book was so much more polished and flowed really well. I'm not sure that I can put my finger on just what I liked, but I guess it helped that I enjoy war novels, plus I actually liked the short no nonsense writing style, which I was surprised about. I now have no idea whether I'd like Hemingway's other novels, but I guess I'll have to give them a try one day.
Thanks Pink. That's really interesting.I have also read For Whom the Bell Tolls, which is Ernest Hemingway's book about the Spanish Civil War, and it's worth a read. Slightly better than A Farewell to Arms I'd say.
We did have a group read of The Sun Also Rises a while ago. I think I may have been the only one who liked it. But you could find that discussion in the group discussion archives.
I haven't even heard of The Sun Also Rises. I think the only other Hemingway books I know of are For Whom the Bell Tolls and The Old Man and the Sea, which I guess are his more famous books. He seems to get such mixed reviews that it's hard to know what else to try. I'll take a look through the archives to see what discussions I can find. Nigeyb, interesting that you slightly preferred For whom the bell tolls, as we've had similar opinions about Hemingway for the other two.
Pink wrote: "I haven't even heard of The Sun Also Rises. I think the only other Hemingway books I know of are For Whom the Bell Tolls and The Old Man and the Sea, which I guess are his more famous books. He see..."It is post-WWI novel about expatriates from England & the US. Recovery is still going on for some. And they go to the bullfights.
I just had a look at the old thread, it sounds like that one split opinions too, though it looks interesting.
I have taken a while to write about this, as it was a book that rather unexpectedly changed my opinion in the final chapter. Having only read one other Hemingway novel (The old man and the sea) which I enjoyed, particularly from a stylistic point of view, and having read about Hemingway (including in Everybody was so young) I had mentally composed a review of the book before I read the last chapter. It went along the lines of - great to read about the Italian front, captured the chaos and boredom of war beautifully, again loved the short, punchy style, but he cannot draw a female character to save himself. Then I read the final chapter and had the horrifying (yet amazing) sensation of seeing the feelings and atmosphere of the most traumatic day of my life on the page - suffice to say that, thanks to living in the West in the 21st century, my outcomes were rather better than Cat's. And, given that I am female, I redrafted my review - Hemingway can draw a female character. Generally not sympathetically or necessarily flatteringly, but he certainly can do it.
I'm currently (very slowly!) reading a selection of Hemingway short stories, The Snows of Kilimanjaro. I was interested to find that one of the tales included, 'A Very Short Story', written in 1924-1925, is based on the real-life relationship between Hemingway and nurse Agnes von Kurowsky which inspired 'A Farewell to Arms' a few years later. This story includes the end of their relationship and the 'Dear John' letter she sent him.I'm impressed by this collection, which is basically a reprint of his first book of short stories In Our Time, but with a couple of later stories added at the start. Must admit I was slightly confused by the inclusion of 'vignettes', single-paragraph mini-stories at the start of the main stories, but these contain some of the most powerful writing - a lot of them are also about the First World War.
Erin, I appreciated reading your reactions to this book - it must have been a shock to find that last chapter being so close to your experiences. It's good to know that the outcomes for you were better.I keep changing my mind about his female characters - I definitely think he is better on men, but Catherine does seem real.
I get impatient with the claim that Hemingway cannot create strong female characters. I suppose that "strong" mean self-reliant, independent, and so forth -- just like the men, in fact. Hemingway characters are opaque, largely unknowable -- just like other people of either gender. I personally think that Hemingway men are not typical of men generally, but don't conclude therefore that he can't create male characters. Can someone explain to me what exactly this criticism means?
I think "a strong female character" means more a believable, realistic, well-developed character, not necessarily a self-reliant one. I think the criticism is that Hemingway's women are cardboard cutouts, not real people. I haven't read enough Hemingway to have an opinion, but I THINK that's what people mean by the comment.....
Hmm. Believable, realistic, well-developed to whom? Why is it that all writing has to have such characters? I would say the same about male characters by some women writers. I generally don't read such books, but I don't consider it a fault of the author's -- strong men are just not important to the story, that's all.
Bright Young Things
Books mentioned in this topic
The Snows of Kilimanjaro and Other Stories (other topics)In Our Time (other topics)
The Sun Also Rises (other topics)
For Whom the Bell Tolls (other topics)
A Farewell to Arms (other topics)
More...
Authors mentioned in this topic
Ernest Hemingway (other topics)Ernest Hemingway (other topics)
Ernest Hemingway (other topics)
Ernest Hemingway (other topics)
2014 will mark 100 years since the start of the First World War. Here at BYT we plan to mark the war and its consequences by reading 12 books that should give anyone who reads them a better understanding of the First World War.
The First World War was a turning point in world history. It claimed the lives of over 16 million people across the globe and had a huge impact on those who experienced it. The war and its consequences shaped much of the twentieth century, and the impact of it can still be felt today.
The BYT 2014 Reading Challenge will be our way of helping to remember those who lived, fought and served during the years 1914-18.
There's a thread for each of the 12 books.
Welcome to the thread for...
A Farewell to Arms by Ernest Hemingway
(Category: Novel Allies)
You can read the books in any order. Whilst you're reading them, or after you've finished, come and share your thoughts and feelings, ask questions, and generally get involved. The more we all participate, the richer and more fulfilling the discussions will be for us all. Here's to a stimulating, informative, and enjoyable BYT 2014 Reading Challenge.