The Fault in Our Stars
discussion
Am I the only one who hates this book with burning passion?
Katie wrote: "Well its your opinion. Some could argue it is not a piece of crap."Yeah, but this thread isn't meant for them; it's meant for users like nimotalai. :)
Katie wrote: "Well its your opinion. Some could argue it is not a piece of crap."And some could argue that it is
Pilcrow wrote: "Katie wrote: "Well its your opinion. Some could argue it is not a piece of crap."Yeah, but this thread isn't meant for them; it's meant for users like nimotalai. :)"
See at least someone gets it :)
Katie wrote: "You both gave it two stars instead of one. Why?"I don't like to be too harsh on a book, and I've read books that are just as bad. And I like the authors name. You gave it 4 stars, why not 5?
Katie wrote: "5 is reserved for really good books that I could read over and over again and never get bored."Je deteste 'the fault in our stars', parce que c'est ennuyeux et nul..cependant mes Amis amour john green
Aly wrote: "@Nimotalai: Oh my God, your passion is amazing!! You put in the rage we all feel! Kudos to you, dear!:))@Katie: I went to a Catholic school in Rome. They're hardcore Catholics.
@Pilcrow: I'm gl..."
Lol thanks!!!
Katie, I gave it 2 stars because I like the way John Green writes when he isn't trying to show off, which is unfortunately only like 10% of the time. Also, the book has a good sense of place - I live an hour and a half from Indianapolis, and, despite its faults, it made Indy seem like a place i might want to check out. I've only ever been to the airport. :)
The thing I don't like about the book is the way Augustus deals with methophors, sure you can like them and use them to understand life better, but to live by them? Literally? Augustus and Hazel are both just too much. He's wants to be a hero, he's obsessed with it. She's just the other way around. IDK, I don't hate the book, but I also don't understand why everyone loves it so much. I had to stop often when reading it the first time, just to cring because of the many stereotypes, you know? I can't really explain well what I think is wrong about the book, it's fairly good, but it's not as perfect as people make it seem to be.
Neats wrote: "I wasn't blown away by this book either. It was my first John Green novel and I'm not sure that I would choose to read another one in hurry."I truly agree with you.
Ayesha wrote: "Veronica wrote: "Okay so I read your review and I wanted to response to it more directly, I've read the book a few months ago and I enjoyed it, it had it's problems but on a whole it was enjoyable...."i know everyone's entitled to their own opinion but how do you believe that any child(teen) with cancer can not be wise? That's complete bullsh#t. Some people with cancer can be smarter that any normal teenager. And not all teenagers who have cancer are confused angry of depressed. Sometime these teenagers want to live their life without feeling sorry for themselves so they are happy smart and they enjoy what they have in their lives. Maybe these teenagers sometimes are depressed at times but they won't spend every second of their lives feeling sorry for themselves. Keep this in mind.
Emma wrote: "i know everyone's entitled to their own opinion but how do you believe that any child(teen) with cancer can not be wise"Because cancer is just an awful thing that happens to people, a lot of people, and it doesn't make everyone who gets it wiser or better in any way. That is the problem with books like this, its puts the pressure on people with cancer, especially kids, to come out "better" for having been through it. This is unfair.
To be honest, I found this book truly alarming, as I don't think it portrayed the hardships of cancer as well as it could have.
Emma wrote: "Ayesha wrote: "Veronica wrote: "Okay so I read your review and I wanted to response to it more directly, I've read the book a few months ago and I enjoyed it, it had it's problems but on a whole it..."You might want to consider the effects of the drugs and treatments. The effects on mood which will in turn affect speech patterns. The out-of-the-ordinary for Hazel and Augustus is that they don't seem affected by their hardships at all. They seem Affected, but that's completely different. They talk too much of this book, and not enough of treatments, they don't vocalise their fears. Yeah, okay, they'd want time off from cancer, but they'd also seek reassurance from others in the same process. And Augustus starts the novel on remission, but he barely mentions the remission. Which is ass, because I go to an oncology Christmas party every year and remission is always the hot topic. It's how you get to know each other, because you're segregated throughout treatment.
And I know, I know, John probably didn't expect people to go in depth on that side of the storyline, but he should either have cut the cancer altogether, or only given it to one of them, that way he could plead character ignorance for any inconsistencies. Oh, but we can't bring it up with him, because he IS Millhouse VanHouten and because of that shitty ending Author's note.
These may be before many poster's times, but I wonder if anyone ever seen older movies like "Love Story", "Brian's Song" or "Dying Young"? Not every cancer story ever developed focuses on depicting the treatment like an episode of "ER" or "House". I think it's quite clear that the author didn't intend for this book to be a medical drama that chronicles the cancer treatment process. When Augustus first meets Hazel and asks her what's her story and he interrupts her and says "....not your cancer story. What's your story?" Also, I don't think the atmosphere at any singular event should be used as the basis to decide what is realistic for all cancer patients everywhere. I do the Avon Walk every year and there the "remission hot topics" also typically involve life plans outside of cancer, too. It's not necessarily always treatment. Things like travel plans, milestones and achievements, future goals. All types of people do the walk, including people who are terminally ill. That is what I was getting at when I talked about climbing the waterfall in Jamaica. The "image" that some have of a cancer patient in their final stages is not the only image of cancer, mentality toward cancer or side of cancer out there.
An elderly woman and a cancer patient completely kicked my ass in a bootcamp class that I took. To me that cancer story is every bit as realistic as the one of my friend dying from lymphoma. TFIOS is just one depiction of a story about people with cancer. I don't think he ever intended for it to be the quintessential model of a typical cancer patient. It's just one of many.
Charlotte wrote: "Katie wrote: "An then on godhatesgoths.com theres a page that say that J.K. Rowling is in a league with Lucifer>_
Sounds like the Westboro Baptist Church. They have a whole little McSeries of "God..."
Yikes.
Sounds like the Westboro Baptist Church. They have a whole little McSeries of "God..."
Yikes.
Katie wrote: "I dont even get why those people say stuff like that!!!! If you have ever read the bible, It mentions that God hates NOBODY!!!! He loves us all, no matter what!"Unless they're gay, non-virgin, belonging to any other religion, Proud or boastful people, and I'm pretty sure he wasn't too fond of the 2,821,364 people that he slaughtered in the bible
Charlotte wrote: "I don't know if the God of the bible hated all non-virgins. Probably just unmarried ones. If you were married you were supposed to multiply, and seeing as there was no in vitro back in the day of d..."Well then his hatred and murder is limited to all before mentioned people and unmarried non-virgins, and all women.
Sammy wrote: "Katie wrote: "I dont even get why those people say stuff like that!!!! If you have ever read the bible, It mentions that God hates NOBODY!!!! He loves us all, no matter what!"Unless they're gay, ..."
popping back in for a second only to say that everyone's different and people can believe in whatever religion they want to believe in. if you don't believe in god, that's fine, but don't try and make other people feel down on themselves for being a christian.
some people choose not to follow parts of the bible that others follow, (gay people are evil, abortion is evil, etc) and it's unfair of you to claim that an entire group believes only in hate because the westboro baptist church exists.
(also! don't want to get into an argument about religion so please don't take it that way. i'm just saying that we can all get along no matter what we believe in, you know? anyway.)
Katie wrote: "I dont even get why those people say stuff like that!!!! If you have ever read the bible, It mentions that God hates NOBODY!!!! He loves us all, no matter what!"
keep your chin up girl!
Bekah wrote: "Sammy wrote: "Katie wrote: "I dont even get why those people say stuff like that!!!! If you have ever read the bible, It mentions that God hates NOBODY!!!! He loves us all, no matter what!"Unless..."
I done nothing of the sort I stated my opinion and I find it wrong that someone was allowed to voice their love of God and I wasn't allowed to voice my negative opinion on religion, isn't that similar to what so many are saying on this thread? Why are people allowed to voice their positive opinion on this book but not a negative one, why is religion not the same? However I agree that this is the wrong place to discuss religion and I shall do it no further as I believe that should be saved for a discussion originally intended to be based on religious debates this is not one of those discussions or threads :)
@sammy glad we're not turning this into an argument! hahaha. you're more mature than a lot of other people on here. :)
I just finished it and I loved it. I find it interesting to hear everyone's opinions of books!!Thanks for sharing
Bekah wrote: "@sammy glad we're not turning this into an argument! hahaha. you're more mature than a lot of other people on here. :)"Thank you, you acted a lot more mature than most Creationists (which I'm only assuming you are based on your defense, sorry if you're not) do toward atheist opinions so thank you for that also.
Aly wrote: "@Bekah: There is no need for sly digs here. Got something to say, then say it."i wasn't referring specifically to this board, i meant goodreads in general because i've come across nasty people on other boards who only want to argue. you weren't even who i had in mind.
PLUS, i once got a message from someone on here who has since deleted because i reported them, telling me i should commit suicide because i didn't agree with their opinion. those are the type of people i'm talking about. not the ones who are talking about books.
Aly wrote: "@Bekah: Surely you can see how it can be taken the wrong way though? And I wasn't referring to myself either. Oh don't worry, I get messages like those every day. They become rather funny after a..."
i can definitely see how you would take it that way and i apologize! i meant nothing of the sort.
and i know, i just deleted it and reported the person. those types of things don't really affect me at this point. guess i've just grown a thicker skin, haha.
Aly wrote: "@Bekah: I'm sorry, too. :)Unfortunately, some people just don't realise that books are just books and think they have a blood bond with the author/characters and their honour (the book's/characte..."
can i also say that i apologize for my previous comments? i tend to get fired up when i see other people getting picked on, but that doesn't mean i have the right to do the exact same thing back ha. really stupid move of me, i don't think before i speak! i'm glad we're all good now.
it's dumb for people to be mean to others who liked the book, but it's just as dumb for people to be mean to others who didn't like the book. i don't understand why people jump to death threats over something like this, it's pointless.
I dunno much about religion, but I will say that some fans of this book are religiously devoted to John Green and the cult built around his awful writing. :)
I don't like it either. It's just so boring. It looked better on the description. :)
Katie wrote: "This isn't supposed to start an argument; but also in the bible when God technically killed all those people, he did give them a chance(to live). All I wanted to say."No in fact he did not, there are several occasions in which God slaughters entire communities, women, men, children, babies, elderly and animals while they were asleep and who had never done any harm to anyone and who were completely unaware so that the so called "prophet" that had been sent by God to kill them all could gain more power and recognition and be feared by others. I will not argue this topic further, if you wish to discuss this further with me please message me privately or talk on another discussion based on religion to me. But please I do implore that you do research what you're talking about if you intend to communicate about this further with me as all religious facts you have stated thus far are incorrect. But again I state that this will not be discussed on this thread, thank you.
Aly wrote: "@Dimena: It did, didn't it?"
Sadly, yes.
Sadly, yes.
Aly wrote: "@Bekah: Agreed!@Pilcrow: They are absolutely terrifying. A friend and I went to the library last week (our teeny tiny no good for anything library) and she said, "What's TFioS like?" So I told he..."
They'll be really embarrassed a few years from now when they realize you were right and this book is like 90% crap.
I've re-read some of the lines several folks have posted here to prove their asserted point about the lack of reality in the dialogue in TFIOS. I have to admit, isolated like that, the dialogue examples persuade me more favorably toward their opinion about their complaints of TFIOS and its dialogue. I compared these samples to dialogue from another book in which an 11-year-old boy named Bup has leukemia, and it's 1967 so a cure or remission is highly unlikely at the time. It's not a cancer book, but it's the fate of one character, and the dialogue from him, set in a hospital room. A bit of background is that Bup came to be known as the neighborhood liar, not to be believed about anything. Anyway - compared to TFIOS, the dialogue here goes like this, in a conversation with Jeremy, his friend, as a sample - "I can yell at God," Bup says, beginning to smile. "I can yell at God and complain and sometimes win."
"Win what?" I say.
Bup's eyes narrow, then close. "I'm not gonna win this," he says. "Not likely." With his deep breath, shapes of his ribs poke through his gown. "That's five times, Jeremy," Bup says. "Five times in ten minutes you should believe me."
My thought on that is this dialogue avoids over-dramatization even as it handles big themes, using simple language even as it shows this boy has insight to and acceptance of his situation, even if sad and uncomfortable with it.
So - maybe I am persuaded now, that John Green, even if true to what he experienced working at a children's hospital ward, may have over-written his dialogue for the sake of drama at the expense of truth. As Mark twain said, one of his many famous quotations: 'Truth is stranger than fiction. That's why fiction has to make sense."
I'll get the title of t he book if anyone's interested.
I think what people don't realize is that John Green is well aware that teenagers don't talk like Augustus and Hazel. I remember watching one of his videos and hearing him talk about it. Honestly, I think it was just for effect and impact. I don't think he was trying to write realistic dialogue WHICH IS FINE, you know? You don't have to like it, but you kinda have to realize that what's awesome about fiction is that there aren't really rules and if you want to make a teenager sound like they're speaking poetry then you totally can.
I'm not going to lie, I loved this book but I did find the dialogue a little pretentious. But that's okay. I have a feeling that it knows. Still, dialogue aside, I think this was a really honest book and I found the ending especially relatable (losing someone you love and all that suckiness).
Charlotte wrote: And Gus going "I'm in love with you, Hazel Grace" out loud was a thousand times worse of an experience than it was to read."dude! nobody talks like that! a (figurative) pox on john green.
Trace wrote: "I've re-read some of the lines several folks have posted here to prove their asserted point about the lack of reality in the dialogue in TFIOS. I have to admit, isolated like that, the dialogue exa..."Trace, I'd be interested in the title if you've got it.
@Pilcrow. The title is The Widow's Son, and I'm not sure if it's YA, maybe a crossover. You have to be willing to be interested in a story set in the late 1960s. (But who isn't?) And the adults aren't written as two-dimensional clichés, which is my real peeve about TFIOS. Would be interested in what you think if you read it.
Well, read the portion Amazon provides, first, to get an idea about the dialogue and the kids. I don't want to recommend anything w/o you deciding for yourself. I just think the kids are portrayed very realistically, although not perfect, and the adults are not treated like footnotes.
I really hate Hazel. She just whines, bitches, and makes fun of other people all the time. Ugh.
I personally felt John Green was writing this book in a very arrogant and pretentious matter. You can feel in the writing that he believes what he is writing is a masterpiece.Even the cover, which was made by a famous designer despite him holding a fan competition to make a great fan-cover. John chose the cover because it looked "timeless", as if he assumed the book would become and instant classic.
The author is pretentious, the fans act like they are in a secret underground club and the writing is little above average for a young adult novel.
@Chantelle. First, I respect your opinion, and respectfully disagree with a portion of it. I think it's hard for an adult author to write the voice of a teen or child because the author is, obviously, an adult, and adult vocabulary can sneak in. The ideas and themes expressed in the dialogue in TFIOS may all be reasonable (I think they are), but the way they're expressed can become a problem. So when an author makes his or her word choices for a teen's / child's dialogue, it becomes revealing whether the author has the talent to express feelings in a more realistic way for a child, or if it comes off, as you admit, pretentious or adult-like. And if pretentious language happens too often and on nearly every subject by nearly all the children or teens, the dialogue can slap readers in the face as hard as a typo. Like too many typos in a book, it can then ruin the enjoyment of the story. So when Aly and some others posted examples of TFIOS' dialogue, it struck home and caused me to change my opinions somewhat on that issue. These characters could have been in their 20's or 30's and most of the themes could still arguably apply. That John Green, who I do admire, chose to use younger teens as his protagonists, I now admit, makes the language he uses for their dialogue not only pretentious but, as others have said, manipulative in that - hey, I'll make the cancer victims young teens to add to the cry factor. Obviously, Green, in the big picture of literary success was right, and it worked for him, and congratulations to him. But others, as expressed on this thread, are certainly right in politely expressing errors we see, and call him on it even if none of it matters to the masses. Hope all this makes sense.
Aly wrote: "@Brooke: She's all, *puts on nasally whining voice*, "omg my life is SO horrible cos like I have friends and families that love me and I'm so unappreciative of everything that means something and l..."
You nailed it.
You nailed it.
I hate the fault I our stars. Full stop.
Trace wrote: "@Pilcrow. The title is The Widow's Son, and I'm not sure if it's YA, maybe a crossover. You have to be willing to be interested in a story set in the late 1960s. (But who isn't?) And the adults are..."Cool, thanks!
Aly wrote: "@Brooke: She's all, *puts on nasally whining voice*, "omg my life is SO horrible cos like I have friends and families that love me and I'm so unappreciative of everything that means something and l..."Hazel is a total beatch. Especially when she rips on other survivors in the support group for how they choose to carry on, or on Gus's sisters for their affectionate little nicknames for him. It's more unsettling because you're constantly aware that this book is basically just the author talking to himself, so there are maybe John Green's actual feelings? I understand he wants to make a split from the typical cancer novel so he wants his characters to take a different approach to survival. But he doesn't have to put other people down to do this...
Cannot wait to see the film version so I can compare them. And if it's bad, it will just give me more of a reason to hate the fault in our stars.
Ben wrote: "I personally felt John Green was writing this book in a very arrogant and pretentious matter. You can feel in the writing that he believes what he is writing is a masterpiece.Even the cover, whic..."
This, so much! Totally agree, Ben!
What bothers me about John Green's novels is this thing where like, don't worry if you ever are depressed because a cute boy or a pretty girl will come along soon and fall in love with you and make your problems go away. It doesn't work like that. People, especially teenagers, need to learn not to depend on the thought that someone will save them. And also, people need to recognize that no matter how sweet their smile is, they can't fix someone. You can't make someone stop being depressed by falling in love with them.
Nimotalai wrote: "The fault in our stars is a bunch of SHIT! BUNCH OF SHIT! I wasted around a day of my life on that book that I can never get back......EVER! FUCK THE FAULT IN OUR STARS, FUCK HAZEL, FUCK AUGUSTUS, ..."All of my thoughts in just a few sentences :,)
Sammy wrote: "Katie wrote: "I dont even get why those people say stuff like that!!!! If you have ever read the bible, It mentions that God hates NOBODY!!!! He loves us all, no matter what!"Unless they're gay, ..."
Actually, it goes through interpretation...I don't think it is even written in the book, but people like to over-infer and over-emphasize things.
Charlotte wrote: "Katie wrote: "Trace: that book sounds interesting.Charlotte: the only good book series that had good movies(that I've ever seen) was Harry Potter. But who knows. Sometimes crappy books make good m..."
Definitely! One of my thoughts were that Tris was in abnegation, so why was she (visibly) wearing so much makeup?
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Thanks.. At least someone understands the horrifying nature of this book