Which are your favorite plot motifs in Heyer?

[Margaret]

Some that I can think of include the "convenient marriage" motif that Katie mentioned, the cross-dressing motif that's a particular favorite of mine, the "reforming the rake" motif (e.g. Vidal, Damerel)...

Which other ones can you think of, and which do you like or dislike?

[Jamie]

I haven't read them all yet, but so far I like the older, wiser heroines better than the younger, impulsive ones. I do like the rakes, but I was charmed by the unusually nice hero in The Unknown Ajax.

I haven't run across a bad Heyer yet, but my least favorite books are the ones with cross-dressing. I find them terribly implausible, for one thing. And it's a little eyebrow-raising when a man in his mid-30's who has never shown any interest in women becomes attracted to a 17-yr-old girl who is pretending to be a boy. As if he's decided it's the best compromise he's going to find. :)

[Hannah]

Jamie wrote: "And it's a little eyebrow-raising when a man in his mid-30's who has never shown any interest in women becomes attracted to a 17-yr-old girl who is pretending to be a boy. As if he's decided it's the best compromise he's going to find. :)..."

OK, this is the best post of the day as far as I'm concerned. Thanks for the laugh, Jamie. By the way, you owe me a new computer screen....lol

[Margaret]

Cross-dressers getting away with it sounds implausible to us, but there are historical examples of people who did get away with it -- sometimes for many years!

Recall that people (often) wore a lot more clothes then, that they were more concealing ... and also, people's assumptions were different. Nowadays we don't necessarily assume (for instance) that someone wearing trousers is male, so we look more closely for other gender markers. In the Georgian/Regency periods, not so much.

[Elcee]

Jamie's comment really does take the prize for me today! However, I really don't mind the fantastic premise posed in both the Corinthian and also in the Masqueraders. I regularly go back through some of those Heyer books and could probably quote most the text - but the enjoyment is still there.

[Margaret]

The Grand Sophy and Cotillion have wonderful finales, too.

[Elcee]

I agree with Risa. I loved the way These Old Shades finished but for sheer hilarity it is hard to beat those final scenes in The Unknown Ajax. What excellent writing from Ms Heyer! But then, all her writing is very good.

[Mir]

I like the ones where the hero or heroine isn't a paragon. I loved the way Freddy in Cotillon improved because he was actually trying, even though he still wasn't the brightest guy.

[chinami]

I especially like Grand sophy, Alastair series, Bath tangle for their strong female protagonists. I am not a fan of too gentle and wideeyed women who spend half their time crying or complaining about one thing or another.
Conqueror and Beauvallet are evergreen favorites with historical background and the latter replete with adventure and thrill.
I am partial to rakes, so any book featuring the hero as a rake becomes my favorite(DC)

[Mir]

No, I'll have to put that one on the queue!

[chinami]

Risa wrote: "Miriam - Oh, do! It's a lovely one!:)

Veronica - Her wide-eyed women are usually the young ones...but I don't recall too many 'gentle' ones. Atleast, all of her heroines seem to have spirit in t..."

It is not that I'm too harsh upon most of her heroines, only that after having read books like Grand sophe, Gone with the wind, i have got myself acclimatised to its strong and intellectual women.

[Deanna]

Jamie, you made me snort my drink! That was too funny and too true.

[Claire]

Frederica is a great heroine ,don't forget her

[MashJ]

Cross dressing for sure.

I just caught up with Jamie's comment and I'm glad I wasn't drinking anything at the time! Was Richard totally disinterested in women before?- I'm pretty sure it was just the matchmaking kind but you still made my day.

Heyer also enjoys the highwayman/smuggler theme (me too).

She also uses sibling love a lot (not much sibling rivalry that I can remember)- she had 2 brothers but only one child herself.

[Jamie]

Mshj wrote: Was Richard totally disinterested in women before?- I'm pretty sure it was just the matchmaking kind..."
One friend remarks that Richard has "never troubled much about females", and another that he has "never looked seriously at a female in his life". Richard himself recalls that "in ten years spent in the best circles he had not had the common good fortune to meet one female whose charms had cost him a single hour's sleep."

[MashJ]

Jamie wrote: "Mshj wrote: Was Richard totally disinterested in women before?- I'm pretty sure it was just the matchmaking kind..."
One friend remarks that Richard has "never troubled much about females", and ano..."

ruroh!

[[deleted user]]

Margaret wrote: "Some that I can think of include the "convenient marriage" motif that Katie mentioned, the cross-dressing motif that's a particular favorite of mine, the "reforming the rake" motif (e.g. Vidal, Dam..."

Don't you get bored with repeat plots? I think I would. I like for something super different to happen.

[[deleted user]]

Hannah wrote: "Jamie wrote: "And it's a little eyebrow-raising when a man in his mid-30's who has never shown any interest in women becomes attracted to a 17-yr-old girl who is pretending to be a boy. As if he's ..."

LOL! I agree!

[chinami]

Lady Lavender wrote: "Margaret wrote: "Some that I can think of include the "convenient marriage" motif that Katie mentioned, the cross-dressing motif that's a particular favorite of mine, the "reforming the rake" motif..."

I don't think there's repetition in the plots, each is different and refreshing. I would have got bored had there been authors many who write in similar 'clean' style. I guess i can never get bored with Heyer :D.

[Margaret]

That's very true. There are certain motifs that Heyer uses more than once, but like an expert musician, she plays the variations on her themes each time she introduces them, to make each story unique and delightful.

[Kim]

Margaret wrote: "That's very true. There are certain motifs that Heyer uses more than once, but like an expert musician, she plays the variations on her themes each time she introduces them, to make each story uni..."

I agree. The variations on different themes are part of what makes Heyer's novels so very enjoyable.

[Melinda]

Have any of you read Simon the Coldheart? I read on a book jacket that it was her father's favorite of all her books, and it is excellent, both as historical fiction and for the development of the powerful and complex main characters. Simon is the predecessor of Beauvallet, as I recall.

[chinami]

Melinda wrote: "Have any of you read Simon the Coldheart? I read on a book jacket that it was her father's favorite of all her books, and it is excellent, both as historical fiction and for the development of the ..."

Nope. Never knew it was really good. Thanks, I'll give it a shot. By the way anyone read Royal Escape or Great Roxythe? They are hard to find.

[Karlyne]

I have Royal Escape, and it's certainly worth a read, but I've never even laid eyes on the Great Roxythe!

[Kim]

Sitting on my bookshelf is a 1951 re-print hardback copy of The Great Roxhythe, published by Heinemann, complete with dustjacket, in fair to good condition....which has never been read (well, not by me, at any rate!). I'm not sure when and how I acquired it, but I'd forgotten it was even there until you mentioned it, Veronica and Karlyne.

PS. I see that Abebooks has a few copies, but they are expensive. I've just looked at the spine of my copy and it says "Cheap Edition 9s6d Net". Not so cheap anymore!

[Karlyne]

Wow! It sounds like you'd better read it, and let us know how it is! Is it one of those with the really good illustration on the jacket? The very vintage 1950's mystery cover?

[Kim]

I have added it to my "to-read" shelf so that I don't forget about it again! The cover is very vintage, but vintage historical rather than vintage mystery. The novel is set during the reign of Charles II. (Who knew? Certainly not me before I checked it out this morning!) Here's what the cover looks like:

[Mir]

I intend to read Simon the Coldheart eventually, although I'm not as into the medieval setting for romance. The other two I had never even heard of! Thanks!

[Karlyne]

I read a couple of the Goodreads reviews of the Great Roxhythe, and it sounds like an intriguing read- but definitely not for everybody. I have a feeling that all of us die-hard Heyer fans will like it just because she wrote it. But then, who knows? Maybe we'll like it just because it is different! Or maybe, gasp!, even not like it?!?

[Kim]

If I don't like it, it will be hard to admit, falling into the die-hard fan category as I do. I gather that Heyer was not that fussed about the book and refused to have it re-printed before her death. (I think I read that in The Private World of Georgette Heyer, but I may be making it up!)

[chinami]

I borrowed Simon the Coldheartfrom a local library, good thing they had a copy. I couldn't find Royal escape in any old used books store and brand new copies are too costly.

[MashJ]

look for it on amazon - I just checked and they have some 1 penny paperbacks for this one (plus P&P of course) if you click on the link to expand the paperback price options- hope that helps!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Royal-Escape-...

[Peregrina651]

Jamie wrote: "I haven't run across a bad Heyer yet, but my least favorite books are the ones with cross-dressing. I find them terribly implausible, for one thing. And it's a little eyebrow-raising when a man in his mid-30's who has never shown any interest in women becomes attracted to a 17-yr-old girl who is pretending to be a boy. As if he's decided it's the best compromise he's going to find. :) "

And then you really have to wonder about the relationship between Avon and Hugh Davenant, as they depart arm in arm. Ha, bet I've sent you all scrambling to find that scene.

[Kim]

Peregrina651 wrote: "Jamie wrote: "I haven't run across a bad Heyer yet, but my least favorite books are the ones with cross-dressing. I find them terribly implausible, for one thing...."

While they're not my favourites, I really don't mind the cross-dressing themed novels. I see them as something of an homage to Shakespeare, whose best comedies (in my opinion) are Twelfth Night and As You Like It, both of which have heroines who dress as boys.