Making Connections discussion
ARCHIVES
>
Reviews on Amazon
As a reader, I go for the 3-* ratings. I trust them more than the 5 or 1 star ratings. My naive reasoning? 5 star ratings (unless they are in hundreds) can be swapped, bought, or biased positively. All 1-star reviews with a one line comment are worth disregarding them. Only 3 star reviews will truly tell me what I don't know about the book:+)
Robert wrote: "Richard, this is all about context. If the content of the one review is in-depth and adds to my understanding, and if the six are typical of the one or two-sentence wonders that seem to dominate Am..."Robert wrote: "Richard, this is all about context. If the content of the one review is in-depth and adds to my understanding, and if the six are typical of the one or two-sentence wonders that seem to dominate Am..."
Robert wrote: "Richard, this is all about context. If the content of the one review is in-depth and adds to my understanding, and if the six are typical of the one or two-sentence wonders that seem to dominate Am..."
I agree totally with what you said about the function of reviewers - that's why I don't 'trade' reviews with other authors. What would be the point if I felt I couldn't be honest because someone had given me a four star and I hated their book!
It certainly is horrible to see a reader giving you a one star review (I've got a couple, thankfully outweighed heavily by the good ones) but at the end of the day that is, or should be, that person's opinion - they didn't like it and that's that. But what I can't understand is people who write reviews that trash a book for the sake of it without actually 'reviewing' it. If I don't like a book I say why it wasn't for me or what I found unappealing, not just 'this book was drivel' etc.
By the way, I love the word 'pickle puss' . I'm going to pinch it and use it :)
Prash wrote: "As a reader, I go for the 3-* ratings. I trust them more than the 5 or 1 star ratings. My naive reasoning? 5 star ratings (unless they are in hundreds) can be swapped, bought, or biased positively...."I'm still getting used to the Goodreads "star" definitions. When I was reviewing professionally for a now-archive-only ezine, I very rarely published 3-star reviews because I viewed those books as average, "meh," run-of-the-mill, okay-if-you're-into-that-sort-of-thing books. If I felt "meh" about the book I just read, it wasn't worth my effort to write a review of it. To a certain extent I still feel that way.
As for using reviews as an acquisition tool, generally I don't, regardless of the assigned star ranking. Unless I personally know the reviewer, I have no basis of knowing whether a given review was written from a similar mindset to mine.
Kim -The three star review is helpful to the reader, so if they're on a tight budget they know it's not the "glowing fantastic book" that the friends of the author purport it to be.
A well written review should hopefully give insight into the mindset of the reader, so you understand where they're coming from.
Lisa wrote: "A well written review should hopefully give insight into the mindset of the reader, so you understand where they're coming from. "This is the key. The actual review is far more important then the star rating. What one person might right down as a negative another might think is a positive.
In light of the original question, I have to admit that I was initially pissed off when I received a one star rating of my novel Discovery. But then I thought about what the reader said about the book.Since Discovery is the first installment of a trilogy that tells of what happens in America when the country discovers African Americans have been secretly living on the backside of the moon since before Neil Armstrong arrived, when I examined the review I found the review and rating to be perfect, and here's why.
The review was written by a white man who simply couldn't wrap his head around the notion that if offered the chance, Black folks would choose to live on the moon with just their own kind instead of putting up with the bigotry and racism of present-day America.
In this case, his review was vindication of the story I wrote, and a perfect illustration of the dichotomy of perception and attitude between Blacks and whites in this country!
As I travel and discuss the first two published installments of the trilogy in college-level classes, I put this review up to illustrate that in terms of perceptions about the quality of life in the United States, skin color makes a huge difference.
So, in toto, the perceptions of the reader are an important constituent of the rating/review couplet, and could just be a positive for others to better understand what it is that the author wrote, and more important, what they intended.
WmH
William,I would also think any book that hits on of the big hot button issues (Religion, Race, or Politics) should expect a more extremes in the reviews they get, and honestly should see some 1 star reviews coming. These are topics where many people's opinions are extremely polarized. The emotion the topic created or touches on will outweigh the objective or rational opinions, especially if the book takes one "side" of an issue.
Any reader can get behind the idea of the knight saving the princess from the evil whatever or the space ranger standing between his world and destruction. The basic premise is neutral enough to allow the work to be judged on its own merits.
However, when a firm stance is taken, say taking a position on the bigotry and racism of America (I am not questioning that stance one way or another, to be clear), then the basic idea is going to get in the way for people who disagree with it. The book will never be judged on its own merits.
That isn't to say this kind of book shouldn't be written. There is a need for books addressing religion, racism, and politics...its just that when putting out a book like this you have to expect a portion of the readers will be set to dislike it before reading a page. Its human nature.
Travis -I agree completely. It is amazing to me, sometimes, the stances people hold on issues that seem clear to me. I'm sure to them my stance seems equally wild. So those are the sorts of things that are great fun to write about.
In writing about those topics, one has to expect that not all will wholeheartedly agree :).
Lisa
Travis wrote: "I would also think any book that hits on of the big hot button issues (Religion, Race, or Politics) should expect a more extremes in the reviews they get..."ROFL! Isn't =that= an understatement?!
One of my favorite lowball reviews to date (on a "proto-blog" site, it was that long ago, and long since having disappeared from cyberspace) related to the first edition of my novel DAWNFLIGHT (Simon & Schuster, 1999), the subject of which, in two words, is Arthurian Legends -- though I've turned the "traditional" (read, "Malory-esque") stories and characters upside down but in an utterly plausible and meticulously researched historical context. The reviewer wailed, "The characters have lost their true spirituality!" What? Really? You were there and know what their "true spirituality" was?? (She was referring to my choice of making Niniane, my "Lady of the Lake" character, a prioress... and Merlin a wealthy bishop. :)
IMO stories =should= touch nerves that way. Though I'd much rather everyone loved my work, of course, I see the polarization as a badge of honor. I don't ever aim for "neutral." I aim for meaningful and memorable.
I guess when I said neutral I more meant not volatile to a large percentage of the population.You could write a book about the sky being blue and get one person who writes a negative review disagreeing with the statement.
Also, when it comes to reinventing classic stories, some people just can't handle change. If it isn't as it always was, they will have a problem.
As the great Phil Hartman once said "I am just a simple caveman. Change scares and frightens me"
I was just going through another topic in this forum, where people are posting links to their book trailers for folks to like and share, when I came across a review blurb someone had included in their video that read to the effect of, "I had never before read a novel that made me think about my life." I found that sad. The best novels -- even those written for escapism -- should make us reflect upon our lives on some level.
Richard wrote: "As a reader I would like to know what your would do if you look at a book with 7 posted reviews and six are four and five star and one is a one star? Would you discount the one star as the reader j..."That's a good question. I've wondered that as well. If it's fiction, I assume it's just a matter of taste. But if it is nonfiction, I wonder if the one star reviewer knows something important the rest of us don't.
In terms of one-star vs five-star reviews, I don't think there's any way to make a global, blanket statement about it. It could be the five-star reviews are short, meaningless posts from friends. It could also be that the five-star reviews are in-depth, wonderfully written reviews from industry experts and provide a wealth of knowledge.The one-star reviews could be rants from close-minded bigots. Or they could be detailed explanations of the wealth of issues the book has.
I think it always matters what they say, and not just what star someone clicked on.
Lisa
Justin wrote: "My first book is like this, I have a few 4 and 5 star reviews and then one 2 and 1 star reviews. If people want to judge the book off either I don't mind, I'm redoing the book anyways and aside fro..."Hey, Justin, just read a blog I thought might interest you since you write horror. Looks like the first, so maybe more to come. http://warriorwriters.wordpress.com/2...
Personally I think the number of stars isn't very helpful. Without being familiar with the reviewer, it doesn't mean much. It's the explanation that gives me genuine information.
Bonnie wrote: "Personally I think the number of stars isn't very helpful. Without being familiar with the reviewer, it doesn't mean much. It's the explanation that gives me genuine information."Ah, but they are all-important to the author. I recently had an author all but throw a fit because I chose not to rate the book 5 stars, like everyone else was doing. It was a decent book but certainly not perfect, as my text review pointed out. And the more private emails the author & I exchanged after that, I became aware of even more flaws that I had overlooked in the first reading, which tempted me to lower the rating. I didn't of course, but the point is that as a reviewer I see the 5-star rating as "d*mn near perfect," so I am =very= sparing of handing out a fistful of stars.
Kim wrote: "Bonnie wrote: "Personally I think the number of stars isn't very helpful. Without being familiar with the reviewer, it doesn't mean much. It's the explanation that gives me genuine information."A..."
Kim - I agree a 5 star rating is just about perfect. As an author I am thrilled with a 4 star review. Especially if the reader liked the book and had some good points in the review such as wishing a character had been more developed in the story or if they thought another setting might be better. All great stuff.:-) - Rory
Kim -An author who throws a fit over a review needs to develop a more open attitude toward reactions to their work :). No work in the world will be considered 5 star material by every reader. It just can't happen, because we all have different needs and interests.
Lisa
It's important to keep a cool head when it comes to one and two star reviews. On the other hand, this one jerk really got to me. So I found his home address (he lives in North Carolina), flew there, rented a Hummer under a pseudonym and drove it through the front of his house. Boy, was he surprised!John Rachel, Author of . . .
http://amzn.to/122cnyF
Kim wrote: "Bonnie wrote: "Personally I think the number of stars isn't very helpful. Without being familiar with the reviewer, it doesn't mean much. It's the explanation that gives me genuine information."A..."
I think it works out if you get a large number of reviews, but if there are just a handful, the score can be skewed either way by a couple of people. It might be more consistent if Amazon and Goodreads had explanations of what the stars mean so that people could vote with the same idea in mind. (If they do, please send me the link.)
Bonnie -GoodReads does have an explanation of the stars.
Go to any book, for example Pride and Prejudice.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...
Set it to "read". You'll be brought to the full review detail page.
Now hover over each star. It tells you what level of affection you have for the book to click each one :).
Lisa
Lisa wrote: "Bonnie -GoodReads does have an explanation of the stars.
Go to any book, for example Pride and Prejudice.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...
Set it to "read". You'll..."
Thanks, I saw that. I guess I was looking for something with more detail.
Bonnie -There can't really be more detail, because each of us have different emotions. It has to be in relation to how we feel about things.
It's like the classic "pain chart".
These charts are asking us to pinpoint how we feel about something.
Lisa
I might have to nick your pain chart for my reviews - lol :D
I wouldn't discredit any of them nor would it sway me in either direction to read the book or not. I look them over and while some reviews and star ratings tend to stand out more then others it really doesn't influence my decision. I mean if there's a ton of one star reviews there's more of a chance someone will not look into the book whereas if there were tons of five stars and four stars they wouldn't question how good it is or not. I suppose it depends on everyones preference.
John wrote: "It's important to keep a cool head when it comes to one and two star reviews. On the other hand, this one jerk really got to me. So I found his home address (he lives in North Carolina), flew there..."That's one way of dealing with it:)
Generally, I will look at the reviews and pick a selection. I'll read a couple of high stars and a couple of low stars to see where the cross over is. Are the bits they didn't like simply a matter of opinion, or does it have spelling errors and continuity issues (which might reflect poorly on the question of the 5 star reviews.)I received my first 2 star about 19 days after I published. It hurt... a lot, but I was glad to see that it was all personal opinion stuff.
You can't please everyone, and actually, I think seeing a book with varying reviews will actually push me more toward a book than those with all glowing - Because when they're all glowing 5 stars, I start questioning the validity. Did they buy a load of 5* reviews, did they sock puppet, maybe flag the lower stars as abuse for some reason? That sort of thing.
Seeing that the author has let all reviews show, good and bad, says professionalism to me.
Lisa wrote: "Travis -For a while I was a top-10 reviewer on Amazon so I've seen a wealth of strange behavior from both authors and other reviewers. People would go on campaigns to down vote me so they could g..."
Having been the victim of almost every cutthroat practice on Amazon over the last two years I can confirm a lot of authors use sock puppeting not just to boost their own books, but to attack others AND to attack reviewers.
Part of this is that Amazon's positional algorithm, which determines where your book is sold, seems to contain a "credibility" calculation, based on how many of your reviews have been voted on, and how many of the reviewers have good "reviewer ranking."
Unfortunately, I know of at least one "best selling" author there who got into the ranking by tricking the credibility calculation: he creates deliberately low-ranked reviewers, then has them leave one-star reviews for his book. Amazon interprets this incorrectly as a campaign attacking him, and his books -- which genuinely are one- and two-star efforts -- sell in the thousands.
It's infuriating.
L.H.,Shocking, infuriating, bizarre...and a perfect plot line for a novel...I'm just putting it out there.... You can't make this stuff up!
As a customer, I do pay attention to the star ratings if only to identify the outliers so that I can hone in on 3-5 reviews to read of mixed view point. I am curious as to what was so awful or great that someone felt compelled to share it. However I tend to discount both the passionate loves and loathes and make my book buying decision based on the middle. I do sometimes wish the 1s weren't an option though. I was raised not to say anything at all if I couldn't say something nice and it does impact a person's livelihood. I like to think we're reviewing art, not customer service.
For the record - I did the same cartwheels for my 4 star rating as I did my 5. It was the content of the review that mattered most to me.
Robert wrote: "L.H.,Shocking, infuriating, bizarre...and a perfect plot line for a novel...I'm just putting it out there.... You can't make this stuff up!"
Yes, but can you imagine the reviews?
For the record - I did the same cartwheels for my 4 star rating as I did my 5. It was the content of the review that mattered most to me. Oh definitely. I've had a three-star review that I've been very happy with, even though three-star reviews are seen negatively and negative influence has been shown to be significantly more likely to affect purchase than positive.
Richard wrote: "As a reader I would like to know what your would do if you look at a book with 7 posted reviews and six are four and five star and one is a one star? Would you discount the one star as the reader j..."Hi Richard. I'm a brand new author so I may feel differently as I experience the "other side" of Amazon, but I know as a consumer of books/movies/etc. I always gravitate toward negative reviews. What people don't like about a book/film/etc. often tells me more than what they do like.
That's not to say that negative reviews put me off, but if someone's criticisms look sound then I pay attention. If, on the other hand, they say things like "not enough action" or "I was totally confused" then I check the positive reviews to see if I'm looking at something too smart or unusual for the average consumer.
When I asked that question ablut 7 good reviews and one really bad review the book only had 7 reviews.
It now has 50 reviews--23 5 star; 16 4 star;7 3 star;3 2 star and 1 1 star.
So in conclusion, you cannot please everyone, However, how many of these reviews would anyone read to decide whether to buy the book?
Richard Brawer
www.silklegacy.
It now has 50 reviews--23 5 star; 16 4 star;7 3 star;3 2 star and 1 1 star.
So in conclusion, you cannot please everyone, However, how many of these reviews would anyone read to decide whether to buy the book?
Richard Brawer
www.silklegacy.
Richard, it's quite possible that if the interest is high, all of the reviews would be read. The reason is that the reviews themselves are a source of interest and information. For example if there is a new recording of a Verdi or Wagner opera, people who are into the opera will read all the comments simply to satisfy themselves about the quality of the direction and recording of the new interpretation. There is really no other way to do this, short of buying the new version, and in this we see the great value of reviews.
Kim wrote: "RE: Great Amazon customer reviews deleted because God-knows-why.If you're the author of the book and have a great review that has been deleted from the customer review database, sign in to Amazon..."
Thank you so much! I have an ongoing battle with Amazon to print ANY reviews of my work. One lady contacted me to say she had tried and tried to leave a review on A Whisper of the Romantic in the Eye of God. When eventually they responded, they claimed it was because we were friends. Although I know her from Squidoo groups on Facebook we have never actually met, spoken (phone or otherwise) or even corresponded by letters, messages or emails - and live 5000 miles apart! Likewise, The Cougar, I have had reviews ignored for that too. Perhaps this will redress the balance a bit.
You're welcome, Lisa, and good luck with that. Although Amazon support has been quite helpful for me regarding several issues, one currently seems to elude them: linking the product pages for the ebook and audiobook editions of my short story THE COLOR OF VENGEANCE. Which is decidedly odd, because they managed to locate & link =all= the available editions of another work of mine, DAWNFLIGHT (mass-market 1st edition of 1999, along with the paperback, ebook, and audiobook 2nd edition of 2013). The mind boggles...~Kim
Often the lone single star merely indicates the reader expected something else. Books that are cross-category, aren't exactly a mystery or exactly a romance, for instance, can leave a reader unsatisfied because they wanted more. When an author shoe-horns their book into a category with more traffic, the price is often some low reviews. If I'm looking for Sci-Fi and "Mary Poppins" comes up, it will get a low review. Some people can see past their expectations, but others use them as the yardstick. Without knowing anything more, shooting from the hip based on the 50 reviews, I'd say it's a good book, but something about the description or cover leads some people to expect a different book.
Bonnie wrote: "Kim wrote: "Bonnie wrote: "Personally I think the number of stars isn't very helpful. Without being familiar with the reviewer, it doesn't mean much. It's the explanation that gives me genuine info..."As far as the meaning of stars go... I checked out the equivalency of Amazon and GR ratings when I started doing reviews that would be on both sites. I wanted to be as accurate as possible. You can see the word meaning assigned to the ratings if you hover your cursor over the star rating as you are assigning it. Unless things have changed since I created the crude chart below, you can see that meanings get muddy, especially in the middle. For what it's worth, the stars mean:
----------------Goodreads--------------Amazon
5*------------it was amazing--------I love it
4*------------really liked it---------I like it
3*------------liked it-----------------it's OK
2*------------it was OK---------------I don't like it
1*------------did not like it----------I hate it
Happy New Year,
Sheila
The number of good or bad reviews is not a deciding factor for me. Reviews can be very subjective, even when people are trying to be as objective as possible, which is why when I read reviews outside of blogs, I look for a few of each to get both sides of the argument.S.J: Thanks for putting the meaning of the stars! I didn't know that there was an official meaning other than 5=best and 1=worst. I looked for it when I joined, but I never found it, so I just assigned them the same way that I do on my blog, which is more or less like Amazon. I think that many people may be doing the same thing, because the 2-star reviews that I've read said that they didn't like the book and not that the book was OK.
Sheila - thanks for adding the meanings behind the ratings. I might just have to lower one rating.I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I laugh every time I see a review that starts "I never read this [insert genre], but...." Look, maybe the person really enjoyed it and maybe it's not so genre specific that it matters, but I automatically discount these reviews as the reviewer doesn't even have the confidence not to qualify his/her opinion.
Like others above, I often look at both high and low star ratings to see what the reviewers wrote. Sometimes it piques my interest, other times it scares me away.
I had a Goodreads giveaway winner rate the contest book 5 stars probably because she was happy to have received a free copy, because her review began with, "I actually just received my copy today, I can't wait to read it..." On the one hand I wish she hadn't done that, because it's not a review in the strictest sense. On the other hand, 5 stars! Be thankful and move along, I guess. :)
(the book in question)
Kim wrote: "I had a Goodreads giveaway winner rate the contest book 5 stars probably because she was happy to have received a free copy, because her review began with, "I actually just received my copy today, ..."That's funny, though I have seen a review or two like that. As a writer, it does help your overall rating, which could be good. Perhaps she will update it once finished.
If only 7 reviews were posted I would read them all and look into the other reviews of the 1 & 5 star reviewers. Some people get into a habit of rating 5 or ranting 1. I'm frequently amazed by reviewers that give 1 or 5 stars with a one sentence qualifications: "it was amazing" or "hated everything about it".
'Really?' I think to myself. That's so not helpful-why review at all?
If you hated the book then something about it evoked emotion.
If it was amazing or life changing…ok, tell me why!
As a reader I place more value in the reviews on Goodreads than Amazon; however, I imagine if I were an author Amazon is the cash cow and the reviews=sales.
I think just having the balls to put your story out there for the masses should equal 1 star for jumping off the cliff ;-)
Kim -I know this thread isn't on covers, but as I've been heavily working on covers with other authors for the past week, I thought I'd just mention this :).
The cover you have for your book might be perfect for bookstore shelves, but it's a complete blur in the online arena. The majority of the readers you want to reach in online form will have no idea what it is and probably will pass by it.
I might consider revising the cover you use in online situations so it's much clearer in a small format.
Look at the Twilight cover, how it pops in the small format. That's your aim. You need something that grabs the attention and lures the reader into clicking.
Lisa
I don't tend to be influenced by reviews, although I do sometimes read them. Everyone experiences a book in different ways and so two people might have very different opinions.
Kim wrote: "I had somebody dis one of my books on Amazon, a million years ago, on the grounds that this reviewer was an "expert" and that I had made research errors of the most egregious and unforgivable sort...."I've seen that quite a lot. Such a daft thing to do because it's means I instantly decide to read it!
Boy!! This is a tough one. As an Author you always crave the well written 5-star review. Even 4 is very good. 5 should be perfect and most of us are not. Any way I have heard of disappointment with give aways not getting an author what they wanted. But. . . I was very fortunate to get two very credible and well written reviews from a five book give away. I feel luck and honored. I know it doesn't always come together. Hopefully as an author we will do our hard work and have good reviewer friends who can get our works in prime condition before it gets out to the general reading public. That is where critique partners are a God sent. Thanks for the posts - Rory
To be honest, I do post reviews not often as I should but most of my friends and I are word of mouth people. We don't like all the same things but we can tell you what we like and don't like about a book or series. but I am finding also that as readers, and yes writers also.. we are kind of getting Jaded at what we like to read and yes at times follow others on what they like or hate about something. (sheep mentality if you will.)
Me personally I do like reading reviews at times just for some of the laughs or to find something I missed in the book if they put it in their review. I have even been known to write the reviewer and ask them something that was in their review if it caught my interest.
But for the most part, reviews are what someone thought or felt at the time of reading it. But if you are going to post a review, I think you should be able to put a little of both into it. What you like or don't like about the book. And at the very least why you did or didn't like it.
Terry
Making Connections
Books mentioned in this topic
The Man Who Loved Too Much: Book 1: Archipelago (other topics)God's Buried Children (other topics)
Sufficient Ransom (other topics)
Morning's Journey (other topics)
The Color of Vengeance (other topics)
More...
Lisa