The 16th Century (Oct - Dec 2023)

[Em]

A day or two early but I've got a busy start to the week so here's the discussion thread for ideas, suggestions and recommendations for books concerning the 16th Century.

I'm a huge fan of the Hilary Mantel booker prize winners Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies and have enjoyed all of Philippa Gregory's Tudor Court Novels too...

[Bill]

C.J. Sansom's Matthew Shardlake books are also excellent series set in the 16th Century.

[Em]

I've only read the first one of those - Dissolution, could be a nice opportunity to read further in the series.

[[deleted user]]

I had actually forgotten about this challenge. Good excuse to visit the library tomorrow.

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

I'd like to start with Blood & Beauty: The Borgias by Sarah Donant. Ok, so it's actually 15th century; but it's Renaissance so I'm counting it (plus I've been watching 'The Borgias' on TV and would like to know a little more).

Then I'm definitely reading Bring Up the Bodies, I've been looking forward to it, since it came out, I don't know what's taken me so long....

....still got Anna Karenina to finish though and I never did read The Spire - oh well, I'm sure I'll get around to it eventually!

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

I've made a start on Blood & Beauty: The Borgias by Sarah Dunant and I'm enjoying it so far.

It starts in 1492 and I know it spans a fair few years, so I'm confident I'll be in the 16thC by the end!

As it's about the Borgias, I just can't get the image of Jeremy Irons (and the rest of the cast) out of my head - of course, they don't get their kit off quite as much as they do in the Showtime series!

[Margaret]

Em wrote: "A day or two early but I've got a busy start to the week so here's the discussion thread for ideas, suggestions and recommendations for books concerning the 16th Century.

I'm a huge fan of the Hil..."

Enjoyed Bring up the Bodies, couldn't get past 200 pages of Wolf Hall - by that stage I was getting so annoyed by having to keep going back and counting out the dialogue to see who was speaking, and I'd already felt cheated by the huge time leap between Cromwell as an urchin being beaten by his father and when we next see him as a secretary to the most powerful man in England bar the king of course.

[A.L.]

I have Dissolution which I still haven't read:(

[Jo]

Anyone else here a Dorothy Dunnett fan? Her Lymond Chronicles run through a decade in the mid 16th century up to the beginning of Elizabeth I's reign.

Lovely big books if you like them! The history's good but the principal characters are fictional and there's lots of action all over Europe and the Middle East, entangled in high level politics and murky goings on. Plus a great romance running through.

JoDorothy Dunnett

[Margaret]

Jo wrote: "Anyone else here a Dorothy Dunnett fan? Her Lymond Chronicles run through a decade in the mid 16th century up to the beginning of Elizabeth I's reign.

Lovely big books if you like them! The histo..."

I love Lymond! And especially enjoy the fact that you do really need to read the entire series in order to get the full picture. And was totally happy at the final ending. REad them several times now and still enjoy them - see things I didn't notice before.

[Kate, Your Friendly Moderator]

I'm about to start for this challenge.

[The Idle Woman]

Jo wrote: "Anyone else here a Dorothy Dunnett fan?"

Another massive Dunnett fan here! I'd agree with Jo and Margaret: the Lymond Chronicles is an absolutely wonderful series. You need to put in a bit more time and effort than with some other authors, it's true, but the books are immensely rewarding. And the characters are wonderful. (Her Niccolo books - 15th Century Europe, starting with Niccolò Rising - and King Hereafter - Scotland in the early 11th century - are also brilliant.)

Liz - glad you're enjoying Blood & Beauty: The Borgias! I thought it was much better than other Borgia books (which have a tendency towards bodice-ripping).

[A.L.]

Trojanhorse wrote: "I'm about to start for this challenge."

I have that on my TBR as it's been recommended to me, and I managed to get a second hand copy. Let me know what you think.

[A.L.]

It's not the right period but I'm reading The Love-Artist, which is OK. Only a few chapters in so hard to comment.

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

Leander wrote: "....Liz - glad you're enjoying Blood & Beauty: The Borgias! I thought it was much better than other Borgia books (which have a tendency towards bodice-ripping). ..."

Yes, Blood & Beauty: The Borgias was very good. Although it took me a while to get used to the fact that it's all written in the present tense (like Wolf Hall).

I now want to read more by Sarah Dunant - oh, my 'to read' list just keeps getting longer!

[The Idle Woman]

Liz wrote: "...oh, my 'to read' list just keeps getting longer!"

Ha ha - isn't that the way? Do bear in mind that her other books are slightly more romantically-inclined. I haven't read any of the others for some time, although I remember enjoying all of them: she's extremely good on her history.

[Bill]

Finally getting around to starting this challenge, will be reading Revelation by C.J. Sansom.

[Pamela]

Liz, Wonderful choice of books! i want to read them all! - pam

[Margaret]

Leander wrote: "Jo wrote: "Anyone else here a Dorothy Dunnett fan?"

Another massive Dunnett fan here! I'd agree with Jo and Margaret: the Lymond Chronicles is an absolutely wonderful series. You need to put in a ..."

I haven't tried the Niccolo series yet, probably because (as a writer) I'm living in 16th c Scotland at the moment ( Lymond was necessary background reading you understand...) Must put Niccolo on my TBR list.

[Robyn]

Hi, I'm Robyn and new to the group. If it's ok, I'd love to start the challenge late. I've been meaning to read both Bringing Up The Bodies and Blood and Beauty! Not sure which I'll start first but I'm looking forward to both!

[Em]

Good choices Robyn!

[Robyn]

Thanks! As a history person, this group is right up my alley.

[Em]

I love history too! I've started subscribing to BBC History Magazine this year, thought I'd try to pick up some factual history to accompany the fictional history that I enjoy so much!

[Bill]

I finished Revelation today and enjoyed very much. I don't think I'll read another book for this challenge, looking forward to the 17th Century. :0)

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

I should squeeze one more in before the end of the year. It's going to have to be Bring Up the Bodies.

[Robyn]

thought I'd try to pick up some factual history to accompany the fictional history that I enjoy so much!

Being relatively new to the country, this has not yet come across my path -- I'll have to check it out!

[Kate, Your Friendly Moderator]

I have just finished reading Dissolution for this challenge. Very enjoyable and I gave it 4 stars.

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

Liz wrote: "I should squeeze one more in before the end of the year. It's going to have to be Bring Up the Bodies.

Arse! I just got it out of the library and realised I'd asked my brother to get it for me for Christmas. I'll have to take it back and wait...... (What if he goes and buys me something else instead?)

Which of course he did, so I STILL haven't read it...

[Robyn]

I just finished Blood & Beauty.

I can see why it was recommended highly; it's got all the prerequisites (well-written, strong characters, fantastic research) of a good historical novel. And then, of course, she has the absolutely fantastic hook of her source material. Even though the Borgia family has been written about extensively, their story is so fantastical that it is inherently interesting. Nothing seems as though it could be true, and yet ... most of it is. Or at least, there was a rumour going 'round 16th century Rome that it was. (No wonder the Reformation came so quick on the heels of Alexander's papacy.)

This probably sounds odd, but for me the best part of the book was Dunant's research. She treated the material like a historian, weighing established fact versus rumour and carefully weaving a path in between.

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

Robyn, Glad you liked 'Blood & Beauty', I thought it was great too. It's made me want to read more by Sarah Dunant (sp?)

[Sarah]

I actually read Bring Up the Bodies and find that it fits in perfectly with this challenge =] So I'll just catch up on The Middle Ages Challenge as I totally forgot about it oops =/

[Alberta]

Jo wrote: "Anyone else here a Dorothy Dunnett fan? Her Lymond Chronicles run through a decade in the mid 16th century up to the beginning of Elizabeth I's reign.

Lovely big books if you like them! The histo..."

Great books - not read them for a few decades now - must wander back and re-read:)

[Alberta]

any chance this will run next year? - missed it this year:(

so many books there I'd like to read

[Robyn]

Liz wrote: "Robyn, Glad you liked 'Blood & Beauty', I thought it was great too. It's made me want to read more by Sarah Dunant (sp?)"

Me too! I also want to read some of Hilary Mantel's older works, although I know they're not universally beloved.

[Em]

Hi Alberta, this challenge is taking us up to December 2014 (the planned schedule is outlined under "The Time Traveller Challenge" at the top of this discussion thread.)

We're tackling a new century each quarter so there's plenty of time to catch up if you'd like to...

[Charles]

In the year 1545 a garlic gardener in Madrid begins his career as Captain Alberto Dicer of the pirate ship El Dreadful. The Kindle version is Free 12/22/2013 and the novella is written to entertain readers of All ages. Thanks, Charles Last Pirate at Fort Matanzas

[Kate, Your Friendly Moderator]

It was a bit of a surprise but was half in the present day and half set in the 1580s with Elizabethan conspiracies galore! I didn't pick it for this challenge but am pleased it's fitted the bill!

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

By the way, I did squeeze in one more from this period before the end of the year: The Heresy of Dr Dee by Phil Rickman, which was a historical who-dunnit / why-dunnit sort-of-thing.

It was fine; well-written, with an interesting setting and good use of historical detail, but there were a few plot construction issues (I felt) and I was underwhelmed by the final outcome...

It paled beside the books I read either side of it.

[[deleted user]]

I forgot to update what I did choose to read. It was The Constant Princess by Philippa Gregory which I thoroughly enjoyed. Now have added the rest of her books to my to-read list.

[Ian, Former Moderator]

Liz wrote: "Robyn, Glad you liked 'Blood & Beauty', I thought it was great too. It's made me want to read more by Sarah Dunant (sp?)"

Kindle of now just £2.99.

[Ian, Former Moderator]

Finished Blood & Beauty: The Borgias. I enjoyed all the politics and corruption stuff but felt it was a bit bland with regard to the sex and violence.

[Robyn]

Ha! I kept waiting for more of that too!

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

Ian, you've clearly been watching too much HBO (or is it Showtime?) ;)

[Ian, Former Moderator]

Sky Atlantic in the UK Liz. Think the TV series must have picked out the most salacious stuff from historical records/legend.......but it was all good fun lol.

[Em]

So much choice for 16th Century - I need to have a bit of a think about what to read for this historical period....

[Mercia]

I've recently bought Wolf Hall on a special deal and I was waiting for this challenge to read it.

[Leni]

I am going to start with a piece of non-fiction from the 16th century: and then I am going to brave a novel of more recent date, set in the 16th century: . They've both been on my shelf for years. Machiavelli I just haven't gotten around to, but Lawrence Norfolk I need some encouragement, or a challenge, to deal with. I've read one of his books before, L'emprière's Dictionary, and loved it, but it was a confusing struggle. To this day I wonder what exactly happened at the end (and in the 17th century flashbacks) and what exactly the deal was with the King of France and the cherry trees. I might re-read it when we get to the 18th century. If I have the stamina and sanity of mind after the Pope's Rhinoceros.

[Bill]

I have one more of the Matthew Shardlake series and I've also got three more books in The Hangman's Daughter series. Both would fit this category...

[Kate, Your Friendly Moderator]

Why is it the minute we move on to another era I find loads of books I want to read for the centuries we've just left behind?!
Any way, I have Martyr By Rory Clements lined up for 16th Century.

[Liz, Your Friendly Moderator]

I'm hoping How to Be Both is the right century. I know it's Renaissance.... I will check.

I need to have a good look through my to read list, as I know there'll be others :)