Atheism - Illuminati discussion
Is there a God?
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Mor
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May 21, 2009 09:51PM
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yes, god is there. although we can not see it or we feel God is silent, but as long as we trust and believe that we have a god, god will always be in our heart and soul.
im muslim.
my god is Alla SWT.
Mod
By the way the Muslim, god "Allah il rahman" allows "Shia" Muslims to kill "Sona" Muslims and the other way around. Your god allows making ritual circumcision in millions of women all over the world so is that God , Is she a merciful lady or a hurt less evil witch? And as such does she even excites out side our mind and wishful thinking?
for the case that I also really do not agree, they only use the name of Islam is wrong. many streams that diverge islam, islam is a religion major, many people who feel most right with the flow of Islam they belong to, even without feeling they confess that they have their own gods. and in the case mean that you also wanota many victims and children who are victims of islam. God is allowing people to settle any misuse of Islam, but God is against violence, especially murder like that, it is a great sin.
other than to kill people, they are also the people who kill themselves do not know the religious character of their own.
Mod
If you think God is present then He is If you think he is not then he is not. It hardly matters to god
As I said in the male/female topic : If there's a god, he/she/it has a mind quite like my son (he is five!). Not an all mighty being but someone who wants to check what will happen under certain circumstances. I'm ready to talk to him/her/it after death and ask a few questions....like why the best persons have to suffer that much and the evil ones experience happy endings all around!
it is a matter of your belief that whether there is god or not. It you think he is thier then he is if you think god is not present than also you are right. God dont take is seriously whether you beleive him or not.
Narendra wrote: "it is a matter of your belief that whether there is god or not. It you think he is thier then he is if you think god is not present than also you are right. God dont take is seriously whether you b..."
I think God is certain peoples' hearts and mind. That's the only way God exists. In reality (out of a day-dream) he doesnt exist at all.
Mod
It is not a metter of beleaving all beleaves should be related to hard avidance do you have such avidance and just saying I can't explain somthing then there must be god is like saying we can't prove this is avirose then it must be cancer and yes beliving in god is like consuming drugs
Mod
Then it stregthen the argument that god needs the human kind more then we need him ...
true. we dont need God. If we do need him, then how? The only way our sociaty is how it is is because of all the people who aren't religious questioned more and more possibilities and helped us expand our minds and evolve more. Religion hold us back on so many things
Mod
i'll explain you a bit why i am belief in god including is god male or female. :>>>i once read an article like this. In all these years (I'm sure) see the attraction of Mikhael Gorbachev in the air fighter. When two aircraft nearly collided, closing the mouth, Gorbachev shouted, "Oh, my God!" In fact, the communists had missed God.
Again, sorry this is rather vulgar, if you ever watch "26" (secret code for BF), you must often hear the actors or actresses muttering, "Oh, my God! Bla bla bla ....."
When in college, i have to admit a friend as a true atheist. When challenged to declare themselves in public, he doesn't dare.
Of the three examples above, the question then we can ask is: why be so? The answer is because the embryo has implanted in the spirituality of the human heart, some way they implement it. Early humans to believe the existence of "God" in worship stones, trees, or amulets, which they believe to be a haven of their ancestral spirits. More civilized inch, comes the myths of the gods, like Zeus, Iris, Apollo, and so on. Quraish community makes "God" they are in shape and Huza Lata, for example. Scientists believe the existence of God with him as explained Prima Causa (The Cause). And so on and so on. That's the answer you first question.
Answer two: God has two contradictory properties, but actually complement each other. Sometimes, God manifests himself as "something that deter" (mysterium tremendum), and sometimes as "something thrilling" (mysterium fascinans). In Islam, called the mysterium tremendum jalaliah, while popular with fascinans mysterium jamaliah terms. Husna Asmaul also reflects these two characteristics of God. Allah is Al-Qabidhu (the All-Narrowing) and Al-Basithu (the All-paved), Al-Khafidhu (the All-Lowering) and Ar-Rafi'u (the All-Raising), Al-Mu'izzu (the All-glorifying) and Al Muzhillu (the All-degrading), Al-Muhyi (the All-Turn) and Al-Mumitu (the All-Deadly), and so on. This is like the duality properties of metal coins. Although contradictory, both are complementary and not mutually exclusive.
A Sufi saying,
"... When winter comes, there is summer in yourself,
and when summer comes, You shelter it. "
Mysterium tremendum or jalaliah shows the masculine nature of God. Conversely, mysterium jamaliah reflect fascinans aka the feminine nature of God. If you're in love ama poetry, you must know ya name on this one. T.S. Eliot. In The Four Quartet, Eliot wrote a poem that shows how religious he was: ... The fire and the rose are one .... Yup, the fire is jalaliah picture, while the rose illustrates jamaliah. Even Jalaluddin Rumi says:
"All of roses, despite its rim
looks like a thorn;
That is the light of the Kingfisher Fire,
though it seems like the fire! "
Now can you explain to me and prove to me if god was not there??????
so, noone want to respons my explaination?
You can't make people believe, CJ. Whatever explanation you've got up your sleeve, there will always be someone with a better one. This might not be me, but still, I don't believe in a God, male or female, who watch over human kind. If there would be, he/ she would just not care about his /her creation and that's worse, isn't it??
i dont want to make tou believe, i just want to make you realize if somethin that you know is wrong...God really hate someone who without religion.
indeed there are times in life where these people have doubts about God in his life. him to reject the existence of god, and let his faith, but doubt someday it will bring you to an anxiety.
One proof of that statement is, recognition of the death of Pharaoh himself when he picked her up.
"... I believe that there is no other god but God Children of Israel, I am among those who submit to him (god)"
whereas during the life of Pharaoh thought that he himself is a god.
presence of god is human nature.
Mod
okay, now i just want you to show me and give me an evidence if god isn't there.
Mod
Let's start again by the simple quistion if good exsist then is she good or bad let's asume that she is good then why does she alow to pristes to maleste children or why do women from islamic countries to have sircusments or for that matter why do have boys of any age to go throw such a seramoney at all . then it must be evil and then it is not god but saiten no ?
or to make a long story short if god can do any thing then it can creat a stone that it can't leaft and it becomes not a god because he can't do evrey thing any more can he ib such a case god does not existes
CJ, the god you're talking about is supposed to love ALL of his/her/its creation.If he/she/it is really there and love all people, animals and plants, then how can he/she/it hate me just because I have no religion and don't believe???
Christina, god hates the thought and deed, but god is NOT hate you. god it did so you can come back to him. I (might) know if you think God did not exist, but in your hearts, who knows?, because sometimes a belief is not accepted by reason and the human mind. but the people remain confident and believe, that's what I'm saying that believing in god is a human FITRAH. instincts.
Proof that the god of love with his creation is the existence of us all on this earth, including other living creatures.
small example: a mother and child who has ties. mother's affection to her child, but if then a mother would give anything (even in the worst case) for children only for reasons of love? sure a mother would give an explanation first, see how the children were trying to gain the trust of the mother, until finally she would believe him and give a pleasure to children.
(not finished and wait for mor... thanks for reading)
Mor, you know? with read this sentence:"or to make a long story short if god can do any thing then it can Creat a stone that it can not leaft and it becomes not a god because he can not do any more evrey thing can ib he such a case, god does not existes ".......
I'm sure you're still thinking about God and it does not close your heart to receive God. you are not unbelieve, but you REFUSE to believe even though you believe, that's what makes you like this. ^. ^
God doesnt exist to me because when i was a little kid i use to be a chistian. but then he never helped me nor my family out with anything. i havnt seen them forover a decade and god has not helped me out with anything, the things i needed desperate help on he never came, so i suffered the consiqences. Since you said "god hates" then doesnt that mean that he has feelings? doesnt that mean he can be over thrown? doesnt that mean he's mortal?
i read a book of greek mythology and the gods had feelings too and they supposably created everything as well. they were no different than the god we're talking about now. the reason why people stopped believing in greek mythology is because they found that it was non-sense. I compare your god and their old gods and i see very little differences
i read a book of greek mythology and the gods had feelings too and they supposably created everything as well. they were no different than the god we're talking about now. the reason why people stopped believing in greek mythology is because they found that it was non-sense. I compare your god and their old gods and i see very little differences
Hi Erick, it turns out you were a Christian religion ... But God has shown its existence to me, Erick. okay I'll tell you my experiences.
about 3 months ago ...
I was driving a car to go home after a visit from an uncle's house. and when on the road, I hit a small child, until finally he was in a coma in the hospital, and had a lot of money was spent to provide the best treatment, but my heart remains calm. until finally the doctor said:
"It is very difficult for these children heal, the possibility of living only 20 %..."
and you must know how scared I was, then I ask and pray to God, my god. "Lord, if indeed you are there, show your power, I ask that you give to the child's recovery, and I promise to be your servant devout ..."
a week later, the boy was able to cry, to play.
after that the doctor said again, "the boy was able to go home ..."
can you imagine?
when the doctor can not help, drugs do not work, and medical equipment could no longer do anything, but with a prayer ... God healed him. If god did not grant it, maybe this time, I was in prison, or, even though I'm not in jail. I will be imprisoned by guilt me as a murderer ...
I have an interesting story. There was a professor graduated from famous universities. he asked one kiai (religious teacher in Islam). Prof: "Mr. kiai, I was nervous. Because, all the most genius people I've asked but they did not know the answer."
Kiai: "What's that?"
Prof: "Actually there is a God or not? If there is, how do I prove it?"
Kiai: (pensively for a moment, a sudden) "Slap !!!!" (hands slapped cheek kiai the professor.)
Prof: (in an angry and annoyed) Sirr!! I am really confused and want to know the answer. why i slapped??!!
Kiai: yes that is the answer.
Prof: what do you mean?
Kiai: What do you feel when I slap?
Prof: of course pain.
Kiai: lie!! lie! I do not believe it!!
Prof: I'm not lying! I swear, my cheeks hurt by the slapped!!
Kiai: I still do not believe it.
Prof: how to make mr.kiai believe. What do I need to slap too?
Kiai: I just believe when you show the pain.
Prof: it is not possible to prove existence kiai pack pain.
Kiai: why are you mad?
Prof: There kiai pack anyways nonsense.
Kiai: and you believe if pain there though you can not see his form?
Prof: absolutely sir kiai.
Kiai: then, why do you doubt the existence of God just because you can not prove the physical existence??
and the professor was down ashamed ... =)
why do you jump to the conclusion that it was God that healed him? if iwere really messed up like the child without docters nor that could save me, i'd fight by myself for my life. it's all about how much you want to live and that kid obviously wanted to live alot longer to see his loved ones again.
but why would it matter if one dies in your religion? we'll just become angels and live the greatest of lives in heaven. i question that. if heaven were true theni would've let myself die along time ago.
and you can prove the existance of physical pain because you can actually feel it, same goes for the wind because you can only prove its aftermath by hearing it, feeling it, etc.
but why would it matter if one dies in your religion? we'll just become angels and live the greatest of lives in heaven. i question that. if heaven were true theni would've let myself die along time ago.
and you can prove the existance of physical pain because you can actually feel it, same goes for the wind because you can only prove its aftermath by hearing it, feeling it, etc.
wow, you were a selfish man ya erick. how god help you if you want to believe anything you do not want.
God gave man two things different from other living things, namely: common sense and feelings. common sense that god gave man can think with logic, and to feelings or beliefs, god give to something that is not accommodated by the common sense and logic. tidah there is one thing that god created for nothing, erick!
like a god created sin in every human being, karna god has al-gaffur properties. (all-merciful) if humans do not have a sin, then the nature of god is not useful.
depends on the existence of god by the people themselves. the more people believe in a god increasingly close to them, but increasingly forgotten a race with his god, the god too much for them.
so, with you not believing in God and leave God only because God has NOT help you, whether you are worthy of blame god for your pride as a people?
you dont know me enough to call me selfish Cj so i suggets keep your mouth shut about that before "God" comes and takes it from you.
thinking that God exists is not commen sense, its JUST a thought and only a thought. you have not yet proved tht there is a God or not, you just told me that you BELIEVE that God did this and that. believing is not proof.
a man in black killed a woman and got away with it, all of a sudden a man in white passes by her body that he didnt notice and people suspect him as the murderer, are you saying that the man in white was the killer because you "believe" it was him? without proof, how can you jump to conclusions?
thinking that God exists is not commen sense, its JUST a thought and only a thought. you have not yet proved tht there is a God or not, you just told me that you BELIEVE that God did this and that. believing is not proof.
a man in black killed a woman and got away with it, all of a sudden a man in white passes by her body that he didnt notice and people suspect him as the murderer, are you saying that the man in white was the killer because you "believe" it was him? without proof, how can you jump to conclusions?
okay. up to you.
im not your mother!
even tho you are in hell or heaven thts not my business.
P.S
just be calm!
then quit acting like you're somebody important to me.
besides what's the difference between hell, heaven, and earth? The devil came from heaven, right? and with him also 1/3 of God's angels went to hell (that's alot) so wat makes your religion think that heaven is so perfect? Doesnt it cross your mind that one day another powerful angel like Lucifer will come up to power again?
and since te earth will end up on fire anyway and its a very violent place, what if the antichist is the devil and earth is hell in the future?
besides what's the difference between hell, heaven, and earth? The devil came from heaven, right? and with him also 1/3 of God's angels went to hell (that's alot) so wat makes your religion think that heaven is so perfect? Doesnt it cross your mind that one day another powerful angel like Lucifer will come up to power again?
and since te earth will end up on fire anyway and its a very violent place, what if the antichist is the devil and earth is hell in the future?
i didn't acting like tht!its a forum i thought!
and i don't want to too.
if you felt like that, i dont care.
of course not, why would someone religious care about another person? they're all selfish, that's the only reason you guys want to go to "heaven" in the first place.
im not ignoring you at all. even if i am, does that mean you have to do it too? you sure talk alot about what's right and what's wrong with the support of your religion, but you sure can't back it up with your actions
i tried to tell you generally of this topic, but the sample what i ever felt is.. yeah.. from my self. and i am a muslim. i have a friend too, he is christian. but he is so rarely to be on, maybe cuz you just read my written, so our intonation is different, maybe what i mean is calm and tried to speak kindly, but you read tht as your self. like me is angry or somethin.. okay, maybe you wanna see what is right and wrong from another religion. i'll post my friend's group. okay.wait.
i already nkow what's right and wrong, its just you that doesnt
Mod
Personally, I have seen absolutely no evidence nor been given any reason which would lead the conclusion that there is any god, gods, or goddesses.
Not to mention that when one reads about things like Origin of Species or sees things like the Hubble Ultra Deep Field, it's extremely difficult to imagine humans and the Earth are as important or special as they are portrayed in most religions.
Not to mention that when one reads about things like Origin of Species or sees things like the Hubble Ultra Deep Field, it's extremely difficult to imagine humans and the Earth are as important or special as they are portrayed in most religions.
Mod
I came here to see a real debate about the actual question... and the third comment was totally off point... I don't believe myself by the way...
