Nothing But Reading Challenges discussion
This topic is about
The Orphan Master's Son
Previous BRs - Authors; I - L
>
Johnson, Adam; The Orphan Master's Son; "Relaxed Buddy Read" Start Date 4th November 2013
date
newest »
newest »
message 51:
by
Sarah
(new)
-
rated it 5 stars
Nov 10, 2013 04:47PM
Karen - you totally called it.
reply
|
flag
@Sandylol re Cathie Mathison!!
:-) Karen, I've recently become a Homeland addict!
Mod
I just realised I can download the audiobook version from my library to my phone. Horrah!
So now I can listen to this on the way to and from work which means I will *hopefully* be able to catch up :)
message 54:
by
Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado
(last edited Nov 12, 2013 01:47AM)
(new)
-
rated it 5 stars
Mod
Starts:”Part Two The Confessions of Commander Ga…
”Ends:"...Pain, what was pain?"
So I am feeling a little bit confused. 12 months have passed and Jun Do is now impersonating Commander Ga. So are the descriptions of his "happy place" with Sun Moon actually flashbacks or is it all just fantasy in his mind? I hope we find out soon what is going on. I feel very lost in this part
Btw - The audio is not the best. They put on Asian accents for the dialogue and speak in their usual American accents otherwise which I don't care for. It makes the dialogue hard to understand and really doesn't add to the story for me.
Pages 218-259
Starts:”CITIZENS, we bring good news! In your kitchens…”
Ends:"...tears spilled slowly, slowly, she began to chew"
Ok, so it looks like he was actually having flashbacks. Is this meant to be showing the "collective" ideas where nothing happens unless you are told? and that is how he gets away with the impersonation? It is almost like the emporer's new clothes. No-one admits to it and so it isn't true. Sandy, I don't think the leader realises at the moment and that is why everyone is going along with it. Obviously the story in 'present time' on the loud speakers is explaining the story in a different light so he gets caught out at some point.
I loved the scene with the rower too... I hope something good happens there
Mod
Starts:”CITIZENS, come, gather ‘round the loudspeakers…”
Ends:"...”Don’t worry,”he said. “My plan won’t be like that.”"
I took it from this section that the 'Dear Leader' is going along with the Ga imposter as he hated Ga anyway and he needs him for the American's visit.
I think it is interesting how Ga is teahcing the children how to find and eat "prison food". He is obviously preparing for any outcome... But it shows he does care about them and helping Sun Moon and the kids escape.
The real Ga was a piece of work! Just when you think the book couldn't get any more shocking!
I do wonder as I'm reading this if we are reading propoganda. I think about the "loud speaker" announcements talking about the atrocities the American's are doing and this book is all about the atrocities the North Koreans are responsible for. I guess that is one of the points - to make us think and consider what is the actual truth
Pages 308-342
Starts:”I was awake in the middle of the night…”
Ends:"...”Into his ear, she whispered, “Let’s escape.”.”"
woohoo! I've caught up!
Apart from that small part which was very confusing (when we first went to section 2), I find this book fascinating and thoroughly compelling.
The nameless Division 42 "biographer"'s character is developing well. is this mother realy blind? Are they just that scared of their own son?
We get that first taste of how Comrade Buc gets embroiled in the escape plan. I quite like him.
Sun Moon kisses "Ga", but he recognises it as a kiss from one of her movies. Does she care for him? I don't know. I think she is just grateful and hopeful for escape. I guess from the photo of the kids in mickey mouse hats we know they at least escape. What about her?
Karen wrote: " Pages 260-307 Starts:”CITIZENS, come, gather ‘round the loudspeakers…”
Ends:"...”Don’t worry,”he said. “My plan won’t be like that.”"
I took it from this section that the 'Dear Leader' is going..."
I just read that section last night (Page 260-307) and I had the same thought about propaganda, Karen. I don't doubt that things are pretty horrible there, but I also wonder just how much of this is accurate and how much is embellished for our benefit.
The Commander Ga part of this book definitely has a surreal quality with the changing shifts in perspective - although thinking this over now, what IS real? Doesn't perspective have a lot to do with what is "true". I mean, there are stories that are told within this novel that the characters themselves know aren't factual, but they still accept them as "true". Sorry that's a bit rambling, but it just occurred to me.
Mod
It is one of the reasons I have found myself absolutely loving this book. Amazingly clever
I just finished this and it will take awhile to digest. It is so tragic, and the atrocities depicted are actually toned down, according to the author in the interview at the end of my copy (ebook borrowed from library). Just when you think things can't get more disturbing, they do.
Sandy - I gave two books at the beginning of this thread of biographies from people who have escaped from North Korea, if interested. I don't know if it would be too much to stomach.
Sarah wrote: "Sandy - I gave two books at the beginning of this thread of biographies from people who have escaped from North Korea, if interested. I don't know if it would be too much to stomach."I am very interested. Thank you for pointing that out, Sarah!
Yes I want to get to them too, eventually - now if I could just finish this book. I am reading two other books as well that I will finish first. But I am so glad people are enjoying this book and I will get back into it and finish before the month is over.
Here is some discussion questions for those who have finished.DISCUSSION QUESTIONS FROM http://www.litlovers.com/reading-guid...1. What makes Pak Jun Do believe he is the son of the Orphan Master? Is he right? How does a child become an orphan, what are they used for, and why are they despised by North Koreans?
2. What is the thematic significance of the Americans mistaking Jun Do as "John Doe"? What does the appellation "John Doe" mean to Americans? What does it suggest about Jun Do himself, as well as the millions of people who live under the North Korean flag?
3. How would you describe life in North Korea for its citizens? What do you find most horrifying about the way in which Adam Johnson portrays that society? How would you—or any of us—fare under such circumstances?
4. What do you make of the various characters who express their horror at life in America and the American's lack of protection by their own government? Why would North Koreans prefer their life to that of Americans?
5. Talk about the treatment of women in North Korea? What actually happens to beautiful young women who are born in the provinces? What is their fate?
Mod
message 64:
by
Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado
(last edited Nov 15, 2013 12:29PM)
(new)
-
rated it 5 stars
Mod
Ok, here is my review:
Totally compelling, horrifying, immensly clever and exceptionally written piece of fiction. I wonder what other superlatives I can use to describe this book? Let's see how I go...
Firstly, this is fiction. I know that. It is based on a version of North Korea from the imagination of Adam Johnson based on his research and visits to the country. As I was reading and was completly horrified I started to google certain events and found they were based on real accounts from North Korea. So that is the horrifying part about this book. It feels like a fantastic dystopian novel and I had to keep reminding myself this is actually happening - in our world - TODAY.
Secondly, you can read very good non-fiction novels on North Korea, but do they give an insight into life for a person in this country? That was what I found so compelling about this book. Adam Johnson is a master of story-telling and has used his immense talent to bring to life different characters and show their trial, tribulations and emotional responses in a genuine and realistic way.
Lastly, alot of this book is about propoganda and how it drives a nation. You could also say this book is propoganda to us about North Korea. So what does that mean? What is real and what isn't? Why are so many of the characters in this book nameless? This is the immensly clever part of the book. It is a "thinking" novel. You can't finish it, put it aside on the coffee table and forget about it. I will be ruminating on this for some time. And I'm sure I will be reading it again.
So out of the c.150 books I have read so far this year, I have only rated five 5 stars, and this is one of them. It took me on a deeply moving, engaging story that has challenged my beliefs and has me wanting to find out more about my world. I can't possibly fault it.
Re: the end
Now, for specifics:
- I found it so incredibly sad that the biographer thought he had learnt from Ga and was emulating him (view spoiler)
I *absolutely love* the final paragraph on page 438 before the last loudspeaker announcement (starts with "returning the Dear Leader's gaze, Ga felt no fear...." What a wonderful moment of insight.
The paperback version didn't have anything from Adam Johnson but acknowledgments, bu the audio version has him speaking for about 5 minutes where he says that he wanted to write a book where it is "the most difficult place on earth to be fully human" and a place where "spontoniety is almost impossible". He talks about visiting the country and seeing a bunch of people squeezed into the back of a ute including those in suits and he was told they were going to 'volunteer' because everyone must. He also talks about their vacant expressions, no emotion, and how he used that as inspiration. He talks about this also in an interview on youtube and also shows photo from his trip here
I am still struggling to find words to describe all I feel about this book. Perhaps I need to sleep on it!!
Karen - what a great interview with the author - thanks for that. This to me is what writing is all about. I like to read to be entertained but it is important for me to broaden my understanding of human nature and the world we live in and history and cultures. I want to think as well as read. What an important book. I am so glad I stuck with it and kept nominating this book. I believe it is deserving of the Pulitzer. And I am glad you all joined in on a buddy read. However, I wish even more people would add this to their reading lists. So I have one last question I will post.
The big questions:How should the rest of the world respond to the violence and tyranny of present-day North Korea? Do we have a moral obligation to intervene? What can we do to help North Korea without supporting its government?
message 67:
by
Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado
(last edited Nov 15, 2013 12:38PM)
(new)
-
rated it 5 stars
Mod
As for your last question, I think this was one of the lasting impressions of this novel for me. It had me wondering if North Korea had any worthwhile natural resources, would we have left them alone for so long?.... This can of course be said of other countries in the world right now too.
North Korea now has generations of people growing up in this environment. Never knowing what the Internet is, missing decades of pop-culture, stories, world events.... It isn't that easy to just throw open the doors. I just can't imagine the country being "liberated" without a massive toll. It makes me think about the collapse of the Soviet Union and the devastating effects that had on the people there. When I went to Russia a couple of years ago the after-math was still being felt. People don't understand how to use money, why they have to buy food, pay for medicine etc. The aged live in terrible poverty as they had no chance to ever "save" for retirement and their average life span is quite shocking (around 60 years old)
Karen wrote: "The aged live in terrible poverty as they had no chance to ever "save" for retirement..."Whoa. I just never even considered that.
Mod
Mod
I did finish awhile ago. I loved the book.
I had every intention of reading this one along with the schedule, but life got in the way. I wish I had read this with others, as I found the story so disturbing. Many times I had to put it down and walk away.Truly a wonderful novel, I can't believe it was a debut. I can't even begin to imagine living in that type of environment, but truly if you don't know any different, how could you think of leaving?
Who was the interviewer at the end?
I've started the audio book for this and it took me some time to get into it,but now I'm completely riveted (50%). What I originally thought was straightforward is turning complex.
Mod
I agree regarding the audio, the narration has been a bit dry and I think that's what took me some time to get into it. I'm so close to the end, I'm completely nervous about what the final days are going to be like and how the puzzle pieces will fit together. (view spoiler)
Mod
Yes this was another one of my nominations that won. It was such a good book.
Wow, the ending. Great discussion topics in this thread, especially those concerning how to respond to this type of read. Like Karen mentioned, this is a thinking book and it really is hard to target which component to focus on. Jun Do had to do horrible things, yet he had so much heart and compassion...how do you resolve that dichotomy.I admit, I do not have much background on N. Korea other than what I see in the news, but I'd like to read the stories Sarah recommended. After I let my brain recover a bit ;)
Oh I just started reading this one. I didn't know that there was a discussion topic! Hope to share some of my thoughts here in the coming days.Incidentally, I did live in N. Korea for about 8 months while my husband was there for more than 2 years. I am eager to find out how the place has been described in this book and how accurate the author is towards the regime and the people.
Srividya wrote: "Oh I just started reading this one. I didn't know that there was a discussion topic! Hope to share some of my thoughts here in the coming days.Incidentally, I did live in N. Korea for about 8 mon..."
It will be great to get your insight since it's such an unknown world to many of us.
Sure Snowtulip. Am really looking forward to discussing this one. :)
Nothing But Reading Challenges
Books mentioned in this topic
The Aquariums of Pyongyang: Ten Years in the North Korean Gulag (other topics)Escape from Camp 14: One Man's Remarkable Odyssey from North Korea to Freedom in the West (other topics)
The Orphan Master's Son (other topics)
The Orphan Master's Son (other topics)
