History is Not Boring discussion

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What would the signers of the Declaration think about us today?

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message 1: by Mary JL (new)

Mary JL (maryjl) | 29 comments If the signers of the Declaration of Independence could read ours newspapers now, what would they think of us? Based on their writings, I think many would be disappointed in us. Thoughts?


message 2: by Steven (new)

Steven | 22 comments I suspect most would be surprised that the USA lasted this long and had obtained this much power and prestige in the world. Sure some would be surprised and disappointed about the decreased alcohol consumption, near universal suffrage, and even about the abolition of slavery. Some of the signers would welcome those things of course. And the same is true for the rest of the changes in the world and in the USA.


message 3: by Kev (new)

Kev | 5 comments I think the signatories of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights would wonder why so many members of goodreads.com belong to a country that has not yet ratified a document that all the other nations of the world have ratified, except Somolia.

History is not boring, but it can be a stickler for details sometimes.


message 4: by Jerry (last edited Jul 08, 2013 10:34PM) (new)

Jerry Ash | 13 comments Mary JL wrote: "If the signers of the Declaration of Independence could read ours newspapers now, what would they think of us? Based on their writings, I think many would be disappointed in us. Thoughts?"

Hi everyone.

Mary JL rang my bell with her question about what the signers of the Declaration of Independence would think if they returned.

My new book, "Hellraiser—Mother Jones: An Historical Novel" just went to press and ebook publisher today and it is about a diminutive Irish woman who fought for the rights of the working class and underclass during the darkest period of the American Industrial Revolution.

She often referred to the "founding fathers" and lamented that their intentions had gone so far off track in her time which stretched from the last days of the Civil War to the worst days of the Great Depression.

While the constitution promised life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, equal rights and justice for all, capitalism established a new foundation built on greed, inequality and injustice that plunged most Americans into a state of economic servitude while robber barons competed with each other to see which one could become the richest man in the world.

As MoJo's story unfolds, one cannot avoid comparing the social, political and economic issues of her day with those of our day. And, in the book, MoJo does come back in spirit to observe a country in worse condition than she left it in 1930.

As we know, economic inequality today is extreme. She observes in the last chapter that the CEO of Walmart earns more in one hour than the average Walmart employee earns in one year!

And so, my friends, if the signers of the Declaration of Independence were to have come back in HER day or OURS, they would have been sorely disappointed!

Without promoting my book, I refer you to its preface which explains further this point of view and can be read for free here:

http://www.jerryash.com/uploads/3/2/5...


message 5: by Vicki (new)

Vicki Seldon | 6 comments Except that the concept of equality, justice, and the right to pursue life, liberty, and happiness was narrowly-defined and limited to white males. In addition, many of the Founding Fathers were, or became, landed gentry. Call it 'agrarian capitalism'. My question back to the original question is this: Are the Founding Fathers coming back as themselves, with the social attitudes of their era, or are they coming back as some enlightened and perfected millennium version of "We the people..."?


message 6: by Jerry (new)

Jerry Ash | 13 comments Not all "founding fathers" were the same, but I've read that many of them bankrupted themselves in the revolutionary cause. Many were, of course, slave owners and lived before the advent of women's suffrage. But still, I do believe they were generally men of high principal as evidenced by the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. Imperfect, yes, but visionary. And I do believe if they were to return for a surprise inspection they would be very sad to see the results of their vision.


message 7: by Mary JL (new)

Mary JL (maryjl) | 29 comments I think it likely they would be shocked about how much government we have! Granted, our population has increased tremendously, but still the government is everywhere.In colonial times, if you wanted to start, say, a bakery in your home to make money you did. No permits; inspection. OSHA etc.

Yes of course we need some of these things--but Jefferson once stated that government was best when it goverened least. He at least I think would be appalled at the huge amounts of government paperwork and interference.


message 8: by Jerry (last edited Jul 09, 2013 07:14PM) (new)

Jerry Ash | 13 comments I'm seeing it through the eyes of Mother Jones whose fight for the working class spanned 65 years from the Civil War to the Great Depression. During that time the federal government was still reluctant to infringe on the rights of the states on issues like human rights and economic justice.

The federalists among the founding fathers pretty much lost their battle to state's rights advocates, but beginning in the 30s and 40s the federal government began taking control of social, political and economic policy.

I'm not saying it was, then or now, good or bad, but I do think that the result is that those who fight back, as Mother Jones did, are painted as un-American. In fact, through today's look-back, Mother Jones is often seen as an extremist who favored socialism over democracy. When, in fact, it was unrestrained capitalism she hated and she fought in FAVOR of democracy. She saw, and she has convinced me that she was/is correct in, that the Declaration of Independence favored a nation of the people, by the people and for the people, and along came capitalism which was/is built on a platform of the rich, for the rich and by the rich. At the expense of the people.

And, as MoJo observed even in her time, her country was not controlled by the democratic process, it was/is controlled by the capitalistic process. I don't believe what our forefathers would find today is anything like the vision(s) they had 250 years ago. Our government is frighteningly like - maybe worse than - the one our forefathers expelled during the American Revolution.

I didn't think this way until I researched the life and times of Mother Jones, got inside her quite intelligent head and caring heart. Then she got in my head and gave me a perspective that didn't quite turn me around, but gave me some serious pause.


message 9: by Donna (new)

Donna Peake | 26 comments They would be shocked @ how BIG our Government has become. Just look at the glitch with Obma Care and how it is going to take a year to fix(smokers). We have to read it to see what's in it.


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