July 2013 Operation Mincement by Ben Macintyre

[Jennifer W]

Welcome to July's group read of Operation Mincemeat: How a Dead Man and a Bizarre Plan Fooled the Nazis and Assured an Allied Victory by Ben Macintyre

Enjoy!

[Nigeyb]

Apparently, whilst writing Agent Zigzag: A True Story of Nazi Espionage, Love, and Betrayal, Ben Macintyre became aware of this strange tale of espionage and deception. I read, and really enjoyed, Ben Macintyre's Agent Zigzag in April 2013, and so didn't need much convincing to read this book too. It's not as entertaining and compelling as Agent Zigzag, however, whilst not quite as gripping, it is a story of huge significance to the way the Second World War played out. It saved lives, shortened the war's duration, and quite possibly changed the outcome. It's well worth reading

The book is full of fascinating facts about spying and deception. Using creativity, opportunity, imagination and wish-fulfilment, a cast of characters - many bizarre, idiosyncratic and eccentric - work up a fascinating tale which they hope will deceive the Nazis. It worked, and travelled from a bunker in London, to a submarine in Scotland, to the coast of Spain, and then on to Germany, finally arriving at Hitler's desk. There are many wonderful aspects to this book, highlights for me included the psychological second guessing; the shambolic nature of Germany's spying operations; the different factions at work in wartime Spain; the delicate subterfuge required by the British in the know, to convince the Germans the documents were important, whilst trying (not too hard) to retrieve them and allowing them the opportunity to get access.

The book contains some remarkable characters too, these include a British establishment Table Tennis-loving Soviet spy, explorers and adventurers, a cross-dressing Colonel, a Jewish Nazi, a German aristocrat deliberately misleading Hitler a pompous pathologist, a Welsh tramp, a racing driver, a submarine captain, and many many more. Were there more eccentrics in those days?

Ben Macintyre is a consumate story teller, and as with Agent Zigzag, he tells this tale with skill, verve, and wit, and really brings the story to life, by weaving together private documents, photographs, memories, letters, diaries, and most significantly newly released material from the intelligence files of MI5. The story of Operation Mincemeat has been told before however this version is unquestionably definitive.

I am now inspired to continue to read more of Ben Macintyre's work. If you have any interest in the Second World War, spying and espionage, and/or history, then you should get a lot out of this book.

What did you think of it? Or, what are you making of it so far (for those that are in the midst of it)?

[Carly]

I listened to the book on audio. Although it was kinda tedious at times, I moved on into the account. Interesting, but it's not something I'd to out and throw my shoes on the roof about.

[Nigeyb]

Thanks Carly.

Which parts did you find tedious? And which parts interested you?

[Susan]

I read this a while ago and loved it. I have read most of this authors books and I also thought the drama/documentary based on this book was brilliant.

What the Allies achieved with Operation Mincemeat was remarkable. It was a real 'Boys Own' tale, wasn't it? Full of bizarre characters and I thought it was incredible the detail they went into - for example going out when he should have been on leave to attend shows, etc and pick up receipts and tickets for his pockets.

[Carly]

Oh ... dunno ... just found that a lot of the tale was 'telling' rather than 'showing'. Like a documentary. But that's how it is when it's an account of true events.

But just the same, I enjoyed it.

About bizarre characters - well, that's how really good stories appeared in the 50's, 60's ... a really good book had some remarkable characters. It wasn't just boy meets girl, some conflict, near misses, then the happy ending.

There was always somebody in the story that you'd turn around and have a good gawk at, if the character passed you on the street.

[Nigeyb]

Susan wrote: "I read this a while ago and loved it. I have read most of this authors books and I also thought the drama/documentary based on this book was brilliant. "

Couldn't agree more. A real page turner and almost as good as Agent Zigzag: A True Story of Nazi Espionage, Love, and Betrayal.

I've only read two books by Ben Macintyre. What else would you recommend by Ben Macintyre Susan?

Susan wrote: "Full of bizarre characters.. "

Talking of which...

Carly wrote: "There was always somebody in the story that you'd turn around and have a good gawk at, if the character passed you on the street. "

Yes, I quite agree Carly.

Who can forget the Table Tennis-loving Soviet spy, the cross-dressing Colonel, the Jewish Nazi, a German aristocrat deliberately misleading Hitler the pompous pathologist, the Welsh tramp, the racing driver, the submarine captain, and many many more?

Were there more eccentrics in those days?

Susan wrote: "I thought it was incredible the detail they went into - for example going out when he should have been on leave to attend shows, etc and pick up receipts and tickets for his pockets. "

Absolutely. It was the incredible attention to detail, along with the Nazi spy set up, that helped to fool the Germans. Amazing stuff.

[Nigeyb]

One thing that really struck me about both Operation Mincemeat: How a Dead Man and a Bizarre Plan Fooled the Nazis and Assured an Allied Victory and Agent Zigzag: A True Story of Nazi Espionage, Love, and Betrayal, was how the agents of the Abwehr (the German military intelligence) were so keen to please their superiors, and how keen the senior officers were to please the upper echelons of the Nazi party. And of course the different factions all in competition too. All of which led to a very ineffective spying operation. A real downside to a totalitarian regime.

I hope a few more BYTers read this book. It's great.

[Susan]

I would recommend Double Cross: The True Story of the D-Day Spies, which is almost as hilarious as Operation Mincemeat. At one point, it was decided to make the Germans believe the British army would be leaving from Scotland (or had troops massed in Scotland) so they got one man (yes, one!) on a bike to cycle round and send messages from various locations. The Germans never questioned anything because, as you have spotted, their weakness was that they wanted to please those in charge. Also, they often had secrets they were trying to hide themselves, which made them too accepting of whatever information they received.Macintyre's real talent is to combine the facts with a sense for storytelling.

Another point I have come to realise over time, from reading books like this, is how the British tended to leave people to get on with things. Churchill once visited Bletchley and the scientists were all annoyed that they were expected to march and do drill, etc. Churchill visited one of the great boffins, who was sitting in front of the fire, smoking a pipe in his slippers. The sergeant was apoleptic, saying, they are in the army now, he has to do drill like other soldiers. Churchill sent him away and said something like, "He's thinking. That's what he does and his thinking is more important than his marching." Shortly after that, the code was broken and the British could read every single signal that the Germans sent - often before they even arrived on Hitler's desk. The great art of delegation!

[Nigeyb]

Susan wrote: "I would recommend Double Cross: The True Story of the D-Day Spies, which is almost as hilarious as Operation Mincemeat."

Thanks Susan. I'll read that Ben Macintyre book next.

Susan wrote: "At one point, it was decided to make the Germans believe the British army would be leaving from Scotland (or had troops massed in Scotland) so they got one man (yes, one!) on a bike to cycle round and send messages from various locations. The Germans never questioned anything because, as you have spotted, their weakness was that they wanted to please those in charge. "

Wonderful. It's travelling by bicycle that adds to the absurdity and the magic. Truly truth is so often stranger than fiction.

Susan wrote: "Another point I have come to realise over time, from reading books like this, is how the British tended to leave people to get on with things. Churchill once visited Bletchley and the scientists were all annoyed that they were expected to march and do drill, etc. Churchill visited one of the great boffins, who was sitting in front of the fire, smoking a pipe in his slippers. The sergeant was apoleptic, saying, they are in the army now, he has to do drill like other soldiers. Churchill sent him away and said something like, "He's thinking. That's what he does and his thinking is more important than his marching." Shortly after that, the code was broken and the British could read every single signal that the Germans sent - often before they even arrived on Hitler's desk. The great art of delegation! "

Spot on.

I wonder if it's something that would happen in the event of a national emergency now. I'd like to hope so, but I suspect it wouldn't be the same. There's so much centralisation and people generally appear to feel less empowered.

[Susan]

I doubt such activities would work in the same way again. With the internet, satellites, etc, the game has changed. However, the absurdity and sheer invention of the wartime boffins was magnificent and certainly changed the outcome of the war.

[Amy]

The odd thing for me about reading this was that I typically love all of the side anecdotes mentioned. But this time it grew a little tedious and felt like it was keeping you from getting to the good stuff, and ultimately, the end. I was most excited when the book finally arrived at the actually battle, that kept me on the edge of my seat!

I feel that I probably wouldn't encourage people to read this particular book as I could explain it to them in a few minutes, and I rarely make that statement when it comes to history books. I will definitely be reading other books about espionage and deception as this one has peaked my interest.

[Nigeyb]

Thanks for your thoughts Amy.

Amy wrote: "The odd thing for me about reading this was that I typically love all of the side anecdotes mentioned. But this time it grew a little tedious and felt like it was keeping you from getting to the good stuff, and ultimately, the end."

That's a very different reaction to my own. I wonder if you might get more pleasure from Agent Zigzag: A True Story of Nazi Espionage, Love, and Betrayal by the same author. The drama is more action-orientated, and less about what the ideas people are coming up with.

Amy wrote: "I feel that I probably wouldn't encourage people to read this particular book as I could explain it to them in a few minutes, and I rarely make that statement when it comes to history books. "

Perhaps it depends on what give the reader pleasure from reading history books. I found a lot to enjoy in the detailed preparations, and the different personalities, and also the way the subterfuge found it's way to the Germans, and ultimately Hitler.

Amy wrote: " I will definitely be reading other books about espionage and deception as this one has peaked my interest."

Excellent. Please let us know what you read, and what you make of it.

[Nigeyb]

Amy wrote: "I will definitely be reading other books about espionage and deception as this one has peaked my interest."

Hi Amy, I was mulling over some possible recommendations for you, and suddenly remembered the wonderful...



Ashenden by W. Somerset Maugham

Here's the review that I wrote back in November 2012, just after I'd finished it. It was the first book I read by W. Somerset Maugham (I think I've read a further four since then).

It's a fascinating insight into the world of the spy and, being WSM, beautifully written too.

Anyone who has an interest in espionage and spying should read this book.

[Amy]

Thanks for the recommendation. I am reading Of Human Bondage (as I hope many of us are!) and will check out Ashenden.

I will be trying Agent Zigzag as well. I am hoping it doesn't give me the same reaction as Operation Mincemeat. It did surprise me that I wanted to know the outcome more than the preparations, maybe its just this particular authors writing style that doesn't agree with me?

[Nigeyb]

Agent Zigzag is more dramatic. I loved it.

[Val]

I have just started reading this. I think I must have missed the email from the library telling me it was available for collection, because the reservation was cancelled and I had to reserve it again.
There is a lot of detail, with perhaps more peripheral information than is required to explain the operation. I see others have already commented on the detail and the side stories. I'm not bored with the excessive detail yet, but might be skipping the side stories by the end of the book, although they do add 'human interest'.

[Nigeyb]

Great to hear that you finally got your copy Val. I hope you enjoy it.

Val wrote: "There is a lot of detail, with perhaps more peripheral information than is required to explain the operation. I see others have already commented on the detail and the side stories. I'm not bored with the excessive detail yet, but might be skipping the side stories by the end of the book, although they do add 'human interest'. "

My recollection is that the "side stories" all added something to the overall story. Everything is interlinked and it all combined to the success of Operation Mincemeat. Looking back I don't remember thinking there was anything much in the way of extraneous detail. Perhaps we all have different tolerances for detail?

I thought Ben Macintyre skilfully told the story and brought it to life by weaving together the private documents, photographs, memories, letters, diaries, and of course the "newly released" material from MI5.

[Jan C]

I'm still reading this and enjoying it.

Yesterday I was channel-surfing and came across a movie of this incident, The Man Who Never Was with Clifton Webb. Very interesting.

[Ally]

Better late than never...I'm about a quarter of the way through. The characters who make up the Intelligence service are certainly interesting in their own right. It is perhaps more interesting for the niggling thought that it was very much of its time and I'm not sure such 'spy novel plots' could work so well today!

[Ally]

I'm finished. I do agree with some of the earlier comments that there were parts if this that felt tedious. For me it was a pacing problem because I was just getting excited by bits of the story and then a chapter change would throw you into learning in depth about a brand new character in the saga before the book got back to the thrilling bits of the story. A little annoying.

I loved the nonce prion of the plan. I enjoyed the bits about how the documents got into German hands and I very much enjoyed the aftermath and Montagu's fight to publish his version in the 50s. I did not enjoy the battle planning parts so much.

I also had one more niggle and that was about what 'Pam' did after the war. One sentence...she got married...Then almost a page about who she married and what he did. Oh dear!

Even given my perhaps petty niggles I really enjoyed this book. I also saw the documentary based on the book and it's a jolly good story.

[Ally]

'Nonce prion' was supposed to read conception! ...sometimes I wonder about the spell checker on my phone!

[Nigeyb]

Thanks for the review and the 'nonce prion' clarification. A jolly good story, as you say.

[Val]

Ally, take a look at this site:
http://www.damnyouautocorrect.com/

[Ally]

He he...it's not just me then! (...you write so quickly and don't always have time for a read through when you're catching moments here and there)...oh dear!

[Bronwyn]

Dragging this thread up because I started this a few days ago. I'm really enjoying it so far. I'm listening to the audiobook, so I don't know if that's affecting how I feel about it; I might be feeling more bogged down if I were reading the physical copy than listening to someone read it to me.

This normally wouldn't be my type of book (WWII, military, etc.), but I really loved the novel Operation Heartbreak by Duff Cooper and knew it was based on this story, so I felt I should read this one. It's not disappointing so far; I am only about a third of the way through. :)