Am I the only one thinks Bella is a strong character??

[[deleted user]]

Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ever a strong at all or is it when she was change into vamp, then she was bit stronger, to protect..."

im not saying its a favorite thing. i mean if you've only read to new moon then you wouldnt see how much change their is her. the movies dont count cause the actress didnt capture all of bella though she did do a good job i think but you cant judge her just yet. no, not fully round with judgement yet. if you'd read them all then yes id say judge it how ever you like but if you havent read them all then no

[Marilyn]

Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ever a strong at all or is it when she was change into vamp, then she was bit str..."

What did I just read? I never said I judged her as a vampire.. I only judged her up to the end of New Moon. I don't know why this is still up for discussion? And I never mentioned the movies.

I only added my opinion on Jesse's judgment on how Bella was as a vampire. You know.. minor input.

[[deleted user]]

Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ever a strong at all or is it when she was change into vamp, then ..."

i didnt say you did. and im not saying you did judge bella human or vampire. im just saying I DONT THINK you judgement SHOULD count. im not saying it did either way

[Marilyn]

Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ever a strong at all or is it when she was change..."

Zzz.. good day, fangirl. I never put in much of an opinion originally anyway. Except for "Sounds like a total cop out".

[Jordan]

I think that she can put her opinion in for the first two books. That's what Kasabuta was doing anyway. I don't think anyone should argue about her judging what she has read of Bella.

[Kit]

Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Furthermore, if puritanical ideas of feminine mystique count as strength, I guess Bella is a Madonna.
"

What does Madonna mean in this context?

Doesn't that mean the "virtuous one" t..."

I'm talking more the tired trope of "average" and yet still uberspecial ladies who are somehow destined to do something ~*~so amazingly special~*~ that they oh-so-humbly feel themselves unsuited to perform, and yet somehow have some idiotic power shoehorned in to justify their association or magnetism among these powerful people. To clarify, poor old average Bells (whom everyone seems to desperately love and she's so OMGANNOYED that people would take interest in poor widdle her...unless they are emotionally abusive, of course) and her crappy firewall powers that somehow make her just average enough to make your average pubescent able to wish they were like her (and hate her at the same time for not deserving their pwescious, saintly, angelic, tortured, love interest) and just not-average enough to allow specialness to be both reasonably attainable and "OH STILL SPECIAL" and revered by others around her for the use of her mediocrity in the midst of the exceptional.

In short, still a Mary Sue.

[Kirby]

Genesis wrote: "Olivia wrote: "Genesis wrote: ""No need to sass me, miss."

That has to be the creepiest combination of school teacher and pimp.
You try too hard."

humm."

I'm sorry, were you trying to communicat..."

No, I agree with Olivia this time. This exchange has certainly made me say "humm."

[[deleted user]]

Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ever a strong at all or is it when..."

trust me im not a fan girl. just because ive read them and have to deal with dazzled out friend who love them doesnt make me one. but being around my friends every day it kinda rubs off. and im sorry if i pissed you off i didnt mean to be so... whats the word "Bitchy" or blunt?

[Diane]

Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Furthermore, if puritanical ideas of feminine mystique count as strength, I guess Bella is a Madonna.
"

What does Madonna mean in this context?

Doesn't that mean the "..."

Ahh I see. I was a little confused with the Madonna usage since Bella does not fit my description of a Madonna at all. Maybe the term is "special snowflake"?

[Kit]

Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Furthermore, if puritanical ideas of feminine mystique count as strength, I guess Bella is a Madonna.
"

What does Madonna mean in this context?

Doesn't tha..."

I could totally roll with that term instead.

[Jordan]

Olivia wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Furthermore, if puritanical ideas of feminine mystique count as strength, I guess Bella is a Madonna.
"

What does Madonna mean in..."

I think she says that Bella had the shield all along. That's why Edward and Aro couldn't read her mind, that's why Jane couldn't use hers or why anyone could use their mind tricks (except Alice) on her.

[Jessica]

Jordan wrote: "Olivia wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Furthermore, if puritanical ideas of feminine mystique count as strength, I guess Bella is a Madonna.
"

What does ..."

But why does she has it? How is it possible that she has it? No one knows.

[Jordan]

Jesse wrote: "Jordan wrote: "Olivia wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Diane wrote: "Kit wrote: "Furthermore, if puritanical ideas of feminine mystique count as strength, I guess Bella is a Madonna...."

Yeah, I don't know.

[Jessica]

Jordan wrote: "Yeah, I don't know. "

and that's the thing that makes people say she's a mary sue. (Just to add on to what was said before on this topic) She has an ability that was never explained that once a vampire, was able to master just like that. She had every guy in the school drooling over her, her blood was a delicacy to every vampire for no reason, she was able to control her blood lust immediately, so on and so forth.

[Shona]

She often was detached (in small ways) - never wanting to join in with friends, 'closing' herself off... (except to Edward of course).

Maybe that amplified when she became a vampire?? And manifested in the form of a mental shield...

The rest of it, I agree, is a bit puzzling... I too, could never understand how she managed such control with newborn bloodlust when even someone like Carlisle endured it. It would have added to the story too, to have her 'act out' for a while.

Whilst I love both the books and the movies I do still agree that there are certain flaws such as this in the plot/characters.

[[deleted user]]

This discussion is making my head spin.
Bella is not a strong character in any sense of the term. She is immature, whiny, and selfish to no end.
However, she's a lot more tolerable than Bethany Church or (shudder) Zoey Redbird.

[Jordan]

Jesse wrote: "Jordan wrote: "Yeah, I don't know. "

and that's the thing that makes people say she's a mary sue. (Just to add on to what was said before on this topic) She has an ability that was never explained..."

Maybe that's why mosquitos like me so much... I have sweet blood. I don't know why I said that, the thought just occurred LOL. But I have always wondered why she had this gift. I mean, Edward can read minds, but he couldn't when he was human. So, that's peculiar. I wonder if she has an ancestor with unusual gifts...

[Jordan]

Brooke wrote: "This discussion is making my head spin.
Bella is not a strong character in any sense of the term. She is immature, whiny, and selfish to no end.
However, she's a lot more tolerable than Bethany Chu..."

Zoey never really got on my nerves until people brought it up. Now I can't read a HoN book without questioning her character. She tends to cause more trouble than she can handle, doesn't she?

[Marilyn]

Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ever a strong at ..."

Could have fooled me with the way you reacted to "Sounds like a cop out", seeing that I read everything over. I made no such comment about Bella being a vampire (or any comment at all).

[han⚢]

I certainly don't think Bella's a particularly strong character.

[Maryann]

Yes.

[Stephen]

Personally, I've NOT thought of Bella as weak.

She is self sacrificing. She goes to live with her father when it becomes clear that her mother would be happier traveling with hubby #2.

She's a caretaker. It soon gets to where Charlie would be lost without her.

She's bright and capable and gets what she wants.

She fascinates Mike and Tyler and Eric from day one and it's made abundantly clear that she's not graceful or traditionally beautiful.

Yes, she is fascinated by Edward. But knowing what you want and going after it is NOT what I'd call weak.

[[deleted user]]

Jordan wrote: "Brooke wrote: "This discussion is making my head spin.
Bella is not a strong character in any sense of the term. She is immature, whiny, and selfish to no end.
However, she's a lot more tolerable t..."
Yes. At least Bella was only in a love triangle...

[Jordan]

Brooke wrote: "Jordan wrote: "Brooke wrote: "This discussion is making my head spin.
Bella is not a strong character in any sense of the term. She is immature, whiny, and selfish to no end.
However, she's a lot m..."

Haha, right? How many now? I think she was seeing 4 guys at once? (Zoey, that is)

[Shona]

Nice comment, Stephen. It's great to see someone pointing out the good sides to her character. And I love that this is coming from a guy. It goes against the grain. :)

[[deleted user]]

Jordan wrote: "Brooke wrote: "Jordan wrote: "Brooke wrote: "This discussion is making my head spin.
Bella is not a strong character in any sense of the term. She is immature, whiny, and selfish to no end.
However..."
She's had no fewer than five love interests over the course of the series.

[Jordan]

Brooke wrote: "Jordan wrote: "Brooke wrote: "Jordan wrote: "Brooke wrote: "This discussion is making my head spin.
Bella is not a strong character in any sense of the term. She is immature, whiny, and selfish to ..."

Right? I liked her with Eric, then she ruined it with Lauren... (was that his name?) Idiot.

[[deleted user]]

Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question here is bella ev..."

really i was being over dramatic, now that i look at it. but now i can be a bitch if u'd like. but to me this is stupid and pointless and i'm not even going to waste my time on this

[Marilyn]

Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Kendra wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Jesse wrote: "Olivia wrote: "whichever. the question..."

kbye. Not like you don't need to apologize or anything.

[[deleted user]]

Olivia wrote: "Angela K wrote: "I don't think she is simple, exactly. I felt like her character wasn't as fully developed as she might have been. The internal conflict of starting over in a new place was well-don..."
You're catching on, Olivia.

[Clarissa]

I agree with messages 222 and 223. to me Bella needed more strength in her self-esteem. Her character (not to sound too feminist) made us young ladies seem like a bunch of love struck dweebs. That without a man to love us we would go suicidal. not only that but weak of females, because she wasn't strong has a human but until she was converted into a vampire.

[Diane]

Jordan wrote: "But I have always wondered why she had this gift. I mean, Edward can read minds, but he couldn't when he was human. So, that's peculiar. I wonder if she has an ancestor with unusual gifts... ."

We don't really know if it did manifest because there wasn't much on Edward's human life in the books. Maybe it manifested in subtle ways or in ways that he didn't notice.

We only really know that Bella's a has gift when she interacts with vampires who have certain powers, in normal human circumstances I don't think anybody would notice she has that gift at all.

[Jordan]

Diane wrote: "Jordan wrote: "But I have always wondered why she had this gift. I mean, Edward can read minds, but he couldn't when he was human. So, that's peculiar. I wonder if she has an ancestor with unusual ..."

That's true. If only SM would finish Midnight Sun, maybe we would know a lot more of his history.

[Kit]

Clarissa wrote: "I agree with messages 222 and 223. to me Bella needed more strength in her self-esteem. Her character (not to sound too feminist) made us young ladies seem like a bunch of love struck dweebs. That..."

Because being mistaken for a feminist is the worst thing, right? *chuckles* :)
Yeah, Bells is pretty much a chef's salad of traditional feminine gender roles cleverly disguising her iceberg-lettuce characterization with a vinagrette of "TROO WUV" to give her story any flavor whatsoever.
I think the true test of a real character is if you'd read about them outside of the situation they are written in, namely, are they interesting enough to read on their own in any context? If not, I'd say you have more of a plot device than a fleshed-out character.

[Clarissa]

you are right kit and now that I think about it, Bella seemed alright before she met Edward. you know she was shy but easy to talk to out going.

[Mirkat]

Kit wrote: "Because being mistaken for a feminist is the worst thing, right? *chuckles* :)"

Ha, thank you! I consider "feminist" a compliment. :)

[Chloe]

Barbara wrote: "My biggest problem is the book "teaches" young teen girls that your life should revolve around a man and relies on him way to much to live. I feel it portrays her as being extremely weak and that ..."

I can't agree with that... What I can say is if you want to get to that level with this book, you can say the same about the media. (You don't want to hear my rant on that!Lol)

Is it such a bad thing to teach teens that love is brilliant? It could be telling me that weed is good for the soul, the only way to be respected is through fear or that life isn't worth it.

[Heidi]

I want to know where all these "fictitious girls" are which are "learning" life lessons from Twilight. I believe in Darwin Awards. If I were to have kids, my house would NOT be childproof. When I grew up if we were dumb enough to stick our fingers in the light socket, we died. The problem is, too many stupid people are allowed to live because we "childproof" everything. I mean, its like saying these kids are going to grow up and believe Santa Clause and the Tooth Fairy are real because we told them they were. Someday, (like all of us) these impressionable girls are going to look back and realize quote is true for everyone "Dear past me, YOU WERE SO STUPID .JUST BEYOND STUPID .I CAN'T EXPLAIN HOW STUPID YOU WERE. Dear Present me,YOU'RE STILL STUPID JUST NOT AS STUPID AS YOU WERE BEFORE . Dear future me , DON'T be stupid!"

[Kit]

Mirkat wrote: "Kit wrote: "Because being mistaken for a feminist is the worst thing, right? *chuckles* :)"

Ha, thank you! I consider "feminist" a compliment. :)"

Same here. I can never resist a dig at that "I'm no feminist, but..." statement. It is as tempting as blood to a vamp for me. ;D

[Megan]

I think that there were some parts that she was good in but there were also some parts in the movies were I think that she could have done better That is just my opinion of how good of a character she is.

[[deleted user]]

Yes, yes you are. Haha, I'm just kidding. I'm sure you aren't the only person who thinks so!

As for me, Bella was... well, to be kind let's just say she wasn't my favorite character. Now that's just one thing. She is a whiny, self-depricating, selfish, irritating, one-minded girl! When she doesn't get what she wants, she whines and pouts and does stupid things until she gets it.
Bella is a terrible role model! She teaches girls that if you don't have a boyfriend, you should wallow in self-pity for months on end, jump on the backs of random men's motorcycles, and then fall off a cliff to get a buzz. She teaches girls to lead on boys, to marry at a young age, to beg their boyfriends for sex (most of whom won't object!), to lie to their parents, to call their parents by their first names... oh my gosh it will take hours to write up a list!
Well, she isn't my favorite character, that's for dang sure.

[Taylor]

I think Bella changed a lot during the entire saga, as Jacob did. Jacob was a kid and became a man. Bella was a weak teenager and became a very strong and independent woman...Just that!!

[Heidi]

Nikki wrote: "Bella is a terrible role model!"

Most people are terrible role models. You can't base everything she does as something she "teaches" others. If that were the case, then no one would be role model worthy other than Jesus (and thats only if you believe in him). People are going to have faults. All of which you listed are how you perceive her (subjective), not what she actually does.

[Emily]

Most people are terrible role models. You can't base everything she does as something she "teaches" others. If that were the case, then no one would ..."

I totally agree with this. Just because Bella is listed as a main character doesn't mean she has to be perfect in every way.

[[deleted user]]

You both have really good points, and I agree that there are a lot of people in literature who aren't good role models, and the books would be a lot worse if they were written to be good role models.

That aside, I find her personality to be a bit stereotypical of a teenage girl in love. As Charlie states in the third book, she dropped all of her other friends for the Cullens, she absolutely broke down when Edward left her, and her entire world revolves around him and his world. Despite the fact that he's an undead vampire, that's how a lot of teenage girls act when they're in a relationship. This relationship should be vastly different than any simple high school drama, but when you get down to it, it just isn't.
As well, I don't think Meyer wrote her as a very strong character. What I mean to say is that she didn't characterize her as well as she could have. Her character in itself is a pretty basic teenager. She tried to make her different by having her act differently than her classmates, and react differently to the things she finds out about Edward, but when you get down to the root of it she is a very simple character. There isn't a lot of depth to her as she was written.

[Sarakaay]

I really don't understand why people think Twilight is so bad. I mean, some of it is poorly written, but the characters aren't all that bad. Bella is a strong female character, she's independent and very strong willed.
Also, another thing that bothers me with these judgements is that people always compare Twilight to something completely off topic like Harry Potter. They are not similar at all! It's unfair to compare any book, let alone Twilight, a love story mind you, to that series!

[Marilyn]

Lol, Bella independent. That's the funniest I've ever heard. If you mean very strong willed to be selfish, then I agree.

[[deleted user]]

Kasabuta wrote: "Lol, Bella independent. That's the funniest I've ever heard. If you mean very strong willed to be selfish, then I agree."

I agree with you!
I think that the reason the answers in this thread are so varied is because everyone is viewing her actions in a different light. What some see as selfish others may see as selfless. It's all about opinion.

[[deleted user]]

Nope.

[Chloe]

I agree! And if people say she relies on other too much, she did move from Phoenix to Forks where the only people she knew was her dad and Jacob and he didn't go to her school so she could hang on to him. Then she found someone she was intrigued by, and she pursued it until she found someone she could love and of course when he up and leaves her a long with all of her other friends, yeah okay maybe she does get a little bit depressed, wouldn't you?

I think Twilight shows a normal teenage girl. People are too used to self sacrificing, bold and courageous teens who wouldn't flinch if a four headed sea dog climbed out of their kitchen sink.