Classic Historical Fiction discussion
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Katherine
Anya Seton Group Read
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Part One: Chapter 1-4
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Marie
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rated it 5 stars
May 23, 2013 11:58AM
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I love the demure but intellectual character of Katherine.
And it's interesting to have Chaucer here too!
I started on Monday, so I'm about 150 pages in (chap. 11, I think). I loved this book when I read it 40+ years ago, and I'm happy to find that I still do. Most of all, I love the historical detail, which is rich and enveloping without becoming dull. And the characters are very appealing.The one thing I notice is that Seton jumps a lot from one character's head to another's. I ignored this the first time, but now I do find it a bit distracting. Fortunately, it lessens after the first few chapters.
The pace is good from the beginning, but it really picks up after chap. 10.
Off to read some more.
I need to dig out my copy so that I can start reading this one. :)
I'm taking on too much, as usual, but I'm joining in. Have been wanting to read this for years!
I like Katherine's character too. She's not always just led by other (though she is a great deal because she's so young), but there are times when she stands up for herself, and I like that. Also, Marie, I agree--I love Chaucer's character :)
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I find that if I'm reading a book that jumps from one character's POV to another and I don't really register the change enough to stop my reading flow, then I find it to be a smooth transition. I think for me, that's what's going on with Katherine. I can see how, if this continues until the end of the book, especially with characters that may be considered sort of minor, it would become distracting.
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Is there a reading schedule for this book, or read at our own pace? I'm reading other books at the same time, so I need to know how much to read of this book to keep up, lol.
Lyn M (readinghearts) wrote: "I need to dig out my copy so that I can start reading this one. :)"Same here. I think I know where it is...
I never used to notice character jumping at all. I think it was quite the usual style in 1954, when this book was published. It was only after I started writing fiction that I learned it was frowned on mid-scene, precisely because it can keep the reader from identifying with one character. But I agree that it's not excessive here.I do like the insight Seton gives into her characters, even quite minor ones. They are very vivid and alive. She's also very good at weaving in the historical background without going so far into the details that it feels as if I'm reading a history book instead of a novel. Already by the end of chapter 4, she has laid out the main lines of the story and assigned her cast to its places on the stage.
If anyone's interested, I wrote a blog post on medieval/early modern women that mentions this book: http://blog.cplesley.com/2013/07/ladi....
Character jumping has never really bothered me (unless done sloppily); I guess because I've read a lot of older books, where it's more common.
This is my second reading, and this time I was struck by the the first line "In the tender green time of April, Katherine set forth..." as possibly being a tribute to Chaucer and his opening lines of The Canterbury Tales "When April with his showers sweet with fruit... "
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Sandra- There is NOT A reading schedule, just the topics broken down in sections HERE . Since everyone reads at a different pace and has different home/work schedules I didn't want to put undue pressure on anyone.
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The prose intoxicated me from the start - I love how she writes. This is my first Seton read as well, and now I am intrigued enough to read some others of hers!
I have not read any other Katherine Swynford stories, so I am glad that Seton's view is going to be my first. I am itching to google Blanche of Lancaster because she intrigues me so much, but I don't want to ruin the plot for myself.
Marie wrote: "Susan wrote: "This is my second reading, and this time I was struck by the the first line "In the tender green time of April, Katherine set forth..." as possibly being a tribute to Chaucer and his ..."The only other books I can recall John of Gaunt making appearances are
Within the Fetterlock and Lion of Alnwick, and those are fairly minor appearances IIRC.
What's fun is Susan Howatch's The Wheel of Fortune. She parallels the Plantagenets, and in one of the sections (she uses multiple first person narratives), you get *John of Gaunt* and his *Katherine* as Howatch sees them. Loved it.
Don't google Blanche. Just don't.
I love Blanche as well, she is so selfless and sweet. Marie and Susan, Seton's prose is beautiful and I find myself truly picturing a setting or a character she describes in detail. I tend to lose myself while reading this novel and I become completely caught up in the story.
Susan wrote: "This is my second reading, and this time I was struck by the the first line "In the tender green time of April, Katherine set forth..." as possibly being a tribute to Chaucer and his opening lines ..."I love that first line, too. It also says to me that Katherine is tender and green and in the April of her life. And she has so much more to learn.
When I was in high school, I had to learn the prologue to the Canterbury Tales in the "olde Englishe." I can still recite it!
On Blanche...(no spoilers!) I thought Seton did a marvelous job making her sympathetic. After all, she was Katherine's rival for John's affections and making her a villain would have been so easy, if historically inaccurate. Helps make the story more complex.
Spoiler for some who havent gotten to page 68 yet)So far this is really good. I'm only on pg 68 but I find the writing excellent and every page draws me further into the history. I did find though that after so much struggling to not wed Hugh, Katherine, readily gives in to his proposal when he enters her room. Not sure if she finally resigned to agree because of Blanche's kindness (and not wanting to disappoint her)- or basically saw she had no other choice...
I just read that part and thought it was that she finally realized she had no hope, since even Queen Phillipa on her sickbed had also agreed to the marriage. But I agree it did seem abrupt, since she was hiding there to avoid Hugh.
Yes so far this is the only part I found rushed. I loved the description of all that happened when John was little. I felt so bad for him... But it's now planted a seed in my mind and am wondering if the same character, peter will turn up later in the book and still use 'the changeling' to haunt John. It's great for me that I don't know any of this history at all- very exciting:)
I felt bad for the Duke while reading about his childhood as well, especially when he lost his nurse. Since he was a royal child, his parents were gone a lot and she was the only one to love him.
Always late to the party, but I'm so delighted to be reading this story once again. I'd forgotten what a tapestry Seton weaves with her words. It's such a rich experience. She's spoiled me for other writers.I do have one quibble with the nurse and her son. The son is only four years older than John, yet he speaks like a peasant with a thick flemish accent. Doesn't sound right to me, especially since his mother, the nurse, speaks like a upper class woman. Other than that I'm enjoying this immensely.
Looks like I am late to the party as well...I am half way into chapter two and already drawn in. Katherine has made her journey to the castle at the Queen's request and I simply must find out what happens to her. Seton has such a way with words that I am thoroughly enjoying this story. This is all new territory for me, know practically nothing of this history.
Diane Lynn wrote: "Looks like I am late to the party as well...I am half way into chapter two and already drawn in. Katherine has made her journey to the castle at the Queen's request and I simply must find out wha..."
Diane, I love how Seton portrays Godeleva and Dame Cicily. They're such rich characters and I love how Godeleva acts maternally toward Katherine in these beginning scenes.
MaryKate wrote: "I love how Seton portrays Godeleva and Dame Cicily. They're such rich characters and I love how Godeleva acts maternally toward Katherine in these beginning scenes."I hope Katherine remembers Sheppey's needs later on. Godeleva did act maternally to Katherine.
(view spoiler)
Dame Cicily was a hoot!
I did google Geoffrey Chaucer, but I won't google Blanche, thanks for that warning, Misfit.
I like Blanche's tenderness and care towards Katherine.
I am really enjoying this book so far. The beautiful descriptions in it as well as the characters feel very real to me more-so than other books I've read that are set in this time period. I love Blanche's kindness towards Katherine, and just the general demeanor of Blanche makes it very hard not to love her as a character. I am a little confused at why sometimes John of Gaunt (the duke of Lancaster) seems to dislike Katherine so much and blames everything on her. And yet other times like when he stopped and admired her beauty during the tournament he seemed to be developing feelings for her that he quickly pushed away; I guess time will tell =)
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I also am enjoying the book so far, though I'm a little behind where I wanted to be by this date. I'd forgotten how much I enjoy Seton's descriptions since reading Dragonwyck one year ago. The moment when I felt hooked was when Katherine arrives at the castle, her sister prepares her for dinner by scrubbing her down, and Katherine's long red hair drops down below her knees. Since I read that part, I've been "in" the book. In Chapter 4, I felt like I was there watching Roger vs. Hugh with Katherine and Blanche. For months I've been reading Philippa Gregory's Cousins War series and her writing is so blah. I think I'll be done with Gregory after that series ends and stick with masters like Seton.
Other thoughts: The Duke is a rather complex character and not Duke of Perfection. Katherine's hiding when Hugh pursues her struck me as exactly how a 15-year-old with no one on her side would act. And I really like Blanche!
I don't think they do descriptions of backgrounds like they used to, and it's a loss.
Maggie I feel the same way for the Gregory books! I enjoyed the last one I read, The White Princess( simultaneously with this Seton one) but a whole chunk of chapters I could have done without. It's my first Seton book and so far I'm enjoying it - except for the quick change of character behaviours at times ( for example John towards Katherine as you too mentioned).
Lucy wrote: "Maggie I feel the same way for the Gregory books! I enjoyed the last one I read, The White Princess( simultaneously with this Seton one) but a whole chunk of chapters I could have done without."Then I advise you to not read The Other Queen in her Tudor series. I think it must be her absolute worst; you only need about three chapters of it. I'm glad to know The White Princess is good. The Lady of the Rivers and The White Queen were my favorites in the series so far, and I've been looking forward to miniseries adaptation that will air in the U. S. in August.
Maggie wrote: "Lucy wrote: "Maggie I feel the same way for the Gregory books! I enjoyed the last one I read, The White Princess( simultaneously with this Seton one) but a whole chunk of chapters I could have done..."I'll be posting my review of The White Princess soon- ill post u the link. But seriously it was 'fair' I can't even say it was good.
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I hated her character portrayals of all of them.
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I'll get back to it someday.
Marie hahaha!!!! I know!!! I can't believe I didn't set it aside...I think it's cuz I really wanted to get to know the history a bit better and E. Woodville was the only one who kept my attention.
Okay, not good. Good for Gregory, then? Lol. I feel like The Other Boleyn Girl wasn't that bad, though I read it in college and maybe I wasn't as critical as I am now.
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I've enjoyed several of her novels (particularly Virgin Earth), and found others unreadable (Wideacre, I'm looking at you).
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I suggest having a higher tolerance for incest for fun and profit than I do, in that case.
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Susanna wrote: "I've enjoyed several of her novels (particularly Virgin Earth), and found others unreadable (Wideacre, I'm looking at you)."Virgin Earth was a free bookfair pick that I haven't read yet and had thought of passing along, so maybe I'll read it after all.
Marie wrote: "(Eew ..um.. no. Not in this lifetime.)"::nods::
Classic Historical Fiction
Books mentioned in this topic
Virgin Earth (other topics)Wideacre (other topics)
Within The Fetterlock (other topics)
Lion of Alnwick (other topics)
The Wheel of Fortune (other topics)
