The Robin Hobb Collection discussion
This topic is about
Ship of Magic
Book 4 - Ship of Magic
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Ship of Magic > Chapter One to Five
I started really early and read this in October (I think)
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alex > there isn't really a fixed speed. personally i tend to do 1 or 2 chapters a day, depending on the length. but you can go slower or faster if you want.
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Add to that all the commands i received from GR friends and my expectations are trough the roof!
Always tough to comment on the first chapter though... we know so little!
The prologue introduces us to some strange serpent creatures on the move. But little information beyond that
Ch1 gives us Kennit, a slightly cocky pirate who has a strong belief in his luck and an interesting charm around is arm. It also gives us Wintrow, a 13year old boy in a monastry. I was very glad when i heard he was going to leave the monastry to head back. Too much strange phylosopical conversations going on there. I always get headaches from these sort of discussions :)
I'm really digging the the idea of ships that bond with their owners and absorbing their owners soul when they die to eventually become fully awake.Kennit is not a nice little pirate is he?
When are these events supposed to be happening in relation to the events of the last 3 books I wonder?
This book has grabbed me from the get go anyhow.
This trilogy takes place in the 15 years between the Farseer and Tawny man trilogies.
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the liveships are a cool idea indeed! not exactly sure how it works yet, but i'm sure we'll find out in the next chapters.
kennit is not a nice pirate but still he has something promising. kyle on the other hand? bwah! :)
Hanne wrote: "the liveships are a cool idea indeed! not exactly sure how it works yet, but i'm sure we'll find out in the next Fixed.
I thought I was way behind! I'm sure I will be at some point. I thought I would miss the first person of Farseer, but so far so good with the new characters. It will take more reading to tell you who I look forward to and who I dread because there are always those; although I am digging the pov from the liveship. I'm wondering how he will come to play in the story- Kennit's ship?
I thought Hobb did an excellent job of the argument between Althea and Kyle. She made us see both of them truly believing they had a right to the ship AND Kyle believes it is Althea causing the discord between him and his men giving him a legitimate reason to want her off the ship.
Another issue that I'm sure will be answered is -the liveship is awakened after three generations of deaths ABOARD the ship. What would happen if Ephron died in his bed?
I just saw Hannes comment and Robs reply and apparently we dont find out the details in the next few chapters. Sorry I missed that before.Oh well...
Rob wrote: "This trilogy takes place in the 15 years between the Farseer and Tawny man trilogies."Thanks Rob.
Candace wrote: "I thought I was way behind! I'm sure I will be at some point. "I've had a few interruptions this week so less time spent on this than normal :) - It's not a race anyway. It's not...really...but I'll probably beat you to the finish. I'm not competitive.
Call it a "Contradiction of Sa"
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Fixed."
LOL :)
I guess i should have known!
Candace wrote: "I thought Hobb did an excellent job of the argument between Althea and Kyle. She made us see both of them truly believing they had a right to the ship AND Kyle believes it is Althea causing the discord between him and his men giving him a legitimate reason to want her off the ship.
I am fully on team Althea here! :D
Kyle didn't make a good impression on me right now, but who knows? that might change
Plus his son is coming back from the monastry, a possibility Althea failed to take into account
Candace wrote: "Another issue that I'm sure will be answered is -the liveship is awakened after three generations of deaths ABOARD the ship. What would happen if Ephron died in his bed?
I had the same thoughts. So weird, especially as they decide to take a 5 months trip! sounds a bit dangerous if you're waiting for a ship to quicken.
It was only supposed to be a two month trip, I think, and he stretched it out
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I can't remember what would happen if they don't die on board. If/when you get to that part, you'll have to remind me.It's very important/very expensive to make a liveship. I think the families will go out of there way to make sure that doesn't happen.
Hanne wrote: "yes, but that's weird if you know the guy is very sick and he needs to die on board of that ship right? if circumstances are so strict, you would take the old man with you, or never be out of port ..."I'm not sure Kyle has the best interests of the family at heart. Or he's trying too hard to prove he should be the Captain of the boat. Maybe he thinks it would be easier to take control of the ship if the old man dies without any ceremony handing the ship over to his daughter?
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It's important to remember that Kyle isn't blood. He married into the family.
@David p. 68 of my edition (do we all have same editions?) Ronica says during the past five years she has had problem with their finances in part due to the "red ship wars to the North destroying trade..."
David Sven wrote: "It was only supposed to be a two month trip, I think, and he stretched it out"Yes, Althea thought he was trying to profit and impress her dad, and if the dad does have to die onboard- it would not benefit him to miss it when he thinks he will be captain once it is a liveship- so I think he is just inept for the job as Althea has proven.
It seems as if Ephron does not die on board the ship, it will not quicken. I think it was foolish of them to send the ship out without him. I'm in the midst of ch 3 p. 79, Ephron has awoken wanting to know where the ship is, "I'd like my ship here so I can die on her decks and quicken her, so my whole damn life won't have been for nothing" Further down, " Let me but die on the decks of my ship, and I'll see the Vivacia serves you well."
What a romantic notion that the ship the family sails will have the souls of its ancestors.
Ohh, the setting in this chapter was very original and creepy- a river that suddenly turns milky and white and devours anything that falls in it. How they build their houses to protect them from the forest floor which could overflow with the river water at any time. Am I correct, is that why they build the houses in the trees? Also, the often -born deformed children somehow linked to this setting- where is the line- how much is so deformed that the parents must kill the child and must they? Is it for the parents, child, or the council that this is done? So much to find out in this book. I'm soooo excited!
Candace wrote: "It seems as if Ephron does not die on board the ship, it will not quicken."That's correct. What I don't recall is if they explain what that means for the liveship. To quicken a ship it needs to absorb the blood of 3 generations of the family.
Can it skip a generation? Could Althena quicken it when she died? I'm not sure this is ever addressed in the book. If it is, I don't remember the answer.
Candace wrote: "Am I correct, is that why they build the houses in the trees? ."Yup.
Your other questions are good ones too.
Candace wrote: "@David p. 68 of my edition (do we all have same editions?) Ronica says during the past five years she has had problem with their finances in part due to the "red ship wars to the North destroying..."This would seem to place the start of the book somewhere within five years of the events of the last trilogy.
I have the kindle omnibus with the whole trilogy in one. So this book ends at around page 834 and the Red Ship war reference you point out first gets mentioned on page 75.
Candace wrote: "so I think he is just inept for the job as Althea has proven. "
Yeah, I'm leaning more towards that at the moment. You and Hanne raise some good points.
Agree that the river and the deformed children creepy. I wonder if the deformed children look like baby "Others?" Or maybe have something to do with them?
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kellit is quite the pirate with ambition. but not the brutal type of ambition i expected after seeing him on the island. what a lovely surprise!
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Can it skip a generation? Could Althena quicken it when she died? I'm not sure this is ever addressed in the book. If it is, I don't remember the answer. ."
It is said that it has to be 3 members of successive generations. so you can't skip a generation.
Hanne wrote: "Rob wrote: "That's correct. What I don't recall is if they explain what that means for the liveship. To quicken a ship it needs to absorb the blood of 3 generations of the family.Can it skip a gen..."
Thanks. It's already been too many books :-)
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I also like the idea that a "quickened" ship retains the memories of it's absorbed souls. Trade routes, sources of goods, shipping lanes, even mast configurations used in the past.
@Hanne what chapter does it say successive generations- I missed that and I usualy wouldn't. I want to see if I really missed it or if it might have been edited in your edition... I've double checked in the places they speak about it and so far I can't find that word!! Maybe give me extra help like the conversation it was in too, since we have different page numbers.
I can't remember where this is said either. I remember seeing something - or maybe I was just inferring it from this conversation between Ephron and Ronica in Chapter 3“I'm dying. And I'd like my damn ship here so I can die on her decks and quicken her, so my whole damn life won't have been for nothing.
But now I'm not so sure. I still think it is implied but I can't remember a direct quote.
Then again all the book blurbs on the internet say 3 successive generations so maybe there is a quote in there or later on.
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normally reading the uk massmarket paperback, but i'm travelling in the uk for work right so i brought my friends' ereader, did a search there, but nothing is showing up
could be it was mentioned on the back cover of the book. i'm sure i read it in the book itself that it used the word successive.
so either uk massmarket is different versus the ebook version, or it's on the back of the book. i'll have to check when i'm home!
(i actually had an issue today, because i accidentally started reading chapter 12 of the mad ship (which is book 2!!!) - and i thought: 'wow! so much happened since the last chapter'!
i left a note here before i discovered what happened and then had a ton of trouble to remove it via the smartphone before you guys read some massive spoilers.
silly girl!
I think the use of the term "generations" implies succession. Otherwise why not use "three lives" of the same family? I do remember being on the look out for the answer to this question and was convinced by now (or maybe a bit later) that I had that answer. It might have been implied by a sentence a stating what happens if Ephron doesn't make it aboard. Darn it! It's going to bug me now.
I was specifically looking for it and I don't think generations means successive . I thought the father's life would be for nought if the boat skipped him and went to Althea or whoever because his life memories wouldn't go in to the boat. It is probably later in the book or next book. I haven't looked at internet so it's possible IF Hanne has -sbe remembered it from there.
Look at all this discussion I started! Lol.
I think you are right Candace. I don't think "successive" is implied enough at this stage anyway. It may be more a case that skipping a generation would be disastrous for a family that might be relying on the extra financial benefit to pay back the debt on the ship - so doing it any other way isn't even an option?
Rob wrote: "Look at all this discussion I started! Lol."You are a bad man Rob! But I'm actually glad you brought it up :)
David makes a good point. The only way to pay for a Liveship is to Quicken it and reap the benefits and advantages it gives.
Rob wrote: "David makes a good point. The only way to pay for a Liveship is to Quicken it and reap the benefits and advantages it gives."Yeah, the Vestrits are really struggling with the payments up till now.
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Rare and valuable, they will quicken only when three family members - from successive generations - have died upon their deck
didn't read too much reading while in the uk, and hardly had internet access, but i will catch up1
Hanne wrote: "heyhey, i'm back home, and just checked: it's indeed on the back cover:Rare and valuable, they will quicken only when three family members - from successive generations - have died upon their deck..."
Yeah, Everywhere advertising the books will say that - And I was convinced that it was implicitly implied somewhere in these first few chapters, but I don't know where now or if I was just inferring it.
Let us know Hanne if you come across it - it's bugging me now - lol. Not that it really matters so far I suppose.
it's not on my back cover! That's why I asked in first place when I couldn't find it, sometimes I've found the UK and US editions are edited differently.
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i'll have to browse those chapters this evening to figure out what's going on.
it's true that uk and us editions occassionally vary somewhat
Thx Hanne, I'm very interested in this. Authors don't write the book's back (i don't read them either-for spoiler reasons) but I'm guessing whoever wrote it quoted it from somewhere in at least your edition of the book (since it's on your back). You'll come to it first and then I'll check my book also!
I can't believe how much discussion there has been on this. Lol.I think when I read it I must have assumed it was consecutive if it's not explicitly stated.
Definitely a change from last farseer book which for me was a disaster. I am liking Kennit so far I think he has got the strongest personality. Wintrow is another interesting character.
Just in case someone decides to start early, here is the first thread.