What does a book need to have to be classed as fantasy

[Cecily]

Jim wrote: "...I agree that magic may be the key, but are we running into Clarke's third law here?
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. "

For all that I agree with Clarke, I think the distinction here is whether the author suggests the cause is magical or scientific.

[Jim]

Yes.
I think that some of the really great writers (Jack Vance) amongst them leave you in doubt as to which it is ;-)

[Cecily]

Perhaps, though I don't think I've read such a book, and I'm not sure whether, if I did, I'd find it frustrating.

[Clay]

Many "how-to" books describe fantasy as a story that does not have to adhere to normal laws of physics. The author sets the laws and (if he or she is good) sticks to those laws. Whereas Science Fiction is set in the "real" world that "should" follow the natural laws of physics. This is what makes cross over's a bit difficult. By this definition, "A Warlock In spite of Himself" is Science Fiction, not fantasy. However, elements RESEMBLE fantasy.

Naturally, such a nebulous definition leaves the whole fantasy genre open to a multitude of sub-genres. My personal favorite is Epic (or high) fantasy. I read fantasy only for entertainment. A fantasy book that tries to address "social ills" etc will turn me off instantly. I do not mind that in Science Fiction at all. In fact, a lot of my favorite science fiction books attempt to address social issues. (Admittedly, I will sneer and toss aside any SF book that attempts to address social ills if it is not written from a Libertarian POV LOL)

But I do not want to be "educated" by a fantasy read. So if I detect an hint of any author addressing "social ills" in a fantasy work...even if it is from a POV I agree with, I may very well put the book down and not pick it up again...and may not buy a book by that author again.

When I read fantasy, I want to see a struggle of good vs evil (with very little shades of gray between the two)...magic. Kings and Queens...armies...mythical creatures....etc. I don't want to read about anti-heroes or the lesser bad vs the greater bad.

Now I DO enjoy some of what has become known as Urban Fantasy (what some one else has called vampire romance LOL - a big fan of the True Blood Books and Carrie Vaughn's Kitty Norvel Books as well as Chloe Neill's Chicagoland Vampire books).

[Jim]

Brenda ╰☆╮ wrote: "Unicorns.....
;)"

Actually, it probably wouldn't be too difficult to genetically engineer a single horned horse once we get up to speed ;-)
Mind you, getting them to only allow virgins to ride them is going to take serious work and might be where the fantasy comes in ;-))

[Heather]

Events that don't ordinarily happen in day to day life, generally featuring a breach of physics that can't or isn't explained by science, which would then classify it as science fiction.

[M.T.]

Hello there, I call my book fantasy because it doesn't happen in space but a recent reviewer called it sci-fi because the 'magic' is 'explained' well sort of as science. The first book has an element of cops and robbers but the second is definitely a romance, among other things. There are lots of car chases, so I suppose that makes it action.

To me fantasy is pure and simple, the Narnia books but I'm pretty sure I'm alone in that respect.

Cheers

MTM

[Heather]

M.T. wrote: "Hello there, I call my book fantasy because it doesn't happen in space but a recent reviewer called it sci-fi because the 'magic' is 'explained' well sort of as science. The first book has an eleme..."

You bring up a good point. Often what is classified as fantasy has a scientific explanation as their world understands it.

The dividing line between science fiction and fantasy is a lot of fun to blur.

Typically, the dividing line is electricity, wires, and circuitry, but technological advancements in the real world are making that...obsolete.

[M.T.]

Copper Wings,

Hmm... there's a thing. My lot have cars that run on water and their mobile phones run on static but they're in a parallel reality so it's not space or another planet. So while the first few points make it sci-fi the second might make it fantasy. I'm pretty sure I'm classifying all my books wrong. I've started calling them science fiction fantasy.

Actually if you have electricity and stuff does that make them 'urban' or is that solely for vampire/human romance? Phnark.

How do you classify them?

Cheers

MTM

[Heather]

M.T. wrote: "Copper Wings,

Hmm... there's a thing. My lot have cars that run on water and their mobile phones run on static but they're in a parallel reality so it's not space or another planet. So while the ..."

Sliders: The Novel

Parallel realities can be either one, I suppose. As for urban fantasy, I tend to factor it under crime dramas where the cast is a blend of human and nonhuman, usually something inspired by traditional mythology and folktales. The "urban" comes from "urban setting," and I wouldn't think the romance would be necessary, but they tend to go hand in hand. For some reason.

To classify your story, I'd probably need to read it. Based on water powered cars, I'm leaning towards science fiction, but I don't believe you've given any other details.

One could say science fiction is one that has its grounds in real-world possibilities, but even that is muddled. While computers existed at the time,nobody thought they'd be small enough to fit in your pocket, and yet Star Trek had communicators.

[Charles]

Copper_Wings wrote: "M.T. wrote: "...And if I may be so bold,..."

We'd really prefer that anything that consists of self-promotion (or even just the appearance of self-promotion) be limited to the "Authors" forum here. If the authors here (and any readers who want to join in) want to discuss this in terms of the authors trying to decide how to market their books, a separate topic should be opened up in that forum -- or we could just move this topic there if that makes more sense.

[Heather]

Charles wrote: "Copper_Wings wrote: "M.T. wrote: "...And if I may be so bold,..."

We'd really prefer that anything that consists of self-promotion (or even just the appearance of self-promotion) be limited to the..."

I brought them up because they were pertinent to the discussion. ^^;;

Following that...

Often scifi and fantasy will have direct counterparts. Fantasy has Tolkien, scifi has Roddenberry. Fantasy has elves, scifi has green space women/space elves/asari.

It took five minutes of Mass Effect to note that it was Dragon Age...IN SPACE!

Although having the same studio might have something to do with that...

[Jim]

Perhaps the important thing you've flagged up here is the things they have in common. Fantasy and SF both take people out of the accepted reality and put them somewhere that doesn't currently exist or in circumstances that don't currently exist.
A lot of crime fiction revels in the gritty reality of its settings, even Miss Marple clings firmly to a solid background of its time. Historical novels to are supposed to be faithful to their setting. But SF and Fantasy can 'boldly go where no man (or attractive short skirted young woman :-) ) has gone before.'

[M.T.]

Charles wrote: "Copper_Wings wrote: "M.T. wrote: "...And if I may be so bold,..."

We'd really prefer that anything that consists of self-promotion (or even just the appearance of self-promotion) be limited to the..."

Lordy! I do apologise, I'd hopped in from a writing thread in another group and I just wasn't thinking (MT smacks head on table). Really sorry just forgot where I was. I should have used Jasper Fforde, except that he doesn't have the technology and Adams, except his stuff happens in space.

Cheers

MTM

[M.T.]

Copper_Wings wrote: "Fantasy has Tolkien, scifi has Roddenberry. Fantasy has elves, scifi has green space women/space elves/asari. "

Good point, to be honest what I really want to read is Roddenbury crossed with James Bond, I don't want to read about elves and dwarves and the like, well I do but only if the take is truly original, like Pratchett's.

The thing I like about sci-fi is that you can read about entirely new genera, B-movie style. I suppose what I really like is stories that take normal life, which, let's face it, is a bit boring on its own and make it into something a lot more interesting. I suppose then you get to the point where, like Rankin, you end up calling it whatever you want to. Far fetched fiction has a nice ring to it and it's probably that I'm really into!

Does that make any sense?

[Charles]

M.T. wrote: "...what I really want to read is Roddenbury crossed with James Bond..."

It's more a case of "H.P. Lovecraft meets James Bond," but have you tried any of Charles Stross's "Laundry" series?

[M.T.]

Charles wrote: "M.T. wrote: "...what I really want to read is Roddenbury crossed with James Bond..."

It's more a case of "H.P. Lovecraft meets James Bond," but have you tried any of Charles Stross's "Laundry" ser..."

Oooo, no. That sounds interesting. Thanks, I'll look them up.

Cheers

MTM

[M.T.]

Charles, I've just checked out the Laundry series, it looks brilliant and I've bought the first. I'll look forward to getting stuck into that later today, or next weekend! ;-) Thanks for suggesting it.

cheers

MTM

[Charles]

Hope you enjoy it. I found one of them somewhat mediocre (#3, I think?) but really enjoyed the rest so far.